Ephedrine product question?

[GuyinLA]

Even with the ban, I have learned that ephedrine products can still be purchased. Vasopro is still available. However, the company is careful to market the product as an asthma medicine and adds Guaifenesin as an additional ingredient.

However, I have recently come across another ephedrine product (Mahuang is used) that is clearly marketed as a weight loss aid. It is made by Superior Nutraceuticals (http://www.superiornutraceuticals.com/products/Thermo.htm). I don't know anything about the company. However, if the ingredients in the product are to be believed it looks like an excellent product.

Questions:

1. How does the company get away with marketing this product with the ban? I was under the impression that Mahuang is included in the ban since it is simply the herbal form of ephedrine.
2. Anyone have any experience with this company? Is the company legit? Are the products good?

Thanks.

 

[sawastea]

There are a few sites that still have not updated their website. If you contact them, and they are located in the USA, they will tell you that they no longer have it and that they need to update their website (chances are). If you want pure ephedrine HCL, you can visit DNE

 

[GuyinLA]

There are a few sites that still have not updated their website. If you contact them, and they are located in the USA, they will tell you that they no longer have it and that they need to update their website (chances are). If you want pure ephedrine HCL, you can visit DNE

I have become aware of DNE. Like Vasopro their product is marketed as an asthma medicine. I have never ordered from DNE but the cost is lower vs. Vasopro. I may go with DNE next time around.

 

[diamonddave]

I've been using DNE for several years now. I would recommend them to anyone for ephedrine products. They're not super speedy at shipping like our board sponsors, but I consistently get my orders in 7 - 10 days. I think that you have to fax a copy of your drivers license the first time you buy. They keep it on file and request a new fax when it expires. It's a small hassle, but worth it. All in all, they are a stand-up company that you should feel comfortable doing business with.


dd

 

[littlemark]

I don't know how you feel about ordering from outside of the US, but its widely available legally here in Canada. Seems they put a dosage cap of 8mg per tab here when they changed the laws in regards to eph. Hell, I've even found it in the grocery store pharmacy listed under decongestant.
I was told the real concern was the fact that eph. hcl can be used as the base chemical in the manufacture of ecstacy, hence the rush to ban the substance.

I buy my sups from:
www.sndcanada.com

You'll need to check with them as I don't even know if they ship into the US.

Sorry if this is regarded as blatant flogging, please edit it if needed, just trying to give guy some direction as I'm sure he doesn't know any Canadian supplement dealers.

 

[goes4ever]

as far as I know Superior Nutraceuticals still sells the product mentioned above

 

[former_SlimJim]

I have bought off superior nutraceuticals several times and are very happy with their "acne blast". Their prices and shipping are excellent.

 

[former_SlimJim]

By the way, "ephedra" is banned - not ephedrine nor ma huang - although I'm not the guy that can explain it much further than that.

 

[GuyinLA]

By the way, "ephedra" is banned - not ephedrine nor ma huang - although I'm not the guy that can explain it much further than that.

I don't think you have it quite right. Ephedra is simply another name for ma huang. Ephedra/ma huang is comprised of two alkaloids: ephedrine and pseudoephedrine. Ephedra was banned. Ephedrine HCL is synethesized ephedrine I believe. At present, ephedrine is legal (and hopefully will remain so). Ephedra is not legal. The FDA's website clearly states it is ephedra that is banned.

The Superior Nutraceuticals product contains ma huang. Vasopro is ephedrine HCL.

 

[former_SlimJim]

I don't think you have it quite right. Ephedra is simply another name for ma huang. Ephedra/ma huang is comprised of two alkaloids: ephedrine and pseudoephedrine. Ephedra was banned. Ephedrine HCL is synethesized ephedrine I believe. At present, ephedrine is legal (and hopefully will remain so). Ephedra is not legal. The FDA's website clearly states it is ephedra that is banned.

The Superior Nutraceuticals product contains ma huang. Vasopro is ephedrine HCL.

Yes you are right ma huang is one of the species of ephedra. I did some reading on this awhile back and forgot most of what I learned. The real issue is what the ban really is banning. Basically it bans the sale of any dietary supplement containing an ephedrine alkaloid, which seems to be all inclusive but in affect creates alot of loopholes.

Ephedrine HCL is not banned because it is and has been for years used as an asthma medication. The manufacturers selling it are being very careful to stress that - asthma treatment. As long as it is not sold as a dietary supplement it doesn't fall under the ban.

As far as ma huang goes, it is specifically exempt from the ban when used in traditional Asian medicine. Direct quote from the ban, "Several Ephedra species (including those known as ma huang) have a long history of use in traditional Asian medicine. These products are beyond the scope of this rule because they are not marketed as dietary supplements. The use of ephedrine alkaloids in traditional Asian medicine is discussed in more detail in section V.B.5 of this document. As we describe there, this rule does not change how these products are regulated under the act."

I will say that Superior is itching for a fight with the FDA by including ma huang in their Thermo product. They could of been a little more creative in how they present their product - maybe call it AsiaTherm and stress the "traditional Asian medicine" aspect. VasoPro is safe because it is asthma treatment.

 

[GuyinLA]

Yes you are right ma huang is one of the species of ephedra. I did some reading on this awhile back and forgot most of what I learned. The real issue is what the ban really is banning. Basically it bans the sale of any dietary supplement containing an ephedrine alkaloid, which seems to be all inclusive but in affect creates alot of loopholes.

Ephedrine HCL is not banned because it is and has been for years used as an asthma medication. The manufacturers selling it are being very careful to stress that - asthma treatment. As long as it is not sold as a dietary supplement it doesn't fall under the ban.

As far as ma huang goes, it is specifically exempt from the ban when used in traditional Asian medicine. Direct quote from the ban, "Several Ephedra species (including those known as ma huang) have a long history of use in traditional Asian medicine. These products are beyond the scope of this rule because they are not marketed as dietary supplements. The use of ephedrine alkaloids in traditional Asian medicine is discussed in more detail in section V.B.5 of this document. As we describe there, this rule does not change how these products are regulated under the act."

I will say that Superior is itching for a fight with the FDA by including ma huang in their Thermo product. They could of been a little more creative in how they present their product - maybe call it AsiaTherm and stress the "traditional Asian medicine" aspect. VasoPro is safe because it is asthma treatment.

I think this clears it up. I think you are quite right about Superior being on thin ice with the way they market their product.

 

[psywzrd]

I have become aware of DNE. Like Vasopro their product is marketed as an asthma medicine. I have never ordered from DNE but the cost is lower vs. Vasopro. I may go with DNE next time around.

I can tell you that DNE's Bolt is pure ephedrine HCL, which I assume is exactly what you're looking for. I agree that they're not the quickest to ship but they are definitely legit and the product is good.

 

[jamalgq]

I found that at the local drug store, like rite aid, that there is a product called Bronkaid, which costs 10.99 for 60 tablets. Each tablet contains 25mg of ephedrine. Just in case it might help anyone.

So if you got that, plus the caffiene pills , plus the green tea pills you would basically have the major components of the original trim spa formula that was taken off of the store shelves and banned.

 

[BodyWizard]

The ephedra ban covered (covers) supplements containing extracts thereof, not OTC sources for ephedrine - which have remained widely available.

An example of what I'm talking about:
"...contains: Ephedra extract...313mg, yielding 25mg Ephedrine".

They used this to get all herbal ephedrine off the market - on the gounds that the extracts were insufficiently standardised & therefore dangerous, leaving the chemical co.s free to purvey the more manufactured version.

Haven't looked at the "Superior" product - if it simply has ma huang as an ingredient, they may be ok (then again, that may just be their gamble).

D&E's been around 25years or more.
Back in the day, I'd get 1000-count bottles of ephedrine, caffeine & phenyl-propanolamine from them. Loved that stuff...

 

[Superior1]

ban/Quasi ban

Hey fellows.
I just found this thread. I've been meaning to join this board for
sometime, but my time has been taken up else where. Nice board...

In regards to Ma Huang. Yes, I still continued to sell it (thgouh now ran out)
and didn't really try to hard to hide the fact. Thin Ice? Yeah maybe. But
my true beliefs were always that they wouldn't enforce too heavily. Generally
they will send out a warning letter and require you to cease marketing.
I was willing to err on the side of chance. The truth is they did go after the
largest marketeers, Metabolife, cytodyne (Xenadrine) and a couple others.

Now, as we know, The ban has been reversed, but what does that mean?
They don't want it marketeted and sold with over 10mg of Ephedra. Plus
customs is still making it hard to get it through.

Essentially the FDA accomplished what they set out to do. It was NEVER
about safety. It's always about protecting Big pharma profits. Now how does
this protect big pharma profits you might ask?

Go to ANY online pharmacy and see what the TOP selling drugs are. Phentermine,
Adipex etc.. etc. .. weight loss drugs!! Effective and relatively safe ephedra
products had dented the market for more expensive and less safe pharmaceuticals.
Now they left consumers with less choices of effective means. Taking ephedra of
the supplement market opened up a void in the market of billions of dollars that
pharmaceutical companies can now fill. So now they (FDA) used their weight to
intimidate supplement manufacturers and used the media and a couple deaths
(related or not) to ephedra, to facilitate this action. Even with the reversal.
They have still tainted the consumer market but enforcing an ineffective dose,
combined with increased costs of bulk ephedra because no one that I have found
in the last few weeks wants to even chance it through customs. So the prices
have or will inevidably shoot through the roof. And thats if you can even obtain it.
Eventually yes, But it's new increased costs will not help marketeers in offering the
product at past costs, and again effective doses. At least if they stay within FDA
requirements. It's all BS to be honest. In any case, Superior Nutraceuticals is reformulating,
but will always be looking for the means to market an effect form of weight loss compounds
be it ephedra or otherwise.

Anyway, Thats my rant for the day.

Superior1