- 10-30-2010, 04:34 PM
ive always been one that believed intra-wo drinks were not needed if proper pre-wo and post-wo nutrition was in place.
however, my workouts typically take 1.5-2hrs now a days.
i eat a pre-wo meal 1.5hrs before the workout
have my pre-wo drink 45-30min before the workout
stims, bcaa, creatine, b.a.
then warm ups, lifting, cool downs-1.5-2hrs
then post workout
bcaa, b.a., carbs
then eat 20-30min later
my question is, would a intra-wo drink benifit me in this case
also im training west side barbell if that matters
- 10-30-2010, 05:20 PM
Yes it would especially if doing cardio...Modern bcaa is my fav
- 10-30-2010, 05:24 PM
ModernBCAA....virtually have no DOMS the next day.
10-30-2010, 05:35 PM
so its a legit product?
i currently have chained out by ALRI
i use 1 scoop Pre
2 scoops post
ill prob just do 1 scoop pre/intra/post?
until i run out that is
10-30-2010, 05:38 PM
10-30-2010, 05:41 PM
yea ive noticed that bcaa products generally dont help with my recovery, just help in making my nutrition more effective.
chained out is my current fav
i will try modernbcaa next, do you use it pre/post as well or just intra-wo? how long are ur sessions typically?
has anyone tried size on?
10-30-2010, 05:45 PM
10-30-2010, 05:48 PM
Ok thank you for the help!
so for now ill do superpump max pre-wo+1 scoop chained out
1 scoop chained out intra-wo
1 scoop chained out post-wo with an apple
then switch to modernBCAA intra/post wo after this
10-31-2010, 11:40 AM
11-01-2010, 10:43 AM
Well I train west side barbell, so my warm-up sets always take about 30min to get up to a max, plus 10min warm-up cardio and stretching...so that about 30-45min...then the workout takes about an hr to and hr and 15min...then stretching and at least 10min of cool down cardio...its not all intense training but im there for a long time.
Ur suggestion is interesting...so put the Need2Slin in the drink? or take b4?
If i do intra-wo nutrition, how do i do post workout?
11-01-2010, 04:51 PM
As for the GDA or Need 2 Slin, no I have tried breaking capsules up in shakes in the past and it was terrible! I was just saying prior to your workout you can consume a serving or 1 single capsule of Need 2 Slin in order to keep you from bloating during the training and using the carbohydrates more efficiently.
Post workout supplementation or nutrition would remain unchanged - however I do want to mention if you are exclusively training toward a power lifting end result, I am not well versed in that area of the nutrition needed.
11-01-2010, 09:38 PM
and i highly believe in intraworkut nutrition, personally or me its because workouts are not lazy they are very high paced, and some times over 1-1.5hrs.....
for me it would be 1/2 cup oats,
1 scoop maximum absorbed protein, which is hydrolyzed casein or peptopro which is the fastest absorbing form of aminos you can get....
and 1 scoop IBCAA
i liek it, makes me feel secure, its like my anaolic blanky.....
i dont train west side so i dont know if that makes a difference....
11-03-2010, 03:47 PM
well i do active stretching not static stretching, which does reduce strength.
powerlifting nutrition doesnt very much from bodybuilding imo, 1g-1.5g protein per bodyweight, moderate fats and carbs. Enough to grow but not to much where im getting fat as that moves up weight classes to fast...honestly im seein better gains training westside then anybody building routine ive ever done.
Based on the suggestions of you guys ive started drinking a serving of chained out during the workout about 45-60min after i started to finish, not all the way thru as continous amino acid consumption causes a refactory response from aminos and no growth can occur.
So how is the peptopro??? ive been very interested in it, but i used intrabolic and was not impressed so i opted to bcaa malates to see if there was a difference.
11-05-2010, 07:15 PM
11-05-2010, 11:39 PM
i cant post links since i dont have 50 posts yet,
but google layne norton presentation...you should find his presentation on maximal meal frequency and timing and it explains it all...good info for a new train of thought, its not that you wont grow, but is it optimal?
11-07-2010, 10:13 AM
11-07-2010, 11:53 AM
dude i was offering infromation dont act so sarcastic. You can grow while taking protein/aminos no doubt...but im refering to optimal timing
11-07-2010, 11:55 AM
I think he was being genuine
11-07-2010, 01:26 PM
I have never heard this theory before, and am extremely interested. I won't conclude or assume because he was defensive it means his theory is baseless, I just don't think he knows my posting style well enough to know I was/am truly intrigued by the fact Aminos might negate optimal anabolism.
PS: If you want to share a link, you can always type it out as well. For example, http://www.**********************/store/cart.html could be written as www dot needtobuildmuscle dot com backslash store
11-07-2010, 07:00 PM
Oh..i woulda never thought of that hahaha
world wide web dot slideshare dot net
biolayne/optimal-protein-intake-and-meal-frequency-to-support- maximal- protein-synthesis-and-muscle- mass
insert a slash after net b4 biolayne
11-08-2010, 03:26 PM
Until a process is identified and somehow controlled in the eventual findings, and then repeated multiple times in the same settings by various experimentalists and peer-reviewed/published, I would just contend it's not wise to short-change our own efforts to attain new muscle mass by thinking amino acid supplementation can be counterproductive.
I'm going to read the article though, and thank you for your link. Have a good one.
*PS: I edited the written link, and its Optimal Protein Intake And Meal Frequency To Support Maximal Protein Synthesis and Muscle Mass if anyone is interested. I have yet to read the article, so if the link has supplements for sale, I will come back and delete it since I know the rules are really strict here.
*No there are no products for sale, aside from a Google generated Cinnamon Toast Crunch and General Mills advertisement, but there are external Google links here on AM, a Bowflex is at the bottom of the screen now (thank goodness it isn't that Neanderthal looking soft and small "Situation" from Wannabe Shore)
11-08-2010, 03:57 PM
Slide 22 was a great recap of the slide-show.
I had actually read this article before, only it wasn't presented in a slide-show format. I can't recall if it was on his sponsoring supplement company's site, or Muscular Development magazine - but it intrigued me.
However, I must say although not very scientific in my approach I can tell a huge difference in my muscle fullness and strength capacity when I eat every 2-3 hours, opposed to eating every 4-6 hours (although I admit in the off-season I don't go through the rigors of supplementing with BCAAs or liver tabs etc between meals - maybe this is key?)
11-08-2010, 04:28 PM
im glad you read it!
it is a very interesting way to go about eating no doubt
i did do the precribed eating plan for about 3 monthes straight
5 meals 50g protein each for 3g leucine content
5g bcaa between each meal
and honestly it worked but now a days i just eat every 2-4 hrs and supp bcaa pre-wo and bcaa post with carbs and a meal 30min later....its just very hard to do every 4-5 hrs a meal, get 5 meals in, school, work, working out, and sleep 8-10hrs a night...nearly impossible for me
although once you adjust you dont get hungry after 2 hrs, and your muscle fullness returns as if you ate every 2-3 hrs, recovery was up also
11-08-2010, 04:30 PM
but thanks to everyone here ive been experimenting with intra-wo
since i had sizeon samples.
id mix it up and after about an hr to hr and 15min id sip half the packet till finish then do the other half right after...recovery is up...so thank you to everyone
11-08-2010, 04:48 PM
I just feel as though I'm not following the 'bodybuilder lifestyle' if I go so many hours between meals... I admit in theory perhaps I should abandon that philosophy and try something new.
11-08-2010, 05:10 PM
im not a gaspari whore, but lately their products have been impressing the **** outta me....maybe they are actually trying?
well the diet is 4-5 hrs between meals containing 50g Protein
then half way thru each meal you have 5g BCAA+20g Carbs, Layne uses a bad of baked lays
I was cutting and coming off a long ass unhealthy cycle, i lost 10lbs in Pct and kept all strength and size from it.
actually while carb cycling, i got my squat up to 315 for 3 and deadlift to 405 for 3
i did not use the carbs with the bcaas since i was cutting so just 5g between meals.
It worked no doubt then i would add carbs on my carb up days, 5g BCAA with 1 Slice Eziekle bread, 15g Palantinose, or Baked Lays...pretty much 15-20g carbs.
Its worth a try, maybe for an ecto i wouldnt recomend this but an endo/meso i would say try it
11-08-2010, 05:21 PM
Definitly if your working for almost 2 hours i would look into a intra-workout product. To be honest, there all pretty good now cause most contain Whey Hydroslate and BCAAs so should be covered. Just depends if you want creatine in there as well, in my opinoin i would go with SizeOn or Intrabolic for a full blown intra workout product.
For me personally i just use BCAA mix intra workout, i used Axcell which has 4:1:1 ratio as well as citrulline malate and glucoronlactone aswell as couple other supporting ingredeints, its my favorite BCAA but then again im slightly biased haha
11-08-2010, 05:26 PM
hey i actually need a good bcaa product for pre-wo, and i was curious about your companies BCAA, ive only used xtend, bulk, Chained Out (provides wierd focus bc of the L-Theanine) and modernBCAA...how does the extra ingredients help the formula?
also whats the generall amoung of BCAA/Leucine within the product since it doesnt label it?
im think im going to go with SizeOn Max Performance for a month then try MAP+extras and compare...thank you for your help
11-09-2010, 07:15 AM
11-09-2010, 08:48 PM
i like the sizeon so im excited to compare
ive tried a few pp products, top notch stuff over there
and i still dont use intra-wo...i just drink after about an hr of training as my blood sugar tends to drop then
11-10-2010, 07:38 AM
I've used BCAAs intra-workout once - when I first started using them, just to see if it made a difference, but it didn't. If your nutrition is right for the day, then, yeah, intra-workout products, etc. - the same goes for postworkout products - are not required or necessary, IMO.
The Primordial Woman
11-10-2010, 01:59 PM
ill second what you say honestly
but ive noticed a big difference in fullness and recovery...could be the switch to creapure and hydro proteins with more bcaas tho to be honest, time will tell
u seem knowledgable rosie.
im curious of a claim made by the ALRI owner stating most free form bcaa's such as ur IBCAA turn into glucose very quickly, they have a BCAA Malate product and he has a study where regular bcaa raises blood sugar when taken first thing in the morning and that his BCAA Malates (Chained Out) lowers blood sugar...also he states dairy proteins (whey and casien) are garbage...im curious how much of this is true since you guys have MAP and IBCAA, which to me are the top of the line in their respective catagories
11-10-2010, 02:00 PM
he also states that regular free form bcaa turn into glucose leaving very little actual bcaa for muscles
where his product gives all 5g of Bcaa to the muscles....i trust pp and their reps so i wanted an opinion
11-10-2010, 02:38 PM
BCAAs are unlikely to undergo glycogenolysis if the body has enough glycogen/energy to complete what you require of it. On an empty stomach they may, especially if you are glycogen depleted or in an energy deficit, since BCAAs are in the simplest form of protein (i.e. amino acids are the building blocks of protein), which means less physiological processes for them to be oxidized than say a steak. BCAAs primarily help with muscle metabolism, muscle sparing, and synthesis.
I certainly wouldn't say that whey and casein are garbage - they may not be NECESSARY, but they are not "garbage".
Some of the other Primordial reps may add further to this.
The Primordial Woman
11-10-2010, 04:29 PM
Author's claims have been proven false by the countless studies about the efficacy of whey and casein proteins and their anabolic actions.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
11-10-2010, 06:40 PM
I would agree that sounds a lot like marketing hype, and especially with the whole whey/casein are garbage, it becomes clear he has a motive behind those statements and definitly are not facts.
11-10-2010, 08:50 PM
alright thank you to all!!! really!!! i have been buying chained out bc of his "science" and the l-theanine helps me focus...but it is an expensive product and to know that i can easily switch to a much cheaper alternative for my bcaa usage and achieve optimal results is very comforting. I did think it was just marketing for the most part due to there being no science i could find on bcaa malates in general.
I will most likely be buying IBCAA for my next bcaa sup since its ajipure and at such an amazing price!
do you guys think adding me own theanine with IBCAA pretty much produce the same effect i get from chained out for a much cheaper price?
11-10-2010, 08:51 PM
Also thank you for proving that the standard protein are no garbage considering there are so many great ones now
11-11-2010, 07:50 AM
IBCAA yeah - just have to find the sweet spot re dosing of the Theanine.
The Primordial Woman
11-11-2010, 08:12 AM
alright thank you once again guys! savin me money and gettin better products? lol pp is whats up
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