Creatine Monohydrate... whats the optimal amount to take?

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    Creatine Monohydrate... whats the optimal amount to take?


    I purchased mono in bulk.. And I'm looking to put on as much mass as possible with it. What's the best way to take, how much and when each day?

    I was told just to take 5g post workout. But I was guessing that's probably not how much I should take for optimal results.

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    I would go 5 grams pre, and 5 grams post workout. For gaining mass specifically I would not depend solely on Creatine, and add in some bcaa's to the mix, maybe 20 grams post workout. Personally I cant do that pre cause it makes my stomach feel weird.
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    Creatine isn't a "mass gainer".
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    Nope it isnt one. Diet needs to come into play.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    Creatine isn't a "mass gainer".
    Well I know diet comes into play, which I have. And I also know its going to bring water retention which in turn is going to make me heavier :P
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeInCanada View Post
    Well I know diet comes into play, which I have. And I also know its going to bring water retention which in turn is going to make me heavier :P
    I think you have the wrong idea about what creatine actually does.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeInCanada View Post
    I purchased mono in bulk.. And I'm looking to put on as much mass as possible with it. What's the best way to take, how much and when each day?

    I was told just to take 5g post workout. But I was guessing that's probably not how much I should take for optimal results.
    Actually, (especially if you preload creatine) blood serum levels will eventually be topped out and 5-10grams per day or even every other day in some cases will be sufficient.
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    Creatine isn't stored in blood plasma. In any event, when creatine is initially consumed free floating in plasma it must be taken up by a muscle fiber before it can be used. Typically, creatine stores maintain a net saturation level ~97% at rest. Therefore, it would be oxidized and excreted.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    Creatine isn't stored in blood plasma. In any event, when creatine is initially consumed free floating in plasma it must be taken up by a muscle fiber before it can be used. Typically, creatine stores maintain a net saturation level ~97% at rest. Therefore, it would be oxidized and excreted.
    I was refering to saturation brother and consuming a "maintenance" dose . But yep, there are many ways to supplement with creatine. The best thing to do would be to search for some solid advice and then experiment and see what works best for you
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    Quote Originally Posted by juice3320 View Post
    I was refering to saturation brother and consuming a "maintenance" dose . But yep, there are many ways to supplement with creatine. The best thing to do would be to search for some solid advice and then experiment and see what works best for you
    right on.
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    is it possible to oversaturate your body with it and then start becoming insensitive to it? i havnt really read up on creatine in a while but that was an old theory floating around, receptors downregulate or something. and i also heard 3g CEE was enough but i took a break and started w/5g... endurance is insane.
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    Quick question.

    Can creatine be bad for your liver?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeInCanada View Post
    Quick question.

    Can creatine be bad for your liver?
    i think if anything it would have more impact on your kidneys if you didnt take in enough water
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeInCanada View Post
    Quick question.

    Can creatine be bad for your liver?
    Only if you SEVERELY abuse it. Just stick to a good protocol and you will be fine.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeInCanada View Post
    I purchased mono in bulk.. And I'm looking to put on as much mass as possible with it. What's the best way to take, how much and when each day?

    I was told just to take 5g post workout. But I was guessing that's probably not how much I should take for optimal results.
    back in the day when creatine was first making an impact in the supplement industry, most all of the supplement companies placed labels on the containers stating an individual needed to "load" for 5 days then go on maintenance thereafter. i cannot recall what the load suggestion was but it was and still is ridiculous since your body cannot absorb all the creatine ingested.

    back around 1998 some articles were written showing studies on athletes who loaded vs. those who did not as well as determining optimal daily dosage.

    it turned out that loading provided no additional benefit. most of it was excreted during urination and put strain on the kidneys since it can dehydrate you. optimal dosages showed to be somewhere around 5 or 6 or so grams per day and divided throughout the day, i.e. 2 grams per dose 3 times per day spaced out in something like 4 or 5 hour intervals.

    i'm only speaking from memory here but that summarizes the articles i read. i began taking betagen (or just made my own version, creatine/hmb/l-glutamine/taurine) which provides 6 grams per day with no loading and i always had noticeable and undeniable results. i typically gained between 5 to 10 pounds within a month cycle and all my lifts improved fairly significantly.

    i never stayed on creatine or betagen for more than 4 to 6 weeks at a time with long breaks in between.

    that is my own personal experience, i am sure everyone reacts differently but i do believe consuming in excess of 5 or 6 grams provides the user no greater benefit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cirroc View Post
    back in the day when creatine was first making an impact in the supplement industry, most all of the supplement companies placed labels on the containers stating an individual needed to "load" for 5 days then go on maintenance thereafter. i cannot recall what the load suggestion was but it was and still is ridiculous since your body cannot absorb all the creatine ingested.

    back around 1998 some articles were written showing studies on athletes who loaded vs. those who did not as well as determining optimal daily dosage.

    it turned out that loading provided no additional benefit. most of it was excreted during urination and put strain on the kidneys since it can dehydrate you. optimal dosages showed to be somewhere around 5 or 6 or so grams per day and divided throughout the day, i.e. 2 grams per dose 3 times per day spaced out in something like 4 or 5 hour intervals.

    i'm only speaking from memory here but that summarizes the articles i read. i began taking betagen (or just made my own version, creatine/hmb/l-glutamine/taurine) which provides 6 grams per day with no loading and i always had noticeable and undeniable results. i typically gained between 5 to 10 pounds within a month cycle and all my lifts improved fairly significantly.

    i never stayed on creatine or betagen for more than 4 to 6 weeks at a time with long breaks in between.

    that is my own personal experience, i am sure everyone reacts differently but i do believe consuming in excess of 5 or 6 grams provides the user no greater benefit.
    i never heard of hmb before last night, where i saw it on some obscure supplement site and then just googled it. i take it that its worth trying? nice gains tho for sure, i want to try it hmmmm
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    i never heard of hmb before last night, where i saw it on some obscure supplement site and then just googled it. i take it that its worth trying? nice gains tho for sure, i want to try it hmmmm
    hmb has been around for a while. i believe it is mostly intended to be an anticatabolic which in theory should improve recovery times and ultimately assist in increasing the overall workload.

    i used to hear people say it was just a load of crap and was nothing more than a placebo. last time i googled it i came across a study from Oklahoma State University, iirc, and according to at least that study it did in fact act as an anticatabolic supplement.

    like i said earlier, my own personal experience with the betagen product was positive and i always felt the hmb was a key ingredient. i definitely noticed improved recovery while using the product as well as strength and weight gains. when i took it tho, i took it without taking any other supps.
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    IMO and experience of taking creatine regularly since it was first on the market, anything more than 5 grms dly is a waste. Ideally, 2-3 grms dly combined with glutamine and whey will give optimal muscle volume. It works best when cycled, after I finish a jar, take a break for a week or two. Your diet will also play a big factor in how it works. JMO
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    I've been using AN's NeoVar Creatine Product. I take it in 2 doses during the day, each with carbs. My post workout dosage is taken with a protein shake make with Orange juice and banana slices. Are the simple carbs in the juice and fruit good to take creatine with?
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    You can get away with taking about 5-10g at the start which does have some benefits through empirical studies and dropping to a 2g/d dose to maintain after that. Thats coming from the NSCA though, so its more focused on performance than bodybuilding
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    yeah people cant really decide if creatine is better pre or post workout
    you should probably take 5 grams pre workout and a coulple grams post workout just to be safe. dont worry to much about you liver, eating too much sugar and fat is way worse for you liver then creatine.
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    I personnaly stick to the 5g pre and 5g post. It's not enough to hurt my kidneys or liver and it ensures I am getting all the benefits. If a little is wasted - oh well. It is the cheapest product I take. I am sure I am wasting a lot more money on trying out other products that have little to no effect.

    But since the correct dosage has been debated for many more years that I have been taking it... I don't think anyone can provide you an exact dosing amount. Some guys at the gym take 20g a day.... which I would never do and think a lot of that is watsed... but that is their preference.
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    Taking creatine within 1 hour before workout will hinder performance. Sodium ions contained in the creatine will draw water from skeletal muscles to digestive viscera.
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    Quote Originally Posted by juice3320 View Post
    Only if you SEVERELY abuse it. Just stick to a good protocol and you will be fine.
    In no way could creatine ever be bad for your liver and kidneys even if you took 30+ grams per day.... Creatine, the bi-product of creatine is not even toxic and will just come out of your urine...
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    Quote Originally Posted by cirroc View Post
    back in the day when creatine was first making an impact in the supplement industry, most all of the supplement companies placed labels on the containers stating an individual needed to "load" for 5 days then go on maintenance thereafter. i cannot recall what the load suggestion was but it was and still is ridiculous since your body cannot absorb all the creatine ingested.

    back around 1998 some articles were written showing studies on athletes who loaded vs. those who did not as well as determining optimal daily dosage.

    it turned out that loading provided no additional benefit. most of it was excreted during urination and put strain on the kidneys since it can dehydrate you. optimal dosages showed to be somewhere around 5 or 6 or so grams per day and divided throughout the day, i.e. 2 grams per dose 3 times per day spaced out in something like 4 or 5 hour intervals.

    i'm only speaking from memory here but that summarizes the articles i read. i began taking betagen (or just made my own version, creatine/hmb/l-glutamine/taurine) which provides 6 grams per day with no loading and i always had noticeable and undeniable results. i typically gained between 5 to 10 pounds within a month cycle and all my lifts improved fairly significantly.

    i never stayed on creatine or betagen for more than 4 to 6 weeks at a time with long breaks in between.

    that is my own personal experience, i am sure everyone reacts differently but i do believe consuming in excess of 5 or 6 grams provides the user no greater benefit.
    Loading is not necessary protocol. There has been studies of those who went through the loading process and others who only took about 5 grams a day. The only difference was the time it took for your muscles to saturate. In the long run there would be no difference and if anything you would save your self time and money by not loading all the creatine in a 4-5 day period. As it has already been mentioned, most of the creatine will eventually come out in your urine.

    BTW good advise.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    Taking creatine within 1 hour before workout will hinder performance. Sodium ions contained in the creatine will draw water from skeletal muscles to digestive viscera.


    Is there enough sodium in 5g of creatine monohydrate to do this? What about a pre-workout shake with whey protein? Protein powders usually have a couple hundred mg of sodium per scoop. What about eating a meal within one hour of working out? What's the effect of the sodium contained in the food? What about the water needed for digestion of the food?

    My anecdotal real world experience is that I have slightly better performance when using creatine pre-workout. Nothing earth shattering, but an extra rep here and there, and I don't fade as much toward the end of the workout. *shrug*

    I usually use 3g of CEE pre-workout and 5g CM in my post-workout shake. Works well enough for me.
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    I bought some recently and I've taken it a few times but it makes me feel really weird. I feel very queasy after taking it. Just thinking about taking it makes me queasy now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PR2525 View Post
    I bought some recently and I've taken it a few times but it makes me feel really weird. I feel very queasy after taking it. Just thinking about taking it makes me queasy now.
    I remember taking Phospagen HP and doing a loading phase several years back. Worked good, but I had the trots for several days....
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    Quote Originally Posted by deadsheepmill View Post
    Is there enough sodium in 5g of creatine monohydrate to do this? What about a pre-workout shake with whey protein? Protein powders usually have a couple hundred mg of sodium per scoop. What about eating a meal within one hour of working out? What's the effect of the sodium contained in the food? What about the water needed for digestion of the food?

    My anecdotal real world experience is that I have slightly better performance when using creatine pre-workout. Nothing earth shattering, but an extra rep here and there, and I don't fade as much toward the end of the workout. *shrug*

    I usually use 3g of CEE pre-workout and 5g CM in my post-workout shake. Works well enough for me.
    Yes, it would. It's best to consume your meal 1.5+ hours before workout for optimal performance. If you feel sluggish during your workout try a sports drink during (not chugging it either), nothing else besides water. Eating a meal less than an hour before workout augments blood flow to digestive viscera instead of active skeletal muscles.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    Yes, it would. It's best to consume your meal 1.5+ hours before workout for optimal performance. If you feel sluggish during your workout try a sports drink during (not chugging it either), nothing else besides water. Eating a meal less than an hour before workout augments blood flow to digestive viscera instead of active skeletal muscles.
    Im gonna have to say most of my best lifts come after I have eaten a meal, within an hour. I guess it all depends on the person.
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    I've used CM a few times in the past-5 gms pre, 5 gms post w/o-and had steady solid results from it. But back then i used it while carrying a little extra weight so i couldn't really tell if i had any water retention or not. Anyone have a water retention-free experiance from CM? I've listen to some folks talk on how they never bloated from it, and i've read in a few threads back in the day that this was indeed the case with some.

    Mad lean right now, and just finished up a 8 wk h-drol/fura run...wanted to STAY looking lean obviously, that's y i'm asking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    Yes, it would. It's best to consume your meal 1.5+ hours before workout for optimal performance. If you feel sluggish during your workout try a sports drink during (not chugging it either), nothing else besides water. Eating a meal less than an hour before workout augments blood flow to digestive viscera instead of active skeletal muscles.
    I'm going to disagree. As soon as training starts the body will divert blood flood to the muscles. They will get priority. Performance will not decrease as a result of blood being needed for digestion. During long powerlifting meets meals are essential and it is impossible to give yourself 1.5+ hours to digest food. Most athletes do a lot better running on full than on empty. Another good example are cyclists that can and MUST eat during long races. And I'm talkin real food not silly gu packs.
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    yea, eating right before upper body gets me less fatigued, lower body i sometimes want to puke if its too soon. i might split up my creatine dose through the day, seems like it may help
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamer2be08 View Post
    Im gonna have to say most of my best lifts come after I have eaten a meal, within an hour. I guess it all depends on the person.
    Depends on the size of the meal relative to the metabolic response of the individual.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bench Champ View Post
    I'm going to disagree. As soon as training starts the body will divert blood flood to the muscles. They will get priority. Performance will not decrease as a result of blood being needed for digestion. During long powerlifting meets meals are essential and it is impossible to give yourself 1.5+ hours to digest food. Most athletes do a lot better running on full than on empty. Another good example are cyclists that can and MUST eat during long races. And I'm talkin real food not silly gu packs.
    First off, your body will never augment 100% blood flow even during a post absorptive state. If you consume a meal, your body will not augment its fullest potential (blood will be taken away from digestive viscera, but not completely). One and half hours is far from being empty. Blood glucose levels, muscle/liver glycogen stores, creatine stores are optimal during this time. Cyclist consume sports drinks during races.

    Disagree all you want, this is basic exercise physiology.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    First off, your body will never augment 100% blood flow even during a post absorptive state. If you consume a meal, your body will not augment its fullest potential (blood will be taken away from digestive viscera, but not completely). One and half hours is far from being empty. Blood glucose levels, muscle/liver glycogen stores, creatine stores are optimal during this time. Cyclist consume sports drinks during races.

    Disagree all you want, this is basic exercise physiology.


    if i start practicing the philosophy of eating no less than 90 minutes prior to training, what kind of cumulative fitness gains am i going to see?

    your post encompasses a supplementation of 2g/8hrs. this approach doesn't require a pre-workout dose... i personally have seen great results doing this which has always led me to believe there is no "real" benefit to taking it before you lift. mostly just as long as i was taking it in small doses throughout the day i was good-to-go.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cirroc View Post
    if i start practicing the philosophy of eating no less than 90 minutes prior to training, what kind of cumulative fitness gains am i going to see?

    your post encompasses a supplementation of 2g/8hrs. this approach doesn't require a pre-workout dose... i personally have seen great results doing this which has always led me to believe there is no "real" benefit to taking it before you lift. mostly just as long as i was taking it in small doses throughout the day i was good-to-go.
    I've never stated a quantitative measure for consumption, whether its creatine or macro nutrients. Apparently you missed the "~" before 1.5hr. There are many factors involved, this is a solid estimate though. This time period isn't just about nutrient supplementation for energy expenditure, it also concerns hormone regulation as well.

    Do whatever you like. You're not paying me for my knowledge and seem unappreciative, so you can figure the rest out on your own.
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    Quote Originally Posted by russy_russ View Post
    I've never stated a quantitative measure for consumption, whether its creatine or macro nutrients. Apparently you missed the "~" before 1.5hr. There are many factors involved, this is a solid estimate though. This time period isn't just about nutrient supplementation for energy expenditure, it also concerns hormone regulation as well.

    Do whatever you like. You're not paying me for my knowledge and seem unappreciative, so you can figure the rest out on your own.

    relax doctor russ, i wasn't disagreeing with you. first i asked what the cumulative effect would be if i were diligent about timing my meals relative to training sessions and second, earlier posts i made here discussed evenly spaced small doses of creatine throughout the day, not using it as pre-workout and still seeing positive results.

    if you cannot or do not want to provide answers to the benefits of your statements then don't post or don't whine about it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cirroc View Post
    relax doctor russ, i wasn't disagreeing with you. first i asked what the cumulative effect would be if i were diligent about timing my meals relative to training sessions and second, earlier posts i made here discussed evenly spaced small doses of creatine throughout the day, not using it as pre-workout and still seeing positive results.

    if you cannot or do not want to provide answers to the benefits of your statements then don't post or don't whine about it.
    I always answer questions about what I claim with the exception when some are arrogant and ungrateful for the advice. If that was not your intent, I apologize. Anyways, benefits to be gained are acute in nature (energetic systems-a bit more efficient, hormones-insulin decrease with increase in epinephrine). You're not going to see performance differences as seen with anabolic/androgenic steroids.
  

  
 

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