Volcom’s MassiveFXperiment with 3-AD; Hypertrophy on a Recomp Plan using a Bulk Cycle
- 05-12-2008, 03:58 PM
Volcom’s MassiveFXperiment with 3-AD; Hypertrophy on a Recomp Plan using a Bulk Cycle
My Title sort of says it all, but I want to offer an explanation, as there are seemingly contradictory principles in my mission statement.
I understand 3-AD and MassFX are predominantly and most efficiently used as a bulk stack. However, bulking will not be my primary objective. I have come down from 230lbs, to my current weight of 212lbs, while maintaining about 90% of my neural strength. I am not where I’d like to be in terms of fat mass yet, however, I have been noticing a slight and progressive decline in strength. Yes that’s natural, but that is the point of my stack. I’m using it more as a preventative measure, with expectations of “some” hypertrophy, definitely some prominence in muscle contour and muscle depth. I intend to create an inverse relationship with muscle gain to fat loss. I don’t like the bulk approach because being a natural fat boy, the weight can only be loss at a great sacrifice to the muscle I just bulked up for. I am basically Recomping (strong cardio & diet), but with a mass stack.
I have been lifting for years, have tried muchos supplement plans, stacks, cycles and have been around AM long enough to know my options. Sure I could go Drive/RPM/X-Factor, Retain2/Hyperdol X2 for a more Recomp related supplementation plan. I understand there are multitudes of other combinations I may more efficiently go with, especially budget wise. Been there, tried that, it worked fine, no complaints. Bottom line, money is no object and I’m trying this stack out of mere desire and inquisition.
I understand I will not be “MAXIMIZING” 3-AD in all its glory, because my caloric intake will be far less then a bulking, super-anabolic environment and I’ll be doing hours of cardio (HIIT & Static, as I have been to help me lose the 17lbs so far). I titled this an experiment because that’s just what it is. If my results are less then desirable, its my own fault. I’ve consulted AX reps who have been incredibly helpful, I’ve gotten opinions, suggestions and imperatives. Some of their insightful information I will implement, some I will not because they are not conducive to MY objectives, but I appreciate all their help (expedient help no less).
- 3 AD [6 caps a day]
- MassFX [ 6 caps a day]
- Lean Xtreme [4 caps a day]
Diet Buffers/Enhancements while ON & during PCT
- DCP [for the fatty intake 3-AD requires]
- Anabolic Pump [for the occasional carb containing meals or times of weakness]
- Pslin [for the higher, moderate carb intake/replenish days]
- MassFX [4 caps for two weeks]
- Retain 2
- X-Factor [4 caps a day]
(Hyperdol X2 may replace X-factor, still deciding)
Everything is bought and in my possession except the pending Hyperdol X2 (suggestions are welcomed)
Waiting on AX Rep to finalize dosing schedule. Thanks Tim.
Last edited by VolcomX311; 05-13-2008 at 12:20 AM.
- 05-12-2008, 05:40 PM
Have no fear, TT is here!!!
Stack looks awesome bro and I think you will see some great results. 3-AD from what I have seen so far looks like the perfect product for your goals. It's not a bulker, but it should help you increase (at the very least preserve) strength, while you add a few solid pounds of lean muscle, and drop some of that unwanted bodyfat.
I'm most interested in seeing your results with X-Factor. Are you altering your diet in any way for the X-Factor? It's been a while since I looked into it, but I seem to remember there being certain foods (supplements) you were suppose to avoid while taking it for maximum results. Something about how X-Factor increases inflammation, so products like fish oils which are anti-inflammatories are suppose to be avoided. I also remember people arguing that this might not necessarily be critical to a successful run. So I'm interested in what your approach is going to be and your opinions on the topic?
Overall the stack looks sick and I'm sure with your work ethic, dedication, knowledge, and commitment that it will be 110% successful. You get out what you put in, and you my friend definitely put everything into your training and dieting. So best of luck with your cycle!
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to VolcomX311 again.
- 05-12-2008, 06:05 PM
However, I ran into this article in the AX forum:
[NP: OK, I think we have sufficiently covered the basics. Now onto the new stuff. First, what is the deal about AA and Fish Oil? I’ve seen mixed messages. Is it OK to stack the two?
WL: Yes, it is actually. At first, knowing that there are studies suggesting that Omega 3 fatty acids can compete with arachidonic acid for storage and conversion enzymes, we advised everyone to limit extra Omega 3 intake while taking X-Factor. We really just wanted to be sure it worked for everyone. After a lot of experimentation, and some new research, we have reversed this position almost completely. Unless you have a diet unduly excessive in Omega 3’s, they should not interfere substantially with X-Factor. In fact, we even tell people they can supplement Omega 3’s while taking X-Factor if they want. A couple of caps per day may even lend some synergy.
NP: What new research are you referring to?
WL: There have been a number of new studies on AA actually. The British Journal of Nutrition published an important one last year showing Omega-3 supplementations to have no effect on arachidonic acid levels. The subjects took a good dose of AA with their Omega-3’s too, about 850mg per day. This is only about 150mg shy of what we recommend at the maximum. There has been some additional data to suggest that low levels of added Omega-3’s might even increase the membrane uptake of arachidonic acid. At the very least, these studies, combined with our own observations, has led to us removing the “Limit Omega 3’s” recommendations.]
Which affirmed my usage of X-factor with 3-AD, however, I'm still saving the X-factor for later use just to keep my primary stack simple. Supps that require food intake or an empty stomach aren' that hard to schedule, but supps with requirements that are macronutrient specific may be a pain.
[You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to TerribleTowel again.]
This has the makings of a goodie! From one naturally fat boy to another subbed.
What is your diet going to look like on this cycle? I believe your carb cycling right now, are you going to consider to do so? Will your total weekly caloric intake be around maintenance or slightly below?
I'm here! I'm here!!!
Alright, man! Let's tear this place apart!!!
Getting answers for ya ASAP. Hope you're ready to kick some AX, bro!!
-RecoverBro Zombie Specialist and Paracord Wrangler
-Independent due to lies that hurt my family. Loyal to myself and my Bro's.
Protein will be around 300g a day.
Carbs: 40g a day, post workout (with my AP), maybe 60g on a back or chest day (with AP; I have Pslin on hand also)
Fats: Depending on what Tim reports back, either a 60-80g or 40-60g a day. If I only have to dose twice a day, then 40g will come from 3-AD requirements alone, if thrice, then 60g will come from 3-AD requirements. (this is why I'm running the DCP; to help with mitochondrial fat oxidation)
Other mediating variables will be if I lift or do cardio in the morning, or if its a rest day. I'll probably take Norwegian's lead on skipping the carb replenish spike and do a two day moderate. However, if I do not need a scheduled carb replenish, because of my intended PWO carb/protein load, then I may skip out on any repleshment plan. Plenty of vegetable carbs though. I eat spinach & broccoli like crazy.
Last edited by VolcomX311; 05-13-2008 at 12:22 AM.
Tim, the hardest working rep in showbiz, got back to me about a significantly important inquiry.
We know 3-AD requires about 20g of fat, therefore, a dosing plan of 2 caps, 2caps, 2caps, would result in a minimum intake of 60g of fat for dosing purposes alone. However, Tim was investigating the idea of perhaps a 3 caps x 3 caps dosing plan. The 3x3 is plausible, however, it would require about 45g of fat per dose, which ends up to be 90g of fat intake for dosing purposes alone.
I thought to myself, "what if I did a 3x3 DCP plan along with the 3x3, 3-AD" but I'm going with the lower calories count. It'll be harder to time and schedule the 2x2x2, but its all part of the discipline right.
Tim, what's your take on the addition of Hyerdol X2 with the MassFX and Retain2 (aPCT a given) in my PCT?
What is the reasoning behind such high doses of fat with 3-AD? I've heard this argument made for orals in general, as it may help with absorption, but it seems to be getting overly emphasized with 3-AD. Is there something unique about 3-AD and fats and absorption?
I'd throw in PCS by AI instead of HX2. just a thought.
Maybe throw in 50 mg of forskolin per day. It is a great compound for recomping and is pretty cheap as a bulk.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
M.Ed. Ex Phys
Day 1: Opening Day got car bombed
Bent Over Barbell Rows
225lbs x 15 reps
275lbs x 15 reps
295lbs x 12 reps
315lbs x [this is where it all got shot to hell. I was shooting for 10 reps, but on rep number 8, I felt a painful and instantly lower body numbing, sharp pain where my old slip disc injury used to be].
I couldn't breathe because that sharp pain knocked the wind out of me. I'm normally really good about cleaning up my station, but I could tell I wouldn't be able to bend over with 45lbs in my hands, so I just walked away and was walking on glass over to the abs, floor mat area to stretch. When I took my weight belt off, the weight on my back just from standing doubled in pain and sensitivity.
I stretched my lower back awhile, sweating from the pain. It really threw my mind that I was sweating, got up, strapped on my weight belt and decided, no more horizontal resistance movements today, too much room for lumbar jerking and cheat assistance, so I at least wanted to finish up on some vertical resistance movements. I couldn't just stop yet.
Machine, Behind the Neck Pull Downs
150lbs x 15 reps
175lbs x 12 reps
190lbs x 10 reps
195lbs x 9 reps
200lbs x 8 reps
Lat Pull Downs, tip of the bar wide grip
145lbs x 15 reps
160lbs x 12 reps
175lbs x 10 reps
190lbs x 9 reps
190lbs x 8 reps
Neutral Grip Pull Ups
BW x 10 reps
BW x 8 reps
BW x 7 reps
I couldn't take it at this point. On te previous two exercises I was able to sit, so the pain wasn't as apparent, but at the pull ups station I had to remain standing between sets and that took a toll on my lower back.
I can feel it slightly pinch everytime I take a step, so it feels like I'm walking on glass. I kept my weight belt on, and it's under my shirt at work right now. I may ask to go see a Chiropractor this afternoon if the Firm covers it.
I think I should lay off of Deads and Barbell Rows for a few months. I seem to be aggravating my slip disc injury a lot more then I care to these days.
This means no more HIIT for awhile, but I don't see a problem with the stairmaster (assuming it doesn't hurt), but axial load wise, the stairmaster shouldn't be a problem.
CHEST tonight, no Db's for damn sure! I was hoping for a great opening day but things could be worse.
Edit: For those of you who are new to my logs and workout schedule. I normally have an AM lift or cardio session and a PM cardio AND lift session, but we'll see how I handle this injury today.
Put some capsaicin cream on your lower back before you train. I do this to help loosen up the fascia before deadlifts and it has helped immensely to alleviate the tightness and pain from deads.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
Bro, I'm so sorry to hear about that ! Do you think after 3 days of resting, lower back was finally loose and 'tension free,' and you didn't warm up enough on the barbell rows ? It just sounds very bad how that's how little it took to further aggravate the lumbar region, after such a long time without flare-ups!
Once again, I've got to recommend you get a hip-support belt, one of those that is 'disguised' under your work shirt. It's a much wider support, from under your hips to an inch or so underneath your chest, and you tighten it as hard as you can while still breathing comfortably. I swore by this last summer when I dealt with lumbar pain for 6-7 weeks after tweaking it doing heavy machine t-bar rows without a belt. I worked at a meat packing fascility at the time, so I was doing a lot of manual lifting - meats and various produce - and it got heavy at times, as well as very uniform and little work variation, yet the belt kept me able to function and lift what I had to lift to accomplish my job. I wore it in the gym in that period of time, as well, ditching my weight lifting belt - somewhat for good - and just focusing on more back supported exercises and more machine/cable work for further lumbar stabilization.
Man, I'm really hoping this isn't gonna be keeping you down for long, you've got a bunch of people following this log, and we've got our expectations, V ! jk, but really, rest up and don't go too nuts with the weights tonight. I'd recommend you didn't do weights, period, and just do some light incline treadmill work or stationary bike, and see how the weights feel tomorrow instead. It's not a matter of swallowing your pride, but more-so of listening to your body!
Wish you the best, bro !
Depending on whether I can see my chiro or acupuncturist may determine the rest of my day. Even just sitting here, if I tilt to my left or right, normally unconscious movements, I feel a radiating sting that occurs here and there. If I do anything major tonight it'll probably be flat bench, no incline or anything that's going to cause loading at my lumbar. However, depending on the severity of my injury, sometimes an upright, chest press machine can even hurt the lower back. I won't push it too hard, if my body gives me the middle finger tonight, I'll listen.
I think I remember someone posting on your log, the late, great theologian, VolcomX311, "pain we work through, injuries we cater to." I'll be sure to take my own advice. If I can't even flat bench, then I'll hammer, no hammer, machine, no machine. The Navy Seals Challenge, how many push ups can you do. Damn, my instincts told me to just do shrugs this morning too.
P.S. Your table salt should be arriving today
sorry the log didn't start of the way you wanted but it's not how you start it's all about how you finish. Listen to your body and good luck!
Damn volcom I'm sorry to hear that man. I've only slightly tweaked my back once before and it sucked. It put me out of commission for over a week. Hopefully it's nothing serious and it won't limit you too seriously. Just take it easy on your back and lay off the deads and rows for a while, but you know this. Hang in there bro and keep us updated.
I just spent all morning getting every kind of low back treatment possible.
I started off with some electrical muscle stimulation, which was great. Then ultrasound, which was great, I got some spinal manipulation done, which was great. Then I had to go on this Spinal Decompression Machine and my intervertebral disc inflammed so much that couldn't walk. I layed there and the Chiro didn't know what to do with me. I couldn't walk because the pain that shot through my lumbar spine was literally unbearable, I wasn't able to lift either one of my legs or support myself in an erect position. The chiropractor re-performed a bunch of orthopedic tests that I originally had no problems with, and I was positive for pain on everyone.
He helped me up and hobbled me BACK to the electrical muscle stimulation machine and I got re-treated, but it didn't help, I'm still walking like a 95 year old man. Any position other then laying prostrate or on my back creates an enormous amount of pain. I did come back to work because I can sit, but even sitting is painful.
I'm quite literally, a cripple. Not literally, I "can" technically walk. The doctor wants an MRI done and I sure as hell can't afford that, nor is my medical insurance worth a damn. It's all bad.
Without a doubt, I'll have to delay my log. The whole time at the office I kept telling myself I can still hit the gym tonight, I can still hit the gym tonight. It wasn't until my inability to walk experience hit that I realized, the gym isn't happening.
I can't even get in and out of car without using every portion of my roof and door to support myself on the way up or down like I'm scaling a vertical incline.
Whats the shelf like of 3-AD and MassFX after they've been opened? I'm one dose down the toilet.
I don't know when I'll pick it back up, probably sooner then I should if my body allows me (to walk). This sucks to say the least...
I was instructed that the pain may be worse in the morning and I may not be able to get out of bed. Bad day to have my last final.
Damn bro, I'm sorry to see a fellow warrior step down for a little while, but whatever you do, don't throw yourself further off course by jumping back in the gym prematurely !
I wish you a quick and complete healing, bro ! Keep us updated when you can !
Not yet, man, it should be up and running tonight.
Have you had any PEA experience, bro ? I'll be running Unique Nutrition's PEA (500mg, 120 caps) starting at the end of the week or beginning of next. I was going to dose it in the EARLY AM, prior to morning cardio and 8.00AM work. I'm hoping for the mood-elevation, concentration/focus boosting effects. (Mood elevation was significant the first couple of days with Leviathan Reloaded, but beyond day 3, effects were little to non).
I haven't figured out the correct dosing of PEA, so if you have a suggestion, please let me know!
Not doing so well guys. I was able to get myself out of bed this morning with less pain then yesterday. However, I couldn't bend over enough to save my life just to put some socks on, so I'm sockless today. I still get sharp shooting pains when I walk, but I've graduated from walking like a 95 year old man, to a strapping young 85 year old.
I can't sit in any position without some presence of pain and discomfort and getting up out of a chair, or in and out of a car seems to be the most painful tasks.
I'm still wearing my lifting belt (Norwegian, where did you go to get your hip stabilizing belt you were telling me about?). I think I really need one. I considered buying a cane at CVS Pharmacy yesterday, but they were all color designed for old women.
Sorry to let you guys down, I know this log had a lot of momentum going into it, but clearly, I won't be hitting any "free" weight for awhile.
Boy, you don't know how much to appreciate a healthy, functional body until you've gone gimp. Enjoy it, its a priviledge like no other.
- 5'10" 205 lbs.
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
- Rep Power
I hope you have a quick recovery. did they take any xrays yet?
This space for rent
Phenadrol Log http://anabolicminds.com/forum/suppl...-hell-did.html - AMAZING fat loss results so far
Get yourself a stabilizing belt from Wal Mart, Academy or Sports Authority. They've all got them, and I recommend it highly!
Best of luck to ya, bro ! Good seeing you won't be abandoning the board completely.
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