5-AT and/or 7-OH
- 07-01-2011, 07:22 PM
5-AT and/or 7-OH
I've been reading alot aboutand lately, particularly these two ingredients, and it's said that they're not non-hormonal and "natural", don't require PCT, etc. I wanted to get more feedback on this, just to be sure. I'm 21, never taken anything even close to being hormonal. From what I understand, they are derivatives of DHEA, yet do not convert to Testosterone or estrogen like DHEA does. I wondered if they had any negative hormonal effects whatsoever--besides inhibition of cortisol--including shutdown of anything or binding of androgen receptors. And are they safe for cycling at 21, meaning, they won't throw my hormones out of wack or anything?...
- 07-01-2011, 10:33 PM
They are all fine. Erase is another one of these derivatives, except it has the ability to lower estrogen
07-01-2011, 11:02 PM
07-02-2011, 02:59 AM
If your goal is to reduce fat your most important factor is diet. Lean Xtreme (in my opinion) is fine for 18+, Reduce XT is another product to look at. Lean Xtreme is a staple for me, i have 6 bottles sitting on my desk at all times, and i recommend it to most people. It does have thyroid interaction, but as far as T/E interaction no. I'm not really a fan of DHEA derivatives, i think the estrogen conversion is high unless you add compounds to increase T conversion ratio (like M1-D), so i'd instead look at cort control products or something like Triazole. EC is a good idea at all ages, cheap and effective.
07-02-2011, 03:11 AM
supress c is really cheap right now on the planet, wish I had money, i'd buy it & some formestane.
supress c + ephedrine, yea, that'd be nice.
07-02-2011, 08:10 PM
But I don't really understand your post. You say Lean Xtreme has no T/E interaction, but you say estrogen conversion with DHEA derivatives is high. How is this if LX has two DHEA derivatives? I thought only DHEA converted into estrogen, but its derivatives didn't?
07-05-2011, 01:27 PM
07-05-2011, 03:34 PM
07-05-2011, 07:08 PM
Cortisol, like estrogen, is something you want to "control" and not "eliminate." Also any product that has thyroid interaction i would be very careful with, specifically the length of time on.
OP, in response to your DHEA topic... I simply went over my views of DHEA, Lean Xtreme is not a DHEA product. LX includes metabolites of DHEA, but the two isomers do not convert to estrogens or androgens. This is quite different than say LGs M1-D. Our product uses metabolites of DHEA to convert to T and E. This is the quick response to your DHEA question, Robboe can add something to clarify if i screwed it up.
07-06-2011, 04:13 PM
Go with Lean Xtreme. 5AT is much more effective at lowering cortisol than 7-0H. 7-0h works by inhibiting cortisone -> cortisol and 5-AT works via cytokines
07-06-2011, 04:16 PM
And by the way i also wanna ask you guys, what exactly is the verdict with the Ai's and puffy/itchy nipples thing I've been reading about now and again? I ask because i may end up trying erase as well, and i don't want to set myself up for the risk of "gyno". What exactly would you guys say is the safest, most risk-free AI you can use alone (or with a non-hormonal cortisol agent) at a younger age? I know formestane converts to a testosterone metabolite. Maybe 6-OXO is what i was thinking, but this stuff doesn't seem to be around. I also read on ergo-log about letrozole once a week at 2.5 mg or twice a wee k at 1mg. I'm curious about trying one of these with Supress C or just doing Erase. Arimidex also seems pretty mild compared to others...start with a mere .25 mgs a day? What you guys think?
07-06-2011, 11:32 PM
07-07-2011, 12:08 AM
07-08-2011, 01:43 PM
07-08-2011, 02:02 PM
and yes has other....s
Androstenetriol--This steroid metabolite, which is chemically known as Delta 5-androstene-3b,7b,17b,triol, was shown in an abstract presented at the 1997 conference on cortisol and anti-cortisols to counteract the immunological effects of glucocorticoids.
Norbiato, et al., In Vitro Immunomodulatory Effects of Delta 5-Androstene-3b,7b,17b Triol (AET) in Hypercortisolemic Patients (Las Vegas, NV: Conference on Cortisol and Anti-Cortisols, 1997)
07-09-2011, 07:38 PM
I don't like the PS in LX. I'll try to run S-C then Reduce XT with an AI to see which is better. As for the AI, I'm still not sure, I'll make another thread.