NOLVADEX...not Novadex XT...question (my dad is a doctor lol)
- 01-06-2007, 03:14 PM
NOLVADEX...not Novadex XT...question (my dad is a doctor lol)
ok so i was talking to my dad about how ppl take nolvadex (tamofixen) for post cycle therapy and the end of their cycles and he was flipping **** saying thats ludicrous...there are no scientific studies on how this effects men and what the long term effects on ect...and i was trying to tell him its used to stop gyno and help get your testes into producing normal level hormones and stuff and he said ya but there r just no scientific research on what the other effects are and long term effects are such as cancer ect...
are there any research studies? i would like to show my dad (he does think he knows it all)
he wants me to find him actual scientific studies not just ppl taking it saying this is what it did for me
- 01-06-2007, 03:30 PM
well first, you are talking a bout a Reasearch Chem in the supplements section. *Zombie points to the FAQ*
And second is your dad an endocrinologist? or what the specialty of your dad?
- 01-06-2007, 03:35 PM
01-06-2007, 03:38 PM
01-06-2007, 05:39 PM
01-06-2007, 05:49 PM
01-06-2007, 06:00 PM
01-06-2007, 06:11 PM
Transcriptional Activation and Repression Are Mediated by Protein-Protein Interactions
Next time take a small amount of time to search. Also, I've seen your steroid thread over at bb and I suggest you knock that idea on the head...I do encourage you to at least research PCT.
01-06-2007, 06:26 PM
Originally Posted by Ziricote
ya i decided against doing PHera-plex as of now and gonna stick with my non-hormonal stack.. (like i said in my post) which is AP/JW and most likely , now im just wanting to show my dad that men using nolvadex isnt crazy
but thank you on the link
01-06-2007, 06:38 PM
That is not what I saw you asking about.Originally Posted by East1600Plus
On topic - I don't personally see why you would want to prove it to him but if he knows it's application for women then surely he must know that it would work in a similar way on breast tissue in men.
Frankly I wouldn't be bringing up something like that with a doctor, let alone my own father. They don't tend to like people to know too much in my experience, plus to some doctors it's a give away that you're at least looking into steroids because a random member of the public with gyno probably wouldn't be asking 'to the point' questions.
01-06-2007, 07:01 PM
ya it was b/c i was asking him about nolvadex and stuff and what he thoughts about it if i wanted to use phera-plex ...oddly enough he didnt say anything about a PH/designer steroid but flipped on the nolvadex so i decided against doing a PP cycle and just doing my stack of AP/JW/Originally Posted by Ziricote
01-06-2007, 07:06 PM
Tons of doctors prescribe compounds that have negative long term effects.. look at Lipitor (which is one of the most profitable drugs on the planet for Phizer).
Your Dad should be really concerned about his 18 year old son mentioning post cycle therapy in any case.
01-06-2007, 07:32 PM
A lot of doctors assume that since it's over the counter, it won't have side effects. They don't realize there are real steroids being sold as supplements.
A while back a guy on here went to his doc with two different bottles of new designers. I want to say one was PP and the other was superdrol or HD, but I don't remember exactly. Anway, the doc noticed the five letter word "andro" in the ingredient of one (which he was scared of), but the other bottle didn't have that, so he told him it would be fine to take it.
01-06-2007, 08:57 PM
What long term effects does lipitor have? Itis one of the most studied and well documented compounds available at lipid lowering. In the ER for those presenting with acute myocardial infarction, some studies are pointing to superior cardiovascular outcomes with 80mg doses in this setting.
The risk of rhambdomyolysis are very small. Long term issues are currently unavailable and ar enone to the general knowledge. It is one of the most profitable because tons of research was done and it is one of the few compounds on the market (besides aspirin) which has well documents in numerous studies excellent effects at lipid lowering and promotion of cardiovascular health.
I get what you were trying to say - a better example would have been that of hormone replacement therapy in females. it was done for years and believed to help with hip fractures but negatively impacted cardiovascular health. Sure, there were possible less hip fractures - but there were more heart attacks.
I can only imagine hwo the conversation must have been with his dad - pct? gyno? anabolic steroids?!! eeeek! conversely, his dad may be like, "son, let's get you the right meds" LOL
Originally Posted by Ubiquitous
01-06-2007, 08:59 PM
In all honesty, most physicians, unless exposed to it vigorously in the field, have lmited knowledge of anabolic steroids. However, they are typically made aware of the dangers which they transmit to their patients. In some instances, they are prescribing medications that may have adverse events that may be worse than those associated with any given anabolic. *sigh*
Originally Posted by Moyer
01-06-2007, 09:09 PM
Statins in the same class have been pulled off the market in recent years (Crestor and Baycol). Rhabdomyolysis is rare, sure, but other sides were reported as well.
I'm concerned as my Mom is using Lipitor, and have read sketchy reports since then... and I don't really trust the doctors available to her.
I don't know, I'm not especially trusting of the FDA and big Pharm companies.. Not so much a consipiracy theorist, I just feel that absolute power corrupts absolutely.
01-06-2007, 10:20 PM
If there is any statin I would have a family member on, it is Lipitor. It is unknown if there truly is a class effect so tell her to stick with it. Make sure she is on 81 mg of aspirin too!
Originally Posted by Ubiquitous
01-06-2007, 11:42 PM
01-07-2007, 01:14 AM
Honestly, it's a lot of work for me to search through forums and pubmed to find studies so some guy can explain to his dad about something he's not going to use anyway. Someone already posted the pubmed link for him.Originally Posted by FitModel
It was fine for the OP to ask, incase someone bookmarked the studies, but it appears so far that nobody has done that. I'm guessing Nolva & other SERM use is just too common to bother saving the original studies.
01-07-2007, 02:21 AM
01-07-2007, 03:43 AM
ya like every1 said i got a link i can find what i need i'm good just needed a point in the right direction (not helpless.....yet )Originally Posted by FitModel
01-08-2007, 10:09 AM
tell your dad to look in his pdr, male gyno is actually listed as a reason for prescribing. dont forget in rare cases men get breast cancer too.
01-08-2007, 10:19 AM
I dont think many doctors including endos know to prescribe nolvadex for gyno, I would imagine they just send you straight for surgery.
I have spoken to an endo about novadex and he insinuated that using nolvadex as post cycle therapy is a placebo effect.
When I was briefly looking for side effects of nolvadex this is what I found.
01-08-2007, 10:28 AM
every dr. has access to a pdr i would start there. btw your link involved long term [more than a year] at 4 times normal dosing. i cant think of many prescribed meds that wouldnt be harmfull under those conditions.
01-08-2007, 10:32 AM
Thing is that's with women who have taken high doses of it over long periods of time, we're talking mid to moderate amounts over a relatively short period of time. Did you not ask the Endo to explain why he thinks that about Nolva in PCT?Originally Posted by ItsHectic
01-08-2007, 10:39 AM
Too true, the reason is because one of the medical mottos is the less known to a patient the better treated, but it still doesnt explain why they bottle up so much when your simply trying to understand what is going on. Another reason is because it makes them nervous that they might slip the wrong infomation and the last thing they want to do is give incorrect infomation.Originally Posted by Ziricote
In my experience I have found doctors who are well spoken are more willing to have a conversation with to the point questions where as doctors who arnt well spoken will get on edge and bottle up.
To me it seems that the use in males as post cycle therapy would be less risky then use in females over a long period of time.Originally Posted by Ziricote
I didnt ask him as I was already pushing the envelope not only by the questions but also the length of the apointment.
From my experience I am guessing he said that because he has never heard of it being used as post cycle therapy, I think it was just his logical response.
I had the endocrinology register at the hospital tell me they have never prescribed nolva for gyno so either its all lies or the endos in Australia honestly dont believe it has a medical use for gyno. Keep in mind these are the same doctors giving 200mg Sustanon injections every 14 days instead of 100mg T Cyp injections every 7 days for TRT.
01-08-2007, 11:00 AM
yes my dad did go..here...
Look at a PDR and look for Tamoxifen and tell me the side effects it has on women
01-08-2007, 12:37 PM
A GREAT MANY of the side effects experienced by women will be absent in males, simply because estrogen is not the mainstay of our gender's hormonal balance. For women, blocking estrogen has the same degree of side effects than for a man to be testosterone-less. Think PCT, ask the guys how it feels, etc.Originally Posted by East1600Plus
01-08-2007, 03:01 PM
if i asked my dr. for something for [post cycle therapy] he would say 'why did you go on a long bicycle trip' .
01-08-2007, 03:09 PM
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