PhosphatidylSerine Benefits

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    PhosphatidylSerine Benefits


    I am really fascinated with Phosphatidyl Serine and it's ability to attenuate the negative effects of exercise induced cortisol.

    I am also seeing a correlation with naturally high cortisol levels and environmentally provoked high cortisol levels and lowered Testosterone production.

    It would seem that PhosphatidylSerine would be ideal in a Post Cycle Therapy as an "indirect T booster" via -->cortisol lowering pathways.

    It also looks like phospholipids will serve as a major catalyst in the biosynthesis of cholesterol-->testosterone conversion.

    EndoAmp became 'sexy' to me again....just kind of forgot about it.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2503954/
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6348068

    -Matt

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    What if I told you that exercise-induced cortisol is correlated with increased LBM and may actually be a beneficial adaptation for hypertrophy? Would you still be so staunchly behind the effects of PS (which I love by the way, but definitely not for the reasons you mentioned)?
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    OOO, nerd war!!! Ok Coop, why do you like it?!
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    Much like administering antioxidants periworkout to reduce exercise-induced ROS, I think it would be a rather dumb idea to use an anti-cortisol supplement around workout times: Associations of exercise-induced hormone profiles and gains in strength and hypertrophy in a large cohort after weight training. If not for that reason, then because exercise is a great time for lipolysis to occur, a process which will be blunted if you reduce cortisol prematurely. Conversely, in muscle tissue, cortisol is really only catabolic to muscle protein in a chronically elevated, unnatural state.

    So while Matt is correct in saying PS is a pretty versatile ingredient, he likes it for all the wrong reasons.
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by supermanjow View Post
    OOO, nerd war!!! Ok Coop, why do you like it?!
    Performance, focus, and mood support. Seems to optimize the Yerkes-Dodson curve for various athletic activities.
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    God that ****er beats me to everything. I love him though
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Sub'd for more info. Subject has always kind of interested me. In general I always felt that these things may be detrimental for reasons posted in link, etc.

    Coop I know you like Anabeta Elite, so do the same ideas hold for dosing of that and Reduce XT around workouts (or I guess not around them)?
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    Reduce XT and Anabeta Elite do not reduce cortisol, but rather have an impact on an enzyme related to cortisol predominantly in adipose, resulting in fat deposition/adipogenesis. See the link above: Stop fearing cortisol.
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Reduce XT and Anabeta Elite do not reduce cortisol, but rather have an impact on an enzyme related to cortisol predominantly in adipose, resulting in fat deposition/adipogenesis. See the link above: Stop fearing cortisol.
    Figured I was missing the concept somewhat. Thanks will read up on this more now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    God that ****er beats me to everything. I love him though
    haha yeah he's the man
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    Subbng for info because I feel PS is highly underrated for its benefits partially because the know abouts aren't out in the open.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Movin_weight
    Really awesome thread.

    I like where the discussion is going on stress induced cortisol vs. Exercise induced.
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/231713-rob112-3-means.html
    "Train like a beast, think like a human"-RTS
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Much like administering antioxidants periworkout to reduce exercise-induced ROS, I think it would be a rather dumb idea to use an anti-cortisol supplement around workout times: Associations of exercise-induced hormone profiles and gains in strength and hypertrophy in a large cohort after weight training. If not for that reason, then because exercise is a great time for lipolysis to occur, a process which will be blunted if you reduce cortisol prematurely. Conversely, in muscle tissue, cortisol is really only catabolic to muscle protein in a chronically elevated, unnatural state.

    So while Matt is correct in saying PS is a pretty versatile ingredient, he likes it for all the wrong reasons.
    i missed where he said ingesting PS periWO??
    yes he mentions exercise-induced cortisol but i don't think that specific timing scenario is what he had in mind..just one of the many benefits, to wipe out any worry when PS supplementation is incurred on a daily basis..
    i also thoroughly enjoy this for pct - matt you know i love EndoAMP and TRS.
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    lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by nattydisaster View Post
    lol
    You find this funny!


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    Quote Originally Posted by nattydisaster View Post
    lol
    Natty doesn't like PS?
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    Quote Originally Posted by snagencyV2.0 View Post
    i missed where he said ingesting PS periWO?? yes he mentions exercise-induced cortisol but i don't think that specific timing scenario is what he had in mind..just one of the many benefits, to wipe out any worry when PS supplementation is incurred on a daily basis..i also thoroughly enjoy this for pct - matt you know i love EndoAMP and TRS.
    The effect of PS is acute. If you want to mitigate exercise-induced cortisol, then by default the dose would have to be periworkout.
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    The effect of PS is acute.
    i didnt think it was augly.

    i see what logic you are following then..touche.
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    Quote Originally Posted by domore View Post
    Natty doesn't like PS?
    I was just laughing at the thread....talk about PS, plug a product, then run away
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    Quote Originally Posted by nattydisaster

    I was just laughing at the thread....talk about PS, plug a product, then run away
    Lol me too
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    Quote Originally Posted by nattydisaster View Post
    I was just laughing at the thread....talk about PS, plug a product, then run away
    I would run if I got into a conversation with Coop.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    The effect of PS is acute. If you want to mitigate exercise-induced cortisol, then by default the dose would have to be periworkout.
    Makes sense... cortisol peaks mid workout. It's really THAT acute of effects for PS that a pre/post dosage would be ineffective?
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrganicShadow View Post
    Makes sense... cortisol peaks mid workout. It's really THAT acute of effects for PS that a pre/post dosage would be ineffective?
    I never said that. Cortisol peaks about 45 minutes into an intense training session. I've been saying periworkout (pre/post/intra) is not a good idea for optimizing body composition.
    http://pescience.com/
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    Ohhh I misread that.
    By believing passionately in something that still does not exist, we create it. The nonexistent is whatever we have not sufficiently desired.
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    3g ALCAR
    1g PS
    650mg N-Ac-Y
    400mg DMAE
    200mg Ginkgo

    that was pure win.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3utcher View Post
    3g ALCAR
    1g PS
    650mg N-Ac-Y
    400mg DMAE
    200mg Ginkgo

    that was pure win.
    Is that pure PS, or SerinAid? Pretty expensive if it is the former.
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    Angry


    Quote Originally Posted by domore View Post
    Is that pure PS, or SerinAid? Pretty expensive if it is the former.
    Just saw it was 20% extract.

    That is less than i tought...
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3utcher View Post
    Just saw it was 20% extract.

    That is less than i tought...
    Some places have SerinAid (50%) for a decent price. Still get a 500mg dose with 1 gram.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    What if I told you that exercise-induced cortisol is correlated with increased LBM and may actually be a beneficial adaptation for hypertrophy? Would you still be so staunchly behind the effects of PS (which I love by the way, but definitely not for the reasons you mentioned)?

    I was mostly concerned with its use as a PCT adjunct. Also, perhaps making steroids work better.

    What references do you have the show cortisol promotes hypertrophy or anabolism? This is good info coop.

    I definitely understand cortisol effects that come about in natural 'acute' ways like through exertion through exercise and its ability

    to promote lipolysis ,, but how does this affect LbM accrual? I am more concerned about tipping the favor of utmost muscle growth , rather than oxidizing fatty acids.

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by nattydisaster View Post
    I was just laughing at the thread....talk about PS, plug a product, then run away

    Naw, was just late Friday when I made the thread and prioritize my nutrition clients all weekend so I havent had much time to check up on this til today.

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    I was mostly concerned with its use as a PCT adjunct.
    Which is the reason the product is most often used. Cortisol does become a concern in PCT as cortisol can rebound from exo hormone administration, and yes, I would argue that the increase in cortisol would be unwanted at a time when one would see low testosterone.
    Just inject.
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    This is something I have never understood. Why would cortisol spike after your body was in such an anabolic state?
    Always open light. Itís not what you open with, itís what you finish with. Louie Simmons
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZMIDLYF View Post
    This is something I have never understood. Why would cortisol spike after your body was in such an anabolic state?

    If your referring to heavy weight training it would be more so catabolic as you are breaking down muscle tissue during that time period.

    -Matt
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    But you are breaking down muscle tissue whether on cycle or off cycle. I just never grasped why everyone always said your cortisol spikes when coming off a cycle.
    Always open light. Itís not what you open with, itís what you finish with. Louie Simmons
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZMIDLYF View Post
    But you are breaking down muscle tissue whether on cycle or off cycle. I just never grasped why everyone always said your cortisol spikes when coming off a cycle.

    SOmething like trenbolone is a glucocorticoid antagonist so that is a much different scenario than being UN assisted and breaking down muscle tissue with only endogenous levels

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    I was mostly concerned with its use as a PCT adjunct. Also, perhaps making steroids work better.

    What references do you have the show cortisol promotes hypertrophy or anabolism? This is good info coop.

    I definitely understand cortisol effects that come about in natural 'acute' ways like through exertion through exercise and its ability

    to promote lipolysis ,, but how does this affect LbM accrual? I am more concerned about tipping the favor of utmost muscle growth , rather than oxidizing fatty acids.

    -Matt
    Someone actually posted a link to the study in this thread, right after I made the post. Exercise-induced cortisol increases are correlated with higher LBM and lower fat mass.
    http://pescience.com/
    http://selectprotein.com/
    The above is my own opinion and does not reflect the opinion of PES
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    Well some catabolism needs to happen in order to drive anabolism.
    By believing passionately in something that still does not exist, we create it. The nonexistent is whatever we have not sufficiently desired.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrganicShadow View Post
    Well some catabolism needs to happen in order to drive anabolism.

    Yes -- just like inflammation is crucial in muscle growth and why nsaids and fishoil etc need to be in check.

    Would be cool to see more studies than the one that was posted.

    I like using PS (endoamp) upon rising with my carbless breakfast

    -Matt
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPorter View Post
    Yes -- just like inflammation is crucial in muscle growth and why nsaids and fishoil etc need to be in check.

    Would be cool to see more studies than the one that was posted.

    I like using PS (endoamp) upon rising with my carbless breakfast

    -Matt
    Do you keep your carbs fairly low offseason even?
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