Best Liver Protectant?? - AnabolicMinds.com

Best Liver Protectant??

  1. New Member
    LeanBulk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    106
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    144

    Best Liver Protectant??


    Title pretty much says it all, what do you guys think is the best liver protectant on the market these days??

  2. Board Sponsor
    DrnkMnky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Age
    29
    Posts
    509
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    349
  3. New Member
    LeanBulk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    106
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    144
    •   
       

  4. Board Sponsor
    rms80's Avatar
    Stats
    6'2"  215 lbs.
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    4,224
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    204220

    Quote Originally Posted by ******** View Post
    good lookin
    Liv 52
    Silymarin
    milk thistle

    Any of the above will do the trick!!
    Dirk Tanis, BA, MSci
    Chief Operating Officer, Applied Nutriceuticals
  5. Registered User
    DeerDeer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    432
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    324

    Cycle Support by AI +
    Liv 52 +
    Lots of water


    Quote Originally Posted by ******** View Post
    Title pretty much says it all, what do you guys think is the best liver protectant on the market these days??
  6. She thinks my traps'rrrr sexy!
    supersoldier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Age
    31
    Posts
    3,204
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    1774

    Abstinence
  7. New Member
    LeanBulk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    106
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    144

    i have been reading about about SAMe.....anyone had good results with this??
  8. New Member
    zachattack43's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Age
    31
    Posts
    215
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    243

    Nac
  9. New Member
    V00D00's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Age
    32
    Posts
    225
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    204

    SAMe

    200-400mg a day, take 4 hours after ph dosing.

    everything else is just trying to do as well.
  10. Advanced Member
    Alpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    732
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    508

    High dose R-ALA (or Na-RALA @ NP)
    NAC
    S-adenosylmethionine (SAMe)

    Tyler's Detoxification Factors is a good all in one type of product. It has Calcium D-Glucarate (patented) in it.

    Milk thistle is sort of overrated. A few studies show it helps with specific toxins (i.e. types of mushrooms). These aforementioned choices are much better.

    BTW, all the threads you linked him too sucked. They were just promoting other All-in-one type products without even discussing the actual compounds themselves. Its one thing to point someone in the direction of correct answers, but if none exist, help him out.
    That which does not kill us makes us stronger - Friedrich Nietzsche
  11. Advanced Member
    Skigazzi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Age
    36
    Posts
    627
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    17463

    Lecithin is a cheap addition to liver protection, the more I read about its action on bile removal , the more I see it as a main ingredient for liver protection.
  12. Registered User
    DeerDeer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    432
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    324

    I have to read up a bi ton the value of SAMe however I did read some decent studies published in midrange peer reviewed journals on Liv 52 - what's your take?

    NAC is great for sure - we use it regularly for acetaminophen toxicity (iv formulations as well as po ones).

    RALA is also excellent as a very potent antioxidant.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpine View Post
    High dose R-ALA (or Na-RALA @ NP)
    NAC
    S-adenosylmethionine (SAMe)

    Tyler's Detoxification Factors is a good all in one type of product. It has Calcium D-Glucarate (patented) in it.

    Milk thistle is sort of overrated. A few studies show it helps with specific toxins (i.e. types of mushrooms). These aforementioned choices are much better.

    BTW, all the threads you linked him too sucked. They were just promoting other All-in-one type products without even discussing the actual compounds themselves. Its one thing to point someone in the direction of correct answers, but if none exist, help him out.
  13. Advanced Member
    Alpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    732
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    508

    Quote Originally Posted by Skigazzi View Post
    Lecithin is a cheap addition to liver protection, the more I read about its action on bile removal , the more I see it as a main ingredient for liver protection.
    Lecithin in Sesathin... I notice I seem to have less of a hangover when I have about 3ml before bed with some B-vits and lots of Gatorade. Not saying its specifically related as a result of instant liver detox issues, just interesting how it seems to work. Something with speeding up clearance I'd imagine.

    I have heard good things about Liv52 but the ingredients arent as studied and reputable as Tyler's.

    I really dont get carried away with the liver supps when taking methylated orals. The liver distress from orals is GREATLY exaggerated in most cases. I always take Na-RALA and I may throw in some NAC from time to time if I plan to go longer than normal. IMO, keeping your lipids in check is more of a concern than liver damage.

    Semi-related but interesting info on the sesathin effect I mentioned...

    "Sesamin and episesamin have been shown to raise aldehyde dehydrogenase levels by more than 3 fold. When alcohol is consumed, it enters cells and is broken down into a toxic compound known as acetaldehyde. An enzyme called aldehyde dehydrogenase 2 (ALDH2) converts the acetaldehyde into acetic acid, which is non-toxic and can be readily used by your body to provide energy." -- "The first step is done by alcohol dehydrogenase, the second step by aldehyde dehydrogenase. So with the 3 fold increase in aldehyde dehydrogenase occuring from sesamin supplementation, it would mean first step goes just as fast/good as without sesamin, but second step goes faster/better."

    Antioxidative roles of sesamin, a functional lignan in sesame seed, and it's effect on lipid- and alcohol-metabolism in the liver: a DNA microarray study.

    Kiso Y.

    Institute for Health Care Science, Suntory Ltd., 1-1-1 Wakayamadai, Shimamoto-cho, Mishima-gun, Osaka 618-8503, Japan. Yoshinobu_Kiso@suntory.co.jp

    Sesamin was orally administered to rats, and blood, bile and urine were collected periodically. Over 40% of the dose of sesamin was detected in bile as glucuronides of 2-(3, 4-methylenedioxyphenyl)-6-(3, 4-dihydroxyphenyl)-cis-dioxabicyclo[3.3.0] octane and 2-(3, 4-dihydroxyphenyl)-6-(3, 4-dihydroxyphenyl)-cis-dioxabicyclo[3.3.0] octane by 24 hr after administration. Antioxidant activities of these metabolites were compared and catechol metabolites showed strong radical scavenging activities against not only superoxide anion radical but also hydroxyl radical. It was suggested that sesamin was absorbed by the route of portal vein and metabolized to mono- or di-catechol metabolite by drug metabolizing enzymes in the liver cells. Both metabolites exhibited antioxidant activity in the liver and were finally conjugated with glucuronic acid and to excrete in bile. Sesamin can be classified as a pro-antioxidant. The profiles of gene expression of the liver in rats given sesamin or vehicle were compared. The gene expression levels of the late stage enzymes of beta-oxidation including trifunctional enzyme, acyl-CoA oxidase, bifunctional enzyme and 3-ketoacyl-CoA thiolase were significantly increased by sesamin. On the other hand, the transcription of the genes encoding the enzymes for fatty acid synthesis was decreased. Moreover, in sesamin rats, the gene expression of aldehyde dehydrogenase was increased about 3-fold, whereas alcohol dehydrogenase, liver catalase and CYP2E1 were not changed. These results suggested that sesamin ingestion regulated the transcription levels of hepatic metabolizing enzymes for lipids and alcohol.

    PMID: 15630196 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    Also
    SeaThin and Alcohol by Chris Clancey aka Loki
    That which does not kill us makes us stronger - Friedrich Nietzsche
  14. New Member
    LeanBulk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    106
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    144

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpine View Post
    High dose R-ALA (or Na-RALA @ NP)
    NAC
    S-adenosylmethionine (SAMe)

    Tyler's Detoxification Factors is a good all in one type of product. It has Calcium D-Glucarate (patented) in it.

    Milk thistle is sort of overrated. A few studies show it helps with specific toxins (i.e. types of mushrooms). These aforementioned choices are much better.

    BTW, all the threads you linked him too sucked. They were just promoting other All-in-one type products without even discussing the actual compounds themselves. Its one thing to point someone in the direction of correct answers, but if none exist, help him out.

    thanks for the info!
  15. Registered User
    DeerDeer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    432
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    324

    I totally agree - I see way too many guys using CLA (which will drop HDL and raise LDL) while on a cycle.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpine View Post
    IMO, keeping your lipids in check is more of a concern than liver damage.
    I get 56 references on pubmed for Liv52 - pulled two studies that look adequate:

    The efficacy of Liv-52 on liver cirrhotic patients: a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled first approach.Huseini HF, Alavian SM, Heshmat R, Heydari MR, Abolmaali K.
    Department of Pharmacology, Institute of Medicinal Plants, No. 97, Bozorgmehr St., Ghods St., Enghelab Ave., Tehran, Iran. huseini_fallah@yahoo.com

    Cirrhosis is the irreversible sequel of various disorders that damage liver cells permanently over time. Presently, the use of herbal medicines for prevention and control of chronic liver diseases is in the focus of attention for both the physicians and the patients; the reasons for such shift toward the use of herbals include the expensive cost of conventional drugs, adverse drug reactions, and their inefficacy. In the present study, the efficacy of herbal medicine Liv-52 (consisting of Mandur basma, Tamarix gallica and herbal extracts of Capparis spinosa, Cichorium intybus, Solanum nigrum, Terminalia arjuna and Achillea millefolium) on liver cirrhosis outcomes was compared with the placebo for 6 months in 36 cirrhotic patients referred to Tehran Hepatic Center. The outcome measures included child-pugh score, ascites, serum alanine aminotransferase (ALT), aspartate aminotransferase (AST), total billirubin, albumin, prothrombin time, platelet and white blood cells counts. The indices were recorded in all patients before and after 6 months of drug or placebo treatment. The results demonstrated that the patients treated with Liv-52 for 6 months had significantly better child-pugh score, decreased ascites, decreased serum ALT and AST. In placebo administered patients all the clinical parameters recorded at beginning of the study were not significantly different than after 6 months. We conclude that Liv-52 possess hepatoprotective effect in cirrhotic patients. This protective effect of Liv-52 can be attributed to the diuretic, anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidative, and immunomodulating properties of the component herbs.
    There is one study that shows it NOT being useful in alcoholic cirrhosis - most of the studies are positive - another below.

    [The effect of the heptoprotective agent LIV 52 on liver damage][Article in Czech]
    Kalab M, Krechler T.
    I. interni klinika 1, LF UK a VFN, Praha.

    BACKGROUND: The action of hepatoprotective drugs is a steady subject of discussions. Despite the equivocal character of action hepatoprotective drugs are used, despite the fact that the effect is partly a placebo effect. In the literature are reports on preparation LIV 52 which is a mixture of substances of plant origin and improves the subjective complaints of patients as well as the objective condition of patients with liver disease. METHODS AND RESULTS: The effect of preparation LIV 52 was investigated in a retrospective study in 19 patients with liver damage. In the majority liver damage caused by alcohol was involved, steatosis and persisting hepatitis without the finding of chronic hepatitis B and C. The authors investigated biochemical parameters (bilirubin, ALT, AST, ALP, TZR, cholesterol). The size of the liver was assessed by ultrasonography and the subjective status of the patients was recorded. Within one year of administration of the preparation subjective improvement occurred, hepatomegaly diminished and the activity of aminotransferases declined. CONCLUSIONS: Administration of LIV 52 can improve the subjective condition and clinical parameters in patients with liver damage, in particular in alcoholic liver damage and in steatosis. The effect is certainly due also to better motivation on the patients part, better lifestyle and dietary measures. After one year of treatment no undesirable side-effects were detected.

    I feel as though it would be a good adjunct with some promise, though not completely conclusive in the setting of the use of methylated compounds. I would consider adding it - especially given how affordable it is.
  16. Advanced Member
    Alpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    732
    Answers
    0
    Rep Power
    508

    Quote Originally Posted by DeerDeer View Post
    I totally agree - I see way too many guys using CLA (which will drop HDL and raise LDL) while on a cycle.
    (This is worth getting off topic)

    That seems to be the one of the few bad things about CLA. The only studies showing lowered LDL are in rabbits and mice (Entrez PubMed). Those selling it ran with them even though human results are quite different. Human evidence shows no real effect on LDL and a lowering of HDL.

    I think the body fat reduction benefits have been proven fairly well with some of the more recent studies. CLA has many great benefits. Its touted as lowering cholesterol although I think this issue should be clarified. Overall, I feel its healthy but I'm a bit concerned about its effects on HDL. I really havent made up my mind but I continue to take it for body fat lowering effects.

    The famous Gaullier's study basically showed:

    Both CLA groups lost weight -- about 4 pounds; the placebo group stayed the same.
    The CLA syrup group had a 9% body fat loss; the CLA pill group had 7% loss; the placebo group had no body fat loss.
    Both CLA groups had similar improvements in muscle mass.

    On the downside:

    The CLA pill group had slightly higher LDL "bad" cholesterol.
    The CLA syrup group had slightly lower HDL "good" cholesterol.
    Both CLA groups had higher lipoprotein levels, a marker of inflammation and heart disease.
    Both CLA groups had higher white blood cell counts, which could trigger damaging artery inflammation.
    The CLA groups had only modest changes in blood sugar levels, a marker for diabetes.

    Gaullier J-M. et al., "Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) supplementation for one-year reduces body fat mass in healthy, overweight humans". American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 2004; 79(6):1118-1125.

    Also
    CLA For Atherosclerosis and Diabetes Therapy (PDF)
    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=re...Sv0YwBuf9o8N-A
    ods.od.nih.gov/news/conferences/cla/houseknecht_new_presentation.p df

    To be quite honest, this topic deserves its own thread. There is a lot of CLA hype right now. Im a fan of it too. But I think people should be informed. CLA always gets more popular around summer time. And its especially popular at AM now with Dsades killer deal. Best quality CLA deal I have seen. I'm still getting another bottle in my next order.

    It's amazing how productive I get with my AM posts when I have other important work (case comment for law review) that I'm procrastinating with. Somehow I think my priorities need a serious reality check. Delete my account...pls...
    That which does not kill us makes us stronger - Friedrich Nietzsche
  •   

      
     

Similar Forum Threads

  1. Best on cycle Liver protectant??
    By Turbo4V in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 50
    Last Post: 07-29-2012, 01:44 PM
  2. Best liver protection supp.....
    By pvtpARTS in forum Anabolics
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 03-27-2009, 03:40 AM
  3. what is the best liver protectant supp
    By ersatz in forum Supplements
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 06-08-2005, 10:29 AM
  4. Liver protection When on 1-Test?
    By YellowJacket in forum Supplements
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 12-01-2002, 08:32 PM
  5. some links to liver protection information
    By hamper19 in forum Supplements
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 11-13-2002, 12:50 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Log in
Log in