Who Wastes Money on Glutamine?
- 02-02-2003, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by Bobo
If you guys want something that will give you more benefits than glutmaine, use HMB. I know everyone bashes it but it has been proven to work better than glutamine. I have studies but I'm too lazy to find them. I posted a bunch on bb.com back in the day. The only problem is that HMB was always so expensive and not worth the price (worse than glutmaine). I've seen it drop significantly and can be affordable even at 6g per day (recommended) now. Just another option.....
I think it might of been Benz who posted the study that they work better synergistically than by themselves. Might of been Weave...Can't remember now....
- 02-02-2003, 09:15 PM
I went over and grabbed this stuff from one of my posts at bb.com. The research shows that adding 3 gram of HMB to your creatine will improve lean muscle gain and strength gains, better than taking Creatine OR HMB alone
Creatine and beta-hydroxy-beta-methylbutyrate (HMB) additively increase lean body mass and muscle strength during a weight-training program.
Jowko E, Ostaszewski P, Jank M, Sacharuk J, Zieniewicz A, Wilczak J, Nissen S.
Institute of Sport and Physical Education, Biala Podlaska, Academy of Physical Education, Warsaw, Poland.
We investigated whether creatine (CR) and beta-hydroxy-beta-methylbutyrate (HMB) act by similar or different mechanisms to increase lean body mass (LBM) and strength in humans undergoing progressive resistance-exercise training. In this double-blind, 3-wk study, subjects (n = 40) were randomized to placebo (PL; n = 10), CR (20.0 g of CR/d for 7 d followed by 10.0 g of CR/d for 14 d; n = 11), HMB (3.0 g of HMB/d; n = 9), or CR-and-HMB (CR/HMB; n = 10) treatment groups. Over 3 wk, all subjects gained LBM, which was assessed by bioelectrical impedance analysis. The CR, HMB and CR/HMB groups gained 0.92, 0.39, and 1.54 kg of LBM, respectively, over the placebo group, with a significant effect with CR supplementation (main effect P = 0.05) and a trend with HMB supplementation (main effect P = 0.08). These effects were additive because there was no interaction between CR and HMB (CR x HMB main effect P = 0.73). Across all exercises, HMB, CR, and CR/HMB supplementation caused accumulative strength increases of 37.5, 39.1, and 51.9 kg, respectively, above the placebo group. The exercise-induced rise in serum creatine phosphokinase was markedly suppressed with HMB supplementation (main effect P = 0.01). However, CR supplementation antagonized the HMB effects on serum creatine phosphokinase (CR x HMB interactive effect P = 0.04). Urine urea nitrogen and plasma urea were not affected by CR supplementation, but both decreased with HMB supplementation (HMB effect P < 0.05), suggesting a nitrogen-sparing effect. In summary, CR and HMB can increase LBM and strength, and the effects are additive. Although not definitive, these results suggest that CR and HMB act by different mechanisms.
The latest research shows that Creatine, HMB, and Glutamine when combined, work synergistically to produce results far greater than when taken alone.
Beverly recently introduced a product called MUSCLE SYNERGY. Ingredients are as follows:
niacin 100 mg
L-Arginine 3500 mg
Beta-hydroxy-beta-methylbutarate 1500 mg
creatine monohydrate 1500 mg
L-Glutamine 1000 mg
L-Glycine 500 mg
What Beverly says:
Beverly International's Muscle Synergy™ supplement compound is a breakthrough for drug free muscle growth. There are three distinct compounds combined synergistically to increase muscle growth at a rate that far exceeds that with any of the ingredients alone.
1.The combination of beta-hydroxy-beta-methylbutarate (HMB) with Arginine and Glutamine has been research proven to increase lean muscle mass even in patients with immunodeficienccy muscle wasting.
2. The combination of Creatine Monohydrate and beta-hydroxy-beta-methylbutarate (HMB) has been shown to increase lean tissue to a greater degree than when either is taken alone.
3. L-Arginine, L-Glutamine, L-Glycine, and Nicotinic acid have all been shown to augment growth hormone release when used individually. When combined in the correct ratios found in Muscle Synergy their effect on growth hormone levels may be exponentially heightened.
Now MET-Rx has introduced a similar product called MASS ACTION. A lot of the local guys are raving about the incredible pumps they get from Muscle Synergy. They can't keep this product in stock at our local Max Muscle and Body Masters.
02-02-2003, 09:18 PM
Nice, that was it, thanks John.
I have to add that EAS was on to this when they came out with Betalean years ago, just way too much $$$.
02-03-2003, 11:07 AM
yj , what dissappointed me was the intravenous study , i felt the conclusions reached from the other studies were due to the fact that most of the glutamine injested orally is taken up by the gastro intestinal tract hence hardly anything is getting used by the body .
but yj , can u look for any studies which show the effect of glutamine(intravenous) on cortisol production and on gh spike (or igf-1) ?
02-04-2003, 01:34 PM
i dunno man, theres a million studies out there that say glutamine works too....you know they are there, or should i be so kind to show them to you?. I'm sure a lot of the older bros will remember 10-15 years ago, they had studies saying that 30 grams of glutamine a day was crazy and it'd mess up your brain and possibly kill you. I'm sure you've see those "studies" also.
so whatever i disregard them all.
But listen to MY study.....
I do arm day, the next few days i'm sore as heck, feels like someone took a hammer to my arms, takes around 4 days to heal of which the first 2 days my bi's and tri's kill me.(don't believe me, ask ManBeast what intensity level i train at)
Next arm day, i do the exact same routine, keep the exact same calorie intake and the same amount of protein but add 30 grams/day of glutamine...takes me 3 days to heal, and i'm real real sore for 1 day, then the 2nd day i barely feel a thing, 3rd day i'm pretty much good.
So obviously it's working for ME. Maybe it doesn't work for everyone, but for me it's one of my top supps. Waste of my money? I think not.
02-04-2003, 03:18 PM
Thats a legit point, But its still a watse of money when you can buy a solid protein with a good amino acid profile that includes a significant amount of glutamine, like Optimum 100% whey.
02-04-2003, 03:31 PM
i bought a 5lb tub of glut peptides w/ my roommate last year for $40 from kilosports. We each put down $20, and he never found a scale to take out his half, so he let me keep it all...5lbs of glut for $20, talk about a good deal =P
02-04-2003, 03:35 PM
Thats a hell of a deal, butn ot everyone is going to get that deal...thats pretty rare, but good luck certainly went your way.
02-04-2003, 04:02 PM
Damn Blaze, that is a good deal. I get 2lbs of peptides for $29 and I'm fine with that, but that is killer! I'll have to check kilo now and see what they're at.
02-04-2003, 04:27 PM
Shiot Blaze, if glut had ever allowed me to heal up every 3 days, I'd be a pro bb by now lol. I've gone as high as ~30 g, just didn't work as well for me. That's great if you notice such a benefit though, and ended up with that much bulk powder
By the way, I want to throw in this quick price comparo for you bros:
KiloSports- you're looking at 1kg/2.2lbs-$40
Optimum Nutrition (through DPS) at 1kg/2.2lbs-$33
Prolab (through Muscleshoppe) at either 400g-$17 or 1000g $38.50
Eclipse (DPS) at 1kg-$37
SuppDirect at 2.5kg-$80
so Weave you've got the good deal workin
Last edited by Biggs; 02-04-2003 at 04:54 PM.
02-04-2003, 06:00 PM
u get 60% less from kilo now for the same price....whata jip.
then they'll raise the price more, and run a special and drop off a few $$. I hate them now.
02-04-2003, 07:25 PM
Well I might just be tempted to try this **** again dammit... anywhere else that might be cheaper than Optimum's 1000g/33$?
02-04-2003, 08:20 PM
I should clarify on my original post where I say I dismissed it as crap.
I feel it's beneficial when cutting and eating below maintenance calories. It may help with soreness but I personally never felt a difference. I bought a tub way back and still have a good amount, so I use it for those reasons. I take it through a few training phases, as opposed to year round as I used to do.
If you're taking it with your protein, then you're definitely wasting your money because it supposedly inhibits the absorption of the other aminos (as taking loads of any single amino will do).
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