11-OXO as a Pure Muscle Builder
- 02-24-2008, 10:54 PM
11-OXO as a Pure Muscle Builder
As you all remember, 3AD was the big thing back six months or so ago and unfortunately it never came out. 3AD has the same active, of course, as 11OXO, but at higher doses and it was intended to be used as a muscle builder as opposed to a cortisol control agent. Right around the time when 11OXO came out and 3AD hype died down, I had to take a break from the boards and haven't followed the news until I came back to check what is going on recently. I was expecting many people to use 11OXO at high doses as a muscle builder but to my surprise, there are very few logs or even discussions on that. I am amazed really. Maybe it is the price that is keeping people away from using the 6+ pills a day but c'mon. Some guys run just one cycle per year and even if you need 4 bottles of 11OXO, it is not that crazy amount of money for once a year.
So can someone please bring me up to date on the following -or direct me to a thread where these are discussed.
Is 11OXO liver toxic at doses of 600 mg to 1000 mg?
How supressive is it at 600 mg to 1000 mg? Do people think that we can expect full shutdown at 1000 mg per day?
What kind of gains can we expect if we run it as a stand-alone at 600 to 1000 mg per day as a bulker (if we run it alone, not stacked with something else)? Maybe we cannot so easily give a number such as "gain of 10 lbs in 4 weeks" but we should be able to compare it to other compounds. For example can we expect better or worse gains in terms of muscle mass compared to 30 mg per day of Epistane?
What would be the side effects at 600-1000 mg and what support supps would be needed to counter them. Serious adverse effects on lipids, blood pressure....?
If one were to stack it, what would be an ideal compound to stack this with?
- 02-25-2008, 11:55 PM
- 03-04-2008, 01:46 PM
I'm shocked at the lack of information as well. But maybe it's just because if there were enough positive reviews, it would be taken off the market.
03-04-2008, 06:24 PM
Way too weak & too $$$ IMO. I seen 4 logs where androstenedione was ran with the goal being lean bulk & nobody gained more than 2-3 pounds in a months time.
03-04-2008, 06:34 PM
Yeah this stuff isn't the big lean mass generator everybody thought it would be. Works ok for a cut though. I tried a couple bottles of it, went up to 800 mgs a day. Didn't do a whole lot for mass, but did lean me out a little bit. While I was on I did have all day muscle pumps, and it did make me a bit aggressive. Libido was all over the place. Would I do it again? I may throw it into a cutting cycle.
03-04-2008, 07:09 PM
Havent used it yet, but Ive heard terrible reviews for bulking.
If you run this do so on a cut, regardless, when real gear is cheaper than PHs it kinda sad. 30$+ for every 10 days on 11oxo is unreasonable for the average costumer.
03-05-2008, 07:06 AM
I'm 34 days into a 40 day log of 11oxo. My goal is to cut while keeping lbm. I'm only down a couple of pounds from the start, but I'm visibly leaner and my strength is up. I'm taking 6 caps per day (2 caps x 3 dosages). When I started this, I was benching 275lbs x 5 reps. Last night I did 315lbs x 4 reps. Mood has been good, sleep has been good, libido off a little, joints seem a little dry (knees & wrists) and back is breaking out.
03-05-2008, 08:55 PM
Honestly, I don't know how everybody talks about getting gear like it's available at the local gas station. Ordering online seems very risky. The reason these PHs can sell for so much is because they're legal. If something worked half as good as testosterone but costed twice as much, you could bet it would sell like crazy. Not everybody has the heart, stomach or head for risking prison to obtain steroids.
03-05-2008, 09:21 PM
unless you are buying it in person from someone and its a sting, you have 0 chance of getting arrested. If you mail order from out of the country, the worst that happens is customs confiscates it. So its more about finding a reputable out of country site to buy from.
Its not just the price part, its also side effects that make some people go the gear route. personally I won't because i'm a blood donor, and that matters to me
03-05-2008, 10:02 PM
03-06-2008, 08:26 AM
I'm not a lawyer so you can take this with a grain of salt, but I can't imagine them arresting you.
03-06-2008, 08:44 AM
03-06-2008, 04:20 PM
Off course this doesn`t apply if you are a powerlifter but I suspect you`re a bodybuilder.
03-06-2008, 08:06 PM
03-07-2008, 06:46 AM
03-07-2008, 07:07 AM
Just wanted to clarify.
3AD is NOT adrenosterone. AX has since found something much better (hence part of the reason why it's taking so long to be released), but decided to use the same name anyhow.
Athletic Xtreme Rep
Ask me about the Athletic Xtreme Product Line
03-07-2008, 08:47 AM
Get Legal Muscle by Rick Collins to know what your rights are, and what law enforcement can and cannot due. By listening to gossip like this on the net you may be unprepared when a critical situation occurs and you could end up screwing yourself badly, literally ruining your life.
Plenty of casual users are serving hard time for buying over the net. Not only that but losing their home, job, marriage. If you know what your rights are, and what LEO will do to get you, you can protect yourself from the worst of the damage, and likely get off scott free or with a slap on the wrist.
03-07-2008, 08:52 AM
03-07-2008, 08:55 AM
03-07-2008, 09:01 AM
And frank, just because I haven't talked about it, doesn't mean I haven't ordered it. but whats here is public and can be searchable and could be used to obtain a warrant for search so i wouldn't talk about it here if I did.
The controlled delivery really could only happen if you bought from someone in the US, who they raided and got your info from, and had enough supporting evidence (IP address of order, that sort of thing) to prove it was you who also placed the order. But using for instance a library computer, and a prepaid visa gift card that you used cash to buy, and ordering from outside of the US leaves them nothing to attempt an arrest on. At that point they have no way to prove you ordered it, and you accepting the delivery of a brown box from your postman is not grounds for arrest. At that point them attempting a controlled delivery where a fed agent drops it off and arrests you would be entrapment.
03-07-2008, 09:10 AM
Great man, i just got 6 bottles of 11 TEST by Fast action for 16,95 each, they are 60 pills of 100mg of andrenosterone...
03-07-2008, 09:12 AM
mind you, i'm going to order that book and see what it says
03-07-2008, 09:28 AM
LOL, easy, look at the green bar under your rep power. your activity level is 100%
and i gotta agree with frank...you can never be too careful ordering stuff online. it's not likely that you'll have problems, but search around, you can find some horror stories of people getting caught
03-07-2008, 10:45 AM
03-07-2008, 10:50 AM
I wasn't too impressed by 11oxo, dosed up to 600-800mg daily, but mostly stayed around 600. Maybe it needed to be dosed higher.
03-07-2008, 11:23 AM
03-07-2008, 11:41 AM
Sub7. Most of your questions are answered in the 11oxo FAQ on ergopharm's website.
It says that 11oxo does not pose any substantial strain on the liver.
They highly suggest PCT with doses 6 caps and up. Suppresion is likely in high doses.
As far as sides go, They say potiential sides are the same as with other ph's
Here is the link.. Hope this somewhat answers you questions.
03-07-2008, 11:45 AM
there are some people using the 11-oxo in a dermal and getting pretty stellar results and u dont need to put that much stress on your liver popping so many pills if you go the TD route
03-07-2008, 11:58 AM
our wonderful government
the fda approves prescriptions everyday with really bad side effects which make people have to take 10 or scrips a day to counter the effects of each other
but if bodybuilders and fitness guys want to take gear at theur own risk its a federal offense.
chalk one up to hypocrisy fellas.
I have a grudge to bear becasue I've had a couple of of relatives die from scrips prescribed by the doctor.
and they werent drinkers or illegal drug users or anything like that...
wasnt known od because the life insurance would not have paid their families.
03-07-2008, 12:04 PM
Why cant men take Deca for birth control? The side effects are less than female birth control ( hundreds of women have died of blood clots from birth control pills ) Why is male hormone replacement looked down on?
Its total bullsh1t.
03-07-2008, 12:05 PM
I dont want to believe this compound its all pain(joints), no gain , is it?
03-07-2008, 12:31 PM
03-07-2008, 12:33 PM
03-07-2008, 12:42 PM
03-07-2008, 01:08 PM
no joint pains when I took it.
03-07-2008, 01:12 PM
03-07-2008, 01:13 PM
from ergopharm's site, a PCT isn't entirely necessary at 225mg/day, which is interesting
03-07-2008, 01:15 PM
most likly its not strong enough at a dosage that low, i know a couple people who have used h-drol gained big but never need a pct and kept 90% of their gains (10-15 lbs) and they did it for 6 weeks and dosed it at 100mg ED, so i guess it depends on the compound
03-07-2008, 01:20 PM
Thanks Stl123... I have checked their site and as you mentioned, some of these issues have been addressed there.
why in the world would you do this transdermally? It is hard enough to get the required dose orally. Also, there are no reports of this being liver toxic, so why make it harder on yourself by going the TD route?
Also, any logs or posts by those people who supposedly got "stellar results" from TD application? I never seen even one user who did TD with this...
03-07-2008, 01:22 PM
you can buy this compound in bulk, and it is more effective when applied TD.
Not only would it be more effective at a lower dose this way, but it would be more cost effective (buying bulk, using less compound)
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