Muscletech CLEAR MUSCLE

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    Muscletech CLEAR MUSCLE


    Have anyone tried this supplement.
    What was your experiences?

    In muscletech they claim that people who was the part of the research gained 16.3lbs and the strength has been increased by 170lbs in main lifts. I don't believe in this but let's hear someone who has tried this.

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    ive got a few days left. i bought it after meeting a huge guy who swore buy calcium-bound hmb at 6gs a day. anyway, i havent noticed any benefits with clear; after re-reading some of the praise i came across, i noticed the reviewers were simultaneously on micro phosphatidic acid and im speculating into whether this is clouding the issue for them. that said, i am a strong responder to leucine supplementation and have not stopped running it since i started so who knows, maybe i dont see the benefits from hmb-fa because ive already got the benefit from leucine. another point about me is i dont follow the training guidlines that are catered to taking hmb; i train three times a week for about an hour and my whole thing is that i dont train too hard. im not one to be sold a training program when supp shopping, and if i had that much free time to train i wouldnt waste money on supplements.
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    I'm recovering ten times better and I'm in a 700 kcal deficit and 200g CHO fewer than maintenance levels. I really like it. I'm 5.5 weeks in and honestly might run it at a lower dose as a staple
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    ive got a few days left. i bought it after meeting a huge guy who swore buy calcium-bound hmb at 6gs a day. anyway, i havent noticed any benefits with clear; after re-reading some of the praise i came across, i noticed the reviewers were simultaneously on micro phosphatidic acid and im speculating into whether this is clouding the issue for them. that said, i am a strong responder to leucine supplementation and have not stopped running it since i started so who knows, maybe i dont see the benefits from hmb-fa because ive already got the benefit from leucine. another point about me is i dont follow the training guidlines that are catered to taking hmb; i train three times a week for about an hour and my whole thing is that i dont train too hard. im not one to be sold a training program when supp shopping, and if i had that much free time to train i wouldnt waste money on supplements.
    Interesting thoughts.

    I think this is the first real assessment of ca-hmb that I've read where somehow isn't broing out about he gained x amount of mass.

    To me, this is still just leucine and solidifies my stance with MT about them being the worst of snake oil salesmen. If anything it also shows the sad state of affairs of the everyday lifter will be willing to spend 150$+ for a three month cycle.

    Real gear will cost less with better results.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    Interesting thoughts.

    I think this is the first real assessment of ca-hmb that I've read where somehow isn't broing out about he gained x amount of mass.

    To me, this is still just leucine and solidifies my stance with MT about them being the worst of snake oil salesmen. If anything it also shows the sad state of affairs of the everyday lifter will be willing to spend 150$+ for a three month cycle.

    Real gear will cost less with better results.
    which raises another point; i can get 30 days of 6g of ca-hmb for around 10 bucks. i've seen the claims that hmb-fa is better absorbed, but ive never come across anything indicating that hmb-ca is poorly absorbed or that hmb-fa has actually been measured to be better absorbed; ive speculated that the claim to its better absorption lies in the fact that it is liquid in nature; ie the arguement that liquid supplements are better absorbed than dry ones, which very stupidly overlooks the fact that most people take their supplements with water and thus reach the same end without having to pay extra. did musletech lie anywhere? maybe not; the placebo gained 9 lbs of bodyweight, so i mean that is extraordinary and speaks to the training program. if my training program/diet has reached the point where i only gained, say 1/2lb, then clear muscle would have only added 1/6lb on top of that, so i cant say if it didnt add up to its claims. that said, they got 60 bucks out of me for this and for a product called Aplodan back in the day when i was in college and didnt know any better, so all things considered I'm biased as far as a human can get against what they make at this point. i would be interested in how people who like clear muscle respond to high dose leucine, or something like bcaa ethyl ester like i take; while only 5% of our leucine intake is said to go on to become hmb, i try to give companies the benefit of the doubt that my high leucine count, which may not equal taking hmb straight up as far as raising hmb goes, is never the less equal in terms of the benefits rendered and that those benefits do not increase when both are taken together
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    which raises another point; i can get 30 days of 6g of ca-hmb for around 10 bucks. i've seen the claims that hmb-fa is better absorbed, but ive never come across anything indicating that hmb-ca is poorly absorbed or that hmb-fa has actually been measured to be better absorbed; ive speculated that the claim to its better absorption lies in the fact that it is liquid in nature; ie the arguement that liquid supplements are better absorbed than dry ones, which very stupidly overlooks the fact that most people take their supplements with water and thus reach the same end without having to pay extra. did musletech lie anywhere? maybe not; the placebo gained 9 lbs of bodyweight, so i mean that is extraordinary and speaks to the training program. if my training program/diet has reached the point where i only gained, say 1/2lb, then clear muscle would have only added 1/6lb on top of that. that said, they got 60 bucks out of me for a product called Aplodan back in the day when i was in college and didnt know any better, so all things considered I'm biased as far as a human can get against what they make at this point. i would be interested in how people who like clear muscle respond to high dose leucine, or something like bcaa ethyl ester like i take; while only 5% of our leucine intake is said to go on to become hmb, i try to give companies the benefit of the doubt that my high leucine count, which may not equal taking hmb straight up as far as raising hmb goes, is never the less equal in terms of the benefits rendered and that those benefits do not increase when both are taken together
    Where do you get ca-HMB that cheap?
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    which raises another point; i can get 30 days of 6g of ca-hmb for around 10 bucks. i've seen the claims that hmb-fa is better absorbed, but ive never come across anything indicating that hmb-ca is poorly absorbed or that hmb-fa has actually been measured to be better absorbed; ive speculated that the claim to its better absorption lies in the fact that it is liquid in nature; ie the arguement that liquid supplements are better absorbed than dry ones, which very stupidly overlooks the fact that most people take their supplements with water and thus reach the same end without having to pay extra. did musletech lie anywhere? maybe not; the placebo gained 9 lbs of bodyweight, so i mean that is extraordinary and speaks to the training program. if my training program/diet has reached the point where i only gained, say 1/2lb, then clear muscle would have only added 1/6lb on top of that, so i cant say if it didnt add up to its claims. that said, they got 60 bucks out of me for this and for a product called Aplodan back in the day when i was in college and didnt know any better, so all things considered I'm biased as far as a human can get against what they make at this point. i would be interested in how people who like clear muscle respond to high dose leucine, or something like bcaa ethyl ester like i take; while only 5% of our leucine intake is said to go on to become hmb, i try to give companies the benefit of the doubt that my high leucine count, which may not equal taking hmb straight up as far as raising hmb goes, is never the less equal in terms of the benefits rendered and that those benefits do not increase when both are taken together
    I thought there's no real difference in adding an ethyl group to bcaas?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Where do you get ca-HMB that cheap?
    My thoughts exactly.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by cbsharpe View Post
    My thoughts exactly.....
    China at a total of 180grams
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    Quote Originally Posted by USPlabsRep View Post
    China at a total of 180grams
    Oh, okay....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Where do you get ca-HMB that cheap?
    im not sure what the rule is on this forum about mentioning other sites; it may have changed recently, but last i knew i cant say beyond that i got it in powder form from an online auction and it ships from the uk 60bucks for a kilo
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    I thought there's no real difference in adding an ethyl group to bcaas?
    well, there is certainly alot of info on forums against it; high dose leucine enables me to drastically add weight to my lifts; bcaa ethy ester has enabled me to keep that strength; at one point i backed off leucine and lost it eventually, and then regained the exact amount of strengh when adding bcaa ethyl ester; its ridiculously overpriced, but only 3 caps a day and im there
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    Quote Originally Posted by thescience View Post
    well, there is certainly alot of info on forums against it; high dose leucine enables me to drastically add weight to my lifts; bcaa ethy ester has enabled me to keep that strength; at one point i backed off leucine and lost it eventually, and then regained the exact amount of strengh when adding bcaa ethyl ester; its ridiculously overpriced, but only 3 caps a day and im there
    How high do you normally dose leucine pre-workout? Max I've done is 8gm from a 4:1:1 bcaa.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post

    How high do you normally dose leucine pre-workout? Max I've done is 8gm from a 4:1:1 bcaa.
    I dont take it preworkout. Plenty of guys do the 7g twice daily, which is a good protocall made famous in large part by muscletech actually (leukic anyone?). I found i didnt have to take that much and settled for less; sort of jard to calculate how much less because i shifted to a product called leuca-lyn which in my experience was hands down the best leucine supp of all time, that was unfortunately made by a company that got raided and shut down from what people have claimed. The stuff was dirt cheap, liposomal, and sustained release. Strangely, i put my old man on the leucine protocal and he experienced no benefits whatsoever. Anyway, i started with bcaa ethyl ester because i couldnt help but notice that the people bashing that form repped for companies that sell creatine monohydrate and all anyone has to do is mention that they like cee better than mono on a creatine forum board to get ten reps on their jock; creatine is a big money maker with way too many companies eating from the same plate, so its competitive. Anyway, theres a company, nutrabio, that specializes in aminos. Thats what they do. They believe in ethyl ester,.and if u call them and get transferred to one of their wizards, it becomes evident theyre pretty smart. They said there are alot of ethyl ester formulations that literally just have the amino dumped into the tub with the ethyl ester, and thus u have user experience reflective of the ingestion of two totally separate substances with no benefit to absorption. Also, the guy who "invented" creatine mono himself advocated creatine ethyl ester over mono. He wrote a book on it
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    Op when ever you see a claim on an advertisement, it probably meant 1 guy achieved this, and that isn't the average. HMB would probably be most beneficial on a cut to try and preserve muscle.

    Also MT's logs they are running now has you doing a set workout routine. So keep in mind anytime a new routine is being done, there will be huge gains in the first few months. Example i just started doing close stance squats. In 1 month I went from doing 225x5 to 365x3.
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    Quote Originally Posted by changemyoil66 View Post
    So keep in mind anytime a new routine is being done, there will be huge gains in the first few months. Example i just started doing close stance squats. In 1 month I went from doing 225x5 to 365x3.
    Exactly. If i woke up one day and found i was.on a new regime that had me working out all the time, i would very naturally start eating more to buffer the workload. Thats why i think even the placebo gained 9lbs of bodyweight . I also think that could explain the strength increase. All in all, i think mt played a fair game; bthe supp just wasnt made for a guy with my goals and circumstances. Im still waiting to hear about an absorption comparison between forms. for the money, it would have to be 12x better absorbed. i will be trying huge doses of ca-hmb whenever my bag decides to arrive. "Ask not what your supplement can do for you, but what you can do for your supplement" seems to apply here with regards to adding strength and bodyweight from this. Nice change with the squats bro.
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    Ive been hearing great things from some people I really trust. My bottle gets here tomorrow!! Need anything I can to help me bulk at this point, definitely at a sticking point getting past a bodyweight of 240lbs while staying fairly clean body fat wise.
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    HMB is most beneficial on a cut to preserve muslce. It wont do much if you're on a bulk.
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    I'm one of the beta(alpha)-testers of FaHMB, and I've experienced a 137lb increase between my big 3... Now mind you, I've only been squatting (atleast consistently) since January, and DL'ing since Feb. Honestly I believe this first phase of the routine is completely irrelevant to the supplement (essentially S/B/DL on M/W/F).

    You can take almost any forum mongerler (like myself) who trains in a bro sense (or a BB sense in mine, and others cases), and throw them on a PL-type routine and watch their lifts jump. Obviously my big 3 are going to jump, and jump big, it's practically the only thing I've done, and lived for (in the gym) for the last 8 weeks.

    Now if I'd made these gains on my regular routine (usually run PHAT for 3mon, twice a year) I'd be ecstatic, and confidently could stand behind this. I'd like to say I believe the next phase (Overreching/OT phase) will be the real test, but I'm not too sure it is...

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't OT/OR for a short period of time be effective for anyone?? I'm assuming especially after a low volume kind of routine like this... So of course these next two weeks of training my ass off (and more than likely eating my ass off) is going to illicit some kind of gains... Perfect idea, eh? And most of the loggers probably won't catch this and owe it all to FaHMB

    Honestly, i don't dislike MT (as I once did), and I'm actually very greatful to have this opportunity (and also be given over $200 worth of supps... hnnng).... But I really don't think it'd be fair for me to give a "real" review of this after forcefully being made to run this routine, that's obviously going to give gains (esp for someone like me)
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    Ive been using CM for just over 4 weeks now, running my own routine (high volume/frequency with built-in overreach and deload).

    Im eating in a slight cal surplus, and in this time Ive noticed some recomping that I am confident is due to CM (scale weight increased 2.5lb, stomach measurement decreased 1inch); I have never ever experienced this before.

    In the first 2 weeks CM had no noticeable effect on my training numbers, and it wasnt until I hit the overreach phase in week 3 that this changed (and quite dramatically too).

    Would I purchase CM again? Im not sure, to be honest. If it were half its current price Id be tempted to make it a staple, or maybe if I got the same effects from it at half the dose. Not sure Id want to experiment with the latter, though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MultiVitamin View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but can't OT/OR for a short period of time be effective for anyone??
    Personally I dont think 'overtraining' and 'overreaching' are equivalent, though I think they do share some similarities (they are certainly not absolute isolated opposites).

    If you're onto it with timing your deload, then yes I think overreaching can be effective for 'anyone' (whether you are pure strength training, or more hypertrophy focused). However, whether OR-ing is 'optimal' for any particular trainee would depend on their training exposure/experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheStalker View Post
    Maybe the price will drop in the futur
    Possible, but in the 50% range? I doubt it. If MT representatives are to be believed, HMBfa is expensive to produce (as reflected in the price).

    Id actually be prepared to regularly pay the current selling price if the product outperformed, significantly, all the other anabolic supplements (PA, ABE, ArA, Folli, etc). But that is something else I highly doubt.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheStalker View Post
    I dont think i have see one good log about clear muscle , with real result not just good recovery
    Most of the logs Ive seen involve the 'trainhard' program (supposedly) from Wilson's study. Id much prefer to see CM being used by trainees in other programs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Most of the logs Ive seen involve the 'trainhard' program (supposedly) from Wilson's study. Id much prefer to see CM being used by trainees in other programs.
    I second this.

    I'd like to see it specifically used in a high volume/hypertrophy program.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Most of the logs Ive seen involve the 'trainhard' program (supposedly) from Wilson's study. Id much prefer to see CM being used by trainees in other programs.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Engineer View Post
    I second this.

    I'd like to see it specifically used in a high volume/hypertrophy program.
    Why? Didn't they gain a ****load in that program? Maybe it's worth a try.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Why? Didn't they gain a ****load in that program? Maybe it's worth a try.
    Wilson said the test subjects were selected specifically because they would be 'high responders' to the training protocol. Read into that what you will, but the crucial thing here is this: how you personally respond to any particular program will depend largely on 2 things.

    1) Your short-term training environment; ie what you have become adapted to 'recently', how detrained you are currently, current volume tolerance etc etc

    2) Your long-term training environment; ie how advanced you are in terms of your progress rate capacity

    Both these factors are of course related. But I take it as given and understood that the more advanced you are then the 'slower/lesser' your progress capacity is regardless of programming. Further to this, the more advanced you are the more likely you will have to 'move away' from cookie-cutter programs...your training protocols will become more individualized.

    Cliffs: depending on your training capacity you may find the program from the study underwhelming and subsequently get jack from it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Wilson said the test subjects were
    much ado about nothing
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheStalker View Post
    I dont think i have see one good log about clear muscle , with real result not just good recovery
    few and far between
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Wilson said the test subjects were selected specifically because they would be 'high responders' to the training protocol. Read into that what you will, but the crucial thing here is this: how you personally respond to any particular program will depend largely on 2 things.

    1) Your short-term training environment; ie what you have become adapted to 'recently', how detrained you are currently, current volume tolerance etc etc

    2) Your long-term training environment; ie how advanced you are in terms of your progress rate capacity

    Both these factors are of course related. But I take it as given and understood that the more advanced you are then the 'slower/lesser' your progress capacity is regardless of programming. Further to this, the more advanced you are the more likely you will have to 'move away' from cookie-cutter programs...your training protocols will become more individualized.

    Cliffs: depending on your training capacity you may find the program from the study underwhelming and subsequently get jack from it.
    Doesn't Wilson use 400lb minimum squatters? I don't think most people would be underwhelmed. But who knows everyone online is Phil Heath.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Doesn't Wilson use 400lb minimum squatters? I don't think most people would be underwhelmed. But who knows everyone online is Phil Heath.
    I think the average squat max at the start of the study was around 315.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Doesn't Wilson use 400lb minimum squatters? I don't think most people would be underwhelmed. But who knows everyone online is Phil Heath.
    you called?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Young Gotti View Post
    you called?
    You're more like Dusty Hanshaw.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    You're more like Dusty Hanshaw.
    oh if only i had a wife like his to make me brown sugar oatmeal protean food....mmm
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Ive been using CM for just over 4 weeks now, running my own routine (high volume/frequency with built-in overreach and deload).

    Im eating in a slight cal surplus, and in this time Ive noticed some recomping that I am confident is due to CM (scale weight increased 2.5lb, stomach measurement decreased 1inch); I have never ever experienced this before.

    In the first 2 weeks CM had no noticeable effect on my training numbers, and it wasnt until I hit the overreach phase in week 3 that this changed (and quite dramatically too).

    Would I purchase CM again? Im not sure, to be honest. If it were half its current price Id be tempted to make it a staple, or maybe if I got the same effects from it at half the dose. Not sure Id want to experiment with the latter, though.
    This, I think if the price were lower it would be a no brainer staple for all serious weightlifters. The science is promising, the anecdotal reports on recovery are as well. Beginning my dosing today with high hopes as I train with a lot of volume.
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    @MultiVitamin,

    Although I cant take your 137lbs increase into factor due to the fact that you just started doing squats and deads, but I am curious how much alone did your bench go up, and body weight?
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Ive been using CM for just over 4 weeks now, running my own routine (high volume/frequency with built-in overreach and deload).

    Im eating in a slight cal surplus, and in this time Ive noticed some recomping that I am confident is due to CM (scale weight increased 2.5lb, stomach measurement decreased 1inch); I have never ever experienced this before.

    In the first 2 weeks CM had no noticeable effect on my training numbers, and it wasnt until I hit the overreach phase in week 3 that this changed (and quite dramatically too).

    Would I purchase CM again? Im not sure, to be honest. If it were half its current price Id be tempted to make it a staple, or maybe if I got the same effects from it at half the dose. Not sure Id want to experiment with the latter, though.
    I'm in the same boat. Especially given that you can almost buy a decent six week run of cell tech for the price and make better gains.

    It's helped a bit in my strength training and recovery, but is kinda underwhelming for the price.

    Great product; too expensive is would be my four word review.
    Bulking to 225, eating pwo straight from the tub... oh yeah and also I'm a banana.
    b245, s275, d365 (885 total/1000 goal)
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    Swolen and dj...it really seems to come down to one thing: is CM 70$ better than placebo? Speaking for myself, at this stage it is certainly 'something' better than nothing/placebo, but not 70$ better. You may yet come to a more favourable conclusion though, swolen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewAgeMayan View Post
    Swolen and dj...it really seems to come down to one thing: is CM 70$ better than placebo? Speaking for myself, at this stage it is certainly 'something' better than nothing/placebo, but not 70$ better. You may yet come to a more favourable conclusion though, swolen.
    Nope, and that's coming from a MT fanboy. I actually enjoy most of their products a lot.

    I'm also an honest reviewer though, and no, I wouldn't pay that for it. And it's not just $70, because it took 3 weeks for me to notice it working. If you don't run 2-3 months you're wasting your time.

    I'll recommend their various proteins, Nitro tech, creacore, nanovapor and neurocore... probably a few more. I couldn't recommenbd CM though unless cost is no issue.
    Bulking to 225, eating pwo straight from the tub... oh yeah and also I'm a banana.
    b245, s275, d365 (885 total/1000 goal)
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    I got a lot better results with it by stacking it with Cell tech.
    Orbit Nutrition Rep
    http://www.orbitnutrition.com
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