Which would you do as a Non-hormonal Stack
- 11-18-2007, 08:16 PM
Which would you do as a Non-hormonal Stack
I have come to the conclusion that I have to limit myself on the amount of damn money i spend at nutraplanet, so I have devised three stacks that I want to run for 8 weeks in January. I will no longer just continually try and run stuff lol.
Its going to be either:
8 week cycle of
Mass Fx (2 bottles)
Hyperdrol x2 (2 bottles)
Retain 2 (1 bottle, I already have one on hand)
Total est. cost: 212.89
3 bottles of drive
total est. cost 149.65
3. Drive/X-Factor/ /
total est. cost: 207.64
The first one just seems to pricey, Drive and X-factor def cheaper, and Drive/X Factor/DCP/Levi looks like it covers more bases to me (more bang for your buck). My goals are Recomp/slight fat loss (i never try to go above 10-11%bf. Opinions!?? Any and all greatly appreciated.
- 11-18-2007, 08:19 PM
2nd one. you need 2 bottles of X-Factor btw. 50 day cycle 4 caps each. you could always do bulk x-factor which is 70 bucks instead of 90. 70+ 70 = 140. 2 bottles of Drive should be good if you run at 6 caps then ramp down to 4 after day 10. 3 bottles is also cool. Id say do 3 bottles drive 2 bottles x-factor run drive at 6 caps straight through. You'll love the results. Leaning out and mass
- 11-18-2007, 08:23 PM
so #2 add on another bottle x factor, still under 200 bucks, sounds good. Thats at 4 caps a day of X-factor for 50 days?
11-18-2007, 08:51 PM
11-18-2007, 10:42 PM
11-18-2007, 10:45 PM
11-19-2007, 04:01 PM
11-20-2007, 01:25 AM
I pick 3. Leviathon/dcp stack is awesome for a recomp. My diet was bad one week and still dropped fat on it. I wouldn't go route 1. If you want something for test boosting I'd pick up a bottle of atd or transdermal formestane. Both are cheap and both seem to give me good strength gains. I personally would go for the e-form because its cheap and I feel better on it than I do on atd.
11-22-2007, 03:26 PM
I chose 3 because that is what I will be doing sans the XFactor. I am more interested in cutting, maintaining mass and hardening what I have as I am a big fella.
11-24-2007, 06:26 AM
Agree, I would pick the third option, throw out X-Factor and add IGF-2 instead. That way, you would see some very good body recomposition (thanks to DCP/Drive/Leviathan Reloaded/IGF-2), muscle hardening (thanks to Drive/IGF-2), heightened endurance (thanks to Drive/IGF-2) and a noticeable enhancement in quality lean mass (thanks to Drive/IGF-2).Originally Posted by DreamWeaver;
Now to X Factor. X Factor has had very good reviews, so it must be an excellent product. It is just that I personally am averse to having to cope with so much "inflammatory" turmoil in my body over a sustained period of time. No attacks intended, jjohn I've always admired your dedication to your product. Some other reps should learn from you!
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11-24-2007, 08:59 AM
11-27-2007, 05:30 PM
11-27-2007, 05:32 PM
11-27-2007, 05:38 PM
2 bottles of bulk XF and 2 bottles of JW would be my choice.
Edit: but that depends how you define non-hormonal i guess
11-27-2007, 05:52 PM
I actually have a bottle of JW on hand that a friend gave to me when his supp store went under...im done with the bulk powders though, while they do save money, i cant stomach them and dont have time to cap them.
11-27-2007, 05:56 PM
11-27-2007, 05:56 PM
I say three as well. The DCP /Levi is very synergistic together. And Matt is even noticing an increase in libidio on it?
11-27-2007, 08:04 PM
How about an option now of Megadosed Xtend and X-Factor?!?, I am really tempted since xtend and vasocharge is on sale ie they are basically giving this stuff away on nutra. Drive just seems a tad to expensive, most supps I feel are underdosed and I would probably need 6+ caps a day of drive.
11-27-2007, 08:59 PM
Either way, the DCP/Leviathan makes me painfully "heavy" and in need of release pretty much every day.
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11-28-2007, 11:38 AM
For recomp, muscle preservation, and fatloss option 3 is by far your best option.
Take note also that the ones who "know a thing or two" and took time to explain their vote, the majority chose 3.
11-28-2007, 06:15 PM
I would go with SyntheSIZE,excellent for recomping and fat loss IME (I kept a detailed log on the beta version around two years ago) along with NP's bulk Sesathin or Scivation's bulk Sesamin,which I think is still on sale for $12 a bottle at NP.The SyntheSIZE write up on the AR site explains the role in recomposition it plays,chiefly via enhanced nutrient partitioning at meal times.
I'd reccomend taking in supplemental glucosamine(around 6 grams per day ,2 grams at 3 meals) for the benefit on leptin levels and of course,more of a definitive cash-money recomposition transference.Below is a link to my 60 day SyntheSIZE (at full dosing protocol which was 3 times per day with meals) log,which is pretty lengthy so be forewarned
SyntheSIZE prototype - Mind and Muscle Forums
I cut from the upper teens to almost 10% b/f,which is quite lean for me as I'm an endo whose set point is in the upper teens.My b/w ended up at 170-175,IIRC from around 190.I also gained a signifigant amount of strength (PR's on several lifts) while in a deficit of up to 1000kcals per day averaging 2 training sessions per day.Most days the caloric deficit wasn't as pronounced,I cycled a 1000 kcal deficit in with a 500-750kcal deficit and one day at maintainance per week.Maintainance day was greens,lean meats,shakes and nuts and low carb wheat bread with natty PB and sugar free grape spread with a glass of FF/LC milk with sugar free Swiss Miss chocolate powder as a doozy of a special treat.Woo-hoo,good times
Point being that diet(extra care towards nutrient manipulation around w/o's),training time such as implementation of AM cardio with weights in the PM and supplementation must be finely tuned to truly be successful at recomposition.The genetic odds are against you,anyone who attempts to recomp actually,but bigger guys with endomorphic tendencies like you and I (based on your self description and avatar pic) have to bust open up a can of grade-A,frosty whup ass in the right damn direction on the regular,if ya feel me D:
Regarding my final results on SyntheSIZE,LBM must have increased to a signifigant degree by actoring in visual assesment,pre/post b/w.Not to mention that the profound increase in strength/drive is surely correlated with accrual of muscle tissue,despite a caloric deficit.It is damn near all about nutrient timing/manipulation around w/o's but I will state that vigourous exercise demands an equal role in the process.
I would add in MAN's Scorch,as needed,for enhanced fat oxidation,appetite supression and its stimulatory properties,which will be useful considering your lowered CHO intake whilst dieting.One dose in the morning should be sufficient so you may be able to stretch out at $28 bottle for two months.Scorch has sulbutiamine,which imparts enhanced cognitive processing,resistance to fatigue for extended periods of time,well beyond other base and fairly crude stimulants like caffiene.
The NHA stack has had several reports of inducing an undesirable bump in appetite and I believe X-factor to be a bit over hyped in relation to the expense.You also cannot use PPAR modulators (fish oil,sesamin) while on it which I view as a signifigant drawback.
I'd supplement with 20 grams or so of protein at mealtimes,in lieu of leucine which is cost prohibitive if dosed highly.I usually add some bulk psyillium husk and bulk inulin powder to my shakes while dieting for satiety.This stack,including the casien protien(Optimum is fine or use Hood's Calorie Countdown low carb,fat free milk as the base of your shakes) will tally up below two bills.
I would add in the Retain bottle that you have towards the end of your diet when fatigue becomes more of a pressing issue.
Whoa,that was a lengthy and time consuming post so I really hope you take my advice on the stack.Honestly,it will give optimal results,over any other legal supplements on the market.Jamming testosterone into your arse cheeks while downing anavar with gleeful abandon would be the sole more viable option than this but of course,this has its inherently detrimental side effects as well as cost/legality issues.
11-28-2007, 09:56 PM
11-29-2007, 12:19 PM
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