Phyto-Testosterone is here

[Eric Potratz]

Folks, Phyto-Testosterone is finally here.

For those of you who haven’t yet heard, Phyto-Testosterone is a legal, orally active, plant based testosterone mimicker & potentiator. That’s right, this scientifically proven combination of natural ingredients is just as anabolic as real testosterone.

To learn more about Phyto-Testoterone, visit here –


As a sponsor of Anabolicminds we wanted to announce that we have a very limited initial supply of Phyto-Testosterone, so if your eager to get your hands on it, you should act now before the first batch is gone. Also, please feel free to openly post your questions here on this official Phyto-Testosteone thread.

Cheers to an Anabolic New Year.

-Pp

NOTE - The original liquid Phyto-Testosterone was changed to caps on 03/01/09. Therefore, Phyto-testosterone can now be taken by simply swallowing the caps.

 

[pmiller383]

Need any Testers lol ?? This stuff looks awesome guys very innovative.

 

[ozarkaBRAND]

I want this!

But the site seems to be having difficulties.. sad day.

 

[MuscleGuyinNY]

I wanna try this. If you end up needing testers anytime before I'm able to buy, then please let me know.

You guys never fail to come out with some very innovative and interesting products. Way to go!

 

[sogone2day]

Will this be going to other retailers like nutra anytime soon?

 

[Eric Potratz]

Will this be going to other retailers like nutra anytime soon?

Probably not for awhile, especially right now with its low supply, and high per/bottle cost. (we don’t have a lot of room for wholesale discounts)

-Pp

 

[LatSpread]

Perhaps this will be the testofen supp to finally deliver on its promise the way the scivation product wanted to, but fell short.

 

[jminis]

Very nice can't wait to see some reviews on the stuff particularly if it shuts you down or not. I'd love to see someone get bloodwork done as well.

 

[sogone2day]

Well i guess i'll wait to see some Aminds result threads.
Just trying to save on shipping by ordering at nutra so i can get other goods at the same time. Cause shipping to canada on a single item alone is $26. Thanks hope the product works out well for you guys.

 

[pudzian2]

looks promising.....

 

[T-Bone]

I have been wanting to try your products for some time now...Just a little too expensive for me.

 

[ralph4u2c]

writeup makes me want to try it - great job on that.

had small but decent results with fenugreek products, but never with a 50% extract so i can only imagine it being better. No results with any methoxy product i've tried in the past, hopefully this particular way proves to be better.

can we get more information to this advanced oral delivery matrix you speak of, as i'm thinking this will be a big factor in the making/breaking of this product.

 

[Eric Potratz]

writeup makes me want to try it - great job on that.

had small but decent results with fenugreek products, but never with a 50% extract so i can only imagine it being better. No results with any methoxy product i've tried in the past, hopefully this particular way proves to be better.

can we get more information to this advanced oral delivery matrix you speak of, as i'm thinking this will be a big factor in the making/breaking of this product.

The delivery technology is based off a readily absorbable phospholipid solution that easily absorbs through the sublingual and oral cavity. So naturally some of the ingredients are absorbed before they even get to the digestive track, a nice improvement over a powder packed capsule.

-Pp

 

[ImJ2x]

The delivery technology is based off a readily absorbable phospholipid solution that easily absorbs through the sublingual and oral cavity. So naturally some of the ingredients are absorbed before they even get to the digestive track, a nice improvement over a powder packed capsule.

-Pp

So I imagine it would be wise to hold this stuff in your mouth for awhile before you swallow it? (I even take my Superdrol sublingually, though I don't know if it makes any sense at all, lol.)

 

[djbombsquad]

How much free test levels does it raise?

 

[pudzian2]

So I imagine it would be wise to hold this stuff in your mouth for awhile before you swallow it? (I even take my Superdrol sublingually, though I don't know if it makes any sense at all, lol.)

i imagine it has the same/ similar delivery method as the old finigenx. it had a phospholipid blend that required you to hold the stuff in your mouth a while before swollowing.


HOW do you take your superdrol sublingually. that is quite interesting....... makes my liver smile!

 

[Eric Potratz]

How much free test levels does it raise?

Checkout the attached study.

Yes you can hold it in your mouth to help it absorb sublingually.

-Pp

 

[ImJ2x]

HOW do you take your superdrol sublingually. that is quite interesting....... makes my liver smile!

It's simple. I just open the cap and pour it under my tongue. It tastes just fine. And if I'm careful not to swallow for a couple minutes, it seems like I can get almost all of it to absorb under my tongue, thereby avoiding that first pass liver metabolization. But this is one of my weirdo ideas that I'm not too confident in. I wonder what DrD would say?

 

[bound]

It's simple. I just open the cap and pour it under my tongue. It tastes just fine. And if I'm careful not to swallow for a couple minutes, it seems like I can get almost all of it to absorb under my tongue, thereby avoiding that first pass liver metabolization. But this is one of my weirdo ideas that I'm not too confident in. I wonder what DrD would say?

Huh. I would've figured superdrol to be one of those "capped so you're tongue doesn't disolve" supps.:blink:

 

[ImJ2x]

Huh. I would've figured superdrol to be one of those "capped so you're tongue doesn't disolve" supps.:blink:

No--it works fine, lol. But the whole reason to methylate it is to increase oral availability. That's why I'm not sure sublingual makes any sense. But if you can get it into your system without forcing it full-strength through your liver, why the hell not?
But back on point...
Mr Perf: Does the Phyto-Test have the same androgenic side effects as real test--ie acne, MPB, BPH, etc?

 

[bound]

But back on point...
Mr Perf: Does the Phyto-Test have the same androgenic side effects as real test--ie acne, MPB, BPH, etc?

Aye, and what of aromatization? ....or am I just way off course since it only mimics test....

 

[Eric Potratz]

No--it works fine, lol. But the whole reason to methylate it is to increase oral availability. That's why I'm not sure sublingual makes any sense. But if you can get it into your system without forcing it full-strength through your liver, why the hell not?
But back on point...
Mr Perf: Does the Phyto-Test have the same androgenic side effects as real test--ie acne, MPB, BPH, etc?

As far as the animals studies tell us, the fenugreek extract (Testofen) is just anabolic as testosterone (ie makes the levator ani muscle grow), while being slightly less androgenic (ie making the seminal vesicles and ventral prostate grow less)

With that in mind Id say Phyto-Test is less likely to cause acne, MPB, and BPH than testosterone would at a relatively effective muscle building dose. As far as aromatization, Im not aware of any work done on this, but based on the above animal study Testofen is less estrogenic than Testosterone, so probably nothing to worry about for most men. (None of the men in the human study reported any estrogenic related side-effects)

-Pp

 

[EasyEJL]

Still not sure about its use in post cycle therapy Eric?

 

[Eric Potratz]

Still not sure about its use in post cycle therapy Eric?

I think its acceptable for PCT, please check out this post I made on another thread –

The animal studies showed fenuside to boost total T production, but we cannot explain how fenuside can be so anabolic and androgenic and still encourage hormone production. It’s possible that the fenusides in the fenugreek extract are lending some sort of ligand cross-talk without direct AR transcriptional activity. Remember, just because something binds to a receptor doesnt mean its brings all the same effects and something else that binds to the same receptor.

If there is any inhibition of natural T production in humans we feel that it would be very minimal, and the anti-cortisol effects and anabolic effects would far outweigh any minor effect on hormone production. (making it acceptable for PCT)

-Pp

 

[EasyEJL]

Oh then hold a bottle aside for me to order for my PCT then, I think I should be ready to start PCT about 2/11

 

[ImJ2x]

I've been trying to find a way to add at least some test to my Superdrol cycle. I don't wanna deal with all the hassle of pinning, so I tried 100mgs DHEA for 2 weeks. It really seemed to work -- I blew up. But it also covered my chest area with 100 little pimples. Unsightly, itchy, slightly painful, so I dropped the DHEA. I may try it again at a lower dose (but 100mgs isn't that high). Or maybe I should try that Phyto-Testosterone all the kids are talking about...

 

[davidcyt]

i will use that through my cycyle and pct very soon

 

[DMac]

Very nice can't wait to see some reviews on the stuff particularly if it shuts you down or not. I'd love to see someone get bloodwork done as well.

I agree. If it does shut people down the way a Test cycle does, then it proves that it works like test in a way, and if it delivers the strength and muscle gains too then it's a great supplement.

If it delivers the strength and muscle gains that Test does and it doesn't shut you down....

Well then it's an f-ing unreal supp

 

[Trauma1]

This stuff does look very promising Pp. I'm very interested in seeing the logs/results from this.

 

[jminis]

If it delivers the strength and muscle gains that Test does and it doesn't shut you down....

Well then it's an f-ing unreal supp

Yep. Can we possibly have our cake and eat it too? guess we'll find out.

 

[json75]

How much more effective would this Phyto-test be if one were to run a light AI alongside?

 

[Eric Potratz]

How much more effective would this Phyto-test be if one were to run a light AI alongside?

I’m not sure that you would get more gains, but the gains would probably be a little drier.

What AI are you considering?

-Pp

 

[json75]

I've heard, or read rather, that alot of people feel as tho Fenugreek may have some estrogenic sides, I believe that a certain "dr" may feel this way, but maybe I'm remembering wrong.....

 

[Highlanda01602]

I've heard, or read rather, that alot of people feel as tho Fenugreek may have some estrogenic sides, I believe that a certain "dr" may feel this way, but maybe I'm remembering wrong.....

I personally also recount that that certain fellow spoke very highly of fenugreek as a natural test booster... and here, with the extract, this product has a bit more backing in my opinion.

Really have nothing to comment about the estrogenic sides, but I thought I'd throw that into the convo! I too am also looking forward to some solid feedback on this one... would run it now, but currently in some other goodies.

 

[Eric Potratz]

You guys lost me...

Im not aware of any estrogenic effects from the Fenusides.

-Pp

 

[johnyq]

I'm really cynical at this point, but I like pp's other products, so I gave it a shot and put in an order. I'll be running it alongside old sustain.

 

[wontdie]

You guys lost me...

Im not aware of any estrogenic effects from the Fenusides.

-Pp

Hi, does it come in a glass bottle? I'm just worried that it might break into pieces under USPS tender loving care.

Anyway, fenugreek is well known for stimulating production of breast milk (yummy!).

http://www.breastfeeding.com/all_about/all_about_fenugreek.html

 

[davidcyt]

Eric any idea about the ETA on NP site?

 

[FrankJ]

Would something like this be beneficial while on a short oral cycle ( 4-6 weeks ) to keep the "feeling" of being shut down away?

I used a bottle of dermacrine for this purpose last year and it was my best cycle ever as far as gains, retention, and libido. Usually my libido drops off after 2 weeks and I start feeling like @ss at 4 weeks.

 

[Eric Potratz]

Hi, does it come in a glass bottle? I'm just worried that it might break into pieces under USPS tender loving care.

Anyway, fenugreek is well known for stimulating production of breast milk (yummy!).

http://www.breastfeeding.com/all_about/all_about_fenugreek.html

We’ve got an extract of Fenusides from fenugreek, quite a different monster than the herb as a whole. Besides, just because something has an estrogenic/progestergenic effect in women doesn’t mean it has the same effect in a man.

The bottles are glass, but we pack them well so there shouldn’t be a problem.

Davidcyt,

We are working with NP, and if they end up carrying it, it wont be for at least a few more weeks.

FrankJ,

I think Dermacrine would serve the best purpose for what you used it for, as its probably a bit more androgenic than Phyto. I think Phyto-Test will probably find its most popular place as a natural steroid alternative or PCT choice.

-Pp

 

[Highlanda01602]

PP,
Got a question about stacking Phyto-Test with other hormone-related products, such as a cycle of Dermacrine...

On one hand, I consider Phyto-test a natural test booster, due to the Fenusides being the extract of Fenugreek. So it makes me think at first that it would be useless during a cycle, where your hormones are already suppressed.

Then on the other hand, when I consider putting Phyto-Test into the post cycle therapy regimen, I read how Phyto-Test effeciency is directly related to your testosterone levels (I recall reading how it doesn't raise total test, but rather in summary makes more of it readily available for muscle building). In PCT, with hormone levels down, it again at first doesn't appear to be a fit.

I'm planning a Dermacrine/Furazadrol cycle in the coming months, and would definitly like to include Phyto-Test into the mix. I'm assuming that the best time to use such a product would be alongside Dermacrine, with the raise of test, but I just don't know for sure.

Just wondering when the absolute OPTIMAL time to do a Phyto-Test cycle would be!

 

[terminator]

I am very skeptical about any phyto-hormones. All the studies that I have read on soy isoflavones and phyto-estrogens show them to be very weak when compared with human estrogen, so I would assume that any phyto-testosterone would be very weak when compared to human testosterone.

I see the study with fenugreek, but I would feel more confident in the results of independent studies on fenusides.

I noticed the website mentioned:

"Perhaps you have heard of the natural plant flavones known as “phyto-estrogens” or the nasty man-made synthetic chemicals known as “xeno-estrogens”. Essentially, these are chemicals that act like estrogen in our bodies. Some of these compounds (especially the xeno-estrogens) can cause unwanted side-effects such as breast tissue growth, impotence, and an overall fat & flabby appearance. "

I have never seen any human studies in which males who consumed phyto-estrogens showed any of these side effects that were described above. I consume soy protein on a daily basis and surprisingly enough I have seen a little more muscle hypertrophy when using soy protein vs whey and I do not show any gynecomastia or fat or flabby appearance.

I will be interested to read reviews from others taking this new product.

 

[djbombsquad]

How much free test does it raise?

 

[json75]

I am very skeptical about any phyto-hormones. All the studies that I have read on soy isoflavones and phyto-estrogens show them to be very weak when compared with human estrogen, so I would assume that any phyto-testosterone would be very weak when compared to human testosterone.

I see the study with fenugreek, but I would feel more confident in the results of independent studies on fenusides.

I noticed the website mentioned:

"Perhaps you have heard of the natural plant flavones known as “phyto-estrogens” or the nasty man-made synthetic chemicals known as “xeno-estrogens”. Essentially, these are chemicals that act like estrogen in our bodies. Some of these compounds (especially the xeno-estrogens) can cause unwanted side-effects such as breast tissue growth, impotence, and an overall fat & flabby appearance. "

I have never seen any human studies in which males who consumed phyto-estrogens showed any of these side effects that were described above. I consume soy protein on a daily basis and surprisingly enough I have seen a little more muscle hypertrophy when using soy protein vs whey and I do not show any gynecomastia or fat or flabby appearance.

I will be interested to read reviews from others taking this new product.

Good post!

 

[Eric Potratz]

PP,
Got a question about stacking Phyto-Test with other hormone-related products, such as a cycle of Dermacrine...

On one hand, I consider Phyto-test a natural test booster, due to the Fenusides being the extract of Fenugreek. So it makes me think at first that it would be useless during a cycle, where your hormones are already suppressed.

Then on the other hand, when I consider putting Phyto-Test into the post cycle therapy regimen, I read how Phyto-Test effeciency is directly related to your testosterone levels (I recall reading how it doesn't raise total test, but rather in summary makes more of it readily available for muscle building). In post cycle therapy, with hormone levels down, it again at first doesn't appear to be a fit.

I'm planning a Dermacrine/Furazadrol cycle in the coming months, and would definitly like to include Phyto-Test into the mix. I'm assuming that the best time to use such a product would be alongside Dermacrine, with the raise of test, but I just don't know for sure.

Just wondering when the absolute OPTIMAL time to do a Phyto-Test cycle would be!

Phyto-Test isn’t really a test booster…. Its more of a test mimicker and potentiator. It mimics testosterone with the fenugreeks extract, and amplifies the anabolic effects of testosterone with the methoxyisoflavone. So its effectiveness doesn’t really depend on how high your T levels are since the fenugreek extract pretty much acts like testosterone in and of itself. (at least as far as muscle growth is concerned)

So, it would be a good stack with almost anything. It would increase the gains from a pro-hormone product like Dermacrine during a cycle, but it could also be used for PCT to help suppress cortisol and keep you in an anabolic state.

Since you’ve already got a Dermacrine/Furazadrol stack, you would probably be best off saving the Phyto-Test for your post cycle stack.

-Pp

 

[Eric Potratz]

I am very skeptical about any phyto-hormones. All the studies that I have read on soy isoflavones and phyto-estrogens show them to be very weak when compared with human estrogen, so I would assume that any phyto-testosterone would be very weak when compared to human testosterone.

I see the study with fenugreek, but I would feel more confident in the results of independent studies on fenusides.

I noticed the website mentioned:

"Perhaps you have heard of the natural plant flavones known as “phyto-estrogens” or the nasty man-made synthetic chemicals known as “xeno-estrogens”. Essentially, these are chemicals that act like estrogen in our bodies. Some of these compounds (especially the xeno-estrogens) can cause unwanted side-effects such as breast tissue growth, impotence, and an overall fat & flabby appearance. "

I have never seen any human studies in which males who consumed phyto-estrogens showed any of these side effects that were described above. I consume soy protein on a daily basis and surprisingly enough I have seen a little more muscle hypertrophy when using soy protein vs whey and I do not show any gynecomastia or fat or flabby appearance.

I will be interested to read reviews from others taking this new product.

You probably won’t find a human study with humans and xeno-estrogens, but they are nasty little compounds which have been found even more powerful than estradiol in various in-vitro studies. (Ie Bisphenol found in everyday plastics) Personally, I don’t think the ethics community would allow a study of toxic xeno-estrogens to be administered to humans.

As far as the physiological relevance of estrogenic compounds in our environment, you can take a wealth of knowledge from well accepted anecdotes… such as hermaphrodite crocodiles from the lakes infested with xeno-estrogen dump off, infertile cows who eat too much clover, or kids who develop gynocomastia from tea tree/lavender soaps.

Remember, our “Phyto-Testosterone” isn’t a single compound. It’s a name we chose for the product to implicate its actions and mechanisms from the different ingredients -- Ingredients which have proven an ergonomic benefit just by themselves.

-Pp

 

[Eric Potratz]

How much free test does it raise?

About 98%.

-Pp

 

[Highlanda01602]

Phyto-Test isn’t really a test booster…. Its more of a test mimicker and potentiator. It mimics testosterone with the fenugreeks extract, and amplifies the anabolic effects of testosterone with the methoxyisoflavone. So its effectiveness doesn’t really depend on how high your T levels are since the fenugreek extract pretty much acts like testosterone in and of itself. (at least as far as muscle growth is concerned)

So, it would be a good stack with almost anything. It would increase the gains from a pro-hormone product like Dermacrine during a cycle, but it could also be used for post cycle therapy to help suppress cortisol and keep you in an anabolic state.

Since you’ve already got a Dermacrine/Furazadrol stack, you would probably be best off saving the Phyto-Test for your post cycle stack.

-Pp

Sounds great, very good explanation

 

[terminator]

You probably won’t find a human study with humans and xeno-estrogens, but they are nasty little compounds which have been found even more powerful than estradiol in various in-vitro studies. (Ie Bisphenol found in everyday plastics) Personally, I don’t think the ethics community would allow a study of toxic xeno-estrogens to be administered to humans.

As far as the physiological relevance of estrogenic compounds in our environment, you can take a wealth of knowledge from well accepted anecdotes… such as hermaphrodite crocodiles from the lakes infested with xeno-estrogen dump off, infertile cows who eat too much clover, or kids who develop gynocomastia from tea tree/lavender soaps.

Remember, our “Phyto-Testosterone” isn’t a single compound. It’s a name we chose for the product to implicate its actions and mechanisms from the different ingredients -- Ingredients which have proven an ergonomic benefit just by themselves.

-Pp

I was referring to the phyto-estrogen studies on human males. I have yet to find any that showed any negative side-effect. I have searched and searched after hearing that I shouldn't take soy because it would lower my testosterone or cause high estrogen-like symptoms (i.e. gyno, testicular atrophy, etc).

When males ingest phyto-estrogens from soy and other weaker phyto-estrogens; the phyto-estrogens bind to estrogen receptor sites and act as a much weaker form of estrogen compared to endogenous estrogen in males.

If the same is true of a phyto-testosterone, why would you want it binding to your testosterone receptors? Hopefully it is more potent than endogenous testosterone, but I remain skeptical.

I guess I'll have to wait to see others results with the product.

 

[Eric Potratz]

I was referring to the phyto-estrogen studies on human males. I have yet to find any that showed any negative side-effect. I have searched and searched after hearing that I shouldn't take soy because it would lower my testosterone or cause high estrogen-like symptoms (i.e. gyno, testicular atrophy, etc).

When males ingest phyto-estrogens from soy and other weaker phyto-estrogens; the phyto-estrogens bind to estrogen receptor sites and act as a much weaker form of estrogen compared to endogenous estrogen in males.

If the same is true of a phyto-testosterone, why would you want it binding to your testosterone receptors? Hopefully it is more potent than endogenous testosterone, but I remain skeptical.

I guess I'll have to wait to see others results with the product.

I understand the phyto-estrogen/ligand receptor relationship, and I also understand your logic, but to propose that Phyto-Testosterone would somehow have an anti-testosterone effect and make your muscles wither away just isn’t realistic in this situation. The human studies have shown a positive effect of increased lean muscle and fat reduction (including myself), aswell as dramatically enhanced sexual function/activity in animals.

-Pp