FIGHTING CORTISOL: Phosphatidyl Serine

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    FIGHTING CORTISOL: Phosphatidyl Serine


    I am not sure if this has been posted before and in how much detail, thought it would be of interest :

    Phosphatidyl Serine (1,2-diacyl-sn-glycerol-(3)-L-phosphoserine, PS) is a phospholipid that's comprised of the amino acid L-serine and a lipid molecule. It is essential to the healthy functioning of virtually all cells in our bodies with highest concentrations in the human brain.

    While its mechanisms of action are unknown, PS is thought to:
    • Repair damaged nerve cells.
    • Maintain nerve cell integrity.
    • Enhance neurotransmitter signal efficiency.
    • Enhance cognition.
    • Elevate mood.
    • Enhance memory.
    • Increase the brains absorption of nutrients.
    • Improve nerve cell signal transmission


    For athletes and bodybuilders, PS has additional benefits: it works by lowering cortisol levels in response to weight and endurance training. Release of cortisol is stimulated by stress and low blood levels of glucocorticoids. The bad thing for us though is that cortisol increases the rate of protein breakdown as well as removing amino acids from cells and transporting them to the liver to be used for energy. On the positive side though, cortisol makes this energy available when stress levels are high and it also works as an anti inflammatory agent. After a workout, cortisol levels will rise. This excess cortisol is the real problem. The postworkout high cortisol levels break down muscle tissue and block the entry of amino acids into the muscle cells. Ideally, this is the time when you want to take in a high quality protein supplement and some good low GI carbs to speed healing and growth. The trouble is that regardless of the quality of protein you take, when cortisol is high, protein is more apt to be excreted in urine or processed by the liver into glucose. Cortisol also appears to inhibit carbohydrate use. You may have high blood glucose levels, but the glucose may not be transported into the muscle tissue particularly well.

    Thus, by taking phosphatidylserine, you may be able to speed recovery times between workouts dramatically. Because cortisol can halt protein synthesis, PS may actually increase your postworkout absorption of amino acids.

    Furthermore, unlike other cortisol blockers on the market (like DHEA metabolites, PS is a ‘non-hormonal’ cortisol blocker that can effectively lower cortisol levels. Also, unlike DHEA, rather than lowering testosterone production, PS can actually increase testosterone production.

    PS is present in the cells of all plants and animals, and is derived from egg yolks, soybeans or lecithin (phosphatidylcholine). Because the amount of PS that reaches the bloodstream after surviving the intestinal tract is small, results are best observed over time with regular supplementation. The current dosing is around 400 - 800 mg per day, divided in individual doses (4x200mg per day).Do not take PS if you are using amphetamines (recreationally, to treat depression or to treat ADD/ADHD). Do not take PS if you are using adrenergic agonists like dopamine.

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    This is a great PS product EndoAmp
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxGolf View Post
    This is a great PS product EndoAmp

    Thanks, I will look into it !
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    I love Phosphatidyl Serine. I do notice a lift in mood and recovery after taking it for a while. Underrated supp imo. Primordial's EndoAamp is one of the best deals you can find on high grade PS. I'll probably take it as long as I can afford to, especially for any post cycle.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattikus View Post
    I love Phosphatidyl Serine. I do notice a lift in mood and recovery after taking it for a while. Underrated supp imo. Primordial's EndoAamp is one of the best deals you can find on high grade PS. I'll probably take it as long as I can afford to, especially for any post cycle.
    I was hoping someone would post feedback on EndAmp
    How do you dose it and how long after taking it did you notice results ?
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    EndoAmp is still relatively new, so reviews may be sparse. However, you can count on quality when it comes from Primordial Performance. Truely a solid company over there, and I've been very impressed with their products. I'm going to be running EndoAmp for my first time in an upcoming PCT, and I have very high expectations of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfly View Post
    I was hoping someone would post feedback on EndAmp
    How do you dose it and how long after taking it did you notice results ?
    On training days I take a dose before training and one after or before bed. I start to notice benefits within a week. The first time I took PS I didn't really notice much while taking it, but I did when I stopped. I missed the well being and recovery. I seem to notice EndoAmp more than other versions of PS that I have taken, which were of questionable quality.
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    The amount of PS in each serving of EndoAmp is quite large (0.8g, + other phospholipids )http://www.nutraplanet.com/product/p...oamp-48-g.html so the price may seem steep but you're getting alot.
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    Bragging here but I got lucky and got a one time sale I could not opass up and got 2 tubs 40% off, don't ask how cause it really was a one time thing when they moved storage facilities but I can't wait to try it for pct...

    I think people need to realize that the hormonal nature of lean xtreme and x-lean ect make them things that should not be used in the first few weeks of pct. The companies clain they don't effect the hpta but with enough digging you can find things and studies that show they do. For this reason things like endo amp should be more popular for the first few weeks of pct (my pct's run the entire time I am off because my cycles are long).
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    Quote Originally Posted by justreading View Post
    Bragging here but I got lucky and got a one time sale I could not opass up and got 2 tubs 40% off, don't ask how cause it really was a one time thing when they moved storage facilities but I can't wait to try it for pct...

    I think people need to realize that the hormonal nature of lean xtreme and x-lean ect make them things that should not be used in the first few weeks of pct. The companies clain they don't effect the hpta but with enough digging you can find things and studies that show they do. For this reason things like endo amp should be more popular for the first few weeks of pct (my pct's run the entire time I am off because my cycles are long).
    haha same here man! I SHOULD have grabbed some Sustain Alpha and toco-8 for the kill, but I hesistated. Bad move in hindsight!

    I agree in how Lean Xtreme/X-Lean cortisol controllers may illicit some undesirable sides. The fact that you should taper to come off usually gives the red flag warning. Not too big of a deal IMO, but EndoAmp or PS for that madder does not need to be tapered. I questioned PP about the optimal tapering schedule, and I was pleased to hear that there is not a rebound upon cessation. Instead, PP informed me that you actually reap the benefits of PS for as many as several weeks after coming off.
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    personally I would run PS with a high grade relora (and for the love of god I can't find one, and no now's is not a high grade for these purposes, see below) because relora is supposed to increase dhea production as well and be cort suppressing.

    To be honest i liked Now's at first but some things claim its overal extract is low. It did give me a light relaxed feeling which may have been placebo. The overall extract should be much higher to reall work I think but higher extracts are damn near impossible to find...

    Sorry off subject but the nature of Ps lends itself to pct which brought me to relora for dhea stimulation
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    I just ordered my first bottle, but by a different company that I trust a lot!
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    Anyone ever notice the size of their waist shrink while on PS? I'm thinking of trying but for the price I want to see/feel more than just subtle effects.
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    I'm still not convinced that currently available PS is all that effective. most of the early studies were on bovine PS, but all that is now available is soy/plant based. I'm not saying it ISNT effective, but that i'm still not sure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I'm still not convinced that currently available PS is all that effective. most of the early studies were on bovine PS, but all that is now available is soy/plant based. I'm not saying it ISNT effective, but that i'm still not sure.
    Right..and at $50 a pop I don't feel like experimenting.
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    I am getting the one I will be using for $34 for a month supply and anything i've ever used by the company was 100% quality product.

    I will be sure to let you know how it goes for me.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    I'm still not convinced that currently available PS is all that effective. most of the early studies were on bovine PS, but all that is now available is soy/plant based. I'm not saying it ISNT effective, but that i'm still not sure.
    True, PS was originally manufactured from the brains of cows, however, because animal brain cells can harbor pathogens (eg BSA, cause of the "mad cow disease"), that form is no longer available. Most PS today is made from soybeans or other plant sources. There are reasons to believe that plant-source PS should function similarly to PS made from cows' brains, and some animal studies suggest that it is indeed effective, mainly in terms of improving memory function (see ref 1-3).

    There are a number of studies that support the benefits of animal-derived PS supplementation in terms of athletic performance. A double-blind, placebo-controlled study on 11 intensely trained athletes found that 800 mg of PS taken daily reduced the cortisol rise by 20% as compared with placebo (4) Another small study on 9 nonathletic males found that daily doses of 400 and 800 mg of PS reduced cortisol levels after exercise by 16% and 30%, respectively (5).

    The effects of non-animal sources of PS in training individuals is controversial, however the nature of responses vary depending on the dosage. For example 750 mg of soy-derived PS improves exercise capacity during cycling (increased time to exhaustion at 85% VO2max), but has no effect on serum cortisol concentration (6). Similarly, administration of 750 mg soy-based PS does not blunt cortisol response and has no effect on markers of muscle damage in runners but it does increase running time to exhaustion (7). However, when given at 400 mg soy PS significantly blunted serum cortisol and ACTH, an effect which was not seen with larger doses of PS (600 and 800 mg respectively, 8).

    In conclusion, whichever way you take it you got to experiment, individual biochemistry will dictate the nature of individual responses. In the end, isn’t tweaking with dosages what we do with all performance supplements ? There is no one-size-fits all, unfortunately…


    1. Toffano G, Leon A, Benvegnu D. Effect of brain cortex phospholipids on catechol-amine content of mouse brain. Pharmacol Res Commun. 1976;8:581-590.

    2. LaBrake CC, Fung LW. Phospholipid vesicles promote human hemoglobin oxidation. J Biol Chem. 1992;267:16703-16711.

    3. Orlando P, Cerrito F, Zirili P. The fate of doubly-labelled brain phospholipids administered to mice. Farmaco. 1975;30:451-458.

    4. Fahey TD, Pearl M. Hormonal effects of phosphatidylserine during 2 weeks of intense training. Abstract presented at: National Meeting of the American College of Sports Medicine;June, 1998;

    5. Monteleone P, Maj M, Beinat L, et al. Blunting by chronic phosphatidylserine administration of the stress-induced activation of the hypothalamo-pituitary-adrenal axis in healthy men. Eur J Clin Pharmacol. 1992;42:385-388.

    6. Kingsley MI, Miller M, Kilduff LP, McEneny J, Benton D. Effects of phosphatidylserine on exercise capacity during cycling in active males. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2006; 38(1):64-71.

    7. Kingsley MI, Wadsworth D, Kilduff LP, McEneny J, Benton D. Effects of phosphatidylserine on oxidative stress following intermittent running. Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2005;37(8):1300-6

    8. Hellhammer J, Fries E, Buss C, Engert V, Tuch A, Rutenberg D, Hellhammer D. Effects of soy lecithin phosphatidic acid and phosphatidylserine complex (PAS) on the endocrine and psychological responses to mental stress. Stress. 2004;7(2):119-26.
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    its a pity there are no international sources for bovine based. there was some experimentation with porcine based, but i haven't heard more about it
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    We need primordial perf in here to comment...
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    Most all the studies that have been done in the last 10 years have been with soy derived PS, and they all show the same benefit as bovine derived PS. (except for one low dose PS study in stress management)

    Bovine may be absorbed slightly better, but it’s simply not produced any longer. We can get the same athletic enhancing and cortisol blocking effects from soy derived PS.

    -Pp
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfly View Post
    I am not sure if this has been posted before and in how much detail, thought it would be of interest :

    Phosphatidyl Serine (1,2-diacyl-sn-glycerol-(3)-L-phosphoserine, PS) is a phospholipid that's comprised of the amino acid L-serine and a lipid molecule. It is essential to the healthy functioning of virtually all cells in our bodies with highest concentrations in the human brain.

    While its mechanisms of action are unknown, PS is thought to:
    • Repair damaged nerve cells.
    • Maintain nerve cell integrity.
    • Enhance neurotransmitter signal efficiency.
    • Enhance cognition.
    • Elevate mood.
    • Enhance memory.
    • Increase the brains absorption of nutrients.
    • Improve nerve cell signal transmission


    For athletes and bodybuilders, PS has additional benefits: it works by lowering cortisol levels in response to weight and endurance training. Release of cortisol is stimulated by stress and low blood levels of glucocorticoids. The bad thing for us though is that cortisol increases the rate of protein breakdown as well as removing amino acids from cells and transporting them to the liver to be used for energy. On the positive side though, cortisol makes this energy available when stress levels are high and it also works as an anti inflammatory agent. After a workout, cortisol levels will rise. This excess cortisol is the real problem. The postworkout high cortisol levels break down muscle tissue and block the entry of amino acids into the muscle cells. Ideally, this is the time when you want to take in a high quality protein supplement and some good low GI carbs to speed healing and growth. The trouble is that regardless of the quality of protein you take, when cortisol is high, protein is more apt to be excreted in urine or processed by the liver into glucose. Cortisol also appears to inhibit carbohydrate use. You may have high blood glucose levels, but the glucose may not be transported into the muscle tissue particularly well.

    Thus, by taking phosphatidylserine, you may be able to speed recovery times between workouts dramatically. Because cortisol can halt protein synthesis, PS may actually increase your postworkout absorption of amino acids.

    Furthermore, unlike other cortisol blockers on the market (like DHEA metabolites, PS is a ‘non-hormonal’ cortisol blocker that can effectively lower cortisol levels. Also, unlike DHEA, rather than lowering testosterone production, PS can actually increase testosterone production.

    PS is present in the cells of all plants and animals, and is derived from egg yolks, soybeans or lecithin (phosphatidylcholine). Because the amount of PS that reaches the bloodstream after surviving the intestinal tract is small, results are best observed over time with regular supplementation. The current dosing is around 400 - 800 mg per day, divided in individual doses (4x200mg per day).Do not take PS if you are using amphetamines (recreationally, to treat depression or to treat ADD/ADHD). Do not take PS if you are using adrenergic agonists like dopamine.
    that is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to expensive. i guess i could do that when/if i get my big career after college. heh.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manimalia View Post
    that is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to expensive. i guess i could do that when/if i get my big career after college. heh.
    Primordials EndoAmp is a good buy PM for Promo code
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    I agree that EndoAmp is probably one the best choices for PS on the market today. In comparison with other brands appears to be the best value, taking into account its high concentration.

    However, after finishing one container and dosing it the highest dose instructed, which is 1600mg a day, I am not convinced in overal effectivness of PS supplementation for purpose of cortisol reduction. It MIGHT be effective in keeping cortisol from raising, but I am not sure about it's capability to reduce it to a degree that would offer concrete, measurable results. In my opinion, barely noticable results (if you experience them at all) are not good enough, considering the price of PS supplements.

    Besides cortisol regulation, one more effect usually asociated with PS is improved cognitive function, especialy in elderly. Since I have not noticed anything in this regard, I beleive it is really a boon that mostly elderly can benefit from.

    The main reason I wanted to try PS is a bit of belly fat that I would like to get rid of. This haven't happened in my case, not even during restricted calorie intake that I went through up untill recently.

    While deciding wether I should buy a PS supplement or not, I noticed several reviews expressing doubts in efficacy of PS, which turns out to coincide with my experience. As you can see I ignored them and now need to decide what to do with the remaining two containers I bought...
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    Not to sound like a jerk or anything...but maybe you should run the other 2 containers you bought.

    Many products don't reach their full potential until the 2nd or 3rd bottles. Look at Anabolic Pump which seems to be everyone in the countries favorite supplement. Many people say the effects didn't kick in until their 3rd run of it.
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    PS works best in people that have an imbalance between DHEA and cortisol throughout the day, especially higher cortisol at night causing insomnia. A Doc I know recomended 500mg PS at night. Haven't tried it yet myself but I will be very soon as part of my PCT.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CTDeuce View Post
    Not to sound like a jerk or anything...but maybe you should run the other 2 containers you bought.

    Many products don't reach their full potential until the 2nd or 3rd bottles. Look at Anabolic Pump which seems to be everyone in the countries favorite supplement. Many people say the effects didn't kick in until their 3rd run of it.
    really tho all the evidence of cortisol suppression with PS is from just that, suppressing a rise in cortisol. There isn't any evidence of it lowering cortisol below normal baseline. So it would be good for workout purposes, and good for PCT, but not necessarily all that great for a person looking to use lowering cortisol for fatloss.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    really tho all the evidence of cortisol suppression with PS is from just that, suppressing a rise in cortisol. There isn't any evidence of it lowering cortisol below normal baseline. So it would be good for workout purposes, and good for PCT, but not necessarily all that great for a person looking to use lowering cortisol for fatloss.
    Since there are diurnal cortisol variations, I think it might be useful to take it upon waking when it's high and also post-training, but alot of people I've heard about take it before bed too. If we ever got some bulk PS at NP I'll experiment a bit.
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    Why not just use something that is proven like Retain 2 or Restore pre or post-workout to combat cortisol? I don't see the harm in doing maybe 5 caps a week of either indefinitely. As for day to day cortisol reduction i think everyone should first and foremost be on Reset Ad to keep their adrenal glands healthy so the can change how their body's react to stress in the first place, then from their maybe some Relora a couple times a day. I did find Recreate to work just as well as Retain 2 for abdominal fat and i felt better too. For pct my vote is either Retain 2+Clenbuterol or Recreate+Clenbuterol for lowering cortisol and preventing catabolism.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CHAPS View Post
    Why not just use something that is proven like Retain 2 or Restore pre or post-workout to combat cortisol? I don't see the harm in doing maybe 5 caps a week of either indefinitely. As for day to day cortisol reduction i think everyone should first and foremost be on Reset Ad to keep their adrenal glands healthy so the can change how their body's react to stress in the first place, then from their maybe some Relora a couple times a day. I did find Recreate to work just as well as Retain 2 for abdominal fat and i felt better too. For pct my vote is either Retain 2+Clenbuterol or Recreate+Clenbuterol for lowering cortisol and preventing catabolism.
    Because dhea based cort blockers can have some potential hpta effects. I'll prob double dose relora, ps and some ashwaga (or however you spell it) for the first couple weeks then switch to lean xtreme
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    plus retain 2 is becoming hard to find
    This space for rent

    Phenadrol Log http://anabolicminds.com/forum/suppl...-hell-did.html - AMAZING fat loss results so far
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonfly View Post
    Do not take PS if you are using amphetamines (recreationally, to treat depression or to treat ADD/ADHD). Do not take PS if you are using adrenergic agonists like dopamine.

    PrimordialPerf, what is your standing on taking EndoAmp while on Deprenyl (selegaline), alongside a number of nootropics (piracetam, pea, hordenine, choline citrate). Any interactions as possibly suggested above?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump View Post
    PrimordialPerf, what is your standing on taking EndoAmp while on Deprenyl (selegaline), alongside a number of nootropics (piracetam, pea, hordenine, choline citrate). Any interactions as possibly suggested above?
    There shouldnt be any interactions.

    -Pp
  

  
 

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