Testopro and lethargy?

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    Testopro and lethargy?


    Hi all, has anybody experienced lethargy while using testopro? I've been taking 6 caps a day (3 am 3 pm) for a little over a month and my energy levels are in the toilet. The only other supps im taking are creatine and cissus but ive been taking those both for awhile with no negative issues. Im eating a surplus of calories and getting plenty of rest so the only thing i can think of is that it's the testopro. I still have another months worth but im going to cease taking it if this doesnt let up. Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan6f7 View Post
    Hi all, has anybody experienced lethargy while using testopro? I've been taking 6 caps a day (3 am 3 pm) for a little over a month and my energy levels are in the toilet. The only other supps im taking are creatine and cissus but ive been taking those both for awhile with no negative issues. Im eating a surplus of calories and getting plenty of rest so the only thing i can think of is that it's the testopro. I still have another months worth but im going to cease taking it if this doesnt let up. Thanks
    Have not heard of this problem. Why are you taking 6 caps a day?
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    Have you tried reducing your current dose of six, to the recommended dose of four capsules per day (2 AM/2 PM)? If not, that would be a good starting point.
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    I experience lethergy while taking Testopro also. I beleive it lowers blood glucose levels causing lethergy. Fenugreek is used by diabetics to control blood sugar levels so this makes sense. I currenlty take it late in the evening only when lethergy is welcomed. The rest of the day I use either DTH or I am currently experimenting with Formadrol XT.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    I experience lethergy while taking Testopro also. I beleive it lowers blood glucose levels causing lethergy. Fenugreek is used by diabetics to control blood sugar levels so this makes sense. I currenlty take it late in the evening only when lethergy is welcomed. The rest of the day I use either DTH or I am currently experimenting with Formadrol XT.
    interesting-but i have ran testopro 3 different times and at 6 caps, never had any lethargy whatsoever. actually endurance and energy always seemed increased-another case of how products effect people differently. glad to see you recognized how it effects you and put it to use as helping with sleep-for me it makes me energized.
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    I'm with bigt, i've ran this product multiple times and didn't have any problems with lethargy. Why are you taking six caps???? i weigh 240lbs and have been getting great results at the regular dose of 4 capsules.
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    Im 6'7" and 320 lbs 30 years old and ive usually taken higher doses of natural test boosters but never had sides like this. I just stopped taking it for a few days, might try the recomended dose. I also just got in three bottles of Pink Magic which i was gonna run solo after the testopro but i might just start now. Im not getting much from the testopro, libido is the same, strength is up a little but nothing noteworthy and the increase in aggression is really just in the form of irratibility for me. Ive read good things though it seems to work well for most.
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    Everyone responds to things differently. Testopro works great for me and others, sorry to hear that you weren't able to get the results you wanted from it.
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    I would recommend despite your size, running at the recommended dose and seeing how that foes. If that doesnt treat you well you may wanna try Stoked. Im running both Stoked and Testopro and feel no lethargy. Sorry to here its not sitting well with you.

    Do you take Testopro with meals or on an empty stomach?
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    Yah you never know with herbals, Lethargy is the last thing I get and my libido goes fuggin nuts, like and 18 year old or me in my mid thirties.
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    Thanks for the replys, yes i took it with meals. 3 before breakfast and 3 before dinner, about 10 hours apart. I will try 2 and 2 and see how it goes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan6f7 View Post
    Thanks for the replys, yes i took it with meals. 3 before breakfast and 3 before dinner, about 10 hours apart. I will try 2 and 2 and see how it goes.
    Let us know if that does not work then something in it does not agree with you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryan6f7 View Post
    Im 6'7" and 320 lbs 30 years old and ive usually taken higher doses of natural test boosters but never had sides like this. I just stopped taking it for a few days, might try the recomended dose. I also just got in three bottles of Pink Magic which i was gonna run solo after the testopro but i might just start now. Im not getting much from the testopro, libido is the same, strength is up a little but nothing noteworthy and the increase in aggression is really just in the form of irratibility for me. Ive read good things though it seems to work well for most.
    I have no experience to base this on but Pink Magic just sounds completely bogus to me. I will be looking for unsponsered threads before spending before any money on this supp.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    I have no experience to base this on but Pink Magic just sounds completely bogus to me. I will be looking for unsponsered threads before spending before any money on this supp.
    I used PM on my contest prep and it is a remarkable nutrient repartitioner but that can be Chaos on a prep with low carbs. Then out of the blue I experience these crazy increases in strength. Then not as much the next week as I was pretty exhausted. I haven't really nailed it down but I figure it will work very well on a above maintenance calorie intake. I don't think you will gain tons of mass on it unless you're in a pretty serious surplus but it will be very good for recomp. I am thinking I will gain a few lbs and lose a couple pounds of fat. We'll see if I'm right. I do believe the strength increases will be more consistant. I would not want to run this again on low carbs. I got it for a very low price so it will be a good deal for me.
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    Pink Magic may or may not be bogus, but the only bad things ive heard about it are from people that have not used it. Im not going to do a full blown log as i just dont have time but i im a almost a week in on pink magic and i will try to post a report after my 6 week run. I stopped the testopro and im already feeling back to normal, energy is up and mood is up and the irratibility has gone away.
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    There are only a handful of reps who's opinion I value, DreamWeaver you are one of them. So I will probably give PM a try base on your input. I also put a lot of value in Bigt's opinion. IMO both of you are straight shooters.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    There are only a handful of reps who's opinion I value, DreamWeaver you are one of them. So I will probably give PM a try base on your input. I also put a lot of value in Bigt's opinion. IMO both of you are straight shooters.
    Thank you very much for the compliment, nothing more important than a man's integrity. I also rely on T for advice as well...
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    Quote Originally Posted by thebigt View Post
    interesting-but i have ran testopro 3 different times and at 6 caps, never had any lethargy whatsoever. actually endurance and energy always seemed increased-another case of how products effect people differently. glad to see you recognized how it effects you and put it to use as helping with sleep-for me it makes me energized.
    A big T good to hear from my fellow Hoosier, a man im gonna be your way somtime next month for a game. Ill send you a pm with a date. Also if you get a chance check us out on face book, search for Indiana Hitmen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    There are only a handful of reps who's opinion I value, DreamWeaver you are one of them. So I will probably give PM a try base on your input. I also put a lot of value in Bigt's opinion. IMO both of you are straight shooters.
    DW tells it like it is for sure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pembroke3355 View Post
    DW tells it like it is for sure.
    Thanks, the truth is easier to remember and I'm getting old ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamWeaver View Post
    Thanks, the truth is easier to remember and I'm getting old ...
    I am in the same boat my friend.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pembroke3355 View Post
    DW tells it like it is for sure.
    Def a man whose word you can count on.

    I tried Pink Magic solo during the beta run. Wasnt too blown away. Leaned up nicely, vascularity did improve and so did recovery. It did work for me but i sadly did not get the same gains as DW and others, but remember everyone reacts differently to a supp and sometimes i react far better the second and third time i run a supplement. They did improve the formula so i would look at the new logs to see how it continues to treat others. I would personally run Pink Magic again with the testopro, HGHup and Life Support. Stoked would keep anything from aromatising and you can run Prime and glycobol after to keep the gains going strong.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoHardOrGoHme View Post
    Def a man whose word you can count on.

    I tried Pink Magic solo during the beta run. Wasnt too blown away. Leaned up nicely, vascularity did improve and so did recovery. It did work for me but i sadly did not get the same gains as DW and others, but remember everyone reacts differently to a supp and sometimes i react far better the second and third time i run a supplement. They did improve the formula so i would look at the new logs to see how it continues to treat others. I would personally run Pink Magic again with the testopro, HGHup and Life Support. Stoked would keep anything from aromatising and you can run Prime and glycobol after to keep the gains going strong.
    I like the way you think.
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    Quote Originally Posted by punthra View Post
    I'm with bigt, i've ran this product multiple times and didn't have any problems with lethargy. Why are you taking six caps???? i weigh 240lbs and have been getting great results at the regular dose of 4 capsules.
    ill let you all know how i feel runnin 8 caps EOD with 4 caps perform ED.

    see how it feels, because sometimes my libido dies off from products with i3c after 3 weeks, so im going to try and offset that.
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyfool405 View Post
    ill let you all know how i feel runnin 8 caps EOD with 4 caps perform ED.

    see how it feels, because sometimes my libido dies off from products with i3c after 3 weeks, so im going to try and offset that.
    Please keep us informed.
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    I have also been feeling lethargic. I purchased testopro about a week ago been taking that with novedex xt. I was thinking about adding in dhea. Im only 27 so i know dhea wouldnt very beneficial, but would dhea help with lethargy? I was thinking about 50-100mgs a day. thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcr1 View Post
    I have also been feeling lethargic. I purchased testopro about a week ago been taking that with novedex xt. I was thinking about adding in dhea. Im only 27 so i know dhea wouldnt very beneficial, but would dhea help with lethargy? I was thinking about 50-100mgs a day. thanks.
    I have heard of people becoming lethargic on novedex more so then testopro. Novedex is a strong anti-aromatase. Testopro does have an anti-aromatase agent, I3C. Again i have heard Novedex is a very potent anti-aromatase which in turn may cause lethargy.

    Try this, run each solo and see if you are getting lethargic b/c of the potentiating effects of both or if one maybe causing the lethargy more so then the other.

    I do recommend Stoked as if you want to control/negate the effects of estrogen while on Testopro or another testbooster. I have yet to use Novedex and am not very interested in it. Currently using both Testopro and Stoked and liek stated before experiencing no lethargy.

    I do not think adding DHEA would help. But i have no experience with it so maybe someone who has tried DHEA can chime in.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoHardOrGoHme View Post
    I have heard of people becoming lethargic on novedex more so then testopro. Novedex is a strong anti-aromatase. Testopro does have an anti-aromatase agent, I3C. Again i have heard Novedex is a very potent anti-aromatase which in turn may cause lethargy.

    Try this, run each solo and see if you are getting lethargic b/c of the potentiating effects of both or if one maybe causing the lethargy more so then the other.

    I do recommend Stoked as if you want to control/negate the effects of estrogen while on Testopro or another testbooster. I have yet to use Novedex and am not very interested in it. Currently using both Testopro and Stoked and liek stated before experiencing no lethargy.

    I do not think adding DHEA would help. But i have no experience with it so maybe someone who has tried DHEA can chime in.
    I really dont wanna run them solo, i was stacking them for potency reasons. I can manage its only a 4 week supply. But it is kiking my ass. Last time felt like this i overtrained, just feel weak, little motivation to work out but i do, i just wanna go right back to bed after i wake up and eat in the am after 8-9 hrs of sleep. sucks but i manage, i just LOAD up on Jacked and sip on my bcaa's mixed with ASGT intra. Next time ill def. try stoked. I posted this in the Anabolic Innovations section so hopefully they will get back to me. thanks
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcr1 View Post
    I really dont wanna run them solo, i was stacking them for potency reasons. I can manage its only a 4 week supply. But it is kiking my ass. Last time felt like this i overtrained, just feel weak, little motivation to work out but i do, i just wanna go right back to bed after i wake up and eat in the am after 8-9 hrs of sleep. sucks but i manage, i just LOAD up on Jacked and sip on my bcaa's mixed with ASGT intra. Next time ill def. try stoked. I posted this in the Anabolic Innovations section so hopefully they will get back to me. thanks
    Well first off have you ever run either one of the solo in the past? Or have you run any of these in another stack in the past?

    I can understand you want to get the max benefits from a stack but its best to stack 2 supplements that will work synergistically rather then have one induce neg sides.

    I strongly recommend the testopro/stoked combo. But it would still be best figure out what is causing the lethargy and not just start blindly stacking, if that makes any sense.
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    You may want to read this about the main ingrediant in Pink Magic.

    Massularia Acuminata & Testosterone

    Back in 2008, a study was conducted on Massularia Acuminata (Massularia Accuminate = alternate spelling) and its effects on testosterone. The abstract was published online, and was reposted on several websites. In late 2009 and early 2010, I looked into it because Daniel Clough from At Large Nutrition was planning to add a test booster to his product line, and he had contacted me (long story) as the potential formulator for the product.

    I looked into dozens of testosterone boosting herbs, and this one was on my list. Anyway, I purchased the full study and read it…and quickly decided that this herb had exactly ZERO potential to be used in a testosterone boosting nutritional supplement. It simply doesn’t raise testosterone very high, and even then, it can’t do it without taking impossibly high megadoses.

    But, since most supplement buyers don’t purchase and read studies full studies (*when the abstract is available for free), the door was (and is) left open for it to be used in a nutritional supplement. I’ll tell you why it’s not going to work in a second, but first, I want you to check out the abstract:

    J Ethnopharmacol. 2008 Aug 13;118(3):508-13. Epub 2008 May 28. Androgenic potentials of aqueous extract of Massularia acuminata (G. Don) Bullock ex Hoyl. stem in male Wistar rats. Yakubu MT, Akanji MA, Oladiji AT, Adesokan AA. Medicinal Plants Research Laboratory, Department of Biochemistry, University of Ilorin, PMB 1515, Ilorin, Nigeria. tomuyak@yahoo.com Abstract The use of medicinal plants in the management of several ailments is gaining popularity nowadays. Massularia acuminata, one of such plants is commonly used as chewing sticks due to its antimicrobial activity and the aqueous extract of its stem as an aphrodisiac. Aphrodisiac activity in some plants may be due to androgen increasing property of its phytochemicals. AIM OF THE STUDY: This study therefore sought to assess the androgenic potentials of aqueous extract of Massularia acuminata stem in male rats for 21 days. MATERIALS AND METHODS: Male rats weighing between 220 and 260 g were completely randomized into four groups: A, B, C and D. Group A, the control received orally 1 ml of distilled water (the vehicle) while groups B, C and D were orally administered with 1 ml each corresponding to 250, 500 and 1000 mg/kg body weight of the plant extract, respectively for 21 days. Rats were sacrificed 24h after 1, 7 and 21 days. RESULTS: Compared with the control, extract administration at all the doses produced significant increase (P<0.05) in testes-body weight ratio, testicular protein, glycogen, sialic acid, cholesterol, testosterone, luteinizing and follicle stimulating hormone concentrations throughout the period of administration. Testicular gamma glutamyl transferase activities were decreased significantly (P<0.05) after the first dose and was sustained throughout the experimental period. CONCLUSION: The available evidence in this study suggests that aqueous extract of Massularia acuminata stem has androgenic potential which may stimulate male sexual maturation and enhance normal testicular function. PMID: 18602232 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

    So, at first blush, it looks vaguely promising, right? But check out the dose required…the lowest dose examined in the study was 250mgs/kg! On a kg/kg (simple comparative bodyweight) basis you’ll need about 25 grams of the stuff per day for a 100kg (220lb) bodybuilder, going off the absolute lowest dose. The highest dose would require 100g/day based on a 220lb (100kg)human bodyweight. However, this is based on human weight versus rodent weight. Now, if we convert the rodent dose to the human dose equivalent using the accepted body surface area formula, we find that we need just over 4 grams per day. And that’s at the lowest dose examined – we’d double that dose for the 500mgs/kg (over 8 grams per day) and double it again for the 1,000mgs/kg dose (over 16 grams per day). Currently, only two companies (that I know of) are using this herb in a product, and the dose per serving is (at best) on par with (but likely lower than) even the lowest dose examined in the study (250mgs/kg), translated to anything resembling a human equivalent. The daily suggested dose (all of the daily servings added up) contained in the proprietary blends currently being sold on the market still isn’t likely to be equivalent to the lowest dose in the study.

    In fact, even if the 250mg/kg equivalent dose were being used (and it isn’t), the testosterone boost provided would be 12%. But since nowhere near this dose is being used…have I made my point yet? The full study is much more interesting, because when we crunch the numbers, we find out that the rodents were being given an ungodly amount of this stuff, and barely getting any kind of decent test boost! So how much of a boost in serum testosterone did the herb provide? Well, we don’t know, because the study doesn’t tell us. Wait…what? Yeah, you read that correctly, the study doesn’t actually look at serum testosterone levels. So what about free testosterone levels? Well, the study doesn’t look at that either. The study examines intratesticular testosterone, LH, and a bunch of other stuff (testicular glycogen, testicular sailic acid concentration, etc…) but provides no hard data on how much of a real test boost the herb provided. So, as you can see, even if you were chocking down thousands of milligrams per day of the stuff, the rodent data suggests that after 21 days, your LH will get around a 60% boost (rodents in the control group were 1.27 and the 1,000mg/kg group ended up at 2.14) , and your testicular testosterone will go up about the same, roughly 60% (the rodents in the control group were 3.37, while rodents in the 1,000mg/kg group were 5.38 ng/dl). But of course, none of the companies using this ingredient are using anywhere near an effective dose. This is why I abandoned the idea of using this stuff in a product formulation, and focused my research and development elsewhere.

    But as the saying goes, there’s a sucker born every minute, and no shortage of supplement manufacturers looking to scam them.
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    Deleted Massularia Acuminata thread from Bodybuilding.com

    Several days ago, an article I posted here in my blog sparked some serious discussion over on Bodybuilding.com. The article concerned Massularia Acuminata, the primary ingredient being used in Pink Magic, a product being sold by USP Labs. At the dose it’s being used, it will provide just over a 10% increase in testicular testosterone, according to the one study performed on it (although the advertisements reference this study, they cite the highest dose, which provides over 60%). This same study makes no note of total or free testosterone…

    As previously stated, I’ve got no dog in this fight. I don’t sell a testosterone booster, haven’t sold one in years, and have not collected a check from a nutritional company since 2008. I stumbled onto this information while doing research for At Large Nutrition, for a testosterone boosting product that never materialized, and simply decided to write an article on one of the (many) compounds that didn’t make the cut. And Massularia Acuminata just didn’t make the cut. I’ve got a case to make here, in support of my original article, which I stand by, and I’ve included more than enough evidence in the form of unaltered screenshots, for you to judge whether or not to believe me. As always, this decision is left to you, not me.

    Although I have an active account on Bodybuilding.com, I chose not to participate in the thread surrounding my article; it contained my full thoughts on the debate. My own blog, likewise, is not a place I chose to discuss or debate my posts (the comments section is disabled). I have reserved the comments portion of my Facebook account for that function – where each and every single blog post I make gets published in my feed so everyone on my friend list can discuss them. Feel free to add me as a friend if you’ve got comments about anything I’ve ever written.

    A day after the article was published, on AnabolicMinds.com, USP Labs could be seen lamenting the fact that one article has disproven his product. But my article is probably only half the reason for the most recent criticism directed at USP Labs – a company who was kind enough to give me my first writing gig under the Anthony Roberts name (and for which I am grateful). As you can imagine, I’ve got nothing against USP Labs – if anything, I’d lean in FAVOR of USP Labs, who I’ve written for previously; I’ve known USP Labs before they even started selling nutritional supplements. No bias here, and no hidden agenda…

    I even sent a PM to USP Labs on Bodybuilding.com to discuss whether I’d erred in my article – because if I did, I’d print an immediate retraction.This was during the time while USP Labs was active on the forums and replying openly to the thread about my article. I’m forced to think that if there was a reasonable explanation, he’d have replied to me personally so I could have retracted my piece.



    In truth, the product was disproven because USP Labs failed to respond with timely answers to my article, and because of the actual response USP Labs had to the article itself. If there were any sound reason that my article wasn’t accurate, it would have been immediately posted by USP Labs when the subject was broached on Bodybuilding.com.

    Immediately!

    Not an hour after his first post, not a day later, not two days later. And as you can see by the thread below, it didn’t happen. AGAIN, if the evidence to disprove my article was on hand, then it would have been posted immediately.

    This is common sense, guys. If you were accused of killing someone on the night of 6-10-2010, and you had an alibi for that night, wouldn’t you tell the police immediately?!?! Of course you would.

    Is there a reasonable explanation that my article could be incorrect, and the herb in Pink Magic be accurately dosed to provide a 60% (or higher) test boost, as shown with the highest dose in the study referenced? What If the USP Labs product contained a super-duper highly concentrated version of the herb, or if they had managed to isolate the active fractions and extract/concentrate? Surely that would account for the low dose?

    My response is that if this were the case, then we’d have seen it referenced on the label. I know that USP Labs has claimed their extract to be more potent, but once again, where is that noted on the actual label? And, it’s interesting to note that the amount of the herb contained in the product, if we assume no super-potent concentration, would appear to correspond exactly to the lowest dose used in the study, the one that gave a 12%-ish rise in testicular testosterone.

    But there is no such notation of this process or concentration level on the label or in the ad copy. You’ll see that in the case of their Cissus Quadrangularis product (Super Cissus Rx) they note the higher concentration of the herb in the product on the sales page:



    While they do no such thing in the advertising copy or label information for their Pink Magic product, and in fact, fail to disclose what kind of extraction process they use (if any) as well as what concentration the herb has been standardized to (as required):



    Are we all on the same page here? Let’s go over this one more time: If there was, in fact, an explanation for the incredibly low dose of Massularia Acuminata found in Pink Magic, that would have been the immediate response by the company owner, not a response given several days later. We’d see it reflected on the label also; which we don’t. If there’s an explanation, it would have been given on front street, not on the river card. Think about it.

    You don’t fold when you have the winning hand, and you certainly don’t need to bluff.

    When approached with the data contained in my blog, via a thread on Bodybuilding.com, things got heated, and USP Labs got banned from posting, while the thread was ultimately deleted. Instead of sensibly answering questions about the herb, and defending the product in a sound manner, USP Labs instead chose to repeatedly post the ad-copy, thereby irritating members: Naturally, this was unanimously seen as insulting and disrespectful. A good deal of damage was likely done by my blog, but as can be seen by members’ postings on Bodybuilding.com, a great deal of damage was also done by the owner of USP Labs himself, by refusing to engage the data in a constructive way, or provide any sort of immediate and reasonable explanation, which could easily be confirmed by checking the label (in the case of a more potent extract or concentration): As a result, numerous members reported USP Labs for spamming the forum, a clear violation of Bodybuilding.com rules. This led to the banning of USP Labs from posting on the forums, at least for the remainder of the day.

    It should be noted that at no point was any viable explanation given for the low dose of Massularia Acuminata found in Pink Magic, either that day or the next. An explanation, if one existed, would have been the first thing posted by the company and/or its reps. The word “immediately” springs to mind here. And once again, we’d see any claims of a more potent extract or concentration reflected on the label itself.

    The thread grew to 10 pages pretty quickly, with no such explanation being given, and although I see no need to repost the entire thread here (it gets repetitive), I am going to repost the first two pages, as it may be of interest to my readers to know exactly what kind of dialogue Bodybuilding.com is censoring. At this point, it seems unlikely that the dose of Massularia Acuminata found in Pink Magic will do anything more than give the user a 12% boost in testosterone (if that).

    But please, judge for yourself, and check out USP Labs’ responses to my article. The screenshots below will also let you judge whether you believe any future claims made about my previous article, and decide for yourself why any mitigating data to disprove my claims was not presented:
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoHardOrGoHme View Post
    Well first off have you ever run either one of the solo in the past? Or have you run any of these in another stack in the past?

    I can understand you want to get the max benefits from a stack but its best to stack 2 supplements that will work synergistically rather then have one induce neg sides.

    I strongly recommend the testopro/stoked combo. But it would still be best figure out what is causing the lethargy and not just start blindly stacking, if that makes any sense.
    No, this my first on both these supps. thanks
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    The Testofen in TestoPRO is one of the few ingredients that have human studies proving that it increase free test. I agree with running the TestoPRO and Novedex solo if your stacking them and it is not treating you well then it is not worth it.
    Ask me for samples of the new RecoverPRO and Maniac. 3Z is coming July 1st Facebook for more info and maybe a great deal on it coming.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pembroke3355 View Post
    The Testofen in TestoPRO is one of the few ingredients that have human studies proving that it increase free test. I agree with running the TestoPRO and Novedex solo if your stacking them and it is not treating you well then it is not worth it.
    The only studies I have seen are "in-house" studies by Gencor. Moreover, they did not check estrogen levels. Are there any others?
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    Quote Originally Posted by NattyT View Post
    A big T good to hear from my fellow Hoosier, a man im gonna be your way somtime next month for a game. Ill send you a pm with a date. Also if you get a chance check us out on face book, search for Indiana Hitmen.
    please do!! i have alot of respect for a man who follows his dreams-i would be very happy to see you suiting up in the blue and white one day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    The only studies I have seen are "in-house" studies by Gencor. Moreover, they did not check estrogen levels. Are there any others?
    my blood test showed almost 50% increase in free test/only a slight increase in total test. estrogen did increase, but only slightly and it was well within range. overall i was very impressed with results-i rate testopro as the best natty test booster i have tried-based on my results along with blood test results.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    The only studies I have seen are "in-house" studies by Gencor. Moreover, they did not check estrogen levels. Are there any others?
    There you go a real life AM user results.
    Ask me for samples of the new RecoverPRO and Maniac. 3Z is coming July 1st Facebook for more info and maybe a great deal on it coming.
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    Over the years I have tried many test boosters including TestoPro. None of them increase test levels enough to increase mass. Thus far the best natty stack I have found is DTHC + Primal Male + TestoPro. These three work synergystically to increase test enough to put on mass however it takes about 2-3 weeks to kick in. I plan on trying TCF-1 in the near future.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    Over the years I have tried many test boosters including TestoPro. None of them increase test levels enough to increase mass. Thus far the best natty stack I have found is DTHC + Primal Male + TestoPro. These three work synergystically to increase test enough to put on mass however it takes about 2-3 weeks to kick in.
    hell-it took around 3 weeks for test cyp to kick in, lol.

    according to my blood test testopro will not increase total test by all that much-the thing that makes it shine is the huge increase in free test, but i agree if you have the cash the stack you have there would be very nice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBB View Post
    Over the years I have tried many test boosters including TestoPro. None of them increase test levels enough to increase mass. Thus far the best natty stack I have found is DTHC + Primal Male + TestoPro. These three work synergystically to increase test enough to put on mass however it takes about 2-3 weeks to kick in. I plan on trying TCF-1 in the near future.
    That makes sense. You want something to increase total test and Testopro will make sure the extra is free-test. That's also why Testopro works so well with cyp like T states. The problem I have is I can't find a natural pure test booster that works well for me. Testopro does work well at creating more free test but I can't help feel it would be better if my total test was higher.

    If you add stoked to test it enhances the results as well. I am thinking a good DAA product may be the answer.
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