Highest Doses of Yohimbine Used
- 08-14-2004, 10:30 PM
Highest Doses of Yohimbine Used
I'm talking oral here. I've had 5 grams of powder sitting around for a while now, time to put it to use. I'm a seasoned vet with stimulants , so I'm not looking for "Don't go over 10mg at once or you'll be awake for 3 days ". I'll be using it with caffeine powder, and Vasopro. I'm coming off a LONG clen cycle (I ran out of ephedrine, ect. ), currently using 260mcg/day with a bit ofadded (I started this clen cycle at 60mcg). So bros, what is the highest dose of you've used for a continuous period of time. I'm looking for mg per actual dose, per day, total lenghth of cycle, ect. Also if you've experimented with higer doses, ect. All feedback is welcomed and appreciated.
- 08-14-2004, 11:18 PM
08-14-2004, 11:25 PM
I just use 5mg 3x daily, although I'm planning on upping that to 7.5mg 3x daily. I haven't really went up that high I suppose, sorry
08-15-2004, 06:10 AM
i take 20mg 1 time in the morning with 200mg caffeine. i then take e+c 3 more times spread throughout the day
08-15-2004, 05:56 PM
My training partner and another friend faced (read: snorted) 20 mg of Y Hcl for kicks one night (this was after taking 15 Avant Labs HEAT caps each about 3 hours earlier). Both of them slept like babies an hour or so later. I definitely wouldn't try this or recommend it - they are experienced stimulant addicts.
09-09-2004, 05:59 AM
09-24-2004, 05:55 AM
Well I mixed my 5g Yhcl with 100g caffeine. I take about 1/3 of 1/4tsp with a vasopro about 2-3 times a day. Gives me about 200mg caff, 10mg Y, give or take. **** makes me invincible, especially preworkout. It also makes driving while listening to really loud DMB or Incubus super-enjoyable. If anybody out there is as much of a stimulant crack-head as me, I urge you to give this a try. Plus it's much cheaper, lasts longer, and hits you faster than whatever thermogenic caps you use. I just finished a bottle of real Lipo-6 with ephedrine (thanks Dmitry ), and this concoction is WAAYYYY more potent than 2 or even 3 caps of that.
09-24-2004, 09:56 AM
I occasionally use 15mg of oral yohimbine HCL with 200 mg of caffeine and 400 mg of green tea extract, on an empty stomach, prior to early morning cardio without any noticeable side effects. I've tried the same stack with 25 mg of ephedrine HCL, but it made me jittery as hell and gave me a severe headache.I've also used much higher does of topical yohimbine (up to approximately 150 mg.) with oral e/c stacks, and I had no noticeable side effects.
09-24-2004, 12:37 PM
Using high doses of stimulants serves no purpose. It has no more effect than the recommended doses. YOu guys serisously need to do a bit more research on how these things work. THis is one thing that just doens't follow the "more is better" philosophy.
Unless you want to burn out your adrenal medulla.
For answers to board issues, read the Suggestion and News forum at the bottom of the main page.
09-24-2004, 01:18 PM
Adrenal Fatigue is no joke. I work with a woman who has it and her life is in the ****ter. She can't gain weight, is sickly thin, has no energy and has to take a couple of naps under her desk just to get through the day. On top of that she can hardly digest anything but the mildest of foods..it seriously sucks for her.
Worst of all there's hardly any doctors out there that can diagnose or even come close to treating it. She's under treatment but it may take a year or more before she gets back to normal..if ever.
09-24-2004, 01:50 PM
What about the crash from using so much stims? I do way fine off of 1/2 the recommended dose of most stims, and even when I'm tried I still shy away from megadoses b/c crashing is not fun.
Plus, a study was just released in regards to performance ehancement via stims (particularly methylxanthines, i.e. caffeine) among doctors and other professionals who must work 20-hour shifts. They found that SMALL doses taken at regular intervals did more for performance enhancement than several large doses.
If you need to triple dose these chems to feel the effects, you've probably created a severe problem in the adrenal department. I'm no doctor, but I've had my share of science courses, and when you develop a high tolerance like that, you're setting yourself up for major problems, not to mention spending a lot of money!
Regarding Adrenal fatigue, this is a pretty good article:
09-24-2004, 02:22 PM
09-24-2004, 07:04 PM
For a while when i cycled off EC, i tried YC for a couple weeks or so, 35mg YHCL and 200mg caffiene 2x a day, it didnt really have the kick of EC.. i wasnet very impressed, this was on a CKD too,
Now im taking 7.5mg along with 600mg Alcar, 2g tyrosine and 600mg chocomine every morning as a pick me up, works pretty well
Pre workout, i am taking 600mg alcar, 7.5mg YHCL and 200mg Caffiene,
again, dosent work as well as EC but it will do until im done my NO stack
09-26-2004, 01:58 AM
I think you guys actually scared some sense into me, for once . If I keep the Caff/Y, but drop the E-hcl to only pre-workout, am I still asking for trouble? That would be ~approx. 200mg caffeine, 10mg Y-hcl 2-3 times a day, and on workout days a vasopro tab with that combo pre-workout.
09-26-2004, 02:18 AM
I don't really know. I actually only do stims for energy, and never pre-workout b/c I don't like the blood pressure racing.
Re: dosage, I think that's a good bet. I like Yohimbine a lot, and 10mg 2-3x daily isn't too crazy. Caffeine; well, if you use it a lot (and I used to--believe me!), than 200mg 2-3x is a decent dose.
What was 260mcg. of clen like?! That's by far the highest dose I've heard of. We're you at the end of the cycle or did you hit that a week in?
09-26-2004, 02:22 AM
That much clen wasn't too bad, at that point I was on clen for over 4 weeks. I went on vacation, spent all my money (and then some ) and since Custom's clen lasts forrevvver, I just kept using it and upping the dose over time, since I didn't have money to buy any E/C/Y.
09-26-2004, 02:30 AM
Ahh...I figured that. B/C if you don't use ketotifen to upregulate your beta receptors, you can jack it up really high and still not see much.
Curious, do you get any anxiety from the caffeine? Sometimes I do when I'm dosing like that.
Have you seen that 1fast now sells pure synephrine HCL tabs? I'm curious if they're worth anything...they're really cheap. Also, a board sponsor now sells pure ephedrine HCL, if you get sick of the guiafenisin:
BTW...why the hell are we posting on a forum at midnight on a Saturday night! Dedcation...or insanity?!
09-26-2004, 02:33 AM
09-26-2004, 02:33 AM
09-26-2004, 02:34 AM
ORIGINALLY POSTED ON ANABOLIC REVIEW FORUMS by CYCLEON:
Ketotifen - what you need to know!
I see a lot of newbie people trying to find good info on this so I thought it would be best to put it all in one place. I patched this from a wide range of sources as well as my own experience (also thanks to FONZ). This truly is a wonderdrug for BB.
What Is It?
Ketotifen is very safe antihistamine used extensively in Europe to treat bronchial asthma and allergies. It is also being studied as a treatment for colitis. When used for asthma, weight gain and an increase in appetite are among the most frequent side effects. Ketotifen also protects the cells in the stomach, small intestine and perhaps the rest of the gut from a number of toxins. A number of case studies suggest that it may be helpful treating skin problems such as acne. Ketotifen also reduces edema (swelling and puffiness caused by water retention) around sores.
German researchers have published data showing that ketotifen lowers tnf-alpha in the test tube. One study used ketotifen in combination with oxymethadone, a steroid like Megace that helps people gain weight, so it is hard to gauge what effect ketotifen had (the study notes a 14% reduction in TNF-alpha levels and weight gains of 11-12 pounds in less than four weeks). A larger placebo controlled study of this combination is underway. The other study used ketotifen by itself in eight patients with elevated TNF-alpha, (but no wasting). Taking ketotifen for 12 weeks, these patients gained an average of six pounds, had increases in their body cell mass and reductions in their TNF-alpha levels.
Side Effects and Toxicity
Ketotifen is virtually non-toxic (although it is not advised for patients with epilepsy). People who took twenty times the recommended dose (in suicide attempts) suffered no serious consequences (other than embarrassment). Its primary side effects seem to be temporary drowsiness, dry mouth,(and other mucuos membranes) appetite stimulation and weight gain.
Dosing and side effects
No studies have been done to find the most effective dose but the German researchers used 4 mg ED. Dan Duchaine (who discovered ketos use for BB) suggested 10mg ED but in my experience this much is not needed and makes u far too sleepy. I find that 3-4mg ED seems ideal. However, much higher doses have been shown to be quite safe with no adverse affects other than increased drowsiness and appetite – it will make u hungry for solid foods. You can take it divided in the day or all at once.
Ketotifen and Clen
Clenbuterol is a beta 2 agonist which has a limited anabolic effect during its first few days of use and afterward is normally used to fight fat. At higher doses, however, it can be catabolic to muscle and it must be cycled on a 2 week on, 2 week of basis or the beta 2 receptors that clen binds to become saturated and down regulate.
Ketotifen’s magic is that it upregulates the beta-receptors including the beta 2s that clen uses. As long as you are taking ketotifen, it will continue to clean these receptors, never allowing them to downregulate – even while on a heavy clen cycle. That means you can continue to take clen indefinitely without having to cycle off to regenerate the receptors. 2-3mg ED can upregulate even severely shut down receptors within a week.
It also means that you don’t need as much clen to get the same benefits. It seems u can take about 30-40% less clen and it be equally effective. FONZ posted that it also increases the number of receptor sites on the surface of the cell, allowing more clen to attach and perhaps this is the reason for the increased efficacy. Ketotifen also seems to lessen the sides of clen including the jitters.
Ketotifen and ECA
Perhaps an even better use for ketotifen is taking it with the ECA stack. While the thermogenic effect of ephedrine is not as potent as clen because it doesn't have a high receptor affinity, and it is not limited to beta-2 receptors. In fact it seems to have a good effect on beta 3 receptors as well, which act as a type of thermogenic messenger and over half of ephedrine effect is from beta-3 stimulation. Clen has almost no effect on beta 3 however. So by keeping the beta 2 receptors up, ketotifen can allow the benefits of continuous beta 2 and beta 3 stimulation from ephedrine.
"Ephedrine is believed to have some direct effect on both alpha adrenoceptors and beta adrenoceptors, but AT THERAPEUTIC DOSES, ephedrine exerts its thermogenic effect almost entirely via stimulating noradrenaline release from the sympathetic nerve terminals [endings] . . . at least 40% of the [thermogenic] response is mediated by an atypical receptor, which is presumed to be the beta 3-adrenoceptor."
Liu YL, Toubro S, Astrup A, Stock MJ Contribution of beta 3-adrenoceptor activation to ephedrine-induced thermogenesis in humans Int J Obes Relat Disord. Sep;19(9). 678-685
09-26-2004, 05:33 AM
Today was an off day training-wise. I took 200mg caff, 10mg y-hcl about an hour after breakfast, and another dose about 4.5 hours later.
Normally (with ephedrine) I would "need" that 2nd dose (and a 3rd later), because the crash was so bad. Today, no crash. I just took it to up my metabolism a little, and make things go a little smoother.
Also I don't feel as much like a minute-to-minute bipolar case --> --> --> , but still like a million bucks .
Sometimes I need to be told how much of an idiot I'm being so I can get on the right track, like when Bobo and jweave made fun of my diet! Thanks guys !!!
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