Grant
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I read an article at BB.com stating you should not use Taurine while on clen, what do you guys think about it.
by Big Cat:
"It has come to my attention that some people have been adding taurine to their diets to decrease cramping from clenbuterol or other beta-adrenergic agonists. Whether or not there is any merit to this, I really don't know. I haven't seen any data one way or the other. I assume there must be some truth to the rumour or people wouldn't be doing it. Then again...
Regardless however, supplementing extra taurine during a diet is not advisable. It is indeed true that beta-adrenergic agonists like clenbuterol and ephedrine will reduce taurine levels, no question about it. But did anyone ever stop to think that maybe this has a reason? Your protein intake should stay the same, roughly, which means that these compounds are actively reducing taurine levels.
If anyone had bothered to look these things up for a few seconds they would have known it is with good reason. Taurine may inhibit fat loss in different ways. First of all it will increase insulin sensitivity. I didn't even need to state that, it has been used in supplements with varying success for that exact same reason. If we know that many effective fat loss aids work primarily by lowering insulin resistance (Growth hormone, noradrenaline, etc), we already know this is not a bright idea.
This lowers the threshold at which glycogen is stored again. This will increase chance of gaining fat during cheat days due to enhanced sensitivity of fat cells to insulin, and limit fat lost on dieting days since the extra stored glycogen will have to be burned again before you start burning fat again.
This is however the least of your concerns. Taurine is also known to reduce Thyroid levels. Studies have demonstrated that a high platelet level of taurine will reduce T3:T4 ratio in men. This would slow down your metabolic rate, meaning you use less calories than you would otherwise. Obviously this will result in less fat lost for the same amount of calories eaten.
Taurine may also reduce cAMP production in certain animals. The extrapolation in this case is a far fetch, but something I would like to see tested in humans. Since the cAMP acts as a second messenger in the process of lipolysis, the process of releasing fatty acids from their glycerol backbone, making them available for burning, this will reduce the amount of fat released and consequently the amount of fat burned.
This all fits nicely into the picture that free form amino acids should not be frequently used on a diet. As with carbohydrates, quickly absorbed sources create higher peak levels that also decline faster. This almost always leads to a favourable situation for a lower metabolism.
When dieting you will opt for carbohydrate sources that absorb slower, so they have less of an effect on factors influencing food intake. The same holds true for protein. You should opt for protein sources with a more anti-catabolic character, that release slower, such as casein. "
Haber CA, Lam TK, Yu Z, Gupta N, Goh T, Bogdanovic E, Giacca A, Fantus IG. N-acetylcysteine and taurine prevent hyperglycemia-induced insulin resistance in vivo: possible role of oxidative stress. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2003 Oct; 285(4): E744-53. Epub 2003 Jun 10.
Baskin SI, Klekotka SJ, Kendrick ZV, Bartuska DG. Correlation of platelet taurine levels with thyroid function. J Endocrinol Invest. 1979 Jul-Sep; 2(3): 245-9.
Hayakawa Y, Downer RG, Bodnaryk RP. Taurine inhibits octopamine-stimulated cAMP production.. Biochim Biophys Acta. 1987 Jun 15; 929(1): 117-20.
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=280286
by Big Cat:
"It has come to my attention that some people have been adding taurine to their diets to decrease cramping from clenbuterol or other beta-adrenergic agonists. Whether or not there is any merit to this, I really don't know. I haven't seen any data one way or the other. I assume there must be some truth to the rumour or people wouldn't be doing it. Then again...
Regardless however, supplementing extra taurine during a diet is not advisable. It is indeed true that beta-adrenergic agonists like clenbuterol and ephedrine will reduce taurine levels, no question about it. But did anyone ever stop to think that maybe this has a reason? Your protein intake should stay the same, roughly, which means that these compounds are actively reducing taurine levels.
If anyone had bothered to look these things up for a few seconds they would have known it is with good reason. Taurine may inhibit fat loss in different ways. First of all it will increase insulin sensitivity. I didn't even need to state that, it has been used in supplements with varying success for that exact same reason. If we know that many effective fat loss aids work primarily by lowering insulin resistance (Growth hormone, noradrenaline, etc), we already know this is not a bright idea.
This lowers the threshold at which glycogen is stored again. This will increase chance of gaining fat during cheat days due to enhanced sensitivity of fat cells to insulin, and limit fat lost on dieting days since the extra stored glycogen will have to be burned again before you start burning fat again.
This is however the least of your concerns. Taurine is also known to reduce Thyroid levels. Studies have demonstrated that a high platelet level of taurine will reduce T3:T4 ratio in men. This would slow down your metabolic rate, meaning you use less calories than you would otherwise. Obviously this will result in less fat lost for the same amount of calories eaten.
Taurine may also reduce cAMP production in certain animals. The extrapolation in this case is a far fetch, but something I would like to see tested in humans. Since the cAMP acts as a second messenger in the process of lipolysis, the process of releasing fatty acids from their glycerol backbone, making them available for burning, this will reduce the amount of fat released and consequently the amount of fat burned.
This all fits nicely into the picture that free form amino acids should not be frequently used on a diet. As with carbohydrates, quickly absorbed sources create higher peak levels that also decline faster. This almost always leads to a favourable situation for a lower metabolism.
When dieting you will opt for carbohydrate sources that absorb slower, so they have less of an effect on factors influencing food intake. The same holds true for protein. You should opt for protein sources with a more anti-catabolic character, that release slower, such as casein. "
Haber CA, Lam TK, Yu Z, Gupta N, Goh T, Bogdanovic E, Giacca A, Fantus IG. N-acetylcysteine and taurine prevent hyperglycemia-induced insulin resistance in vivo: possible role of oxidative stress. Am J Physiol Endocrinol Metab. 2003 Oct; 285(4): E744-53. Epub 2003 Jun 10.
Baskin SI, Klekotka SJ, Kendrick ZV, Bartuska DG. Correlation of platelet taurine levels with thyroid function. J Endocrinol Invest. 1979 Jul-Sep; 2(3): 245-9.
Hayakawa Y, Downer RG, Bodnaryk RP. Taurine inhibits octopamine-stimulated cAMP production.. Biochim Biophys Acta. 1987 Jun 15; 929(1): 117-20.
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=280286
