11-OXO as a Pure Muscle Builder
02-24-2008 10:54 PM
11-OXO as a Pure Muscle Builder
As you all remember, 3AD was the big thing back six months or so ago and unfortunately it never came out. 3AD has the same active, of course, as 11OXO, but at higher doses and it was intended to be used as a muscle builder as opposed to a cortisol control agent. Right around the time when 11OXO came out and 3AD hype died down, I had to take a break from the boards and haven't followed the news until I came back to check what is going on recently. I was expecting many people to use 11OXO at high doses as a muscle builder but to my surprise, there are very few logs or even discussions on that. I am amazed really. Maybe it is the price that is keeping people away from using the 6+ pills a day but c'mon. Some guys run just one cycle per year and even if you need 4 bottles of 11OXO, it is not that crazy amount of money for once a year.
So can someone please bring me up to date on the following -or direct me to a thread where these are discussed.
Is 11OXO liver toxic at doses of 600 mg to 1000 mg?
How supressive is it at 600 mg to 1000 mg? Do people think that we can expect full shutdown at 1000 mg per day?
What kind of gains can we expect if we run it as a stand-alone at 600 to 1000 mg per day as a bulker (if we run it alone, not stacked with something else)? Maybe we cannot so easily give a number such as "gain of 10 lbs in 4 weeks" but we should be able to compare it to other compounds. For example can we expect better or worse gains in terms of muscle mass compared to 30 mg per day of Epistane?
What would be the side effects at 600-1000 mg and what support supps would be needed to counter them. Serious adverse effects on lipids, blood pressure....?
If one were to stack it, what would be an ideal compound to stack this with?
02-25-2008 11:55 PM
03-04-2008 01:46 PM
I'm shocked at the lack of information as well. But maybe it's just because if there were enough positive reviews, it would be taken off the market.
03-04-2008 06:24 PM
Way too weak & too $$$ IMO. I seen 4 logs where androstenedione was ran with the goal being lean bulk & nobody gained more than 2-3 pounds in a months time.
03-04-2008 06:34 PM
Yeah this stuff isn't the big lean mass generator everybody thought it would be. Works ok for a cut though. I tried a couple bottles of it, went up to 800 mgs a day. Didn't do a whole lot for mass, but did lean me out a little bit. While I was on I did have all day muscle pumps, and it did make me a bit aggressive. Libido was all over the place. Would I do it again? I may throw it into a cutting cycle.
03-04-2008 07:09 PM
Havent used it yet, but Ive heard terrible reviews for bulking.
If you run this do so on a cut, regardless, when real gear is cheaper than PHs it kinda sad. 30$+ for every 10 days on 11oxo is unreasonable for the average costumer.
03-05-2008 07:06 AM
I'm 34 days into a 40 day log of 11oxo. My goal is to cut while keeping lbm. I'm only down a couple of pounds from the start, but I'm visibly leaner and my strength is up. I'm taking 6 caps per day (2 caps x 3 dosages). When I started this, I was benching 275lbs x 5 reps. Last night I did 315lbs x 4 reps. Mood has been good, sleep has been good, libido off a little, joints seem a little dry (knees & wrists) and back is breaking out.
03-05-2008 08:55 PM
Honestly, I don't know how everybody talks about getting gear like it's available at the local gas station. Ordering online seems very risky. The reason these PHs can sell for so much is because they're legal. If something worked half as good as testosterone but costed twice as much, you could bet it would sell like crazy. Not everybody has the heart, stomach or head for risking prison to obtain steroids.
03-05-2008 09:21 PM
unless you are buying it in person from someone and its a sting, you have 0 chance of getting arrested. If you mail order from out of the country, the worst that happens is customs confiscates it. So its more about finding a reputable out of country site to buy from.
Its not just the price part, its also side effects that make some people go the gear route. personally I won't because i'm a blood donor, and that matters to me
03-05-2008 10:02 PM
I don't want to hijack this topic - so I apologize.. But how about times where I hear people get the actual delivery from a federal agent? I mean, what then? Heck, in Florida, I can get jail time for ordering and receiving a research chemical.
Originally Posted by EasyEJL
03-06-2008 08:26 AM
The fed agent can't deliver it. Thats him possessing a known illegal chemical. Becomes entrapment then. You can also make it difficult to prove that it was you who ordered it (use a public computer and a prepaid visa card, create a new gmail account that day on that computer and never reuse it for instance) so the mere fact of accepting delivery is not enough to arrest you for.
Originally Posted by Zero Tolerance
I'm not a lawyer so you can take this with a grain of salt, but I can't imagine them arresting you.
03-06-2008 08:44 AM
WHAT? you mean Adrenosterone does NOT feel like 600 mgs of Test a week. I'm shocked... shocked I tell you. (I did cut up pretty good on it like most everyone else)
Originally Posted by mattikus
03-06-2008 04:20 PM
your joint problems can happen because of your kind of training , low reps heavywheights , and let me tell you that the latest studies showed that sets between 10 and 15 reps are ideal for hypertrophy cause low reps heavywheights push myostatin to high levels blocking muscle hypertrophy, please don't see this post as a lesson, I respect everybody's training I`m just sharing what I read in the latest magazines flex and MD,
Originally Posted by edvanp
Off course this doesn`t apply if you are a powerlifter but I suspect you`re a bodybuilder.
03-06-2008 08:06 PM
I think everybody thought, "I'll believe it when I see it" when that statement came out...
Originally Posted by RBKing
03-07-2008 06:46 AM
Hello Nunes- I mainly lift for fitness, so I change things up. I very seldom do max's and I keep reps in the 6-14 range. I tried an "EPI" clone last summer and I felt my joints dry out a bit. I haven't read anyone else having issues with dry joints while taking 11oxo, but I've noticed it at 6 caps per day. It's not bad, just something that I've felt. But I also think my strength has taken off too, so 11oxo might work a bit better for me!?! Thanks for your thoughts.
Originally Posted by nunes
03-07-2008 07:07 AM
Just wanted to clarify.
3AD is NOT adrenosterone. AX has since found something much better (hence part of the reason why it's taking so long to be released), but decided to use the same name anyhow.
03-07-2008 08:47 AM
Ok, not to sound like a jerk but dont listen to this advice. Especially since he doesent use gear or run the risks himself of ordering it.
Originally Posted by EasyEJL
Get Legal Muscle by Rick Collins to know what your rights are, and what law enforcement can and cannot due. By listening to gossip like this on the net you may be unprepared when a critical situation occurs and you could end up screwing yourself badly, literally ruining your life.
Plenty of casual users are serving hard time for buying over the net. Not only that but losing their home, job, marriage. If you know what your rights are, and what LEO will do to get you, you can protect yourself from the worst of the damage, and likely get off scott free or with a slap on the wrist.
03-07-2008 08:52 AM
Originally Posted by EasyEJL
huh ? How is taking a designer different from taking AAS ? Just the screening methods they use ?
03-07-2008 08:55 AM
Originally Posted by thesinner
03-07-2008 09:01 AM
just the needles... So oral turinabol or dbol would be ok
Originally Posted by ReaperX
And frank, just because I haven't talked about it, doesn't mean I haven't ordered it. but whats here is public and can be searchable and could be used to obtain a warrant for search so i wouldn't talk about it here if I did.
The controlled delivery really could only happen if you bought from someone in the US, who they raided and got your info from, and had enough supporting evidence (IP address of order, that sort of thing) to prove it was you who also placed the order. But using for instance a library computer, and a prepaid visa gift card that you used cash to buy, and ordering from outside of the US leaves them nothing to attempt an arrest on. At that point they have no way to prove you ordered it, and you accepting the delivery of a brown box from your postman is not grounds for arrest. At that point them attempting a controlled delivery where a fed agent drops it off and arrests you would be entrapment.
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