PH's to young?

[Royalstime]

i had a prev account on this but its gone this says im 5'11 180 but im 210 now like 10-12%bf. i have a frends thats taking PH's and hes like 18 and getting amazing gains, im 20 with my stats wud i benifit from them i read around that 20 was young but he almost done his cycle and he seems to be doing fine. he went from 190 to like 205 almost near me so these things work amazing. just wanted to knoe y 20 to young?

 

[Royalstime]

o and how do u change your stats?

 

[sanchezgreg18]

just because he seems to be fine doesnt mean anything... how does he kno what his hormones are like does he get bloodwork done, i doubt it. theres a reason why younger people should not use ph. improper use and pct is one reason, not to mention all the lifetime long side effects they can cause hormonally especially.

 

[Royalstime]

well i knoe hes goin for blood tests after it all i dont knoe bout during never asked to much of him but wat ever hes using is working. of course it can mess up his hormones, lots of things can, but if he knoes wat he doing and getting his doctor check ups wats the matter. i knoe hes not stupid in wat hes doing but the frequent blood test thing i dont knoe

 

[Royalstime]

wud it have sides as bad as tru stuff?

 

[BurghHardcore]

wud it have sides as bad as tru stuff?

It could have sides WORSE than real anabolic steroids. I don't want to be a d*ck....but you're friends an idiot. I'm sorry, maybe I shouldn't say that, he MIGHT just be uneducated, like you seem to be. But it's good that you came to the right place to get some information first. So kudos to you for that. Just b/c he's going to the doctor afterwards, which is a good idea, doesn't mean that he will be fine. He could go to the doc and have the tests come back that's he's all screwed up. Then, doctor or no doctor, he's got a road to recovery ahead of him.

The fact of the matter is at your age you simply DON'T NEED a PH. It doesn't matter how awesome the gains are, I'd bet money you don't keep them after the cycle. People aren't pulling your chain when they tell you to take EFA's, Protein, Creatine, and lots and lots of food at your age. That are just trying to help you so you don't seriously injure yourself. You are literally in the PRIME YEARS for muscle growth right now. Bust your *ss, eat tons of food, and get some rest. I really hope you take my advice and the advice of others on this board. Stay away from PH's at your age. It's just NOT worth it.

 

[permanabol]

I agree with Burgh but sure would like to see that bloodwork

 

[sanchezgreg18]

just because hes getting a physical every so often which im assuming you are saying by dr check ups is no where even close to anything relevant. even if an endocrinologist was monitoring him that wouldnt prevent his hormones from being permanently screwed up and ending up on trt because he wanted to gain 10lbs and only keep that while on cycle and lose everything after from having low test. im sure this guy doesnt have a serm, and is probably using novadex like so many people these days are. Im not trying to be a **** either but theres too many of these threads popping up saying oh why can i use it , it cant be that bad. truth is it can. not just hormonally but methyls are seriously toxic. Im not against prohormones by anymeans, but they should only be used by the educated, advanced in training, those who use responsibly and dont screw it up for everyone else, and with proper on cycle support supplements proper PCT including a SERM.

 

[R1balla]

u say he isnt stupid?! he is VERY stupid for using them at 18. i have a cousin at 15 who is on mdrol and i laugh when he says he is fine. even though his bloodwork is fine, he hasnt had is hormones checked

 

[Royalstime]

ok thats reasonable and yea ill try to find out how his blood work goes when hes all done and hits the doctor. thanks for the words, another i wanna ask about for the ones here do u think igf-1 at 20 is bad not like im lookin for away out or anything, ive done a 50 day cycle of it already. jus wonderin if i cud highly screw my self up doing another one. got my blood work all was good then went to get a scan bc i heard that ur lower intests can enlarge but they said all seemed normal. personaly i think igf-1 is fine at 20-23 wat u guys think hopefully ppl who used it can give some adivce.

 

[Royalstime]

wow 15 is a lil serious but doesnt goin to get ur blood checked they also tell u ur hormone lvls. thats how we do it in Canada.

 

[BurghHardcore]

I got a baaad feeling about this. Seems like you're worried about your buddy catching up to you gym wise and want to keep your advantage. Don't worry, when he comes off the PH he's gonna shrink.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32Pwf9kql7E&feature=fvw"]YouTube- I've Got a Bad Feeling About This[/ame]

 

[Royalstime]

lol, i guess u can say somthing like that. i look alot better tho but he put on some good weight wat everyone is making sence and im here to learn before i do somthin dum, from wat i knoe arnt PH like AAS alternatives?

 

[BurghHardcore]

not necessarily alternatives, they are precursors to a hormone. Meaning that some type of conversion needs to take place for the PH to convert to it's target hormone. Like Sanchez said, some PH's are methylated as well. These methylated hormones put a lot of stress on your liver. If you're not taking liver support supplements (before, during, and after), or run a cycle of a methylated hormone for too long you can do serious damage to your liver. PH's can also screw with your cholesterol levels, prostate, blood pressure, indigenous testosterone levels, testicular atrophy, and can have some hair loss as well. It's really....really, not a good idea so young. It's good that you came here first. Please, for your sake and for the sake of supplement lovers everywhere, don't take the PH. And try to educate your friend as well.

 

[Royalstime]

hes a lost cause but i can only look out for my self, wow i did research on them but never came across any news like this it sounds exacly like the reall thing, just in pill form. so wat supps do u guys recomend? wat about AI's? u think i cud do another igf-1 cycle again?

 

[Royalstime]

wat ur sayin make complete sence but how do u knoe hes not using it right with good on cycle support and pct? not saying he is cuz i dont knoe, however u cant say he isnt u knoe? from wat i learned from u guys using it early is rong, but no one said hes not using it right, age has nothing to do with how hes using it u knoe wat im sayin? dont think itll make a def if i say wat hes using if i get it out of him so i wont

 

[BurghHardcore]

I'm not educated enough on the use of IGF-1 to give you any advice. Check in the Anabolics forum for that. I'm sure you will get the same reply though. An AI might not be too bad an idea, but even those and test boosters at your age...IMO your $$$ could be better spent in the grocery store, on protein, creatine, BCAA's, beta-alanine, BCAA's, and anti-oxidants. Don't be in such a hurry bro, at 27yo I would do a lot of things to have just 6 months of the muscle building ability I had when I was 20. My god, I don't know if it is genetics or what, but all my friends hated me b/c if I busted my *ss for just two weeks I could make noticeable aesthetic progress. I'm not doing too bad here right now at 27yo LOL, but at 20 I grew from just looking at the weights.

 

[BurghHardcore]

wat ur sayin make complete sence but how do u knoe hes not using it right with good on cycle support and pct? not saying he is cuz i dont knoe, however u cant say he isnt u knoe? from wat i learned from u guys using it early is rong, but no one said hes not using it right, age has nothing to do with how hes using it u knoe wat im sayin? dont think itll make a def if i say wat hes using if i get it out of him so i wont

I didn't mean to imply that he wasn't using all of the necessary support supplements for on-cycle and post-cycle. But to be completely honest, at the age of 18 more than likely he's not. With PH/DS use there comes a certain level of responsibility, patience, education, and dedication one must have to use a PH in a safe manner, and do all the right things to stay safe and keep all of your gains off cycle. Most 18yr olds I know/knew (including myself at that age), don't have that. Not to say you're friend doesn't...he might...I just doubt it.

 

[Royalstime]

no worries im not in a hurry or any thing just been working out for 3 years and the only thing that has changed is my body fat. went down alot now....nothing, just looking for somthing to give me a lil boost u knoe? igf-1 worked great for me did loads of reserach on that before i touched it 2 year worth. so i knoe about that

 

[ax1]

ill take 20 year old natural hormone levels over a cycle any day..........

and ill tell you this, ive made better gains naturally at 20, than my current hdrol run which is my first cycle (im 32 now.) when i was 20 i didnt even use protein supplements, i used nothing. just ate and trained right.

so if you arent getting results and craving ph's, you really should just go visit the diet and training forums, and READ!

if you want to do ph's, nobody can stop you, but you may really regret it later in life. you young kids think your invisible, cause your so healthy and dont know what its like to be sick.

 

[R1balla]

wow 15 is a lil serious but doesnt goin to get ur blood checked they also tell u ur hormone lvls. thats how we do it in Canada.

not in the US. when u get a blood test, its the basic ldl, hdl, liver, kidneys...etc. if u want hormones checked, u gotta get a hormone panel done.

 

[CaponeCEO]

I cant even read what you post because that "text message font" throws me off. I could never be a teacher these days.

Dont do PH's until you have:
1. Researched enough about steriods
2. Learned grammar to ask proper questions.
3. Seen your friends do them and regret not doing them properly. This always helps when you can be the one who gives them the correct answers as to why they got gyno.

 

[Royalstime]

thats uncalled for ur basicly saying im stupid. im doing pretty damn good in school so i knoe i can read and right, u knoe that im on the net asking questions, so im goin to type different than writing an essay. no need to come and be a d*ck about sh*t, no asked u to come here thanks for the advice tho, make sence. next time, remember ur on the net and were not writing essys, funny thing is ur the only one that brought up grammar instead of just helping somone out....tisk tisk

 

[BurghHardcore]

thats uncalled for ur basicly saying im stupid. im doing pretty damn good in school so i knoe i can read and right, u knoe that im on the net asking questions, so im goin to type different than writing an essay. no need to come and be a d*ck about sh*t, no asked u to come here thanks for the advice tho, make sence. next time, remember ur on the net and were not writing essys, funny thing is ur the only one that brought up grammar instead of just helping somone out....tisk tisk

To be fair...I was going to bring it up last night b/c it was driving me insane. But I figured I'd let it go and try to help ya out :439:

 

[CaponeCEO]

thats uncalled for ur basicly saying im stupid. im doing pretty damn good in school so i knoe i can read and right, u knoe that im on the net asking questions, so im goin to type different than writing an essay. no need to come and be a d*ck about sh*t, no asked u to come here thanks for the advice tho, make sence. next time, remember ur on the net and were not writing essys, funny thing is ur the only one that brought up grammar instead of just helping somone out....tisk tisk

Sorry bro. I wasn't trying to be a jerk. It is just painful for my old eyes to read town that type of writing. I wasn't calling you stupid, but the trend of re-defining the English language to some wierd writing format that makes no grammatical sense is. You have to understand that some people who don't write like that have a hard time reading it. I even yell at my teenage sister who text's me like that sometimes. I am happy you don't write like that in school.

It also says to me that you are the younger generation of lifter, who is going down the same road we have all gone down. PH's are steriods and you have to be very versed in thier use, side effects, and PCT. I only learned about PH's after a friend of mine told me how he gained 20lbs of muscle off "some new thing". I researched that he was taking Superdrol and ended up getting a bunch of nasty sides. You will be one step up in the game if you know more about it then your friends who just unassumingly take it. People doing this is why they are harder and harder to get.

 

[Royalstime]

Sorry bro. I wasn't trying to be a jerk. It is just painful for my old eyes to read town that type of writing. I wasn't calling you stupid, but the trend of re-defining the English language to some wierd writing format that makes no grammatical sense is. You have to understand that some people who don't write like that have a hard time reading it. I even yell at my teenage sister who text's me like that sometimes. I am happy you don't write like that in school.

It also says to me that you are the younger generation of lifter, who is going down the same road we have all gone down. PH's are steriods and you have to be very versed in thier use, side effects, and PCT. I only learned about PH's after a friend of mine told me how he gained 20lbs of muscle off "some new thing". I researched that he was taking Superdrol and ended up getting a bunch of nasty sides. You will be one step up in the game if you know more about it then your friends who just unassumingly take it. People doing this is why they are harder and harder to get.

you're right, and you know i guess i wasnt thinking about the genration level difference, the way i was writing was in my time i understand that. since im looking for help the least i can do is type in a readable format. Anyway sorry about that, i was wondering yea im a young lifter however ive come to a stand still when it comes to gains, as i said ive been 5'11 210 for like a yr and a half, i make little ones of course due to my bf going down and i remain the same weight i was just wondering is there any good AI stacks out there, from like AX or alr?

 

[R1balla]

210 is good. not sure if u can get any bigger other than running a PH but maybe. post a pic up

 

[Royalstime]

how do i do that? and where?

 

[gamer2be08]

I know an 18 year old gearing like crazy. Of course he is about 210lbs 8 percent BF. Body building is his life and career; he could be the next arnold...

 

[Royalstime]

I know an 18 year old gearing like crazy. Of course he is about 210lbs 8 percent BF. Body building is his life and career; he could be the next arnold...

hmm, from what i have learned so far, ive come to the understanding that AAS are a little less risky if everything is done properly for both is my asumption rong?:nervous:

 

[Royalstime]

PH's are steriods and you have to be very versed in thier use, side effects, and PCT. .

wait PH's are the really thing or reall close?

 

[gamer2be08]

Well, how close do you believe to be to your natural genetic limit? How knowledgeable are you on AAS. Can you accept responsibility to any harm you may cause yourself physically, hormonally and mentally? Do you feel mature enough. How long have you trained for? Age regardless, there are a lot of things to take into account with proper AAS usage. Im not telling you to use steroids or condoning it, but your going to do what your going to do...

 

[gamer2be08]

wait PH's are the really thing or reall close?

There are some "PHs" out there that are actual oral steroids such as mdrol, pplex or epistane... They are the real thing...

 

[purebred]

signs that you shouldn't use ph's:

-you do not use periods when typing.
-you spell the word "know" like this: "knoe"
-you spell the word "why" like this: "y"
-you misuse "to" and "too"

I'm just getting started....

 

[Royalstime]

Well, how close do you believe to be to your natural genetic limit? How knowledgeable are you on AAS. Can you accept responsibility to any harm you may cause yourself physically, hormonally and mentally? Do you feel mature enough. How long have you trained for? Age regardless, there are a lot of things to take into account with proper AAS usage. Im not telling you to use steroids or condoning it, but your going to do what your going to do...

you are right however im a very open person, my frame can still hold more weight not much though i think thats why the last few pounds to add on are little difficult. been lifting for a soild 4 years. the past 2 were e day splits just to maintain size and strenght

 

[CaponeCEO]

wait PH's are the really thing or reall close?

They are methlyated oral designer steriods. Basically which is why they work unlike any of the other crap you can buy at GNC or so. They can give you terrible side effects post cycle. They can give you side effects during cycle. If you know how to use support supplements prior to going on cycle with them, and when done using proper post cycle therapy, then you would be fine. Post cycle therapy has its own section dedicated to it on this site. But my first warning is that some of the stuff you take during post cycle therapy is just as hard to get as illegal gear, unlike the designers which are legal and easy to buy.

If I were you I would start with just a test booster and see how you like it. The natural progression should be IMO:

1. Weight lifting and taking basic supplements like creatine, NO, BCAA's. This way you build base muscle and learn good form. You also learn about proper nutrition, sleep, and how your body feels when its gaining weight and strength. This is where you get your DIET IN CHECK!
2. You hit a plateau as we all do. You change your diet around. You up the calories, you up the protein, you up the carbs. You may try a pre-workout energy booster. Other basic things until you realize that nothing you are doing has helped.
3. You reasearch testosterone boosters. There are a thousand of them out there. Some are much more recommended then others. You learn about thier side effects (which arent that much), how to take them, and you read others logs of how they felt on them. They are pretty mild and could help you break through the tough spot. If they do then great, back to step one, until your next plateau.
4. When test boosters haven't helped, or maybe you are at your 2nd or 3rd plateau you cant start looking into PH's. If you don't need PH's because you can break your plateau natural ways, then that is your best bet. PH's need alot of research done on them before you cycle one. Some are milder then others, but even the mild ones have caused some people issues (luckily not me). You need to research support supps, and PCT. Some designer labs have created total liver killer PH's. They mix methyls which isn't recommeneded, some have upwards of 3 methyls mixed.

This is a very broad path but you will get the idea.

 

[Royalstime]

They are methlyated oral designer steriods. Basically which is why they work unlike any of the other crap you can buy at GNC or so. They can give you terrible side effects post cycle. They can give you side effects during cycle. If you know how to use support supplements prior to going on cycle with them, and when done using proper post cycle therapy, then you would be fine. Post cycle therapy has its own section dedicated to it on this site. But my first warning is that some of the stuff you take during post cycle therapy is just as hard to get as illegal gear, unlike the designers which are legal and easy to buy.

If I were you I would start with just a test booster and see how you like it. The natural progression should be IMO:

1. Weight lifting and taking basic supplements like creatine, NO, BCAA's. This way you build base muscle and learn good form. You also learn about proper nutrition, sleep, and how your body feels when its gaining weight and strength. This is where you get your DIET IN CHECK!
2. You hit a plateau as we all do. You change your diet around. You up the calories, you up the protein, you up the carbs. You may try a pre-workout energy booster. Other basic things until you realize that nothing you are doing has helped.
3. You reasearch testosterone boosters. There are a thousand of them out there. Some are much more recommended then others. You learn about thier side effects (which arent that much), how to take them, and you read others logs of how they felt on them. They are pretty mild and could help you break through the tough spot. If they do then great, back to step one, until your next plateau.
4. When test boosters haven't helped, or maybe you are at your 2nd or 3rd plateau you cant start looking into PH's. If you don't need PH's because you can break your plateau natural ways, then that is your best bet. PH's need alot of research done on them before you cycle one. Some are milder then others, but even the mild ones have caused some people issues (luckily not me). You need to research support supps, and PCT. Some designer labs have created total liver killer PH's. They mix methyls which isn't recommeneded, some have upwards of 3 methyls mixed.

This is a very broad path but you will get the idea.

thanks alot for the great advice, very simple to follow, if they are like AAS y are they legal this is, hopfully i dont annoy anyone with my frequent questions. just looking to gain more mass and fill out a xl t-shirt:439:

 

[gamer2be08]

I disagree to an extent with the whole steroid/genetic potential situation.. Most people dont plan on being pro bb's, and most people dont plan on cycling 2 times per year, every year to maintain the new mass past their genetic potential and add on to that. Some people cant gain as well or near as fast as say mesoInsertNameHere even when diet and training are in check. If they have enough knowledge, why shouldnt they be allowed to use AAS? I understand the 140lb 6 footers situation and thats not what im talking about..

 

[CaponeCEO]

thanks alot for the great advice, very simple to follow, if they are like AAS y are they legal this is, hopfully i dont annoy anyone with my frequent questions. just looking to gain more mass and fill out a xl t-shirt:439:

Honestly. I would wager to bet that you could do that without test boosters or even a PH. I bet if you posted your diet we could get your set in the right direction. Be educated before you worry about filling up that t-shirt. They are legal because they are "designer" oral "supplements". However the FDA has been on a rampge to get rid of them lately. Which sucks for all of us who are responsible users.

 

[Royalstime]

I disagree to an extent with the whole steroid/genetic potential situation.. Most people dont plan on being pro bb's, and most people dont plan on cycling 2 times per year, every year to maintain the new mass past their genetic potential and add on to that. Some people cant gain as well or near as fast as say mesoInsertNameHere even when diet and training are in check. If they have enough knowledge, why shouldnt they be allowed to use AAS? I understand the 140lb 6 footers situation and thats not what im talking about..

^^^ there allowed to use it, but i understand what your saying anyone want to explain??

 

[CaponeCEO]

I disagree to an extent with the whole steroid/genetic potential situation.. Most people dont plan on being pro bb's, and most people dont plan on cycling 2 times per year, every year to maintain the new mass past their genetic potential and add on to that. Some people cant gain as well or near as fast as say mesoInsertNameHere even when diet and training are in check. If they have enough knowledge, why shouldnt they be allowed to use AAS? I understand the 140lb 6 footers situation and thats not what im talking about..

I'm not sure what you are asking or stating here. If anyone does their homework and wants to take something then so be it. It's the uneducated ones that ruin a good thing for the rest of us. Like that jerk-off in Atlanta who took Havoc for 13 months, at super high doses, and went into liver failure.

 

[BurghHardcore]

I'd love to see your diet as well. There are a ton of different training styles out there to look into as well. The thing is dude...it's very unlikely you have reached your full genetic potential. I'm sure there are still plenty of ways to shock your muscles into a good amount of further growth.

 

[Royalstime]

thats true, i only eat good quality foods, im Jamaican so i eat lots of Jamaican food daliy its always different. i see alot of the diet plans here that i can follow, however, i think what im eatting so far is fine. every thing in those diets are in what i eat plus some. the worst thing to enter my mouth is fried chicken. i eat 5 times a day and drink my protein and such, only thing is i cant the calories of the food i eat. Anyway i plan just to eat more than i regularly do.

 

[Royalstime]

signs that you shouldn't use ph's:

-you do not use periods when typing.
-you spell the word "know" like this: "knoe"
-you spell the word "why" like this: "y"
-you misuse "to" and "too"

I'm just getting started....

man more grammar stuff? i cleaned it up now so people on the site can understand me. not like you didnt understand what i meant, WHY be a d*ck about it? making it seem like i can't use the words right or spell them, man people these days. its never just "can you type so we understand you?" nope, no ones nice anymore, i cant use PH's b/c the way i type. i do it so i can type faster than writing everything out, you ever thought of that?
bet you want me to put capitals at the beginning of sentences TOO.

 

[CaponeCEO]

thats true, i only eat good quality foods, im Jamaican so i eat lots of Jamaican food daliy its always different. i see alot of the diet plans here that i can follow, however, i think what im eatting so far is fine. every thing in those diets are in what i eat plus some. the worst thing to enter my mouth is fried chicken. i eat 5 times a day and drink my protein and such, only thing is i cant the calories of the food i eat. Anyway i plan just to eat more than i regularly do.

There is a problem right there. No structured diet consistency. This game is sometimes painful with the food you have to consume on a daily basis and consistency is a big help. You need to be able to count your calories, carbs, and protein. Eating some Jamaican food is tasty but hard to see its values.

And another thing. Stop getting mad when people talk about your text message spelling. Laugh with them. That text lingo is pretty cheesy and you know it.

 

[ax1]

thats uncalled for ur basicly saying im stupid. im doing pretty damn good in school so i knoe i can read and right, u knoe that im on the net asking questions, so im goin to type different than writing an essay. no need to come and be a d*ck about sh*t, no asked u to come here thanks for the advice tho, make sence. next time, remember ur on the net and were not writing essys, funny thing is ur the only one that brought up grammar instead of just helping somone out....tisk tisk

im so happy for you now................

 

[R1balla]

im so happy for you now................

hey, i would much rather have bush in there than obama. he promised change, well we got change! in the wrong direction though

 

[CaponeCEO]

hey, i would much rather have bush in there than obama. he promised change, well we got change! in the wrong direction though

We will finally all be equal when we are all broke. Then all of our income can go directly to the government and they can give the same amounts to each of us. Welfare abusers are already ahead of the game. The savior.

 

[ax1]

hey, i would much rather have bush in there than obama. he promised change, well we got change! in the wrong direction though

omg your acting like i support obama cause i make fun of bush.

you are deceived my friend, stop listening to what obama is telling people what he wants to do.

obama is george bush's 3rd term, please stop paying to this change nonsense, its all a distortion and a distraction. if you pay attention to what he does and not what he says you will see he is just a continuity of bush's last 2 terms. its as if bush never even left.

they are both pieces of crap.

look into it and you will see, and if you look for mainstream media to feed you info, you will continue to be deceived by these corporate monsters.

 

[andrew732]

Wait till you are no longer vital aka old, then touch these garbage phs.