Love Hate With LG Sciences wtf
12-25-2009 02:03 PM
Im not sure how to answer the OP questions but all i can say is ive used a few of their products which seemed very good to me..
their MMV2 was the best product i ever tried of them but their new mmv3 is good but not as good as the old formula anyway Lg sciences are a great company and cant wait for their future products.
12-25-2009 02:05 PM
i love their stuff, thanks guys
12-25-2009 02:34 PM
I couldn't gather quite all of the questions at once, but I'll address this the best way I can. If anyone has specific questions, it would really help me out if you put them in an easily readable format.
First off, there are many reasons why we have done the reformulations on our hormonal lines, specifically that of M1D and MMv3. We at LG Sciences take it upon ourselves to assure not only high quality product, but LEGAL products, and by that, I don't mean gray-area synthetic drugs that a lot of other companies put on the shelves, only to cause issues with the FDA and DEA, and further harm the supplement industry. - Most of the reformulations that have taken place have happened to stay compliant with FDA and DSHEA regulations.
With M1D, many see the DHEA derivative and automatically think this is an overpriced DHEA proudct, which is not at all the case. The other ingredients in the product assure that the hormone itself has a high conversion to testosterone, as well as a high absorption rate. I don't have the paperwork with me, so I can't post it up, but just take a look at some of the logs on this site (I believe most all are unsponsored) that include M1D and MMv2/3. - M1D IS 5-alpha reduced, which results in a MUCH more potent androgen (this is not the case in nandro derivatives). Taken from Seth Roberts' book Anabolic Pharmacology...
"An interesting side effect of 5-alpha reductase inhibition is an increase in testosterone production due to a decrease in androgenic feedback at the hypothalamus. Also, less testosterone is "broken down" to DHT; therefore, more remains in circulation." - This is not the main purpose of M1D or the MOA, but interesting nevertheless.
With MMv3, the hormone was changed, once again as a compliance issue. I WOULD agree with most of the public that MMv2 was probably a more enjoyable compound, but neither MMv2 or MMv3 are lacking in what they offer.
T911, as I said, the AI was switched from an androsterone to a 7,8-benz derivative. While the psychological effects are not as powerful, the AI itself is more productive at increasing testosterone levels, which is the main aim of the product. I personally get the same increase in strength and LBM while taking the new one as I did the old. I'm on it now and continue to use it off and on. It's one of my all time favorite products not only from LG Sciences, but in the entire supplement industry.
ALL of our hormonal products contain ingredients found naturally, which is a necessity to produce a legal product. Many of the hormones that are out, and even AIs for that matter (6-bromo for example) are completely synthetic, making them already illegal, hence the "gray-area" issue. - Our hormones are completely legal and compliant, but don't take this to mean that they are lacking in performance or results.
I've never tried NO Infuse, but I hear it takes a hefty dose to do the trick. I know a site that sells it for real cheap that some people get it at and love it, but ya, if it's expensive where you get it, it wouldn't make sense for you to buy it, considering the dose needs to be higher.
If you're looking for a pump-product, I'd suggest our new Anadraulic Pump. Great pump product and priced very competitively. - Additionally, Anadraulic State GT will be coming out soon, which I'm VERY excited about.
We nowhere state that a 12 week cycle is normal or recommended, but 8 weeks is perfectly safe, and I personally see no problem hitting the 12 week range, although results may diminish somewhat after 8 weeks, so I still recommend the 8 weeks for ample time. None of our hormones are methylated or harsh on the liver. I understand that one does not mean the other, but in this case, it holds true.
You've continued to state your hatred for T911 in various threads. I'm sorry it didn't work for you. I don't know what to say other than don't buy it again. There are plenty of products that I've used that people love, yet have done nothing for me. I don't continue to go in threads and bash the product.
It's very possible that with your receptors not being quite fresh, you wouldn't respond nearly as well to the old T911 as you did the new. I'm just speculating. You're a stand-up guy and I trust your feedback, so I know you're not just bashing the product. - Maybe Formadrol is more up your alley? - I know you like TestoPRO, and when I stacked it with Formadrol during that log, the results were incredible. I know you're on TRT, correct? - If so, I'd believe the only effects you'd really be getting from T911 in the first place are increase psychological effects and some estrogen reduction. It works far better when not used in conjunction with another hormone, especially a hefty dose of Test Cyp.
12-25-2009 04:10 PM
The recommended dose for M1D is 4 to 6 caps/day, and I definitely recommend the upper amount of 6 caps for ample results, although past this point is not at all necessary.
Originally Posted by Mrhandyman
We list the possible sides so everyone knows what IS POSSIBLE, but the reported sides of M1D are all extremely mild from what I've seen. Rarely do I see anyone report anything other than maybe some acne or increased aggression, the ladder usually being reported as something positive.
Give me a rundown of your previous cycle history, your time spent training, your diet, your goals, and your weight/height. I'll set things up for you the best I can.
As for the warning, again, just something precautionary. Don't let your wife down a bottle of M1D. You should be fine.
12-25-2009 05:03 PM
ic, thanks for the kind words. the t911 i used was beta, i never bought any of it because it was gnc exclusive and i boycott gnc. when i finally did buy t911 the formula had been changed. imho, the beta must have been stronger than what was released because my results were truly incredible. i went back and reread my log, i said that results were on par with a mild ph- and it was noticable after first dose. btw this was well before trt.
12-25-2009 05:39 PM
Running with the Big Boys
i really love the OG t911 it was great as for the new version im not sure ive only used the old stuff.
Athletic Xtreme Team REP
AXHOLE BY NATURE
12-25-2009 06:02 PM
Is METHYL 1-D even methlyated?
12-25-2009 06:10 PM
Originally Posted by liftin4fun
12-26-2009 09:54 AM
I have sent you a PM you with my history. I would like to increase my test levels naturally and not sure if M1D is right path for me. I do need to know all the possible sides, that is important for me, acne and aggression is not a problem . that warning made me think it was for both male and female. can I avoid any potential sides by taking a very small dose instead, like 1 cap for a certain period or cycle, and would that prove to be more beneficial than taking some natural test boosters or gh stack of some sort?
12-26-2009 11:07 AM
I haven't gotten your PM, but this is my recommendation...
Originally Posted by Mrhandyman
If you simply want to increase Test levels, I say forget the M1D and go with a stack of Formadrol Extreme/T911. I would recommend running the Formadrol @ 3caps/day (1 AM, 2 PM), and one tablet of T911 prior to training. - Now, 3 caps of Formadrol will last 30 days, so when you run out of the Formadrol, bump the T911 to 2 tablets/day.
If you want, you can run an herbal test booster with the stack. It wouldn't be necessary, but it's always a nice addition. The herbals I've had good results with are...
Anabolic Innovations TestoPRO
Controlled Labs Blue UP
DS Activate Xtreme
As I said, the stack works great by itself, but hey, if the money is there, why not add an herbal for some extra synergism?
Let me know if I didn't answer any questions.
12-26-2009 12:35 PM
Thanks, the PM is now sent =>
I already got the MD1, why do you recommend the others instead, are they more appropriate for increasing test levels and so what is MD1 generally good for?
I do worry on the risks since they seem to be similar to steroids so I hear, which is why I wonder if taking such a small dose would not harm at all and then cycle with softer post cycle (of an GH stack that is 100% natural, or all herbal as you say). just wonder if there would be much point taking the small dosage of the MD1 prohormone if the GH stack will yield the similar results? Thanks again, for the help.
12-30-2009 10:08 AM
12-30-2009 10:59 AM
Doing some traveling today. Give me a day or so and I'll get back to you, possibly tonight.
Originally Posted by Mrhandyman
12-30-2009 12:39 PM
Originally Posted by Irish Cannon
i'm thinking you are mixing up m1d with mmv2 possibly. Methyl 1 d is not a derrivative of dhea. it is dhea. I have nothing against lg. I've yet to use their products. they work, and are for a specific crowd of ph users.
but as the nomenclature states, it is just dhea.
and when test gets 5 a reduced, it becomes dht. so if as in mmv2 you do this, you get a conversion into dht. which this could be, but the nomenclature looks to also be dhea, with the intentions of a possible conversion into the more adrogenic dht.
it is known that these products contain dhea, all of them in the trifecta stack, whether is be the 3a, or 3b.
dhea converts to numerous hormones, and can be written in about 20 different ways, the nomenclature itself is meaningless, as it isn't a true makeup of the hormone itself. you can take something out of it to make it appear as something more, and it will still be dhea, but still have the possibility to convert into that hormone (if it's naturally occuring in the body) so any claim is not falseified.
dhea has so many pathways, if i was to list them all, it would make this post super long, and not worth reading.
the point is, these products contain dhea among other key ingredients that may add or take away from the potency of the product, depending on you.
if you are looking for a safe pro hormone that will cause minimal side effects when taken as the instructions indicate, then these products will most likely be for you.
but one should be aware, that they will not cause steroid like gains for a majority, and this is why there are minimal side effects.
if you wish to delve into the world of anabolic hormones for those results, much time, and research is needed to prevent oneself from becoming a statistic with man boobs.
more gains, more sides, you cant have one without the other, thats life.
if one spends the time researching like one should do, a thread like this wouldn't even have to be made, then one could decide if this is a product for them. if you want steroids, look elsewhere, it isn't with l.g.
12-31-2009 05:51 PM
Good info pal, appreciate that. i'm looking for one that has minimal side effects, what are the possible minimal side effects of a pro hormone like from the ingredients I listed below?
so I take it that this is a soft pro hormone and the gains are much like taking a natural test booster such as animal stack, both would have no sides if followed by instructon, no?
I'm totally confused what this product is now to be honest Ha-ha is it a natural test booster that is DHT estrogen blocker labelled as a prohormone or is it a prohormone, so there won't be chances of man boobs as that's associated with steroids and so the only sides are possibly on women with the warning as mentioned in the earlier post and for men it would be increased sexual drive and maybe slight increase in blood pressure, no?
the only sides I wish for are physique gains Ha-ha close enough to steroids minus any sort of sides at all, surely that is possible with an intake of an anaboloc testosterone product like in the following ingredients from lg:
12-31-2009 06:08 PM
are you suggesting that prohormones dont cause gyno?
Originally Posted by Mrhandyman
Prohormones are pretty closely related to steroids.
maybe I misread what you wrote but it seems you are confused as to what prohormones are.
Prohormones are called precursors. What this means is that they are substances that are converted to hormones when they enter the body. These hormones, particularly testosterone, then participate in protein synthesis in the body, which helps grow muscles and other tissues. Additionally, when prohormones convert to testosterone they also help promote male characteristics and increases in strength. Prohormones don’t generally give as drastic results as people who use steroids normally see
Additionally, there are some safety concerns with prohormones as there are with steroids. Since prohormones convert to testosterone in the body they can cause similar side effects including acne, balding and gynecomastia.
And to the last paragraph..What is going to give physical gains without a side effect and not a herbal test booster.. umm not sure a product exist cuz even the test booster is gonna come with the possibilty of side effects Anything else that is going to work is gonna have some sort of sides and rule of thumb is the better it works the harsher the sides.
Quinon Proficit Deficit
"Science literacy is a vaccine against the charlatans of the world that would exploit your ignorance." - Neil deGrasse Tyson
12-31-2009 07:17 PM
Here's a rundown on what M1D has to offer, and a little on how it works...
Originally Posted by Mrhandyman
- The heavy lifter in these kinds of products. This is what is converted to testosterone.
- A steroidal skeleton aromatase inhibitor. Aromatase is the nasty enzyme that converts the parent compound to estrogen.
- An 11-Hydroxylase inhibitor. Blocking 11-hydroxylase is why the stuff you can no longer get puts instant size on you.
Luteolin - This plant based compound binds strongly to block sulfation, which is one main route by which natural testosterone gets excreted from the body.
Ellagic Acid - Shown to block estrogen at the receptor level helps keep side effects down. - Very important to keeping sides minimal.
Zinc Aspartate - Zinc is important for making the androgen receptor accept increased testosterone.
Coleus Forskolin - This is a 3bHSD upregulator that converts more Methyl 1-D into testosterone!
Caprylic Acid - Increases the sensitivity of the androgen receptor
Stinging Nettle - Has a dual function of binding and reducing SHBG, the hormone that locks up extra testosterone. It can also reduce the effects of 5aReductase that causes hairloss.
- Another potent aromatase inhibitor that helps block the conversion of Methyl 1-D to estrogen
01-01-2010 08:35 AM
Originally Posted by Irish Cannon
Thanks for the info, very helpful.
The thing is, you must have another formula or just changed it, TWO ingredients are NOT the same:
Please can you tell me what these two offer and how it works?
The other guy says it's an DHEA?
he names in these two ingredients is similar but the chemical strands can make it a different product, hence why i'm led to think the product you have quoted is an estrogen blocker and the one I have is a prohormone, this is where there's confusion...
and please correct me if i'm wrong as i'm led to think because of the change in those two ingredients makes it a natural test booster and NOT a prohormone, it will naturally build hormones in the body and extend their potency! and therefore, no chances of side effects with that product, so with the two ingredients I quoted what are the sides?
01-01-2010 08:51 AM
To me LG seems a bit over hyped.. no offense but I've seen a lot of mods posting post after post of how they have been using one of the products and it's been working wonders. I cant really judge them though since I haven't tried any of their products but I'm skeptical. Just my opinion.
01-01-2010 09:31 AM
Thanks Josh, your right i'm not so clued up on prohormones, but i'm hearing one product is softer than the other and less chances of sides, are there any reports of sids from prohormones on this foruml?
i've been looking at tribulus terestris, fenugreek for my herbal test boosters aswell,do all possess sides with gains?
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