Andrew732's HGHup Experience

andrew732

andrew732

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What is HGHup?
PRODUCT DESCRIPTION:

HGHup♂ promotes radical increases in serum HGH and testosterone levels without a prescription. It is the only orally viable compound that is proven to increase HGH AND testosterone in human subjects.


PRODUCT CHARACTERISTICS:

• Increases the output of growth hormone and local IGF-1 levels
• Increases the duration/viability of growth hormone pulse mass
• Increases androgen receptor structure, function, and number
• Increases natural production of testosterone


EFFECTS RELATED TO PHYSIQUE AND LIFE ENHANCEMENT:

• Greater lean muscle mass
• Lowered body fat
• Better skin tone
• Deeper, more restful sleep
• Increased strength
• Faster healing of injuries and better recovery from physical stress/training


MAIN MECHANISMS OF ACTION:

Mucuna Pruriens, Vitamin B6 and L-Dopa: Increase Growth Hormone Output and Testosterone Production While Concurrently Decreasing Somatostatin and Prolactin

• HGHup♂ contains highly concentrated L-Dopa derived from Mucuna Pruriens What is Mucuna Pruriens? (32). L-Dopa has been shown to significantly increase levels of growth hormone in human subjects iwhen administered orally. (1, 2, 3, 33).
• Oral viability in HGHUP♂ critical for product effectiveness, as growth hormone cannot be absorbed and is rendered ineffective due to the fragility of the ingredients. Several good examples are synthetic growth hormone (see Fig. 1) and growth hormone releasing hormone (GHRH, see Fig. 2). These compounds cannot be administered orally; because of their fragile amino acid sequence is destroyed by stomach acids. This also holds true with the vast majority of the so-called “GH Boosters” and “Peptides” commonly found in sports nutrition products.
• L-Dopa and Dopamine have also been shown to inhibit prolactin, a hormone that suppresses male testosterone production. Prolactin also has a positive correlation with a second hormone called somatostatin, which decreases the both amount and effectiveness of circulating growth hormone. Therefore, by lowering prolactin (and consequently somatostatin) levels, HGHUP♂ increases both testosterone and GH production; leading to greater recovery and lean body mass (38, 39).
• Vitamin B6, is included in the formula for HGHUP♂, as it can also help further lower prolactin levels and increase the night-time peak of GH release pulse, while at the same time increasing the rise in GH associated with exercise by as much as 23% (7).

Huperzine-A: Increasing AChE Inhibition and Mean serum GH by Decreasing Somatostatin

• Huperzine-A is a strong acetylcholine esterase (AChE) inhibitor. Acetylcholine esterase inhibitors have been shown in numerous scientific studies to inhibit somatostatin via a variety of synergistic biomechanisms; all of which contribute to increased levels of growth hormone (9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18).
o Somatostatin is a hormone that exerts effects on anterior pituitary as well as pancreatic, liver and gastrointestinal function (40, 41, 42, 43) .
o Somatostatin is also important because it directly effects growth hormone release and is the major regulating factor in slowing or even stopping growth hormone output.
o Somatostatin inhibits GH secretion directly from somatotrophs and antagonizes the GH secretagogue activity of ghrelin. Breifly explain what ghrelin is and its relevance By inhibiting somatostatin, overall mean serum GH will increase (41, 42)..
o Somatostatin inhibits GH secretion indirectly via antagonizing GHRH secretion (41, 42, 43).
o It inhibits GH secretion indirectly via inhibiting the secretion of ghrelin from the stomach (42).
• Therefore, the Huperzine A, in HGHUP♂ increases the length, intensity, duration of growth hormone pulses and increase mean serum GH levels, therefore allowing for more of the positive anabolic and anti-aging benefits associated with GH.(8, 10, 12-17, 19-20).

Green Tea Extract, and (−)-epigallocatechin-3-O-gallate (EGCG): Increasing Dopa Decarboxylase Inhibition and the AChE-inhibiting Effects of HGHUP♂

• Dopamine crosses the blood/brain barrier poorly, and cannot exert optimal effects on target receptors unless enough of the compound reaches the brain. L-Dopa is freely absorbed across this barrier, and when L-dopa crosses the barrier readily, growth hormone levels increase. (1-6, 32-33)
• L-Dopa is most effective when conversion of L-Dopa to dopamine is mediated by a decarboxylase inhibitor What is a decarboxylase inhibitor and what does it do? (2, 3, 4, 5, 19, 20, 37).
• A decarboxylase inhibitor is generally administered at the same time as L-Dopa / Mucuna in order to reduce conversion of the L-dopa into dopamine in the periphery. (−)-epigallocatechin-3-O-gallate (EGCG), which is found in high amounts in the green tea extract used in HGHUP♂ has been shown in several studies to be irreversible inhibitors of Dopa decarboxylase. Are you saying here that EGCG is a decarboxylase inhibitor? This means that EGCG keeps L-dopa from converting into dopamine and allowing significant levels of L-dopa to reach the brain and increase growth hormone levels (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 37).
• EGCG has also been shown to significantly increase the effects of Huperzine A on acetylcholine esterase inhibition by increasing the transport of Hup-A ? by serum albumin. This allows for greater amounts of acetylcholine to be present, therefore allowing for greater mean serum growth hormone. Increased serum GH from HGHUP♂ allows for increased anabolism, better recovery, and increased muscle mass (19, 20).

HGHUP♂ INCREASES ANDROGEN RECEPTOR QUANTITY AND DENSITY AND CREATES A BETTER BINDING ENVIRONMENT FOR EXISTING ANDROGENS

L-Carnitine-L-Tartrate and Magnesium: Increasing Androgen Receptor Number and Density, and the Creation of a Better Binding Environment

• L-Carnitine L-Tartrate is an amino acid that has been shown to increase the number of androgen receptors in skeletal muscle, creating a better binding environment for testosterone and other androgens by allowing for a greater number of intact receptors available for hormonal interactions. (21-23)
• Magnesium has been shown in more recent studies to inhibit the binding of steroid hormone binding globulin (SHBG) and free testosterone. SHBG binds free testosterone and allows it to be excreted from the body, without binding the androgen receptor. Magnesium keeps this from happening by altering the binding affinity of testosterone to SHBG, and thereby allowing for increased amounts of free testosterone to remain active in the bloodstream. (24)
• Other human research has shown that supplemental magnesium, when taken along with other ingredients like DHEA and Zinc, can significantly increase free testosterone. (25-27)
• Therefore, HGHUP♂ allows for greater numbers of androgen receptors and a better binding environment for testosterone in skeletal muscle. This is a new breakthrough in sports supplementation as HGHUP♂ creates a better target for circulating free testosterone, allowing for greater binding of testosterone to the extra receptors which leads to increased protein synthesis, better recovery, and increased muscle mass.

HGHUP♂ INCREASES TESTOSTERONE

Mucuna Pruriens, Selenium, and Chlorophytum Borivillanum Ethanolic/Sapogenic Extract: Increasing Testosterone Levels

• Mucuna Pruriens has been shown in several recent human studies to improve testosterone levels and spermatogenesis in animal studies and humans, via prolactin inhibition. Prolactin, as mentioned earlier, is a hormone that suppresses male testosterone production (30-31, 34-36, 38-39).
• The ethanolic and sapogenic extracts of Chlorophytum Borivaillanum have also been shown in animal studies to increase testosterone, and anecdotal data from products containing this compound also point to increased testosterone and lean body mass for users of this phyto-androgenic compound. However, the mechanism of action of Chlorophytum is poorly understood. (28- 29)
• Selenium has been shown in several studies to have direct effects on the biosynthesis pathways of testosterone. Selenium is rate-limiting in testosterone production in men, and if enough selenium (selenium deficiency is very common) is not available, testosterone will not be produced in optimal levels (27).


Administration, Timing, and Dosing

• Normal GH pulses (see chart below) occur throughout the day. For a normal male in an average day, there are 10 pulses of GH secretion lasting on average 96.4 mins with 128 mins between each pulse. The largest GH pulse occurs during stages 3 and 4 of the sleep cycle. GH pulses during sleep (see Fig. 5) occur at nearly triple the rate of GH pulses during the day (44-45)
• Somatostatin release is controlled in large part by the cholinergic system. The cholinergic system is responsible for regulating the amount of acetylcholine found in the body at any given time. Acetylcholine is a neurotransmitter responsible for muscular activation in the peripheral nervous system, and tends to be excitatory in the central nervous system (CNS) (10, 11, 12, 13).
• The CNS component of acetylcholine mediates the cholinergic system, and this is important because the cholinergic system is responsible for mediating growth hormone response (11, 12, 13, 14, 15).
• The mechanism through which this is accomplished is simple: by increasing acetylcholine levels, there will be an increase in mean serum GH. HGHUP♂ increases acetylcholine via lowering levels of acetylcholine esterase or AChE (an enzyme that breaks down acetylcholine) (11, 12, 13, 14, 15).
• Taking an acetylcholine esterase inhibitor (in the case of HGHUP♂, Huperzine-A) before sleep will result in dramatically reduced somatostatin levels and dramatically increase serum GH levels (1-4, 5, 9-17,19, 20, 44, 45).
• Somatostatin seems to be the major inhibitory factor in sleep-related GH pulses. When AChE is inhibited by pryridostigmine (an AChE inhibitor very similar to Huperzine-A) GH pulse mass is increased, and mean serum GH almost doubled. In terms of potency, Huperzine-A has actually been shown to be more potent than pyridostigmine bromide in terms of AChE inhibition (9-17, 19-20) .
• There has also been a very popular trend recently of bodybuilders taking Huperzine-A along with injectible synthetic growth hormone, because the compound is so effective at inhibiting somatostatin and increasing serum GH (46)
• Taking (−)-epigallocatechin-3-O-gallate (EGCG) along with Huperzine-A will increase Hup-A’s effectiveness in inhibiting acetylcholine esterase, and its ability to allow the cholinergic system to suppress somatostatin. This has been verified in several scientific studies (19-20).
• Taking a supplement containing L-Dopa with a decarboxylase inhibitor before sleep can allow for dramatically increased levels of GH (1-5, 32- 33, 37-39).
• Hypoglycemia (low blood sugar) can also increase the amount of GH released. Insulin and GH are antagonistic, and the lower the insulin level, the higher the GH level (see chart below, 44-45).
• Timing of the dose and manipulating insulin levels before sleep is the key getting great results with HGHUP♂ (44-45, 47)
• Best results occur when a 4-6 capsule dosage is taken on an empty stomach (fasted state) 30 minutes before bedtime (44-45, 47)


Why Most OTC GH Products Are Ineffective, and How HGHUP♂ Differs

• Over the last 20 years, a variety of products that claim to boost HGH orally have been promoted in the US sports supplement market. The vast majority of these products have been completely ineffective for several reasons:
• Growth hormone is a peptide (a long chain amino acid structure), that cannot be taken in an oral form, due to the destruction of the sequence by the acidic environment of the stomach. Any supplement containing “oral growth hormone” is a scam (47).
• Many products use a combination of amino acids such as arginine and lysine in “kitchen sink” formulas, and claim that their combination is “scientifically proven” to work. Many amino acids boost growth hormone levels, but most of the time, it is only when taken intravenously, or in completely unattainable dosages that would make a normal person extremely sick. And the correct dosage is in gram amounts, not in the milligram range offered in many of these products (47).
• Even if these products allow for a viable release of GH, there is nothing present to inhibit somatostatin, which has been found to be the biggest factor in controlling GH levels (47)
• Many of these products are powdered mixes that contain sugar, artificial sweeteners, or other compounds that increase insulin secretion. As discussed above, this will render the product virtually useless due to the antagonism between insulin and growth hormone (47).
• HGHUP♂ differs from these compounds because of the nature of the formulation. Every compound in the product is designed to work in concert with the other components; no filler or ineffective components are found in this product (47).
• HGHUP♂ utilizes the latest research on compounds which have been overlooked by other companies. The secret of the product is not necessarily on the newness of the ingredient, more on the complexity, effectiveness and synergism of the blend (1-47).
• HGHUP♂ also utilizes components that boost androgen levels, increase the number and function of androgen receptors, and create an overall BETTER anabolic environment in which levels of testosterone and GH are optimized, leading to better recovery, increased lean body mass, and lower body fat (1-47).


Stacks and Tips to Maximize the Product

• Take Bio-Mend Anti-Oxidant formula
o High ORAC Value
o Protects cellular membrane
o Protects transcriptional factors (mRNA and DNA)
• In general, maintain a healthy diet and lifestyle:
o Drink Plenty of water; at least 64 oz. per day
o Ingest at least 1 gram of protein per lb. of body weight daily
o Sleep at least 7 hours per night
o Eat lots of fruits and vegetables
o Eat lots of complex carbs
o Eat 5-6 smaller protein and carb-rich meals throughout the day
o Increase calories to at least 500 Kcal/day over your normal intake
o BCAAs and Creatine will be helpful
o Avoid alcohol and tobacco
o Take HGHUP♂ on an empty stomach before going to sleep, or take it with an all-protein meal. Remember, carbohydrates/insulin decrease the effectiveness of the product.
o HGHUP♂ can be stacked with synthetic growth hormone and will make it more effective


In conclusion, HGHUP♂ in the most effective orally administered HGH and Testosterone agonist yet to be offered in the history of sports nutrition.

I really like GH releasers, just recently I tested GHENERATE by LG in which I obtained GOOD size gain along with great erection hardness, libido boost, and great mood boosts, however the recovery was not as good as Powerfull. I believe the main reason for this was its ability to RAISE prolactin levels, which for a guy like me, it has a profound effect on me. I train 7-9 hours of the day in various activities. Now that I am getting more involved with the MMA, I need as much recovery as possible because the training is INTENSE.
These are the following that I will be looking for:
Sleep - Time and Quality
Mental Alertness/Focus
Energy
Motivation
Mood/Aggression
Stress
Libido
Joints
Endurance
Strength
Quality of Training
Pump and Vascularity
Muscle Hardness/Density
Body Composition and Look
Appetite
Overall Sense of Feeling

I hope to gain strength and recovery from this product, I would not log this product had I not expected anything from it but its profile has me with great anticipation. Anyone who followed my last long would know that I had been studying for quite some time the most effective way of administrating L-dopa. All of the ingredients EXCEPT huzperine A were in my intents to combine. The synergesim to this product is exceptional I will say, and if AN gives me permission, I would LOVE to stack it with divanex, butonly with AN's permission. I have used most of their products in the past, the one thing I can say is that AN uses GREAT pure extract raws. When I used RPM, I literally got pressure headaches from the icarrin which I had not gotten from any other icarrin based product. Osteosport was another product that I LOVED from AN with great healing properties. All in all, I can not wait for the strength gains that this cycle could potentiate. Great job Dirk and the AppNut team! My log will include diet, some training, experiences, effects, sides and notes.
 
andrew732

andrew732

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Day 1

I took 2 caps preworkout to assess tolerance and boy did I get sleepy, I had to take 250mgs of caffeine to stay focused. I can not wait to take 4 caps prebed tonight.

Meals 1: bowl of cheerios with 1 cup of almond milk, 1 peach, 2 scoops of caesin whey with 1tbsp of coconut oil and a handful of cranberries.
Meal 2: 2 chicken cutlet sandwiches of sprouted grain bread, spinach, 1 bananna, and water
Meal 3: Alabacore tuna with sprouted grain bread, 1 apple, mixed greens, and water.
Meal 4: 4 tbsp of peanut butter with 5 egg whites, 1 tbsp of olive oil, 1 serving of cranberries, and water.
Meal 5: Quinoa pasta with 16 oz of sirloin steak, 1 tbsp of olive oil, mixed greens, and water.
Meal 6: 1 1/2 cups of pinto beans, broccoli, 1/4 cup of black rice, and left over chicken cutlets, and water.

Notes: Nothing to note too much except for sleepiness from 2 caps, I will update tommorow how the sleep was.
 
alwaysgaining

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hahaha i am really excited about this one, im gona run this with topical form
 
nosnmiveins

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andrew were u ever given how to dose this? like how many caps?
 
Rosie Chee

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Dosing for HGHup♂[

Watching this.

Please make comments at least THREE times a week on ALL of the following factors:

Sleep - Time and Quality
Mental Alertness/Focus
Energy
Motivation
Mood/Aggression
Stress
Libido
Joints
Endurance
Strength
Quality of Training
Pump and Vascularity
Muscle Hardness/Density
Body Composition and Look
Appetite
Overall Sense of Feeling

As far as dosing:

Dosing/Timing for HGHup♂

Resistance Training Days
Dose 1 - 3 caps 45-60 min pre-resistance training
Dose 2 - 3 caps pre-bed

Non-Resistance Training Days
Option A
Dose 1 - 3 caps first thing in the morning
Dose 2 - 3 caps pre-bed
OR
Option B
Dose 1 - 6 caps pre-bed

You may want to start out at the lower dosage for the first few days; this hits hard.


~Rosie
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AZMIDLYF

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HGHup in this bubba!!
 
SamBoz19

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I will be watching this one ;)

Cheers!:cheers:

-Sean-

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TexasLifter89

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Good Luck! I think you will be pleased.
 
metroba

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subbed
 
alwaysgaining

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yeah man i was thinking that this and testopro were a match made in supp heaven
did u test log that as well?
 
thebigt

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you know i am in. give em hell, andrew.:cheers:
 
andrew732

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yeah man i was thinking that this and testopro were a match made in supp heaven
did u test log that as well?
yet to try testopro, however I have used testofen in the past with a fun ride lol.
 
andrew732

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you know i am in. give em hell, andrew.:cheers:
Thanks bro, and thanks to all who are subscribing, I will update in a bit, just need to finish a paper.
 
thebigt

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give us a damned update will ya? the ingredients in this look fantastic, if you give this a thumbs up, it will be the next supp i try out. be looking to make an order around wednesday, so get them updates a coming.:cheers:
 
andrew732

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Day 2

Last night sleep was GREAT and DEEP, did not hear the alarm for 2 FREAKIN hours. I am getting worried that this may be the case during the week, hopefully not to bad. Felt refreshed for sure when waking up in the morning. Had a solid workout today. I only took 1 cap preworkout due to the POTENCY of the product, I need my awareness when doing physical activites, this product makes me drowsy rather quickly.

Meal1: Rolled oats, 1 grapefruit, some cookies from a friend of my mommy lol and some water
Meal 2: 2 whole eggs, 3 egg whites, 1/8 cup of olive oil, 2 tbsp of coconut oil, 2 cups of cranberries, spinach, and water.
Meal 3: Albacore tuna with sprouted grain bread, 1 tsp of olive oil, 1 apple, and water.
Meal 4: Whole grain pita with 5 tbsp of peanut butter with some macademia oil smothered over it, box of raisins, and water.
Meal 5: 3 Chicken breasts, 2 sweet potatoes, mixed greens, 1 piece of chocolate cake, and water.
Meal 6: 2 scoops of caesin protein, 2 tbsp of almond butter and 1/2 cup of almond milk.

Liking the sleep effects thus far from HGHup, can not wait for some gains.

Sleep - Time and Quality 10/10
Mental Alertness/Focus 8/10 at 1 cap I can function well and feel my movements pretty notably
Energy N/A
MotivationN/A
Mood/Aggression N/A
Stress 10/10 good sleep allows me to cope with stress
Libido N/A
Joints N/A
Endurance N/A
Strength N/A
Quality of Training N/A
Pump and Vascularity N/A
Muscle Hardness/Density N/A
Body Composition and Look N/A
Appetite N/A
Overall Sense of Feeling 10/10 good sleep does wonders in this category for me)
 
Rosie Chee

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Last night sleep was GREAT and DEEP, did not hear the alarm for 2 FREAKIN hours. I am getting worried that this may be the case during the week, hopefully not to bad. Felt refreshed for sure when waking up in the morning. Had a solid workout today. I only took 1 cap preworkout due to the POTENCY of the product, I need my awareness when doing physical activites, this product makes me drowsy rather quickly
Interesting that you found it made you drowsy. I know that after dosing I was wide awake and alert for hours afterwards and often had insomnia (and this was using the version before the one you have). I would sleep for ages though, on days that I did NOT dose it, or after several days of using because I had not been sleeping in the days before that. The sleep, when got, is deep and seems to last forever.

~Rosie
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thebigt

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Day 2

Last night sleep was GREAT and DEEP, did not hear the alarm for 2 FREAKIN hours. I am getting worried that this may be the case during the week, hopefully not to bad. Felt refreshed for sure when waking up in the morning. Had a solid workout today. I only took 1 cap preworkout due to the POTENCY of the product, I need my awareness when doing physical activites, this product makes me drowsy rather quickly.

Meal1: Rolled oats, 1 grapefruit, some cookies from a friend of my mommy lol and some water
Meal 2: 2 whole eggs, 3 egg whites, 1/8 cup of olive oil, 2 tbsp of coconut oil, 2 cups of cranberries, spinach, and water.
Meal 3: Albacore tuna with sprouted grain bread, 1 tsp of olive oil, 1 apple, and water.
Meal 4: Whole grain pita with 5 tbsp of peanut butter with some macademia oil smothered over it, box of raisins, and water.
Meal 5: 3 Chicken breasts, 2 sweet potatoes, mixed greens, 1 piece of chocolate cake, and water.
Meal 6: 2 scoops of caesin protein, 2 tbsp of almond butter and 1/2 cup of almond milk.

Liking the sleep effects thus far from HGHup, can not wait for some gains.

Sleep - Time and Quality 10/10
Mental Alertness/Focus 8/10 at 1 cap I can function well and feel my movements pretty notably
Energy N/A
MotivationN/A
Mood/Aggression N/A
Stress 10/10 good sleep allows me to cope with stress
Libido N/A
Joints N/A
Endurance N/A
Strength N/A
Quality of Training N/A
Pump and Vascularity N/A
Muscle Hardness/Density N/A
Body Composition and Look N/A
Appetite N/A
Overall Sense of Feeling 10/10 good sleep does wonders in this category for me)
the sleep part really interests me, i have been a cronic insomniac most of my life. also is there enough l-carnitine-l-tartrate in this to have the effect you were telling me about, or would i have to buy additional l-carnitine?
 
andrew732

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the sleep part really interests me, i have been a cronic insomniac most of my life. also is there enough l-carnitine-l-tartrate in this to have the effect you were telling me about, or would i have to buy additional l-carnitine?
That is a question that you would have to ask AppNut, not sure how much they put because I use LCLT at 1-2g a day.
 
thebigt

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That is a question that you would have to ask AppNut, not sure how much they put because I use LCLT at 1-2g a day.
maybe easy will chime in. thanks andrew, hope you enjoy this. nice log btw.:cheers:
 
andrew732

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Interesting that you found it made you drowsy. I know that after dosing I was wide awake and alert for hours afterwards and often had insomnia (and this was using the version before the one you have). I would sleep for ages though, on days that I did NOT dose it, or after several days of using because I had not been sleeping in the days before that. The sleep, when got, is deep and seems to last forever.

~Rosie
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That is the funny thing about dopamine either excess dopamine production will result in sleepiness or insomnia.
 
Rosie Chee

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That is the funny thing about dopamine either excess dopamine production will result in sleepiness or insomnia.
I see...I was also using Lipotrophin-PM with it...I never had these issues using IGF-2 (and also always stacked with Lipotrophin-PM)...

~Rosie
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thebigt

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That is the funny thing about dopamine either excess dopamine production will result in sleepiness or insomnia.
wow-then judging from what rosie said, i should try the 6 at night and see if i get sleep or just more insomnia. if more insomnia then 6 early in the morning would be better? now i really want to try this.
 
andrew732

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wow-then judging from what rosie said, i should try the 6 at night and see if i get sleep or just more insomnia. if more insomnia then 6 early in the morning would be better? now i really want to try this.
Yup, but here is the thing T, as one continues to develop a feel for l-dopa, the up-lifting feeling will turn into a sleepy feeling, that is the reason why most psychologists do not prescribe dopamine agonists, they are too hard to predict, unlike SSRI's.
 
andrew732

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I see...I was also using Lipotrophin-PM with it...I never had these issues using IGF-2 (and also always stacked with Lipotrophin-PM)...

~Rosie
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LIPO PM is great stuff, bacopa is one my FAVORITE adaptogens, its the only adaptogen that from first usage will NOT cause an adrenal lift. I made the mistake when I started out taking adaptogens by taking rhodiola around 6pm, and could NOT fall asleep that night, adaptogens for the most part have very similar mechanisms to l-dopa.
 
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Yup, but here is the thing T, as one continues to develop a feel for l-dopa, the up-lifting feeling will turn into a sleepy feeling, that is the reason why most psychologists do not prescribe dopamine agonists, they are too hard to predict, unlike SSRI's.
exactly, that is why i was going to try the 6 in the morning if the 6 at night didn't do it. bro-logic tells me that i would be plenty sleepy by bedtime if it gives me a kick throughout the day-see where i am going?
 
Rosie Chee

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wow-then judging from what rosie said, i should try the 6 at night and see if i get sleep or just more insomnia. if more insomnia then 6 early in the morning would be better? now i really want to try this.
You DO have to remember that I did not react the same way that the MALE beta testers did. Whether that is because I am considerably lighter than they were or because I am a female I do not know...Also bear in mind that everything affects people differently and that everyone has their own 'sweet spot' with different products.


Yup, but here is the thing T, as one continues to develop a feel for l-dopa, the up-lifting feeling will turn into a sleepy feeling, that is the reason why most psychologists do not prescribe dopamine agonists, they are too hard to predict, unlike SSRI's.
As mentioned above, everyone will have a different experience with different products, L-Dopa or not. I know that personally I never get and "up-lifting feeling" OR a "sleepy feeling" on using any other product that contains L-Dopa, and that is stacking more than one product that contains L-Dopa at once.

~Rosie
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andrew732

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exactly, that is why i was going to try the 6 in the morning if the 6 at night didn't do it. bro-logic tells me that i would be plenty sleepy by bedtime if it gives me a kick throughout the day-see where i am going?
BRUTAL, bro you willl be dragging your butt to do things, l-dopa rips me bro, and that is with plenty of sleep, lol, you are a beast if you can pull it off, espeically with this supp.
 
thebigt

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LIPO PM is great stuff, bacopa is one my FAVORITE adaptogens, its the only adaptogen that from first usage will NOT cause an adrenal lift. I made the mistake when I started out taking adaptogens by taking rhodiola around 6pm, and could NOT fall asleep that night, adaptogens for the most part have very similar mechanisms to l-dopa.
6pm versus 8am, big difference.
 
andrew732

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Its very possible Rosie, also to consider the female brain is different than the male brain. As I stated before, l-dopa is a very tricky supp, and dopamine can go in many different directions.
 
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BRUTAL, bro you willl be dragging your butt to do things, l-dopa rips me bro, and that is with plenty of sleep, lol, you are a beast if you can pull it off, espeically with this supp.
andrew, i AM an insomniac. i go for days on a few hours sleep until i finally break down and pop a klonipin-klonipin kills my sex drive and i hate them because of that, otherwise i would be taking one ed. if this can somehow get me some sleep without the f'ing klonipin i will be very happy-
 
andrew732

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andrew, i AM an insomniac. i go for days on a few hours sleep until i finally break down and pop a klonipin-klonipin kills my sex drive and i hate them because of that, otherwise i would be taking one ed. if this can somehow get me some sleep without the f'ing klonipin i will be very happy-
LOL, what sleep med are you taking?
 
Rosie Chee

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LIPO PM is great stuff, bacopa is one my FAVORITE adaptogens, its the only adaptogen that from first usage will NOT cause an adrenal lift. I made the mistake when I started out taking adaptogens by taking rhodiola around 6pm, and could NOT fall asleep that night, adaptogens for the most part have very similar mechanisms to l-dopa.
IGF-2 contains BOTH L-Dopa and Rhodiola Rosea; I never had an issue re falling asleep after dosing pre-bed.


6pm versus 8am, big difference.
Yeah, you would have to try the product to determine that. I personally didn't find a difference re results in timing of dosages, and I used several different protocols over the course of the beta testing.


Its very possible Rosie, also to consider the female brain is different than the male brain. As I stated before, l-dopa is a very tricky supp, and dopamine can go in many different directions.
Possibly.

Anyways, back to Andrew's log.

~Rosie
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klonipin-about the same as xanax. it's a benzo.
Benzos are VERY addictive, have you ever had a neurolocisis done? The specialist might be able to determine what is causing the lack of sleep.
 
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Benzos are VERY addictive, have you ever had a neurolocisis done? The specialist might be able to determine what is causing the lack of sleep.
give me a pm, i don't want rosie mad at me. lol.:cheers:
 
andrew732

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give me a pm, i don't want rosie mad at me. lol.:cheers:
Gotcha, although as you know me T, I like to educate as well as be educated, so in my logs questions and answers are always welcomed.:cheers:
 
strategicmove

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LIPO PM is great stuff, bacopa is one my FAVORITE adaptogens, its the only adaptogen that from first usage will NOT cause an adrenal lift. I made the mistake when I started out taking adaptogens by taking rhodiola around 6pm, and could NOT fall asleep that night, adaptogens for the most part have very similar mechanisms to l-dopa.
Bacopa monnieri is not a classic adaptogen (an agent that fortifies the body's response to mental, emotional, and physical sources of stress, without inducing an imbalance between the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems), and adaptogens (standardized for the known active agents), within recommended dosages, should not disrupt sleep patterns. I know individual responses may be different, especially because of the Rhodiola example you gave. Assuming you meant Rhodiola rosea standardized for rosavins and salidrosides, it should not induce sleep disturbances in users, as it has been shown to be both sedative (in the sense of calming) and hypnotic (in the sense of sleep-inducing). An exception could occur, though, if Rhodiola rosea somehow, due to peculiar physiological factors, overstimulates energy metabolism (ATP synthesis and re-synthesis) and norepinephrine synthesis in some users relative to serotonin and natural feel-good opoids (for example, beta-endorphins). In my case, I have been taking 250mg of Rhodiola rosea (standardized for 3% rosavins and 1% salidrosides) twice daily for about two months now without the slightest negative impact on my sleep patterns. I actually take 500mg sometimes (in addition to some other synergists) just before sleep to optimize rest and recovery.

Looking forward to how your log unfolds, Andrew! :thumbsup:
 
SamBoz19

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Bacopa monnieri is not a classic adaptogen (an agent that fortifies the body's response to mental, emotional, and physical sources of stress, without inducing an imbalance between the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems), and adaptogens (standardized for the known active agents), within recommended dosages, should not disrupt sleep patterns. I know individual responses may be different, especially because of the Rhodiola example you gave. Assuming you meant Rhodiola rosea standardized for rosavins and salidrosides, it should not induce sleep disturbances in users, as it has been shown to be both sedative (in the sense of calming) and hypnotic (in the sense of sleep-inducing). An exception could occur, though, if Rhodiola rosea somehow, due to peculiar physiological factors, overstimulates energy metabolism (ATP synthesis and re-synthesis) and norepinephrine synthesis in some users relative to serotonin and natural feel-good opoids (for example, beta-endorphins). In my case, I have been taking 250mg of Rhodiola rosea (standardized for 3% rosavins and 1% salidrosides) twice daily for about two months now without the slightest negative impact on my sleep patterns. I actually take 500mg sometimes (in addition to some other synergists) just before sleep to optimize rest and recovery.

Looking forward to how your log unfolds, Andrew! :thumbsup:
I agree with most of what you said here Ike. The only thing I will add on is that Rhodiola Rosea is also known to cause irritability, restlessness, and for some...insomnia as rhodiola rosea does mildly stimulate the nervous system. However, this depends upon the dosage and the individual. I like you can take 500mg to a gram a day and it works great for me.

Cheers!:cheers:

-Sean-

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.... The only thing I will add on is that Rhodiola Rosea is also known to cause irritability, restlessness, and for some...insomnia as rhodiola rosea does mildly stimulate the nervous system. However, this depends upon the dosage and the individual....
My post also covers these.
 
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also to consider the female brain is different than the male brain.
in many many many ways ;)

i'm not sure on the amount of LCLT in HGHUP, it is a proprietary blend so i'm not sure they'll even tell me :)
 
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in many many many ways ;)

i'm not sure on the amount of LCLT in HGHUP, it is a proprietary blend so i'm not sure they'll even tell me :)
gonna order some of this wed, with now l-carnitine and bulk alcar. got to finish a log i am running then will try this out.
 
andrew732

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Bacopa monnieri is not a classic adaptogen (an agent that fortifies the body's response to mental, emotional, and physical sources of stress, without inducing an imbalance between the sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous systems), and adaptogens (standardized for the known active agents), within recommended dosages, should not disrupt sleep patterns. I know individual responses may be different, especially because of the Rhodiola example you gave. Assuming you meant Rhodiola rosea standardized for rosavins and salidrosides, it should not induce sleep disturbances in users, as it has been shown to be both sedative (in the sense of calming) and hypnotic (in the sense of sleep-inducing). An exception could occur, though, if Rhodiola rosea somehow, due to peculiar physiological factors, overstimulates energy metabolism (ATP synthesis and re-synthesis) and norepinephrine synthesis in some users relative to serotonin and natural feel-good opoids (for example, beta-endorphins). In my case, I have been taking 250mg of Rhodiola rosea (standardized for 3% rosavins and 1% salidrosides) twice daily for about two months now without the slightest negative impact on my sleep patterns. I actually take 500mg sometimes (in addition to some other synergists) just before sleep to optimize rest and recovery.

Looking forward to how your log unfolds, Andrew! :thumbsup:
Thanks for stopping by Ike, very well written, I had a rare case of the stimulation effect, which I felt it was because my CNS was recovering from a panic attack. As always, I stick to the standard of 3%rosavins and 1% salidrosides. Bacopa is the shaz, definitely an adaptogen I try to use on a monthly basis.
 

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