The Catch on Fish Oil
- 12-14-2006, 11:16 PM
The Catch on Fish Oil
I am a big proponent of supplementing your diet with Ultra Refined high-dose fish oil.
Since the doses of fish oil I recommend are pretty high by conventional standards (though not by historical standards), I only advise taking what I refer to as Ultra Refined Omega 3 DHA and EPA concentrates. This type of fish oil exceeds my rigorous standards for purity, meaning that toxins like PCBs or DDT have been reduced to exceedingly low levels, and it has been refined so that gastrointestinal problems associated with lower grades of fish oil are no longer present.
You aren't going to find Ultra Refined Omega 3 DHA and EPA concentrates in fish oil from the health food store or supermarket, because the extra refining simply makes it too expensive. But your brain and body deserve nothing less. At the levels of fish oil supplementation that I recommend, less pure fish oil will cause a buildup of toxic impurities like PCBs, which have been shown to disrupt your hormonal system, possibly giving rise to cancerous tumors, not to mention significant gastrointestinal problems like gas, abdominal pain, and diarrhea.
The History of Fish Oil
You'll be taking a lot of fish oil on the nutritional programs we devise in the office and a little education and history about its manufacturing is in order. The first recorded production of fish oil occurred in 1775 in England. When cod was bought back from America, the livers were slapped on the filthy streets of London, and the oil oozed out. The oil was collected--along with anything else on the streets--and sold as cod liver oil. Disgusting as it was, this crude cod liver oil was considered a miracle cure for arthritis. Obviously, we've come a long way from letting cod livers ooze their content in the gutters, but I still consider the cod liver oil sold in today's drugstores pretty vile.
In the 1980s, fish oil manufacturing took a technological leap. Manufacturers began extracting the oil from the body, instead of the liver of the fish, which solved the problem of Vitamin A toxicity (since the liver contains all the Vitamin A). To extract fish oil, the fish are boiled until the oil rises to the top of the vat, a process known as rendering. Unfortunately, this crude fish oil represents the sewer of the sea, since anything eaten by the fish that is water-insoluble will become part of that rendered oil. This includes toxins like PCBs, DDT, and organic mercury compounds.
In addition, these fish body oils tasted just as bad as cod liver oil, so consumers were loath to try them. Manufacturers solved this problem by encapsulating the oil in soft gelatin capsules, which could be swallowed whole.
But that created another problem. To get the same amount of long-chain Omega-3 fatty acids provided by a tablespoon of cod liver oil required eight 1-gram capsules of fish body oil per day. None of us wants to spend our day popping capsules. But the one or two capsules a day that most of us are willing to take acts essentially like a placebo because the amount of long-chain Omega-3 fatty acids in this dose is extremely small.
For these reasons, the fish oil mania that swept our nation in the mid-1980s burned out quickly. People did not experience any perceptible health benefits because the amount of fish oil they were taking was too low to have any positive effect. Furthermore, any small benefits that might have occurred would have been canceled out by the changing dietary habits. Remember, we were in the midst of a passionate love affair with carbohydrates during that decade, and these carbs would have caused a surge in our insulin levels, which in turn, increased the formation of arachidonic acid.
The formation of arachidonic acid was exactly the opposite of what fish oil was expected to do. Adding insult to injury, once the capsule dissolved in the stomach, many people were bothered by a fishy taste in their mouths and fishy breath for hours. If that wasn?t enough, other contaminants (usually weird fatty acids made by algae) present in the fish oil often caused bloating and diarrhea.
Although the vitamin A was removed from the fish body oil capsules, there was still the lingering problem of PCBs. To deal with this problem, some manufacturers employed a technology called molecular distillation, which removed some (but not all) of the PCBs.
The next innovation in fish oil development was the removal of some of the saturated fats by distillation to give fractionated fish oils slightly increased levels of long-chain Omega-3 fatty acids. However, the purity of these products is still not up to what I define as pharmaceutical standards.
The final breakthrough in fish oils was the development of what I consider to be Ultra Refined EPA and DHA concentrate Omega 3 product. This requires advanced chemical engineering that begins with the removal of most of the saturated fat by fractional distillation and the removal of virtually all the PCBs (measured in parts per billion) by more sophisticated molecular distillation.
With these innovations, a new type of fish oil was created, one that could deliver a concentrated amount of long-chain Omega-3 fatty acids without unwanted byproducts like chemical contaminants or harmful fatty acids. It is only with the use of pharmaceutical-grade fish oil that you can deliver high enough levels of long-chain Omega-3 fats to your brain and body. Once you do, remarkable things begin to happen within 30 days.
The Benefits of High Dose Fish Oil
What can you expect when you begin taking high-dose fish oil if you're relatively healthy and have no chronic illnesses like heart disease or Alzheimer's disease? You will notice that your mental abilities are enhanced and that your emotions are on a more even keel. Taking significant doses of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids increases your body's production of the two neurotransmitters serotonin and dopamine. Dopamine spurs you to action, enhancing your brain's ability to concentrate on the task at hand and allowing you to organize yourself more efficiently. Serotonin is your morality or "feel good" hormone. It gives you a sense of well-being and allows you to handle stress more easily. When you've depleted these neurotransmitters, you're at greater risk of developing attention deficit disorder (low dopamine levels) or depression (low serotonin levels).
Patients with neurological disorders like Alzheimer's, attention deficit disorder (ADD), depression, multiple sclerosis, and Parkinson's disease (to name a few) appear to require higher levels of these fatty acids on the order of 10 to 25 grams per day. There's been an apparent improvement in symptoms in patients who take these higher doses; It's also been found that when they drop their dose to below 10 grams of long-chain omega-3 fatty acids per day, their neurological symptoms invariably re appear.
Patients who take such high doses would find it inconvenient to swallow 10 or more fish oil capsules a day. They need to take fish oil straight from the bottle, delivered by the tablespoon (just as your grandmother did). The purity of pharmaceutical-grade fish oil makes that a realistic possibility, especially if the fish oil is kept in the freezer (remember, it won't freeze).
Here's a promise that is presented by supplementing fish oil. Within thirty days of taking 1 to 2 teaspoons (or 4 to 8 capsules) of Ultra Refined EPA and DHA Concentrate - fish oil* you can expect to find yourself thinking more clearly with a greater sense of concentration, owing to increased dopamine production. In addition, your ability to handle stress will be greatly increased, owing to increased serotonin production. Finally, you will see an improvement in your physical capacity for exercise, especially in terms of greater endurance, owing to better blood flow. Most important, however, you are keeping yourself in the Zone, ensuring a longer and better life.
- 02-12-2007, 07:49 AM
Can some one pls tell me what's the maximum safe dosage for fish oils? How many grams per day would be too much? I really like the effect it has on my mood. I take about 6 grams per day now.
- 02-12-2007, 10:21 AM
I personally take 2 grams of pharmaceutical grade omega 3's a day (formula contains all seven omega 3 fatty acids). Medical researchers and practitioners from around the world are using high-dose fish oil (from 2 grams to 25 grams or more a day) not only for health maintenance, but also to help treat a variety of health conditions, including asthma, bronchitis, emphysema, high blood pressure, heart disease, arthritis, depression, hot flashes, Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, Alzheimer's, attention deficit disorder (ADD), MS, Parkinson's disease, dyslexia, and many more.
If you are using more than a gram or two a day of fish oil (higher doses are needed for working with the medical problems and issues listed above), however, it is important from the standpoint of your health to use only ultra-refined fish oil or in simple terms, fish oil that adheres to strict quality control standards to ensure maximum purity and the most potent and effective levels of EPA and DHA. Otherwise you may be taking in mercury, dioxins, and other toxins, as well as excessive saturated fat, that can be harmful to your health.
I don't feel the need for any more than 2 grams a day. I don't believe there is any additional benefit to taking anything more than that once you pass the two gram mark but to each his own.
02-26-2007, 03:28 PM
how are you defining this level of refinement?
When you select your fish oil what is telling you that it is up to the standard you are looking for?
02-26-2007, 06:53 PM
I take 20-25 grams a day of Carlsons liquid fish oil. Poliquin recommends even more at 30-45 grams per day. I've found at 20-25 grams a day it improves my insulin sensitivity, and I can stay a bit leaner while eating in a large caloric surplus.
02-27-2007, 12:06 AM
- 6'0" 190 lbs.
- Join Date
- Oct 2004
You certainly can get the good stuff at any Whole Foods. It's called Spectrum Essentials, and it's guaranteed to have no heavy metals. We started using it whenmy wife got pregnant with our first, and have used it ever since.
02-27-2007, 07:02 AM
02-28-2007, 02:53 PM
02-28-2007, 03:34 PM
Be wary of taking HUGE amounts of fish oil. You have to consider the intake of fat soluble vitamins like A and D.
In addition very high doses of fish oil will have an effect on blood viscosity.
Department of Human Biology, Nutrition and Toxicology Research and Cardiovascular Research Institutes of Maastricht, Maastricht University, Maastricht, The Netherlands.
OBJECTIVE: The beneficial effect of dietary fish oil, rich in omega-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs), on cardiovascular disease is multifactorial and may partly rely on their anticoagulant action. We studied how fish oil intake influenced thrombin generation in plasma and which factors were involved herein. METHODS AND RESULTS: Twenty-five healthy males with borderline overweight received 3.0 g omega-3 PUFAs daily for 4 weeks. Fish oil intake reduced plasma triglycerides and lowered platelet integrin activation, as well as plasma levels of fibrinogen and factor V, but had no effect on vitamin K-dependent coagulation factors. Before fish oil intake, thrombin generation (reflecting the coagulant potential) considerably varied between plasmas from individual subjects, which were partly explained by variation in prothrombin, antithrombin, fibrinogen, and factor V levels. Fish oil intake reduced thrombin generation in the presence and absence of platelets. This reduction correlated with the fish oil effect on fibrinogen and factor V levels. Interestingly, the lowering effect of fish oil on thrombin generation and fibrinogen clustered around subjects with high fibrinogen carrying a structural fibrinogen alpha-chain polymorphism. CONCLUSIONS: Dietary omega-3 PUFAs provoke a hypocoagulant, vitamin K-independent effect in humans, the degree of which may depend on fibrinogen level. Intake of fish oil reduced fibrinogen and factor V levels as well as thrombin generation in plasma. The effects on thrombin generation and fibrinogen clustered around subjects with high fibrinogen carrying alpha-chain fibrinogen polymorphism. Thus, dietary fish oil can provoke a hypocoagulant effect depending on the fibrinogen level
02-28-2007, 03:56 PM
02-28-2007, 09:41 PM
03-02-2007, 01:20 PM
Right now I take O3Mega liquid fish oil from Genuine Health, which I get out of GNC - it is pharmaceutical grade quality from wild fish (anchovy, sardines and mackeral), free of all toxins including mercury and PCBs. Per 5ml it provides 524mg DHA and 786mg of EPA.
I also like NutraSea liquid and Nordic Naturals liquid.
03-08-2007, 05:25 AM
While DHA displays neuroprotective properties.... when administered in excess, can actually display neurodegenerative properties.
AA and DHA are the most vulnerable targets for free radical-catalyzed lipid peroxidation. Docosanoids/neuroprostanes, are oxidation products of DHA. The compounds 4-hydroxy-2-hexenal/neuroketals, remain esterified to phospholipids, significantly inhibit proteasome, and are highly cytotoxic. This oxidative damage can lead to docosanoid-induced neurodegeneration, and is associated with neurodegenerative disease.
Fatty Acid Oxidation in the Pathogenesis of Alzheimer's Disease -- Montine and Morrow 166 (5): 1283 -- American Journal of Pathology
Formation of Highly Reactive gamma -Ketoaldehydes (Neuroketals) as Products of the Neuroprostane Pathway -- Bernoud-Hubac et al. 276 (33): 30964 -- Journal of Biological Chemistry
Fatty Acid Oxidation in the Pathogenesis of Alzheimer's Disease -- Montine and Morrow 166 (5): 1283 -- American Journal of Pathology
03-08-2007, 11:44 AM
03-13-2007, 11:54 AM
I appreciate the thought but you have the wrong guy though
03-13-2007, 08:32 PM
I got some EPA400 DHA 200 Omega-3's from Costco, and take about 2 of them a day, so not over dosing but that + my flaxseed and almonds covers my EFA. It says ultra-purified and distilled, but I actually emailed the company about the mercury content/chem analysis of their product. They might get back to me; I have had webbers send me detailed breakdowns for some of their other products in the past.
03-16-2007, 07:17 PM
What's you take on Udo's 3/6/9 blend? I take that but it's not made from any animal oils, it's all plant based. Am I missing out on not taking fish oil along with it? I used to take fish oil but I thought Udo's might be better because it has all the omegas in the correct ratios.
03-17-2007, 04:58 AM
The insignificant amounts of ALA found within flax (a plant-based omega 3), must first be converted into to EPA (and this conversion is often inhibited).
03-17-2007, 07:37 AM
03-17-2007, 08:40 AM
03-17-2007, 09:39 AM
I know but the whole point of Udo's brand IS the correct ratios(according to him)
An ideal 2:1:1 ratio of omega 3, 6 and 9 essential fatty acids, proven by research to benefit cardiovascular health, enhance stamina and energy, and improve general health and well-being.
03-17-2007, 01:34 PM
03-17-2007, 01:47 PM
Thanks Bro. What about the studies Ast claims why they made there supplement Myo-D which all it is is almost all EPA and No DHA , they claim very high levels of EPA, like you'd have to take a boatload of fish oil to get this, improves recovery and takes musclegrowth to another level. I dont know how true this is but most of ASt-ss says has been right on.
03-17-2007, 01:57 PM
03-17-2007, 01:58 PM
03-17-2007, 02:06 PM
03-17-2007, 02:09 PM
03-17-2007, 03:04 PM
Anyways I get what you're saying thanks for the info.
03-18-2007, 01:13 AM
04-05-2007, 10:51 AM
Fish oil Brand and dosage
Guys, take a look at Dr. Mercola's website mercola. com and put "Fish Oil" to search his site for a ton of info on it. He recommends Carlson's Fish Oil in the warmer months and their Cod Liver oil in the colder months. The cod liver oil has bio-available forms of Vit. A and D that you need (you aren't getting Vit. D during the Winter months due to less Sun exposure). He recommends 1 Teaspoon for ever 50lbs of bodyweight. It is also VERY important to buy a fish oil that has Natural Vitamin E in it. Otherwise, it can go rancid in your body and that is where you run into the issue. It's all on his site.
Our ratio of Omega 6 to 3 should be around 1:1. The average american diet is 20:1 up to 50:1. I know most of us health nuts do much better than that but we still need the extra fish oil. Udo's is a good brand but I don't think you need the Omega 6 and 9 it has in it. Dr. Serrano told me not to take Flax oil after 35 because our body just turns it into EPA anyway. Just stay with the Fish oil. Since I have been on it my insulin sensativity is that of an elite athlete and my Bad cholesterol and Triglcyrids have dropped drastically. Many other things about my body seem to be better too.
04-06-2007, 11:22 AM
What's the molecular distillation practice of the fish oil you're recommending?
04-06-2007, 11:41 AM
04-06-2007, 11:46 AM
Does Fish Oil Produce Super Babies?
Researchers at the University of Western Australia set up a study to assess the effects of high-dose fish oil supplementation during pregnancy on the subsequent cognitive development of children born from those supplementing mothers.
Ninety-eight pregnant women took part in this double-blind, randomized, and placebo controlled study. Twenty weeks after being knocked up, mothers-to-be were given 2.2g of DHA and 1.1g EPA each day until delivery. The placebo group received the same amount of olive oil.
Prospective mommies had a good five months on "the fish" before delivery, which typically occurs 38-40 weeks after gestation.
Two and a half years after birth, children in the fish oil group scored significantly higher in eye-hand coordination. In fact, eye-hand scores correlated with the levels of omega-3s in the cord blood erythrocytes (red blood cells).
Interestingly, these scores were also inversely correlated with levels of omega-6 fatty acid (found in animal fats and egg yolks), the principle precursor to "bad" eicosanoids (hormone-like compounds) involved in inflammatory processes of the body.
Researchers concluded fish oil supplementation during pregnancy has potential beneficial effects on the child's eye and hand coordination and is safe for the fetus and infant. [Arch Dis Child Fetal Neonatal Ed. 2006 Dec 21]
04-06-2007, 12:00 PM
04-06-2007, 12:26 PM
Carlson's Fish Oil Mfg. Process and FAQ's
If you go to Calrsonlabs .com and look at their FAQ section, they have a .pdf file (see attached) that tells you about their Mfg process and the FDA's RDA of fish oil. I don't necessarily agree with the FDA on many issue but...
Them mention some interesting things about the qualification of putting "phamaceutical grade" on a product.
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