Arachidonic Acid and Cancer

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    Arachidonic Acid and Cancer


    In my opinion there is not a sexier sounding supplement on the market than X-Factor. 10-15 lbs of lean gains, no hormonal side effects, what more could a guy want? But arachidonic acid is linked to prostate cancer because it converts into 12-HETE and 5-HETE.

    I have two questions in realtion to this; First of all, how risky is a cycle of X-factor. It claims to be clinically safe, but that's a pretty vague statement. Are the claims of AA being dangerous overstated?

    My other question is whtether the conversion of AA into 12 and 5 -HETE is integrial to the muscle gaining process of X-Factor, or if taking something like saw palmetto, which blocks conversion into 12 and 5 HETE, would help prevent the tumorous growth while still maintaining muscular gains.

    I really want to give this product a go, but my family has a history of cancer, so I'm naturally cautious. Let me know if you have any info.

    Thanks.

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    bump
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    if you have a family history of cancer, I would say avoid x-factor. x-factor does not cause cancer but it will speed it up if you already have prostate cancer. saying x-factor causes cancer is like saying red meat and eggs will give you cancer as well. Maybe someone can chime in here with some more knowledge than me. for what it's worth, as a healthy individual, one cycle wont kill me. Although i dont have a family history of cancer however. tough call.
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    What i've seen as far as link to prostate cancer is that it increases rate of growth of cancer cells in vitro. Thats not creation of cancer, nor is it actually as measured in living humans. So I take it with a grain of salt. Also, I have so far been unable to find any reasonable numbers to use to convert the dosage of AA in those studies to human ingestion levels. So its hard to say whether for the purpose of the studies the level of AA is the equivalent to 1g a day or 100 or 1000. Similar to the old studies done on saccarin. I'm not surprised that the equivalent of 50,000 cans of diet soda a day of saccarin (metabolism + weight adjusted) would cause cancer in the rats.
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    my father has just recently had his prostate removed, and i'm still going to do an xfactor cycle starting in 2 weeks.
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    Okay, there has been many questions about this, and been answered many times already.

    Arachidonic will NOT cause cancer, it is also stated on the bottle that it has to been consumed by HEALTHY INDIVIDUALS. Which means that you do not have a tumor already. And saw palmetto is not advised because it will hinder AA's effects. Hope this clears up the confusion.

    AA is found in baby formulas to help with growth. Do you think they would add that if there is a detrimental effect on a baby?

    X Factor is very sexy and will be for a long time. We stand by our products and will always do. Let me know if you have any questions!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjohn View Post
    Okay, there has been many questions about this, and been answered many times already.

    Arachidonic will NOT cause cancer, it is also stated on the bottle that it has to been consumed by HEALTHY INDIVIDUALS. Which means that you do not have a tumor already. And saw palmetto is not advised because it will hinder AA's effects. Hope this clears up the confusion.

    AA is found in baby formulas to help with growth. Do you think they would add that if there is a detrimental effect on a baby?

    X Factor is very sexy and will be for a long time. We stand by our products and will always do. Let me know if you have any questions!
    Thanks John,

    That was exactly the answer I was looking for. Thanks especially for the Saw Palmetto info, I would have hated to try X-factor and to have shot my gains in the foot by taking them together. I'm looking forward to trying it.

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    FYI, everything causes cancer, everything.

    You think that water you drink out of the sink tap is really all that clean ? Hello carcinogen city.
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    good point!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReaperX View Post
    FYI, everything causes cancer, everything.

    You think that water you drink out of the sink tap is really all that clean ? Hello carcinogen city.
    You drink tap water?I usually try to avoid things that I can if possible and consume things that are good for me usually,like any normal sensible person. Taking something that is questionable or risky depends on a lot of things and in the case of AA i don't even know if I'm sure it works or would work for me and the thought of giving up omega 3s is a deal breaker but good luck Reaper. keep us posted.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cardiffgiant View Post
    You drink tap water?I usually try to avoid things that I can if possible and consume things that are good for me usually,like any normal sensible person. Taking something that is questionable or risky depends on a lot of things and in the case of AA i don't even know if I'm sure it works or would work for me and the thought of giving up omega 3s is a deal breaker but good luck Reaper. keep us posted.
    So do you only buy organic raised pesticide free vegetables? And not eat anything out of cans? Its not easy to figure out what "things that are good for you" really are. Heck eating in any restaurant is questionable.

    Basically i can show you statistical evidence that swallowing your own saliva is fatal - in 100% of cases it ends in death. Might take 90 years...
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    Wink


    Quote Originally Posted by ReaperX View Post
    FYI, everything causes cancer, everything.

    You think that water you drink out of the sink tap is really all that clean ? Hello carcinogen city.
    C'mon Reaper. There's different levels of risk when dealing with carcinogens. The glass of Mercury is just a little more dangerous than the glass of NYC tap water.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjohn View Post
    Okay, there has been many questions about this, and been answered many times already.

    Arachidonic will NOT cause cancer, it is also stated on the bottle that it has to been consumed by HEALTHY INDIVIDUALS. Which means that you do not have a tumor already. And saw palmetto is not advised because it will hinder AA's effects. Hope this clears up the confusion.

    AA is found in baby formulas to help with growth. Do you think they would add that if there is a detrimental effect on a baby?

    X Factor is very sexy and will be for a long time. We stand by our products and will always do. Let me know if you have any questions!
    If saw Palmetto is not advised..how about people using finasteride for MPB?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    So do you only buy organic raised pesticide free vegetables? And not eat anything out of cans? Its not easy to figure out what "things that are good for you" really are. Heck eating in any restaurant is questionable.

    Basically i can show you statistical evidence that swallowing your own saliva is fatal - in 100% of cases it ends in death. Might take 90 years...
    I try to avoid things if possible but in no means am i nut.lol.What kills me is all the added high fructose corn syrup(was never in same products before-years ago) and trans fats in things you wouldn't even think of. Restaurants do make me want to question or find out stuff before going there anymore. I mean I wanna find out more info on them soon and decide if I will go there(particular ones) anymore. It's still a crap shoot but it is nice to eat out at least some time.What annoys me is when I go to a restaurant and feel as if I coulda made a better meal at home for cheaper. Where I live now-AZ, any good restaurant is worth going to becuase a lot of food here sux balls. Finding a half way decnt piece of pizza took me about 8 months.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dancebot 2000 View Post
    C'mon Reaper. There's different levels of risk when dealing with carcinogens. The glass of Mercury is just a little more dangerous than the glass of NYC tap water.
    Great point. Hey BTW i thought the NYC water was supposed to be one of the best-from Catskills or somethingAdirondacks?It tasted real good when I drank it.
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    Easy I do sometimes buy organic but again, I think the point I was trying to make is that I try to do good things but even at that in todays world it isn't easy or cheap.So I can definitely do better but I can't be in fear of everything either.I do think that me and a lot of people on these boards do a hell of a lot better than the general public.Just watch people at work what they eat or just look at them-To quote Tipsta-"the proof is in the pudding and their physiques are Tapioca".Again I'm hardly perfect but I try. I've been doing really good for a while again now(still adjusting to a big move,etc.)and I think it should only get better.
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    yeah, its hard too to even figure out which risks are worse than which other risks. Almost impossible to know really

    I buy organic on and off, depends on the product. I dont really go out of my way, and I wont spend a 50% premium either.
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    Its wild to see people willing to risk health for 4lbs of lean muscle
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post
    Its wild to see people willing to risk health for 4lbs of lean muscle
    Sigh.

    Read the entire thread.
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post
    Its wild to see people willing to risk health for 4lbs of lean muscle
    Its wild to see people talking **** without reading a single post in the thread.
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    Hahahha, wow. I remember this thread from all those years ago.

    Yeah. This is old news. We basically put the cancer issue (and every other issue) to rest. I do not exaggerate when I say that MN, William Llewellyn, and X-Factor have literally rewritten the book on fatty acids.
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    Quote Originally Posted by niclas90 View Post
    Its wild to see people talking **** without reading a single post in the thread.
    http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2407/12/606

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24435810/
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    Read your own studies bro. Seems like you didnt.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Read your own studies bro. Seems like you didnt.
    Per journal website >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24435810/ Date of the information was just posted may of 2014 which brings it to current status


    BACKGROUND: Arachidonic acid (AA) pathway has been shown to play a role in the development and progression of prostate cancer (PCa). In this study we aimed to assess the changes in concentrations of hydroxyeicosatetraenoic acids (HETEs) in serum samples from patients diagnosed with PCa compared to controls.

    METHODS: HETEs were determined using ultrahigh pressure liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry (UHPLC-MS/MS).

    RESULTS: Elevated concentrations of 5-HETE, 8-HETE, 11-HETE and 15-HETE were observed in 6 out of 20 patients diagnosed with PCa; no statistical differences with controls were observed for 12-HETE and AA in the discovery set. An independent validation set composed of 222 samples divided in five groups ranging from subjects with low PSA and no PCa, to patients with advanced PCa was included. In 30% of the patients in the advanced PCa group, up to ten times higher concentrations of the same set of HETEs were observed with a significant concomitant decrease of the concentration of AA. Logistic regression and Kaplan-Meier curves illustrate that a decreased concentration of AA is a predictor of PCa biochemical recurrence after radical prostatectomy (RP).

    CONCLUSIONS: From the present study we conclude that a significant association between AA and AA metabolites in serum and PCa progression exists, although serum concentrations of HETEs exhibited low sensitivity toward the diagnosis of PCa.
    Last edited by symbianblack; 06-14-2014 at 10:03 PM. Reason: Added date of information
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post

    Per journal website >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24435810/ Date of the information was just posted may of 2014 which brings it to current status

    BACKGROUND: Arachidonic acid (AA) pathway has been shown to play a role in the development and progression of prostate cancer (PCa). In this study we aimed to assess the changes in concentrations of hydroxyeicosatetraenoic acids (HETEs) in serum samples from patients diagnosed with PCa compared to controls.

    METHODS: HETEs were determined using ultrahigh pressure liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry (UHPLC-MS/MS).

    RESULTS: Elevated concentrations of 5-HETE, 8-HETE, 11-HETE and 15-HETE were observed in 6 out of 20 patients diagnosed with PCa; no statistical differences with controls were observed for 12-HETE and AA in the discovery set. An independent validation set composed of 222 samples divided in five groups ranging from subjects with low PSA and no PCa, to patients with advanced PCa was included. In 30% of the patients in the advanced PCa group, up to ten times higher concentrations of the same set of HETEs were observed with a significant concomitant decrease of the concentration of AA. Logistic regression and Kaplan-Meier curves illustrate that a decreased concentration of AA is a predictor of PCa biochemical recurrence after radical prostatectomy (RP).

    CONCLUSIONS: From the present study we conclude that a significant association between AA and AA metabolites in serum and PCa progression exists, although serum concentrations of HETEs exhibited low sensitivity toward the diagnosis of PCa.
    Read the review paper.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Read the review paper.
    So the researcher of this journal was completely wrong? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24435810/
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post

    So the researcher of this journal was completely wrong? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24435810/
    Read the thread and the safety data on Ara supplementation.

    If you dont feel comfortable using Ara then dont use it; but be mindful that Ara is in meat and stuff so best to avoid that too
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Read the thread and the safety data on Ara supplementation.

    If you dont feel comfortable using Ara then dont use it; but be mindful that Ara is in meat and stuff so best to avoid that too
    Thats to be understood. But the amount that is in just for example X-Gels can never be obtained in a 4oz serving of 93/7 ground beef. It must be SOMETHING if they put it in there. I'm just posting information. I'm not trying to argue
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post

    Thats to be understood. But the amount that is in just for example X-Gels can never be obtained in a 4oz serving of 93/7 ground beef. It must be SOMETHING if they put it in there. I'm just posting information. I'm not trying to argue
    The study you posted is not the full text; you cant even begin to understand the study based on the little info in the abstract.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    The study you posted is not the full text; you cant even begin to understand the study based on the little info in the abstract.
    so basically you're saying the study contradicts itself and the researcher or team just put out information about it being cancerous just for the hell of it. So what are we to honestly go by if we do are due diligence to look up things like this?
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post

    so basically you're saying the study contradicts itself and the researcher or team just put out information about it being cancerous just for the hell of it. So what are we to honestly go by if we do are due diligence to look up things like this?
    Read the review you posted. Seriously.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post

    Read the review you posted. Seriously.
    Researchers found no link between increased Ara intake and cancer development
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jiigzz View Post
    Researchers found no link between increased Ara intake and cancer development
    Def a good thing to know
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post
    CONCLUSIONS: From the present study we conclude that a significant association between AA and AA metabolites in serum and PCa progression exists, although serum concentrations of HETEs exhibited low sensitivity toward the diagnosis of PCa.
    I see you wanted to put emphasis on this conclusion but you need to understand that it really is the equivalent of saying that there is a significant association between water and drowning. Water doesn't cause drowning. Most people who swim will never even approach the beginning of a drowning. Those few people who do drown in water do so because something else, some other factor, kicked in first.

    Does this analogy make sense?
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post
    so basically you're saying the study contradicts itself and the researcher or team just put out information about it being cancerous just for the hell of it. So what are we to honestly go by if we do are due diligence to look up things like this?
    If you're going to take the time to research it would behoove you to read the entire study, every page, and not the paragraph or two abstract which is sometimes wildly misleading compared to the actual statistics from the study.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pneumophant View Post
    I see you wanted to put emphasis on this conclusion but you need to understand that it really is the equivalent of saying that there is a significant association between water and drowning. Water doesn't cause drowning. Most people who swim will never even approach the beginning of a drowning. Those few people who do drown in water do so because something else, some other factor, kicked in first.

    Does this analogy make sense?
    Brilliantly put.

    The study noted that only 6 of the 20 people diagnosed with PCa had elevated AA metabolites. Not overly conclusive
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    Quote Originally Posted by symbianblack View Post

    so basically you're saying the study contradicts itself and the researcher or team just put out information about it being cancerous just for the hell of it. So what are we to honestly go by if we do are due diligence to look up things like this?
    Just look into inflammation. There is quite a difference between chronic inflammation vs periodic inflammation. Eggs contain ArA. ..does that mean eggs put my body into a constant state of inflammation and that I should stop eating them? Everything in modesty, everything responsibly.
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    Is the og formula better than the new one?
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