Muscle Specific GDA

Grayson

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Are there any?

From all the research and threads I've encountered, not once have I read that a glucose disposal agent ingredient would be muscle specific.

If anything, can we suppose that the most we'd want to accomplish before a cheat meal/heavy carb load would be reduced blood sugar?
 
aaronuconn

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TUDCA may be.

Not at an economically feasible dosage, though.
 
aaronuconn

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You also need to differentiate between products that have GDA properties and ones that promote insulin sensitivity.
 
Grayson

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You also need to differentiate between products that have GDA properties and ones that promote insulin sensitivity.
For a body recomp position, we don't want total enhanced insulin sensitivity due to insulin acting on both muscle and fat cells.

We also do not want enhanced glut-4 expression because glut-4 is located in skeletal muscle and adipose tissue.

Thus to get the most out of carbs, instead of the aforementioned, and instead of delaying/preventing glucose absorbtion (GCB or gymnema), how can we create an optimal situation for shuttling glucose into skeletal muscle without affecting fat? (besides working out)
 
aaronuconn

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For a body recomp position, we don't want total enhanced insulin sensitivity due to insulin acting on both muscle and fat cells. We also do not want enhanced glut-4 expression because glut-4 is located in skeletal muscle and adipose tissue. Thus to get the most out of carbs, instead of the aforementioned, and instead of delaying/preventing glucose absorbtion (GCB or gymnema), how can we create an optimal situation for shuttling glucose into skeletal muscle without affecting fat? (besides working out)
Correct, I was referring to muscle insulin sensitivity as opposed to adipose insulin sensitivity.

There aren't many compounds that I can think if that take preference for muscle.
 

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Isn't berberine?
This. Berberine is unique in that it activates Glut4 but also blocks PPAR gamma, thus making it tissue specific to muscle tissue.
 
JudoJosh

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Squats!

I am also a fan of berberine
 
Grayson

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Thanks. But, what about atrogin-1 and suppressing muscle hypertrophy?

Working would theoretically blunt this, but still there are no guarantees.
 

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aaronuconn

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Thanks. But, what about atrogin-1 and suppressing muscle hypertrophy? Working would theoretically blunt this, but still there are no guarantees.
I'd think anything increasing AMPk would be considered something "suppressing hypertrophy", how to an appreciable amount? Doubt it.
 

xhrr

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I'd think anything increasing AMPk would be considered something "suppressing hypertrophy", how to an appreciable amount? Doubt it.
Anecdotally I have never noticed it. By far one of my favorite ingredients regardless of goals.
 
SwolenONE

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Good thread, Ive actually noticed that I gain fat easier with some GDA products. With that in mind, Recompadrol is my go-to now, dont even bother with those that actually slow my progress.
 

cbsharpe

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Good thread, Ive actually noticed that I gain fat easier with some GDA products. With that in mind, Recompadrol is my go-to now, dont even bother with those that actually slow my progress.
Recompadrol is my go-to GDA too along with NA-RALA
 
money0351

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Thanks. But, what about atrogin-1 and suppressing muscle hypertrophy?

Working would theoretically blunt this, but still there are no guarantees.
EFB has addressed this in a thread before stating that the amount of suppression is negligible, regardless the glut4 activation greatly outweighs the amount of suppression
 
booneman77

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Quadzilla99

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Do you typically cap this yourself or take as powder?
I haven't tried it yet. I bought a bottle and am planning to start taking it this week. Heard it tastes awful might wrap it up in something digestible and swallow it that way if it tastes too horrid
 
kbayne

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I can assure you that you DO NOT want to just throw it in the mouth and chase it with water. It is by far the worst tasting supplement/thing you will ever try. I would at least parachute it.

Or try it, video it, and let us watch haha.
 

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I can assure you that you DO NOT want to just throw it in the mouth and chase it with water. It is by far the worst tasting supplement/thing you will ever try. I would at least parachute it. Or try it, video it, and let us watch haha.
Please do! LOL
 
Adobo

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I can assure you that you DO NOT want to just throw it in the mouth and chase it with water. It is by far the worst tasting supplement/thing you will ever try. I would at least parachute it.

Or try it, video it, and let us watch haha.
I've chugged it and gotten used to it. Cissus is much more tolerable than berberine though. However it stains everything horribly.
 
kbayne

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I've chugged it and gotten used to it. Cissus is much more tolerable than berberine though. However it stains everything horribly.
I went through a 50 gram bottle and never got used to it lol. I did the parachute method whenever I could.
 
aaronuconn

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Has bioavailability problems. I got some meriva phytosomal curcumin on a sale which is supposed to be the best kind and I still don't think it worked
I remember discussing this with you before, but is Mervia still considered number 1? What were some of the other options?
 
Grayson

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Has bioavailability problems. I got some meriva phytosomal curcumin on a sale which is supposed to be the best kind and I still don't think it worked
From what I've read, bioperine greatly increases bioavailabiliy.
 
heavylifter33

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Berberine uncapped worse than cissus lol. No thanks.
 
Quadzilla99

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I remember discussing this with you before, but is Mervia still considered number 1? What were some of the other options?
I think the meriva is still supposed to be the best. I tried two big bottles (Source Naturals brand) and stopped caring when that did nothing perceivable for me so I dunno if anythings changed
 
T-Bone

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The way I can describe the taste of yellow gold is burnt rubber. If you have ever smelled that smell after someone burned rubber, just imagine what it would taste like. Nothing can cover up that taste.
 

xhrr

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The way I can describe the taste of yellow gold is burnt rubber. If you have ever smelled that smell after someone burned rubber, just imagine what it would taste like. Nothing can cover up that taste.
Yep it is horrible. I can tolerate bulk cissus powder by chugging it in a little bit of water but Berberine is way worse so if you can't handle cissus don't even bother trying bulk berberine. Cissus is nice in that it doesn't linger like berberine. Berberine will hang around for an hour or so after it's that bad. I didn't believe it at first so I tried it myself and all accounts are true. I capped 100 grams before which is a pain in the ass but some powder still gets on the side of the caps so when I take it I get a little bit of that delicious residue. I would just stick to a good GDA that includes berberine unless you have time to cap the bulk powder. Burn 24 is the best imo followed by Recompadrol. They work better than straight berberine in my exp,. anyway but I would never use a GDA that didn't include it as I think it is the all star of any good formulation.
 

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also Anabolic Pump (AP) is the only GDA shown to work acutely in healthy males that exercise.
 
kbayne

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also Anabolic Pump (AP) is the only GDA shown to work acutely in healthy males that exercise.
Yet to try AP still. Not sure why I haven't gave it a go yet.
 
Grayson

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Interesting read on glucose lowering effects and increased glut-4 expression of isoleucine:

http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/ajpendo/292/6/E1683.full.pdf

0.45g/kg was the dose given. For a 70kg human that's 5.11 grams.

Just bought some from nutrabio, so I'll run an experiment on my next carb up and update the thread.

Recent investigations have revealed that the energy excess derived from amino acids activates mTOR and/or S6K1, which leads to insulin resistance (20, 21, 35). However, the single amino acid isoleucine decreases blood glucose through a si- multaneous increase in glucose utilization that actually im- proves glucose metabolism and energy states of both the muscle and liver (Fig. 8). Although the molecular basis of these findings remains to be determined, elucidation of the associa- tions related to these factors when using isoleucine may pro- vide new insights into the role of amino acids on metabolic disorders related to insulin resistance.

In conclusion, our study revealed that isoleucine lowers blood glucose levels by both stimulation of the muscle glucose uptake and an increase in glucose oxidation within the whole body without significant elevation of plasma insulin levels. Our study also showed that isoleucine reduces hepatic glucose production in vitro and the expression and activity of hepatic gluconeogenic enzymes both in vitro and in vivo. By achieving a better understanding of the mechanism of isoleucine’s activ- ity, this may potentially provide important information relevant to the effects of amino acids on glucose metabolism.
 

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