Anyone use straight creatine anymore?

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  1. link to source: http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/me.../954.13?ck=nck

    Pharmacological vasodilation improves the anabolic response of muscle protein synthesis to insulin in elders -- Lee et al. 23 (1): 954.13 -- The FASEB Journal

    Loss of muscle with aging (sarcopenia) contributes to disability in elders. Aging is associated with an insulin resistance of muscle protein anabolism, which correlates with impaired insulin-induced muscle vasodilation and nutrient delivery.

    We hypothesized that pharmacological restoration of muscle perfusion to youthful values during hyperinsulinemia would improve the response of muscle protein synthesis and anabolism in older subjects.

    We measured blood flow (BF), anabolic signaling, and muscle protein synthesis (Rd) and breakdown (Ra) with stable isotope tracers at baseline and during insulin infusion in one leg in 12 healthy, non-diabetic older subjects (71 ± 2 yrs) divided in two groups: CTRL (insulin only) and SNP (insulin + sodium nitroprusside to double blood flow above baseline).

    Blood flow and phenylalanine delivery increased significantly (P<0.05) in SNP only. Muscle protein synthesis (nmol·min-1 ·100mL leg-1) increased in SNP (35 ± 4 to 102 ± 26), but not in CTRL (34 ± 10 to 45 ± 10), while breakdown did not change in either group. Akt/PKB phosphorylation increased in both groups but to a larger extent in SNP (P<0.05) and S6K1 phosphorylation tended to increase more in SNP (P = 0.068).

    In conclusion, pharmacological restoration of muscle perfusion and nutrient delivery during hyperinsulinemia increased muscle protein synthesis in elders.
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  2. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    link to source: http://www.fasebj.org/cgi/content/me.../954.13?ck=nck

    Pharmacological vasodilation improves the anabolic response of muscle protein synthesis to insulin in elders -- Lee et al. 23 (1): 954.13 -- The FASEB Journal

    Loss of muscle with aging (sarcopenia) contributes to disability in elders. Aging is associated with an insulin resistance of muscle protein anabolism, which correlates with impaired insulin-induced muscle vasodilation and nutrient delivery.

    We hypothesized that pharmacological restoration of muscle perfusion to youthful values during hyperinsulinemia would improve the response of muscle protein synthesis and anabolism in older subjects.

    We measured blood flow (BF), anabolic signaling, and muscle protein synthesis (Rd) and breakdown (Ra) with stable isotope tracers at baseline and during insulin infusion in one leg in 12 healthy, non-diabetic older subjects (71 ± 2 yrs) divided in two groups: CTRL (insulin only) and SNP (insulin + sodium nitroprusside to double blood flow above baseline).

    Blood flow and phenylalanine delivery increased significantly (P<0.05) in SNP only. Muscle protein synthesis (nmol·min-1 ·100mL leg-1) increased in SNP (35 ± 4 to 102 ± 26), but not in CTRL (34 ± 10 to 45 ± 10), while breakdown did not change in either group. Akt/PKB phosphorylation increased in both groups but to a larger extent in SNP (P<0.05) and S6K1 phosphorylation tended to increase more in SNP (P = 0.068).

    In conclusion, pharmacological restoration of muscle perfusion and nutrient delivery during hyperinsulinemia increased muscle protein synthesis in elders.
    Very interesting... so along with perhaps some Ecdy, Methoxy and digestive enzymes, this could combine to promote the most advantageous nitrogen balance for a dieting strength athlete effectuating lean mass retention?
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Outstanding View Post
    Very interesting... so along with perhaps some Ecdy, Methoxy and digestive enzymes, this could combine to promote the most advantageous nitrogen balance for a dieting strength athlete effectuating lean mass retention?
    i dont know about "most"

    but i in my experience believe nitrates are effective.

    dont know much about methoxy, and when it comes to Ecdy, Ebol is the best product ive ever used for a total non-hormonal product outside of creatine, but there are other things in it as well.
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by Outstanding View Post
    Thanks for the input... what companies brand did you try?
    Themolife's C-Bol

    I think it is VERY over hyped, atleast at bb.com anyways. I also didnt experience those "mind blowing pumps" from the nitrates. If anything, i experienced some mild headaches here and there.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by niCe99 View Post
    Themolife's C-Bol

    I think it is VERY over hyped, atleast at bb.com anyways. I also didnt experience those "mind blowing pumps" from the nitrates. If anything, i experienced some mild headaches here and there.
    Could there be a way to counter-act this phenomena, so users can take advantage of increased muscle pumps and anabolism, while keeping head aches at bay? I experienced some recurrent headaches last week and it was NOT enjoyable.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    i dont know about "most"

    but i in my experience believe nitrates are effective.

    dont know much about methoxy, and when it comes to Ecdy, Ebol is the best product ive ever used for a total non-hormonal product outside of creatine, but there are other things in it as well.
    My favorite non-hormonal product/stack of all time revolved around Ecdy as well... that's ironic. I don't want to get the thread off course, but its reassuring knowing that other athletes can label past cycles as truly being 'best' when they include certain repeating compounds.

  7. CEE screwed up my digestion. I would say put natural creatine in your body, because everything else may or may not have weird chemical side effects.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by Killerkanadia View Post
    You're right, but im assuming at minimum it works as good as creatine mono. It doesn't hurt me to spend a couple extra bucks to find out if i like a new product. If not, i use it up and go back to the good old regular stuff.
    When i said "a couple extra bucks" i didn't realize that APS Creatine Nitrate was $50


  9. Quote Originally Posted by Killerkanadia View Post
    When i said "a couple extra bucks" i didn't realize that APS Creatine Nitrate was $50

    its cheaper, about $30. usually the companies store will be a jacked price.

    i still like cbol though.
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  10. I dont use regular creatine mono anymore, but I do use Creapure. Works everytime.

  11. I like CreaPure, Ancient Strength, Trinitine, C-bol was solid too, green mag has betaine which I do like.
    doing my own thang!

  12. Quote Originally Posted by andrew732 View Post
    I like CreaPure, Ancient Strength, Trinitine, C-bol was solid too, green mag has betaine which I do like.
    Controlled Labs Green Mag is a great formula... I always forget about Controlled Labs when it comes time to re-up my supply for some reason. I really like that company.

  13. Didnt want to start a new post about an old topic, so dug this up. Does anyone using monohydrate do more than 5gs per day. Currently I take roughly 6-7 grams post workout every day. Been thinking of doing 5g with jack3d 30 mins pre w/o, and then 5g again post w/o. Sound ok?

  14. Quote Originally Posted by Pipes View Post
    Didnt want to start a new post about an old topic, so dug this up. Does anyone using monohydrate do more than 5gs per day. Currently I take roughly 6-7 grams post workout every day. Been thinking of doing 5g with jack3d 30 mins pre w/o, and then 5g again post w/o. Sound ok?
    yes its okay
    but seriously bro, you bumping old threads,kmon
    The difference between who you are and who you want to be is what you do.

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Pipes View Post
    Didnt want to start a new post about an old topic, so dug this up. Does anyone using monohydrate do more than 5gs per day. Currently I take roughly 6-7 grams post workout every day. Been thinking of doing 5g with jack3d 30 mins pre w/o, and then 5g again post w/o. Sound ok?
    HOW DARE YOU SIR! This thread is circa 2 months ago - I can't believe it was still on the servers, or for that matter carved into stone tablets and archived by this point.

    I usually take 5g upon waking prior to breakfast so I flood my system with the goody juice which will be efficiently welcomed with open insulinogenic arms with breakfast's assortment of high GI carbohydrates and Leucine-rich Whey protein. I then create an anabolic safety net by creating a buffer zone before, during, and after training by consuming 3/5/5g in respective order, consuming the final post workout dose with Need 2 Slin to enhance the anabolic window's duration and nutrient uptake.

    Happy Creatining to you!

  16. Quote Originally Posted by Outstanding View Post
    HOW DARE YOU SIR!

    you sound like a British guy or something
    The difference between who you are and who you want to be is what you do.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Outstanding View Post
    HOW DARE YOU SIR! This thread is circa 2 months ago - I can't believe it was still on the servers, or for that matter carved into stone tablets and archived by this point.

    I usually take 5g upon waking prior to breakfast so I flood my system with the goody juice which will be efficiently welcomed with open insulinogenic arms with breakfast's assortment of high GI carbohydrates and Leucine-rich Whey protein. I then create an anabolic safety net by creating a buffer zone before, during, and after training by consuming 3/5/5g in respective order, consuming the final post workout dose with Need 2 Slin to enhance the anabolic window's duration and nutrient uptake.

    Happy Creatining to you!
    18gr a day? Seriously?

  18. i take 3g/day. i think it works equally well as 20 grams
    CELTIC LABS REP

  19. When my current 'special' creatine mix is finished I'll be switching back to good old monohydrate.. Because my current mix tastes like ASS!!

  20. Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    18gr a day? Seriously?
    Yes - I made no claims this is in any way the optimal dosage scheme, or discounted the many studies done in the past revolving around 5g dosages; I am simply stating I enjoy the many benefits of creatine on a very high level, and take in the bulk of my daily amount around training.

    That aggregate 15-18 grams per day drops drastically to 3-5g per day maximum on off days. Since I have never experienced severe stomach discomfort, and we are all aware of the multitude of benefits offered by this amazing supplement, paired with the fact I have more on hand than I can ever imagine using - this is my protocol.

  21. I like creatine mono because it is the closest thing to natural creatine. If anything dose make it more absorbable, which I am doubting, it would be less of a supplement, and moe of a performance enhancing chemical.

  22. MAP+CREPURE+BCAA= My post drink.... I do take Crepure when I wake up in am 3g

    and my post I take 5g...
    Diet is always the key to unlocking the door of success


  23. Quote Originally Posted by Pipes View Post
    Didnt want to start a new post about an old topic, so dug this up. Does anyone using monohydrate do more than 5gs per day. Currently I take roughly 6-7 grams post workout every day. Been thinking of doing 5g with jack3d 30 mins pre w/o, and then 5g again post w/o. Sound ok?
    People who load it will for about a week.

    My nutrient repartitioner is also a creatine product, so yes, some days when I was using it, I was having a lot more than ~5g of creatine daily - albeit not for the creatine.

    However, be aware that once your body has reached its muscle creatine threshold, then using more than 3-5g of creatine daily is not going to saturate them any further, so there's no point in using more than that daily.

    ~Rosie~
    The Primordial Woman
    Contact Me for INDIVIDUALIZED TRAINING AND NUTRITION

    "Think like a Champion. Train like a Warrior. Live with a Purpose." - Rosie Chee

  24. Quote Originally Posted by Rosie Chee Scott View Post
    People who load it will for about a week.

    My nutrient repartitioner is also a creatine product, so yes, some days when I was using it, I was having a lot more than ~5g of creatine daily - albeit not for the creatine.

    However, be aware that once your body has reached its muscle creatine threshold, then using more than 3-5g of creatine daily is not going to saturate them any further, so there's no point in using more than that daily.

    ~Rosie~
    The Primordial Woman
    What if your like 220 mostly muscle?

  25. Quote Originally Posted by kingdong View Post
    What if your like 220 mostly muscle?
    Doesn't make a difference. Everyone has a muscle creatine threshold of between 150-160 mmol/kg dw, and once it is reached, it canNOT be saturated further!
    Contact Me for INDIVIDUALIZED TRAINING AND NUTRITION

    "Think like a Champion. Train like a Warrior. Live with a Purpose." - Rosie Chee

  26. Quote Originally Posted by Rosie Chee Scott View Post
    Doesn't make a difference. Everyone has a muscle creatine threshold of between 150-160 mmol/kg dw, and once it is reached, it canNOT be saturated further!
    Thanks Rosie! That sounds weird to me, because if a big guy needs no more than a little guy, it almost seems like the big can can't hold as much creatine per square inch of muscle.

  27. I think she means everybody has a maximum. More muscle does mean more creatine holding capacity though.. right?

  28. Quote Originally Posted by kingdong View Post
    Thanks Rosie! That sounds weird to me, because if a big guy needs no more than a little guy, it almost seems like the big can can't hold as much creatine per square inch of muscle.
    Once your creatine muscle threshold has been reached ~2-3g per day is enough to maintain those elevated levels, with a bigger individual will use the higher end of the range and a small individual the lower end - for example, a 70kg (i.e. 154 pounds) individual has a daily creatine turnover of 2g (Burke, et al., 2006; Harris, Soderlund & Hultman, 1992); using this ratio, a 200-pound individual has a daily creatine turnover of ~3g, and a 250-pound individual a daily creatine turnover of ~3.2g. Therefore you can see that there is not a lot of difference in the daily creatine requirements of a 150-pound individual and a 250-pound individual, so no, a "bigger guy" doesn't really need a lot more creatine than a "little guy".


    Quote Originally Posted by tWack View Post
    I think she means everybody has a maximum. More muscle does mean more creatine holding capacity though.. right?
    Regardless of how much muscle you have, your body's creatine holding capacity is 150-160 mmol/kg dw (Burke, et al., 2006; Harris, Soderlund & Hultman, 1992).

    A larger individual will have an overall larger amount of creatine in their system than a smaller individual because they have more dense weight, but it will still take the same amount of time to build up that creatine muscle threshold (i.e. ~20g a day for ~5 days (saturation occurs after 2-3 days), or ~5g a day for ~21 days) (Burke, et al., 2006; Harris, Soderlund & Hultman, 1992).

    Your total muscle creatine concentration can only be increased by ~20%, with ~20% of that increase in muscle creatine being stored as Creatine Phosphate (Harris, Soderlund & Hultman, 1992).

    Therefore, you can see that even 5g of creatine a day is plenty adequate for the biggest of individuals.

    See my comments above.

    ~Rosie~
    The Primordial Woman
    Contact Me for INDIVIDUALIZED TRAINING AND NUTRITION

    "Think like a Champion. Train like a Warrior. Live with a Purpose." - Rosie Chee

  29. I take maybe 4-5g a day, and no creapure on workout days due to using ASGT pre-wo. Really helps me stretch out my pre-wo supps.

  30. What if you don't take creatine on your days off, i.e. I workout about 5 days a week, but Fri and Sat I do not, and I do not take any creatine on those days. Do I lose saturation and need to load again on Sun/Mon?
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