Caffeine/17HD alternative??

[planetfuzz]

I used 17HD about 2 years ago and it made me feel like bashing my head into a mirror after each set. The intensity was amazing but I've heard a lot of controversy over the ingredients in the product so I'm a bit skeptical. I also love the boost pre-workout supps with caffeine give me but caffeine usually makes me feel like my heart is going to explode. I read an article in Men's Health that said if you have a history of heart disease then you shouldn't use caffeine preworkout. Not sure if there is any danger in that but it still makes my heart beat waaaay to fast.

My question is: Is there any supplement out there that would give me similar results pre-workout without caffeine? Anything similar to 17HD that anybody knows of? Is it possible that a product like Blue Gene would give a similar affect? I know MST has Ragnork w/o caffeine but would this still be a good thing to rev up your workout? Thanks in advance.

 

[Matttehman]

I was thinking that 17hd was the licorice product so i had to check and sure enough! Lol that review made me laugh.:icon_lol:

Posted by Androgenic on another site:
"So lets tally up the results: we got elevated estrogen, decreased testosterone, increased cortisol, increased blood pressure, and 2 laxatives."
:bb3:

 

[planetfuzz]

I was thinking that 17hd was the licorice product so i had to check and sure enough! Lol that review made me laugh.:icon_lol:

Posted by Androgenic on another site:
"So lets tally up the results: we got elevated estrogen, decreased testosterone, increased cortisol, increased blood pressure, and 2 laxatives."
:bb3:

Wow...that's horrible.:lol: