Neovar question

[msucurt]

I have 2 bottles of Neovar laying around and ready to try it. My only issue is PWO carbs. MY PWO shake consists of the following (which i have really come to like after reading others using same/similar protocol)

2C FF milk
2 scoops isolate
2 Tbsp Natty PB

Obviously, this is more of a protein + fats PWO shake. I dont believe in all the carbs PWO. Since I dont consume lots of carbs, and that is what NEOVAR is for, should I even use NEOVAR or what?

thanks for the suggestions.

 

[jsp0785]

is there any reason for u not to believe in taking carbs after workout?

 

[dg806]

IMO, post Wo, you should have an ample amount of protein and carbs for optimum muscle growth.

 

[msucurt]

Just have read lots of info lately. I have always done the PWO mix of

2scoops whey
50-75g carbs (dextrose or fruit or oats or whatever...tried all)

Ive recently been using whey + fats + milk

Another reason I believe in the PWO regimen of whey + fats or something very similar is this........(by vangut)...

Originally Posted by Hank Vangut
1. fat slows digestion and leads to a more efficient and steady amino absorbtion rate.
whey + carbs will quickly increases anabolism, but these effects are very short lived and shown to be wasteful. although amino acid concentration do increase quickly with whey + carbs, oxidation rates also increased, creating a steady state catabolism in which there is no change in overall protein balance.

2. fats are needed to produce testesterone and other hormones required for muscle building. post-workout, the body is scrambling to keep testosterone levels from dropping too low due to the rise in cortisol levels (the two hormones exist in a see-saw fashion; as one rises the other drops, and vice-a-versa).

3. fat helps maintain consistent and steady insulin levels. increased/spiked insulin output blunts growth hormone release that should naturally be occurring post workout.

4. a recent study compared the effect of whole milk, and a higher dose of fat-free milk (to match the calories of the whole milk) taken 60 minutes post-resistance exercise. whole milk was superior for increasing net protein balance despite the fact that the calorie matched dose of fat free milk contained more protein (14.5g protein, versus 8.0g in the whole milk -an 81% advantage).

the ideal pwo meal in my opinion is a mixture of casein + whey + fat.

is there any reason for u not to believe in taking carbs after workout?

 

[Rosie Chee]

I have 2 bottles of Neovar laying around and ready to try it. My only issue is PWO carbs. MY PWO shake consists of the following (which i have really come to like after reading others using same/similar protocol)

2C FF milk
2 scoops isolate
2 Tbsp Natty PB

Obviously, this is more of a protein + fats PWO shake. I dont believe in all the carbs PWO. Since I dont consume lots of carbs, and that is what NEOVAR is for, should I even use NEOVAR or what?

thanks for the suggestions.

You can still use NeoVar Recomped (it IS, after all, a CREATINE product, and creatine is for RECOVERY). It is however, MORE effective when 'taken' with carbohydrates.

Carbohydrates are important post-exercise to optimise the restoration of liver and muscle glycogen. There is a one-hour window of when recovery is at its most optimal post-exercise, and carbohydrate intake in that window aids in recovery and resynthesis of muscle glycogen stores. The presence of other macronutrients (i.e. protein and fat) do not affect the rate of glycogen storage. Simple carbohydrates are most easily absorbed into the bloodstream, and therefore ideal post-exercise (Burke, 2006).

The consumption of protein post-exercise helps enhance the synthesis of new proteins, as protein intake increases the insulin response, like carbohydrate (Burke, 2006).

Fat takes longer to digest, and therefore contributes little to the recovery process.

If your body is not getting carbohydrates post-exercise, then the liver will undergo gluconeogenesis, using protein to replensish those glycogen stores.

 

[msucurt]

So, what is your optimal PWO shake....

1scoop isolate
1scoop casein
50-75g carbs (oats, vitargo, or fresh fruit...i.e. bananas,etc)

What do you suggest

You can still use NeoVar Recomped (it IS, after all, a CREATINE product, and creatine is for RECOVERY). It is however, MORE effective when 'taken' with carbohydrates.

Carbohydrates are important post-exercise to optimise the restoration of liver and muscle glycogen. There is a one-hour window of when recovery is at its most optimal post-exercise, and carbohydrate intake in that window aids in recovery and resynthesis of muscle glycogen stores. The presence of other macronutrients (i.e. protein and fat) do not affect the rate of glycogen storage. Simple carbohydrates are most easily absorbed into the bloodstream, and therefore ideal post-exercise (Burke, 2006).

The consumption of protein post-exercise helps enhance the synthesis of new proteins, as protein intake increases the insulin response, like carbohydrate (Burke, 2006).

Fat takes longer to digest, and therefore contributes little to the recovery process.

If your body is not getting carbohydrates post-exercise, then the liver will undergo gluconeogenesis, using protein to replensish those glycogen stores.

 

[dg806]

Whey/isolate
Oats
PNButter

This is what I use daily.
Casein should be used before bed.

 

[msucurt]

So basically, you are digesting a shake that is protein + carbs + fats.

When i used oats, I would use roughly 1/2C or so with 2 scoops whey.

I think a PWO shake with the following would serve good...

2scoops isolate
2C milk (skim or fat free)
1/2C oats
2T PB

Whey/isolate
Oats
PNButter

This is what I use daily.
Casein should be used before bed.

 

[Rosie Chee]

So, what is your optimal PWO shake....

1scoop isolate
1scoop casein
50-75g carbs (oats, vitargo, or fresh fruit...i.e. bananas,etc)

What do you suggest

I don't have a post-training shake (if I do, it's because I know that I'm running low on time to eat a decent meal afterwards); I EAT REAL FOOD!

In the past I have used:
* 40g Leppin Pro 4 (mix of whey isolate, whey concentrate, egg albumin, and calcium caseinate, 30g protein in total)
* frozen berries (i.e. blueberries, raspberries, blackberries, etc.)
* fresh fruit (i.e. bananas, etc.)
* yoghurt
* ice/water

If ALL you're going to have is a shake post-training (and I wouldn't recommend this; but have that, and then a proper meal ~30 minutes later), I would recommend having in it:
* 30-40g protein
* 50-60g carbohydrates (predominantly simple sugars, but some complex)

 

[rms80]

great answers!!! basically, when it comes to carbs and recovery- what you take out, you have to put back in, period, or you won't perform as well the next time around, or grow (at least as well), or adapt to training stress.

My post-wo-
5-6 NeoVar
30 grams whey
50-75 grams maltodextrin or WMS
3 grams Fish Oil
multi
anti-ox
10 grams BCAA
8 grams HMB (it really works!!!)

 

[rms80]

....and I love Rosie's fresh fruit idea- blueberries are awesome as far as anti-oxidant properties (one of the healthiest foods on the planet), and so are blackberries and raspberries- they are some of my favorites....

 

[rob561]

great answers!!! basically, when it comes to carbs and recovery- what you take out, you have to put back in, period, or you won't perform as well the next time around, or grow (at least as well), or adapt to training stress.

My post-wo-
5-6 NeoVar
30 grams whey
50-75 grams maltodextrin or WMS
3 grams Fish Oil
multi
anti-ox
10 grams BCAA
8 grams HMB (it really works!!!)

This sounds great for PWO. do you buy bulk HMB? if so where from

 

[rms80]

This sounds great for PWO. do you buy bulk HMB? if so where from

yeah- 25 kg drums, lol not sure if you meant that kinda bulk:donut:

 

[rms80]

j/k think nutra has it.....

 

[dg806]

....and I love Rosie's fresh fruit idea- blueberries are awesome as far as anti-oxidant properties (one of the healthiest foods on the planet), and so are blackberries and raspberries- they are some of my favorites....

I like this too. I usually put bluberries in my shake before bed.

 

[rob561]

j/k think nutra has it.....

25kg. lol. not looking for that much. ill check the planet for some

 

[rms80]

I like this too. I usually put bluberries in my shake before bed.

I put em' in my oatmeal in the AM, shakes, cereal (frozen bb's are really good in soy milk), and I just eat them straight out of a bowl- Bianca (my female bulldog) really likes them as well- she will just sit there and eat them with me....

 

[Brad2131]

just sell me your neovar and forget it

 

[dg806]

Bianca (my female bulldog) really likes them as well- she will just sit there and eat them with me....

Dang and I thought my gf's dog would eat anything.......

 

[rms80]

Dang and I thought my gf's dog would eat anything.......

she really likes fruit for some reason- no clue why- my other dog hates it.....

 

[Outside Backer]

i use kwik carb from nutra for my post workout shake its the only time i take it with my neovar.

the only other time i take neovar is if i put oats in my shakes and grind them up with my magic bullet

waxy maize is great with neovar

 

[rms80]

i use kwik carb from nutra for my post workout shake its the only time i take it with my neovar.

the only other time i take neovar is if i put oats in my shakes and grind them up with my magic bullet

waxy maize is great with neovar

It is- waffles are too I took 6 Neo last night and ate 4 big-ass waffles with syrup, butter, the whole nine- hadn't had them in forever- plus we had no food (wife forgot to go shopping) 20 minutes later- veins popping everywhere- honestly felt like my muscles were going pop through my skin....

 

[Outside Backer]

you know whats also good. adding honey to the POWO mix

i posted some Honey info sometime back on that other board and it made the thread of the month onthe home page or something


honey has insane benefits

 

[rms80]

you know whats also good. adding honey to the POWO mix

i posted some Honey info sometime back on that other board and it made the thread of the month onthe home page or something


honey has insane benefits

plus it tastes really good

 

[msucurt]

hmmm...sounds interested. Got a link? how much honey would u suggest with 2 scoops isolate and WMS or oats

you know whats also good. adding honey to the POWO mix

i posted some Honey info sometime back on that other board and it made the thread of the month onthe home page or something


honey has insane benefits

 

[Chub]

It is- waffles are too I took 6 Neo last night and ate 4 big-ass waffles with syrup, butter, the whole nine- hadn't had them in forever- plus we had no food (wife forgot to go shopping) 20 minutes later- veins popping everywhere- honestly felt like my muscles were going pop through my skin....

Neovar gave you those effects, i thought it was just like a creatine? That sounds like effects P-slin gives you?

 

[Rosie Chee]

NeoVar Recomped also acts as a nutrient repartitioner

Neovar gave you those effects, i thought it was just like a creatine? That sounds like effects P-slin gives you?

It IS a creatine. But it has EXTRA goodies in it. Like Banaba Extract, which is a nutrient repartitioner, and will give such effects...

I have the same thing after a high carbohydrate meal (pre-dosed with NeoVar Recomped); vascularity is even BETTER than when IN the gym sometimes!

 

[Chub]

It IS a creatine. But it has EXTRA goodies in it. Like Banaba Extract, which is a nutrient repartitioner, and will give such effects...

I have the same thing after a high carbohydrate meal (pre-dosed with NeoVar Recomped); vascularity is even BETTER than when IN the gym sometimes!

Yeah i noticed it had Banaba Extract in it, was reading up on that the other week in sam's log

 

[rms80]

Yeah i noticed it had Banaba Extract in it, was reading up on that the other week in sam's log

and D-Pinitol- it is a VERY strong insulin mimetic. The combination of gymnemma, D-pinitol, and banaba is pretty synergistic with creatine.

Here are a couple studies, take a look:

M. GREENWOOD, R.B. KREIDER, C. RASMUSSEN, A.L. ALMADA, AND C.P. EARNEST. D-Pinitol Augments Whole Body Creatine Retention In Man. JEPonline. 2001;4(4):41-47. Previous research has indicated that creatine retention is influenced by the intramuscular creatine concentration, and extracellular concentrations of glucose and insulin. The purpose of this study was to examine whether co-ingestion of D-pinitol (plant extract with insulin sensitizing characteristics) with creatine affects whole body creatine retention. Twenty male subjects with no history of creatine supplementation participated in this study. Subjects donated 24-hr urine samples for 4 days. After an initial control day designed to determine normal daily creatine excretion rates, subjects were matched according to body mass and randomly assigned to ingest in a single blind manner either a placebo (P=4 x 5 g of dextrose), creatine monohydrate (CM=4 x 5 g), CM with low dose D-pinitol (LP=4 x 5 g creatine + 2 x 0.5 g D-pinitol), or CM with high dose D-pinitol (HP=4 x 5 g creatine + 4 x 0.5 g D-pinitol) for 3 days. Additionally, another group ingested 2 x 0.5 g D-pinitol for 5-d followed by ingesting 4 x 5 g CM + 2 x 0.5 g D-pinitol for 3-d (Pre-P). Creatine retention was estimated by subtracting total urinary creatine excretion from total supplemental creatine intake over the 3-d period. Data were analyzed by ANOVA. Results revealed that whole body creatine retention over the 3 day loading period was significantly greater in the LP and Pre-P groups (P=00; CM=36.69; LP=49.73; HP=36.713; Pre P=46.76 g, p=0.001). This extrapolated to a significantly greater percentage of creatine retention in the LP and Pre-P groups (P=00; CM=6115; LP=835; HP=6122; Pre P=789 %, p=0.001). Results suggest that ingesting creatine with low doses of D-Pinitol may augment whole body creatine retention in a similar manner as has been reported with co-ingestion of high levels of carbohydrate or carbohydrate and protein. Additional research is warranted to investigate the possible influence that D-pinitol may have on insulin sensitivity and whole body creatine retention.