EAA's vs. BCAA's pre during and postworkout

[chainsaw]

Is there any benefit to using EAA's during workout vs. BCAA's. I been using xtend for years would it be worth the switch?

[RenegadeRows]

I believe there are benefits to using EAAs instead of BCAAs.

in our Purple WRAATH product FAQ (EAA), here is the list (in addition to Leucine, Valine, Isoleucine)

Lysine:
- Beta-oxidation
- Nitrogen balance
- Calcium absorption
- Energy

Arginine:
- Vasodilator
- Nutrient delivery
- Anti-Catabolic

Histidine:
- Vasodilator
- Sexual function

Threonine:
- Nutrient uptake
- Immune system

Methionine:
- Enhance metabolism
- Energy
- Mood
- Antioxidant

Phenylalanine:
- Energy
- Hormones
- Mood

There's also this...

J Nutr. 2006 Jan;136(1 Suppl):234S-6S.
Modulations of muscle protein metabolism by branched-chain amino acids in normal and muscle-atrophying rats.

Kobayashi H, Kato H, Hirabayashi Y, Murakami H, Suzuki H.

Applied Research Department, AminoScience Laboratories, Ajinomoto Co., Kawasaki, Japan. hisamine_kobayashi@ajinomoto.c om

It has been shown that BCAAs, especially leucine, regulate skeletal muscle protein metabolism. However, it remains unclear how BCAAs regulate muscle protein metabolism and lead to anabolism in vivo. We examined muscle protein synthesis rate and breakdown rate simultaneously during BCAA infusion in muscle atrophy models as well as in normal healthy rats. Corticosterone-treated rats and hindlimb-immobilized rats were used as muscle atrophy models. Muscle protein synthesis rate and breakdown rate were measured as phenylalanine kinetics across the hindlimb. In anesthetized normal rats, BCAAs stimulated muscle protein synthesis despite low insulin concentration and did not suppress muscle protein breakdown. In corticosterone-treated rats, BCAAs failed to restore inhibited muscle protein synthesis, but reduced muscle protein breakdown. Immobilization of hindlimb increased muscle protein breakdown within a day. BCAAs did not change muscle protein metabolism, although essential amino acids (EAAs) suppressed muscle protein breakdown in hindlimb-immobilized rats. We also evaluated changes of fractional synthesis rate (FSR) of skeletal muscle protein during infusion of leucine alone or EAAs for 4 h in anesthetized normal rats. FSR showed a transient increase at 15-30 min of leucine infusion and then declined, whereas FSR stayed elevated throughout EAA infusion. We concluded that

1) BCAAs primarily stimulate muscle protein synthesis in normal rats independently of insulin
2) EAAs are required to maintain the BCAA stimulation of muscle protein synthesis and
3) The effects of BCAAs on muscle protein metabolism differ between atrophy models.

[Ajerone]

There are unique benefits to using a packaged "intra workout," like Renegade mentioned - PW and Ppsyko are great, great choices. I have used and loved them both. If your looking more for a BCAA to spike mTor levels in between meals, then a BCAA with at least a 2:1:1 ration would have you set. Its more about usage and goal - if going for an intra-workout, there are great choices, with fancier formulas for better endurance, etc. If just for the BCAAs, then more economical choices exist.

[RenegadeRows]

There are unique benefits to using a packaged "intra workout," like Renegade mentioned - PW and Ppsyko are great, great choices. I have used and loved them both. If your looking more for a BCAA to spike mTor levels in between meals, then a BCAA with at least a 2:1:1 ration would have you set. Its more about usage and goal - if going for an intra-workout, there are great choices, with fancier formulas for better endurance, etc. If just for the BCAAs, then more economical choices exist.

Good post, bro. I'm doing some research on this exact topic right now.

[JudoJosh]

Rsvd

[criticalbench]

I believe there are benefits to using EAAs instead of BCAAs.

in our Purple WRAATH product FAQ (EAA), here is the list (in addition to Leucine, Valine, Isoleucine)

Lysine:
- Beta-oxidation
- Nitrogen balance
- Calcium absorption
- Energy

Arginine:
- Vasodilator
- Nutrient delivery
- Anti-Catabolic

Histidine:
- Vasodilator
- Sexual function

Threonine:
- Nutrient uptake
- Immune system

Methionine:
- Enhance metabolism
- Energy
- Mood
- Antioxidant

Phenylalanine:
- Energy
- Hormones
- Mood

There's also this...

Solid post, I always use EAA's when trying to build muscle, although I do switch to bcaa's when cutting. I feel that eaa's are superior for anabolism, while bcaa's are far superior at preventing catabolism.

Mike

[mattrag]

Solid post, I always use EAA's when trying to build muscle, although I do switch to bcaa's when cutting. I feel that eaa's are superior for anabolism, while bcaa's are far superior at preventing catabolism.

Mike

Hmm. The article does say that while training ear's are better for preserving muscle tissue? Or am I reading it wrong? Not saying you are doing something wrong, just curious that your experience and application is opposite to the research.

I am one that believes that the N =1 is the best way to decide on what supps to buy.

[Colbert]

The best thing to take during workout is hydrolized whey with some carbs. I take instant oat meal muscle...it's oat meal powder so it mixes with water. During workout your muscle will automatically take in carbs without the help of insulin and with protein powders like hydrolized you'll get a good amount of protein and you'll get all your BCAA, EAA, and everything else in between.

[RenegadeRows]

Solid post, I always use EAA's when trying to build muscle, although I do switch to bcaa's when cutting. I feel that eaa's are superior for anabolism, while bcaa's are far superior at preventing catabolism.Mike

Im a little confused, since EAAs *are* BCAAs plus extras? And in the case of Purple WRAATH, contain the 2:1:1 ratio of BCAA products.And promoting anabolism = preventing catabolism, or am I wrong?Not saying your wrong or anything. But BCAAs are contained in EAAs. I just dont follow.

[RenegadeRows]

The best thing to take during workout is hydrolized whey with some carbs. I take instant oat meal muscle...it's oat meal powder so it mixes with water. During workout your muscle will automatically take in carbs without the help of insulin and with protein powders like hydrolized you'll get a good amount of protein and you'll get all your BCAA, EAA, and everything else in between.

Have you looked into Purple PsyKO? It has hydrolyzed whey + Leucine. Sounds like its right up your alley, just throw some WMS or carb of your choice.

[criticalbench]

Hmm. The article does say that while training ear's are better for preserving muscle tissue? Or am I reading it wrong? Not saying you are doing something wrong, just curious that your experience and application is opposite to the research.

I am one that believes that the N =1 is the best way to decide on what supps to buy.

Im a little confused, since EAAs *are* BCAAs plus extras? And in the case of Purple WRAATH, contain the 2:1:1 ratio of BCAA products.And promoting anabolism = preventing catabolism, or am I wrong?Not saying your wrong or anything. But BCAAs are contained in EAAs. I just dont follow.

I know bcaa's are in an EAA product. I am not basing this on science, just from experience. When bulking, I respond much better to muscle growth utilizing all of the amino's. Whereas when cutting, I find BCAA's are superior in preventing my muscle loss. It might be because of my dosing. I use 20g regardless, so when bulking I use 20g of EAA's, so bcaa's are in lesser amounts because of all the other amino's taking up space in that 20g, whereas when cutting I am getting a whole 20g of purely bcaa's.

Mike