What BULK Ingredients do you know work? Discuss

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    What BULK Ingredients do you know work? Discuss


    As a supplement skeptic I am always leary of "proprietery extracts" or "synergy" ect because most ingredients have little physically noticable effects.

    This got me to thinking, maybe I am missing out on something and maybe as a group we can chime in on which bulk powders we have seen real physical changes from and even which are nothing special. I am an admitted low responder/hard gainer so my expereinces may not be up to par with some.

    Personally I have gotten no noticable benefit from most of the top ingredients.

    I digging and the only bulks I can reccomend are:

    Glycerol Mono Stearate - nice vascularity and pump and SUPER cheap

    Coleus Forskohlii - Recomp effects but slight estro properties

    na-rala - Slight carb effects but great anti-ox, just a solid product if you can handle the burn washing it down (again I said bulks)

    Phenibut - A life saver, I really love this product for a big meeting, a stressful day, or any event that scares you or even just to add to a night drinking.




    Besides tht nothing has done much... So what are your top bulk products and why? Please not what things are supposed to do, lets see what they DID for YOU

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    I have not tried a ton of them but for the sheer mental clarity GTE and ALCAR seem worth it when I have the extra cash.

    I like r-ala quite a bit too.

    JR, what have you tried that did NOT work?
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    This actually might be a good way to figure out what you do and don't respond to. I don't think going bulk you are necessarily going to find superior quality but you are going to have more flexibility customizing stacks that work for you. It involves more research and trial and error but like you said you have been a non-responder to several highly touted products so you may not have a choice.

    Use your past experince, like I said the bulks will not likely be superior in quality so avoid ingredients that didn't work for you before.
    Mind and Muscle Board Representative I am not a physician and any advice is solely based on personal experience with various products
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamWeaver View Post
    This actually might be a good way to figure out what you do and don't respond to. I don't think going bulk you are necessarily going to find superior quality but you are going to have more flexibility customizing stacks that work for you. It involves more research and trial and error but like you said you have been a non-responder to several highly touted products so you may not have a choice.

    Use your past experince, like I said the bulks will not likely be superior in quality so avoid ingredients that didn't work for you before.
    This "superior quality" stuff is mostly something supplement companies push just like all companies. percieved scarcity and unique supply chains keep companies in business. We aren't talking about electronics here where a single part can ruin the whole thing, they are chemicals or plants and if you get them from a solid company then there should be little difference...

    I personally don't like:

    Yellow gold - I thought it was working then realized it was my diet and training

    cissus - placebo for me, great for most

    BCAA - not noticable

    luecine - again not nopticable

    arginines - not enough to warrent buying

    Beta-alanine - tingles from hell for no gain

    citruline malate - tastes bad and noticed nothing

    ect ect ect...

    I am always searching for the next find and think this board is entertaining but I try to avoid buyinging most things although I'll admit p-5-p drew me in recently for prolactin issues and although its not a bulk I really like vpx meltdown right now.
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    this thread seems promising. i've tried so many products and nothing has really even effected me. No-explode and most other NO products dont do a single thing for me.

    as mentioned above, glycerol mono is one of the very few things that actually works. as a bonus its super cheap, so i can say it will be a staple from now on. im tryin cissus now... that looks promising as well. just made 300 "00" sized caps with 200g bulk powder so we'll see how that works.

    green mag works as well, although i've only tried it a few times and im saving my tub for PCT. i dont know why thats the only form of creatine that effects me. but i dont see creatine chelate on NP in bulk
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    this thread seems promising. i've tried so many products and nothing has really even effected me. No-explode and most other NO products dont do a single thing for me.

    as mentioned above, glycerol mono is one of the very few things that actually works. as a bonus its super cheap, so i can say it will be a staple from now on. im tryin cissus now... that looks promising as well. just made 300 "00" sized caps with 200g bulk powder so we'll see how that works.

    green mag works as well, although i've only tried it a few times and im saving my tub for PCT. i dont know why thats the only form of creatine that effects me. but i dont see creatine chelate on NP in bulk
    Thanks for the backup on a few things including GMS, its a pain to take cause it is water repellet in a cup (wierd). Also cissus seems to be a great product but I just think my personal weak connective tissue can't be helped by anything sp I can't be used as an example. I will admit I loved the origonal cissus from usp and primaforces cissus when take right before a workout (totally anecdotal but it worked better for me.)

    Really I think we need to know what products in bulk form work before deciding what formulas are worth the extra expense i.e. if something mixes a couple bulks that you know work for you then the packaging and slight quality control might be worth the ebenefit for the added price.
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    This "superior quality" stuff is mostly something supplement companies push just like all companies. percieved scarcity and unique supply chains keep companies in business. We aren't talking about electronics here where a single part can ruin the whole thing, they are chemicals or plants and if you get them from a solid company then there should be little difference...

    I personally don't like:

    Yellow gold - I thought it was working then realized it was my diet and training

    cissus - placebo for me, great for most

    BCAA - not noticable

    luecine - again not nopticable

    arginines - not enough to warrent buying

    Beta-alanine - tingles from hell for no gain

    citruline malate - tastes bad and noticed nothing

    ect ect ect...

    I am always searching for the next find and think this board is entertaining but I try to avoid buyinging most things although I'll admit p-5-p drew me in recently for prolactin issues and although its not a bulk I really like vpx meltdown right now.
    I am not saying superior quality is used by the companies, I am saying that the bulk will be using the same quality and often will be getting the bulks from those companies that you have not responded to or from the same source. Flexibility is the only advantage of using bulks over products.
    Mind and Muscle Board Representative I am not a physician and any advice is solely based on personal experience with various products
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamWeaver View Post
    I am not saying superior quality is used by the companies, I am saying that the bulk will be using the same quality and often will be getting the bulks from those companies that you have not responded to or from the same source. Flexibility is the only advantage of using bulks over products.
    No money is!

    I am not interested in paying additional money to get more ingredients because they are "synergistic", how do I know they are really synergistic and how do i know the doses are high enough to cross the threshold for effectiveness?

    I hate paying more for something I didn't ask for when I can get mroe of the things that I feel working for the same price or less.. Again I am cheap and skeptic and not ashamed to say that. ha
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    There are reasons every company has almost the same ingredients in their new forumals (minus 1-2 unique "revolutionary" new finds)

    1. Certain things work

    2. Certain things are industry trends and expected

    3. certain products get attention at a given time (see above)

    For me reason one is all I care about and I don't want to pay for the other ingredients that were throw in for reasons 2 and 3 or even worse the "unique and revoultionary" finds thrown in with little science to seperate them from the other copycat formulas.
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    There are reasons every company has almost the same ingredients in their new forumals (minus 1-2 unique "revolutionary" new finds)

    1. Certain things work

    2. Certain things are industry trends and expected

    3. certain products get attention at a given time (see above)

    For me reason one is all I care about and I don't want to pay for the other ingredients that were throw in for reasons 2 and 3 or even worse the "unique and revoultionary" finds thrown in with little science to seperate them from the other copycat formulas.
    Some companies actually research what they put in their products and some do have a good reputation of coming up with very good formulations. If you think you can do better then ok for you. Flexiblity may lead to saved dollars yes.

    I too am interested in bulks but my knowledge is not sufficient to come up with the proper combinations at this time. Yes I hope buying bulk can save me money, but I will be looking for synergy between different additives as results are all I am really after. I am not a supplement expert by any means, my strengths have always been diet and exercise. The only reason that supplementation has become more important to me is age, and the increase of effectiveness in modern supplementation.

    That having been said I look forward to the information on this thread and hope to increase my understanding.
    Mind and Muscle Board Representative I am not a physician and any advice is solely based on personal experience with various products
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    Thanks for the backup on a few things including GMS, its a pain to take cause it is water repellet in a cup (wierd). Also cissus seems to be a great product but I just think my personal weak connective tissue can't be helped by anything sp I can't be used as an example. I will admit I loved the origonal cissus from usp and primaforces cissus when take right before a workout (totally anecdotal but it worked better for me.)

    Really I think we need to know what products in bulk form work before deciding what formulas are worth the extra expense i.e. if something mixes a couple bulks that you know work for you then the packaging and slight quality control might be worth the ebenefit for the added price.
    heres the secret i've found to make GMS work... pre workout i mix it in my shaker bottle with a scoop of protein. gives it a better taste and also helps A LOT with mixability.

    as far as all this synergy stuff is concerned... GMS also make creatine like 3x more effective.

    anyone have any experience with yellow gold? what exactly does it do?

    theres so much stuff i would try in bulk form if i had a lil more money. some of those herbs look like they may work as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    heres the secret i've found to make GMS work... pre workout i mix it in my shaker bottle with a scoop of protein. gives it a better taste and also helps A LOT with mixability.

    as far as all this synergy stuff is concerned... GMS also make creatine like 3x more effective.

    anyone have any experience with yellow gold? what exactly does it do?

    theres so much stuff i would try in bulk form if i had a lil more money. some of those herbs look like they may work as well.
    You gotta be a Man with a capital M to take YG bulk, personally I don't mind the taste but everyone acts like I am nuts. Problen with it is its hard to quantify if it is working or not and I can't really say if it did so to me thats a No. Smelton also gave it a no for the same reasons... My biggest reason I wont try it again is it gets EVERYWHERE. No joke I used it maybe 3 times over the last 2 months and its still ruining new things, I find it on shirts still that I never saw it on. IT GLOWs yellow and stains EVERYTHING and very few people can report REAL gains that could not have been for another reason... If not for the stains I would give it a maybe but because of that its a no.
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    YG is the most disgusting stuff on earth, not worth the mess it makes for minimal effects. I also will not ever buy Bulk BCAA again. Noticed nothing and i fell i get enough BCAA from protein powder. It also tastes wretched and takes forever to dissolve. Beta alanine made me tingle and nothing else. i am also thinking of dropping Xtend and replacing it with CRYSTAL LIGHT as a placebo test, just to see if it does actually make a difference in recovery.

    Bulk ingredients that work for me:
    Whey protein
    Creatine Mono.

    Ill add in something for energy (either rpm or Green tea + caffeine) and some Omega 3s and I am good to go.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SureShot View Post
    YG is the most disgusting stuff on earth, not worth the mess it makes for minimal effects. I also will not ever buy Bulk BCAA again. Noticed nothing and i fell i get enough BCAA from protein powder. It also tastes wretched and takes forever to dissolve. Beta alanine made me tingle and nothing else. i am also thinking of dropping Xtend and replacing it with CRYSTAL LIGHT as a placebo test, just to see if it does actually make a difference in recovery.

    Bulk ingredients that work for me:
    Whey protein
    Creatine Mono.

    Ill add in something for energy (either rpm or Green tea + caffeine) and some Omega 3s and I am good to go.

    That's the thing about aminos I know they are beneficial in some ways but it's really hard to discern how much benefit you are getting. I think that a really good diet and you probably could forgo a lot of them.
    Mind and Muscle Board Representative I am not a physician and any advice is solely based on personal experience with various products
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    I seemed to grow just fine before i ever took bulk aminos or xtend. In fact I would throw out all supplements except for whey and creatine and throw in some winny/test and you are guaranteed to grow...and it also costs less.
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    my favorite bulk products for a good recomp cycle have been
    TTA
    Forskolin
    AA
    the synergy between them is incredible...and since u noticed slight estrogenic side effects from forskolin just throw in some low dosed bulk ATD...
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    For me, malto, dex, MCTs, CM, oats, among other things.
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    Beta-alanine
    Waxy Maize
    Coleus Forskolin
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    Creatine Mono
    BCAA's
    Fish Oil
    Whey
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    Beta Alanine
    Cissus

    These 2 I was skeptical about ... until I ran out thinking it was a waste. Until I started feeling that burn so intense you want to scream again which I had not felt for so long. Starting taking BA again and about 2 weeks later no more screaming

    And if Cissus is placebo I will still take it, because my knee feels about %80 better when I take about 2.5 grams a day.

    Other than those...

    %95 Nettle
    Creatine
    ALCAR dosed at 3g a day
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    I really want to try p-lcar. I remember dsade saying one was more for mind and one more for body but i forget which was which...

    Alcar was ok but not noticable so I'll give it another try because its cheap and I am cheap... not like that...
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    Quote Originally Posted by SureShot View Post
    YG is the most disgusting stuff on earth, not worth the mess it makes for minimal effects. I also will not ever buy Bulk BCAA again. Noticed nothing and i fell i get enough BCAA from protein powder. It also tastes wretched and takes forever to dissolve. Beta alanine made me tingle and nothing else. i am also thinking of dropping Xtend and replacing it with CRYSTAL LIGHT as a placebo test, just to see if it does actually make a difference in recovery.

    Bulk ingredients that work for me:
    Whey protein
    Creatine Mono.

    Ill add in something for energy (either rpm or Green tea + caffeine) and some Omega 3s and I am good to go.
    i will chime in on this one-
    1. cre phosphate or mono- def. helps w/ recovery from hard training, very noticeable effects on vs. off

    2. whey protein- again, helps with recovery

    3. L-tyrosine- helps any stim work even better, plus it is great for alertness, focus, and appetite suppression

    4. L-phenyl alanine- same as 3

    5. cit malate- def. noticed an endurance boost when I have taken this

    6. HMB- 10-20 grams per day, plus cre phos. dramatically increases recovery

    7. forskolin- great fat burner, pct, and boosts free test

    8. maltodextrin- great stuff post wo, and very cheap
    my company only includes 3 or 4 of the above in our formulations- but i have good success with all of these.....

    these are
    Dirk Tanis, BA, MSci
    Chief Operating Officer, Applied Nutriceuticals
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    My favorite bulks:
    1. Green Tea - So many benefits, it just makes me feel all around better
    2. GMS - I use it when I know I wont be able to go to a bathroom for a long time lol, can stay hydrated but don't have to take a whiz for hours after dosing
    3. Creatine + Dextrose + BCAA's or Leucine - Awesome intraworkout or postworkout combination and dirt cheap.
    4. 1 Carboxy - Great sleep and also focus for workouts.
    5. ATD - Only product I have bought from a site other than NutraPlanet or All The Whey. When dosed properly its awesome for lowering estrogen. I have gotten great strength gains from 50mg ed suspended in olive oil.

    I just picked up some Grape Seed Extract so I am looking forward to giving that a try down the road. On paper it looks like one hell of a anti-ox and general health supplement, but only time will tell.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmiller383 View Post
    My favorite bulks:
    1. Green Tea - So many benefits, it just makes me feel all around better
    2. GMS - I use it when I know I wont be able to go to a bathroom for a long time lol, can stay hydrated but don't have to take a whiz for hours after dosing
    3. Creatine + Dextrose + BCAA's or Leucine - Awesome intraworkout or postworkout combination and dirt cheap.
    4. 1 Carboxy - Great sleep and also focus for workouts.
    5. ATD - Only product I have bought from a site other than NutraPlanet or All The Whey. When dosed properly its awesome for lowering estrogen. I have gotten great strength gains from 50mg ed suspended in olive oil.

    I just picked up some Grape Seed Extract so I am looking forward to giving that a try down the road. On paper it looks like one hell of a anti-ox and general health supplement, but only time will tell.
    GMS---> worst feeling ever is after you drink a ton of water pre and intra workout and you stand around talking after your workout... with your protein shake... then your on your drive home and it all decides it finally wants to come out but you have a 15 min drive and theres traffic... had to use a tree in my yard cuz i didnt wanna open the door. and it felt AMAZING

    with the 1 carboxy... does it just help w/ sleep or have you noticed and GH benefits as well? and why does NP have to always be out of it
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmiller383 View Post
    5. ATD - Only product I have bought from a site other than NutraPlanet or All The Whey. When dosed properly its awesome for lowering estrogen. I have gotten great strength gains from 50mg ed suspended in olive oil.
    So is taking ATD with a certain amount and or type of fats somehow beneficial? What about timing?
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    Quote Originally Posted by themills View Post
    So is taking ATD with a certain amount and or type of fats somehow beneficial? What about timing?
    Yes, the mono saturated fats in Olive Oil help with the absorption of the ATD. Also since the dosing is really small it is much easier and more accurate to create a suspension rather than trying to cap the ATD. As for timing most people recommend taking the majority of your ATD at night, I will use do 50g's at night but if I am going high i will split it up so that I get 25g's in the morning and then 50 at night.
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    My favorite bulks are:
    Piracetam
    Aniracetam
    ALCAR
    Tyrosine
    Coleus Forskohlii (20% Forskolin)
    Raspberry Ketones
    Green Tea

    I find Piracetam helped me retain information immensely while studying for exams. I stacked it with Aniracetam and ALCAR and the synergy was outstanding for me. The ALCAR helped me focus and the two *racetams helped me retain information. Studying without that stack was definitely not as productive.

    The Coleus Forskohlii (20% Forskolin) definitely helped me recomp. I stacked Raspberry Ketones and Green Tea with it during a recomp and leaned out quite a bit while staying the pretty much the same weight.. I just wish I took pictures. Unfortunately I had to eventually drop the Forskolin due to GI issues, but I would definitely run it again at lower doses.
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    I really want to try p-lcar. I remember dsade saying one was more for mind and one more for body but i forget which was which...

    Alcar was ok but not noticable so I'll give it another try because its cheap and I am cheap... not like that...
    Awesome man.

    I just took some DURABLAST... It contains both, I just double dosed.... 2g of PLCAR, 1g ALCAR plus the rest... Awesome work out!

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    ALCar
    Creatine
    R-Ala

    Those are the only three supplements I have tried that are worth the money.I am going to order some PLCar in the next few days and see how it works.
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    Good thread.

    My favorite bulks:

    1. Whey Protein
    2. Creatine Ethyl Ester Malate (get too bloated from mono)
    3. Acetyl L-Carnitine (during cut)
    4. Cod Liver Oil
    5. Caffeine
    6. ZMA
    7. BCAA (not great gains, but good intra-workout energy)
    8. ALA
    9. Vitamin C
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmiller383 View Post
    I will use do 50g's at night but if I am going high i will split it up so that I get 25g's in the morning and then 50 at night.
    How's that estrogen control with 50grams???!!

    I think you forgot the m

    That being said, bulk ingredients that I know work;

    Whey Protein
    Creatine Monohydrate
    Glycerol MonoStearate
    Caffeine
    1,3-dimethylamylamine (stuff WORKS!)
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    This is an awesome thread. I'm subbed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmiller383 View Post
    Yes, the mono saturated fats in Olive Oil help with the absorption of the ATD. Also since the dosing is really small it is much easier and more accurate to create a suspension rather than trying to cap the ATD. As for timing most people recommend taking the majority of your ATD at night, I will use do 50g's at night but if I am going high i will split it up so that I get 25g's in the morning and then 50 at night.
    you are correct oleic acid will help get the ATD absorbed into the lymphatic system much easier- placing ATD in an oily matrix is similar to what Organon does with Andriol (test undec.)- many ph's and hormones get assimilated in a much more efficient manner this way....
    Dirk Tanis, BA, MSci
    Chief Operating Officer, Applied Nutriceuticals
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    Quote Originally Posted by rms80 View Post
    you are correct oleic acid will help get the ATD absorbed into the lymphatic system much easier- placing ATD in an oily matrix is similar to what Organon does with Andriol (test undec.)- many ph's and hormones get assimilated in a much more efficient manner this way....
    they are both absorbed more efficiently this way, but it works in different ways (oily suspension for injection IM vs oily suspension for orally ingested products). Regardless, oil suspensions for the win.

    edit: I feel as if i'm following you around rms, but am simply replying to my subscribed threads
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecu19 View Post
    they are both absorbed more efficiently this way, but it works in different ways (oily suspension for injection IM vs oily suspension for orally ingested products). Regardless, oil suspensions for the win.

    edit: I feel as if i'm following you around rms, but am simply replying to my subscribed threads
    good to have a little bit of time to get back on here- I miss this place- and yes, IM and oral absorption are two very dif. things...
    Dirk Tanis, BA, MSci
    Chief Operating Officer, Applied Nutriceuticals
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    so this thread has given me an idea on making my own fat loss stack. i ordered Raspberry Ketones (50 grams), Acetyl L-Carnitine (100 grams), Coleus Forskholii (30 grams), Green Tea Powder (100 gm), PEA (1 gram), Yohimbine HCL Powder (1 gram). what if i just mixed all this together and came up with this blend:

    200mg ketones
    400mg carnitine
    120mg forskholii
    400mg green tea
    4mg PEA
    4mg yohimbine

    that'd be 250 days worth of my homemade fat loss formula. how do those dosages look? the PEA and yohimbine are mainly cuz it was so cheap i thought it wouldnt really hurt to just toss in the mix
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    Damn I really want to try PLCAR but seems anything that has it as main ingredient is out of stock.
    Mind and Muscle Board Representative I am not a physician and any advice is solely based on personal experience with various products
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    Quote Originally Posted by tnubs View Post
    so this thread has given me an idea on making my own fat loss stack. i ordered Raspberry Ketones (50 grams), Acetyl L-Carnitine (100 grams), Coleus Forskholii (30 grams), Green Tea Powder (100 gm), PEA (1 gram), Yohimbine HCL Powder (1 gram). what if i just mixed all this together and came up with this blend:

    200mg ketones
    400mg carnitine
    120mg forskholii
    400mg green tea
    4mg PEA
    4mg yohimbine

    that'd be 250 days worth of my homemade fat loss formula. how do those dosages look? the PEA and yohimbine are mainly cuz it was so cheap i thought it wouldnt really hurt to just toss in the mix
    Too small of a pea dose.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DreamWeaver View Post
    Damn I really want to try PLCAR but seems anything that has it as main ingredient is out of stock.
    i hear lot about it, what exactly does it do?
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    Quote Originally Posted by ecu19 View Post
    Too small of a pea dose.

    how does the rest look?
  

  
 

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