Icariin / Testofen : The Thundergod Stack

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    Arrow Icariin / Testofen : The Thundergod Stack


    TheThundergod Stack
    ~2g Bulk Horny Goat Weed (20% Icariin)
    ~2g Bulk Testofen

    While being entertained by Thundergod's philosophical language in his logs, I found a bunch of gems of advice along the way. The man strongly stands by his bulk powder icariin and testofen stack. IMO his opinion is as honest and reliable as anyone on this board.

    I'm currently on day 20 of post cycle therapy following a Havoc/Furazadrol to Superdrol bridge. The cycle was very successful and had a relatively quick recovery on all accounts EXCEPT for libido.

    Unfortunately, I'm a non-responder to just about every test booster that I've tried to this point. I usually respond very well to libido enhancers such as Paravol, Ejaculoid, and tribulus. Unfortunately, no response this time during this difficult time period.

    My main goal for this stack is libido enhancement. If I get some strength or lean mass from the stack, it will be a bonus as I honestly don't expect much in that category.

    Testofen Review

    Pros
    -significantly increased testicular mass
    -mild pde5-inhibitor like effects with male size
    -mild libido enhancement
    -mild muscle hardness
    -mild vascularity
    -mild mood enhancement

    Cons
    -severe gas
    -mild laxative like effects with soft stool
    -most will want to cap this powder, although some might tolerate it
    -takes about 14 days to "kick in"

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    Good feedback early on. Keep us updated. What were you dosing the trib at that it didnt work this time? Proto/sapo content in it?
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    Bulk Testofen was good at 2g/ED. 4g should show even more effects.

    I wish we carried some bulk Naringin/Bioperine to make your icariin better absorpted, but 4g should be more than enough. With 800mg/day actives, you might notice dry joints, just up the fish oils/EFA's.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Good feedback early on. Keep us updated. What were you dosing the trib at that it didnt work this time? Proto/sapo content in it?
    I was taking 2 tabs of the 1g NOW trib twice per day. I'm pretty sure it's either 40 or 45% steroidal sap. Nothing against the prop blends or the trib, I just think I was shut down hard and then may have overzealously squashed estrogen on top of that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steveoph View Post
    Bulk Testofen was good at 2g/ED. 4g should show even more effects.

    I wish we carried some bulk Naringin/Bioperine to make your icariin better absorpted, but 4g should be more than enough. With 800mg/day actives, you might notice dry joints, just up the fish oils/EFA's.
    I've dabbled with Fenugreek in the past and found it to be only moderately effective. It's still a bit unclear to me the difference between fenugreek and testofen as I admittedly still have some more research to do. These bulk powders are cheap which allows me to dose aggressively at TG's recommendation.

    On the flip side, you make an interesting point on the joint issue. If issues arise, I can always back off on the dosage. I've had my right elbow reconstructed and dislocated my left shoulder in the past, but haven't had any issues in about 6-8 months thankfully.
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    I'll be following along celc. I agree with our boy "ThunderGod". He's most certainly a great asset to this board.

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    Day 1

    GAG, twice today I choked down 2g each of the testofen and HGW. The HGW absolutely MUST be capped fellas. I had to play some serious mind games to not barf my brains out. It's almost as bad as bulk cissus powder.

    The fen MIGHT be tolerable as a powder. But it's still some pretty nasty stuff. If I have enough nutracaps, I'll be capping both powders tomorrow.

    The consistency of both powders is unusually dry, which makes for poor dump and chase strategies.

    No changes to report other than a few easily provoked libido surges. I have a feeling this stack is going to do the trick within a few days

    Just to add to detail, I'm still finishing out my Torem taper alongside a nice easy 300mg dose of 6oxo. I'll eventually taper the 6oxo as well.

    Others supps:
    creatine mono
    occasional xtend
    either 2 caps RPM or 1/2 scoop Fast Twitch preworkout
    multi/fish oil/ yadda yadda
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    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Day 1

    GAG, twice today I choked down 2g each of the testofen and HGW. The HGW absolutely MUST be capped fellas. I had to play some serious mind games to not barf my brains out. It's almost as bad as bulk cissus powder.

    The fen MIGHT be tolerable as a powder. But it's still some pretty nasty stuff. If I have enough nutracaps, I'll be capping both powders tomorrow.

    The consistency of both powders is unusually dry, which makes for poor dump and chase strategies.

    No changes to report other than a few easily provoked libido surges. I have a feeling this stack is going to do the trick within a few days
    Just to add to detail, I'm still finishing out my Torem taper alongside a nice easy 300mg dose of 6oxo. I'll eventually taper the 6oxo as well.

    Others supps:
    creatine mono
    occasional xtend
    either 2 caps RPM or 1/2 scoop Fast Twitch preworkout
    multi/fish oil/ yadda yadda
    I am REALLY trying to choke back the laughter right now!! And I know it's not even funny. The HGW is THE worst tasting stuff I have ever put upon my palate! I still do the "dump and chase" with both products. It won't kill ya! ha ha Might make you wish it would however!! But at the same time it (HGW) is THE most effective libido kicker I have found. I'll look up a study I saw showing how much of the actives in it (the Icariin) compares to the active ingredient in viagra. The Sidefinil or whatever it's called. I shoulda looked it up before posting. But I'll find it if you're interested. But from memory, 1 gram of HGW provides 200 mg. of Icariin which is equivalent to 20 mg. of the sidefinil (SP??) in the viagra. I tend to believe it. And you're already experiencing a libido surge as well. It takes a couple of days for most compounds to start working in the body, so just hang in there brother celc. And the Testofen in the dosages you're taking is going to act like Clomid from my experiences. Did you know the studies done at GenCorp only used 600 mg. of Testofen per day?? And free test doubled after 6 weeks at that small dose. They showed bloodwork from many testers ranging from hard training athletes to non-trained persons. And you're taking 4 grams??!! I only take 2 grams at most. You are gonna love 4 grams of this ball-swelling stuff!! Sorry for the extrememly wordy response, I just wanted to give you the reasons why I think the 2 compounds work so well for me. I used it for my last PCT, and now I've been on a natty run for 3 weeks and I just decided to continue the 2 compounds and consider it a real long PCT (8 weeks) and my libido for the last 3 weeks has been downright frightening. I've turned into a sexual Mr. Hyde!! But Mrs. Thunder is loving it!!!! Keep me updated about your success with this celc. I KNOW it will prove successful for you!! I push these 2 products and DHEA all the time on these forums. It's nice to find some people listen and receive the benefits thereof!! And I am totally humbled by your kind comments. And Trauma1's kind words as well. You gentlemen have been incredibly helpful to me over my 11 month stay here so far. Danke mein bruders!! Bis Spater!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    I'll be following along celc. I agree with our boy "ThunderGod". He's most certainly a great asset to this board.
    Bro. I don't even know how to respond to this. I have a lump in my throat right now. I am so humbled by your kindness and congeniality. You are a total gentlemen sir. It has been my honor and pleasure to get to know you on these forums. People like yourself, celc5, Tripdog, Crader, and many others have been a real blessing to the Thundergod since I've been here. I couldn't mention everybody else or this thread would be filled with names of the nice people here who have befriended the Thundergod. Thank you Trauma1, and thanks to all the others!!! I LOVE YOU ALL!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    I just think I was shut down hard and then may have overzealously squashed estrogen on top of that.
    I'm going to have to be a little bit nosey here and ask what you used that squashed your estrogen. I'm sure we have the culprit here in your libido problem. Everytime I have seen people lower estrogen too much, this happens. It's what happens with ATD that makes most people hate it. It does an amazing job at lowering estrogen. Too good. Above 80%. It's just too strong for people to be taking 100 mg. doses of it. I only use 25 mg. of it and I'm 260 lbs!! We have to be careful with these AI's. A little usually goes a long way. The Havoc itself was keeping estro at bay, were you using something more??!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    I will without a doubt be following this one ! Reduced libido is something I deal with as a result of stressing out about work/school and dieting hardcore. Every time I cut, my libido is virtually non-existant !

    Best of luck to you ! I'm hoping this'll convince me to run Icariin and/or HGW alongside of Activate Xtreme just around the corner . .

    And ThunderGod, you're a man of wise words, indeed. And without a doubt a great asset to this site!
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    I am subbed for this ride, interested in seeing how it goes
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    And now 2 more of my Viking Norse brothers have arrived!!! Wilkommen Bruders!! Vikinginc, your kindness is without bounds my friend. Truly the heart of the Thundergod sings with joy anon this morning!! Odin Bless You All!!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    Great info TG. I was thinking Coq Diesel had a similar profile of ingredients but I am unsure and cannot look it up (at work). Although I bet no where near those dosages.
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    Day 2

    Quote Originally Posted by thundergod View Post
    from memory, 1 gram of HGW provides 200 mg. of Icariin which is equivalent to 20 mg. of the sidefinil (SP??) in the viagra
    Interesting. I'll look forward to learning more if you come up with a link to the study. There is some good icariin information in the Drive/RPM posts in the AN forum. They were pretty convincing evidence to back up your recommendation.

    Quote Originally Posted by thundergod View Post
    Testofen...act like Clomid...ball-swelling stuff!!
    Interestingly, my girl told me last night that my balls felt huge. I figured it was probably because she just felt them atrophied over the past few weeks I'll keep that in mind as time goes by.

    Quote Originally Posted by thundergod View Post
    I'm going to have to be a little bit nosey here and ask what you used that squashed your estrogen.
    I used AX Superdrol in the second half of my cycle in a bridge, which I believe is more anti-estrogenic than I anticipated. I ran TD form/trione at a low dose alongside to maintain libido and to prevent gyno. However, the libido was strong until the last day of the cycle when it crashed. Ya, too much anti-estrogen probably.

    Then I ran Torem at the typical aggressive taper starting at 120. It brought back testicular mass really quickly but is a proven libido killer for me. I probably should have kept running the form/trione for a week or 2 into pct. That was stupid stopping the SD and AI combo all at once in terms of libido. But, health wise, I think it was a great move because I feel fully recovered today at day 22 pct.

    Quote Originally Posted by vikinginc View Post
    Reduced libido is something I deal with as a result of stressing out about work/school and dieting hardcore
    In my experience, all of the typically popular libido enhancers do the trick when stress is affecting libido. I also suggest USP labs PowerFull or bulk tryptophan to enhance quality of sleep to reduce stress. 500mg-1g of Tyrosine with my morning shake and pre/during drinks also has mood enhancing/stress reducing affects for me. All of the above are really cheap and worth a shot IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by str1 View Post
    I am subbed for this ride, interested in seeing how it goes
    Welcome aboard my friend. Feel free to join the discussion!

    Quote Originally Posted by Royd The Noyd View Post
    Great info TG. I was thinking Coq Diesel had a similar profile of ingredients but I am unsure and cannot look it up (at work). Although I bet no where near those dosages.
    You're probably right. You're going to see some small doses of both HGW and fen in a lot of prop blend products. If you read closely, you'll see different active percentages of the HGW listed as Icariin (see RPM/Drive labels). And yes, prop blends are almost always waaay underdosed. So the bulk powders are going to let me experiment with dosages without breaking the bank.
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    If looking for any additional support, you may want to look into Sustain Alpha. Stuff is awesome and raises libido quite a bit for me, even after a long surpressive cycle.

    Also, fen always makes the balls hang low and wobble to and fro.. good stuff.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trauma1 View Post
    I'll be following along celc. I agree with our boy "ThunderGod". He's most certainly a great asset to this board.
    Agreed.
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    Mattikus, did you have any testicular atrophy during your said suppressive cycle? If so, how quickly did mass return with Sustain? Did you also use a serm, or just the res?

    Beau, welcome brotha!

    I just finished capping my HGW. I got 270 "0" caps from the 100 grams so that's 370mg per cap. I'm gonna take 5 caps morning and 5 caps evening which are equal to about 1850mg per dose (total 3700mg/day).

    I've also found that the testofen mixes just fine with Syntrax Iced Tea protein OR OJ/vanilla protein. The aftertaste is really potent, but thankfully doesn't stick around. I'm also going to back off on that dosage to 1g 2x per day (total of 2g) because of TG's suggestion and Stephof's suggestion. That should make the taste more tolerable as well.
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    Day 4

    The stack is starting to kick in libido wise. I had improved male performance last night. It was better than the past few weeks, but still not quite up to my normal Leon Phelps status

    The main thing I noticed was improved stamina and ability to maintain for a bit longer session.

    I'm pleased that this inexpensive stack is kicking in a bit so quickly. I anticipate more good things are to come
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    Dont worry you'll be there in no time I'm sure. The PCT's I have done with sustain seemed pretty effective. Its hard to say it was all due to Sustain alone since every pct I have done has been very successful even with different protocols.

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    damn, a celc5 log with a double whammy of tg thrown in, better take some notes.
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    Royd, thanks for the Sustain feedback. And, it's refreshing when people actually get my silly jokes

    TheBigT, I knew you'd be on board eventually. Just trying out some alternatives to the test boosters.

    Another update for today, I took my second dose of HGW preworkout just to experiment. And I had a sick pump today. I'd say I typically have average vascular response in the gym, but today was noticably enhanced. I have no idea if the HGW had any effect on strength or endurance bc the workout generally very light. I'll experiment more with this as I go.

    I keep forgetting to mention. When I was researching the testofen, I came across IDS testofen. One of it's claims was that testofen had PDE-5 inhibitory qualities. I dunno bout that, cause a single drop of Aspire liquid has me going crazy for 48 hrs. This is another topic I'm sure we'll revisit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    Another update for today, I took my second dose of HGW preworkout just to experiment. And I had a sick pump today. I'd say I typically have average vascular response in the gym, but today was noticably enhanced. I have no idea if the HGW had any effect on strength or endurance bc the workout generally very light. I'll experiment more with this as I go.

    I keep forgetting to mention. When I was researching the testofen, I came across IDS testofen. One of it's claims was that testofen had PDE-5 inhibitory qualities. I dunno bout that, cause a single drop of Aspire liquid has me going crazy for 48 hrs. This is another topic I'm sure we'll revisit.
    First: The HGW has a xanthine effect on me as well.It makes me feel like I do when taking a light ECA stack. It gives me a energy rush for a while. Great for pre-workout. Be sure to take one of your doses 1 or 2 hours B4 WO. Second: I've read that about the Testofen also. From IDS. Have you seen the GenCorp studies on Testofen that showed bloodwork from the testers?? That one is very interesting! I'm glad you're liking the stack. Maybe more people will jump on the Thundergod-Sex-Stack!! You'll make love like a GOD!!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    Day 6

    Male performance stamina is really nice with this stack. I'm very pleased that I haven't been using any Aspire since I started with HGW/Testofen. Desire remains a bit shaky but is slowly getting better every day.

    Workouts have been great but I honestly don't think either has made an impact at this point, other than vascularity. I'm not sure that I feel anything like TG described in terms of ECA effect. I've used ephedrine quite a bit last summer and NOTHING comes close to 25 or 50mg of ephedrine. However, I'm realistic and patient as this might be something that builds up in the system with time.

    I'd be VERY interested with seeing the GenCorp studies on testofen that TG mentioned. I've had a friend in town for the holiday weekend and just haven't had the time to hit the old search button.

    Off topic, I went to the Pro Football Hall of Fame on Friday. I swear that boosted testosterone as much as any supplement!!!
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    Did you happen to see all of this info celc? http://Testofen Benefits? I'm pretty sure you might have seen this one when you bought your testofen. I'll try to find the GenCorp studies showing the bloodwork of the testers for you when I have the time. Got to rush off to work right now!! Bis Spater!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

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    sinner, Canton's a pretty unassuming town. But man, worth the trip for anyone who has never been to the HOF. My favorite part was definately the memorabilia from the players in the 90's... Elway, Marino, Barry Sanders. So much that I had to get out an old '99 playoff VHS of Denver v. Miami

    TG, broken link brotha, but I'd guess you're talking about the write-up for the bulk powder. So yes, it sounds impressive. And I had 2 people ask me if I doused myself in syrup before going to holiday events Ha! For those who don't know, the Testofen will make you smell like syrup/honey just like fenugreek dose.
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    I am following just in case I need a libido stack down the road!

    Another great Celc log
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    UNC, welcome bro!

    Day 7

    Body comp wise, I think I felt some hardening today. Nothing incredibly spectacular, but it was enough to build a little anticipation to see what happens in week 2 and 3. Vascularity was mildly enhanced again today, but definately enough for me to notice.

    Workout wise, I haven't noticed any enhanced strength, endurance, motivation, or stim-like effects.

    Libido is a bit shaky today. But I'm confident that I could have performed to a satisfactory level if needed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by celc5 View Post
    UNC, welcome bro!

    Day 7

    Body comp wise, I think I felt some hardening today. Nothing incredibly spectacular, but it was enough to build a little anticipation to see what happens in week 2 and 3. Vascularity was mildly enhanced again today, but definately enough for me to notice.

    Workout wise, I haven't noticed any enhanced strength, endurance, motivation, or stim-like effects.

    Libido is a bit shaky today. But I'm confident that I could have performed to a satisfactory level if needed.
    Sorry about that broken link I posted earlier. I'll find some more. But it was the one you read on BN's site when you purchased your Testofen. I assume you got it at BN. Even though you will experience "some" body comp changes, and a slight increase in vascularity, this stack is not primarily for strength or stim-like effects, nor even any NOS type of results. I think those are just a couple of the "fringe" benefits that go along with it. It primarily is a Test-Recovery stack. The Icariin is a "testosterone-mimicker" and the fenugreek is like natty Clomid and encourages the release of LH/FSH. So it may not be a pure libido enhancer. But more accurately, it's a performance enhancer! This is what I mainly experience from it. This is why I always include this stack in my PCT's. And about the difference in Libido/Performance: I have found that there are certain compounds that improve performance, but libido is a tricky little mechanism. As long as I can perform whenever the situation calls for it, I'm not too worried about the intense libido-desire or even craving of sexual contact. As long as my Soldier can stand at attention when revele sounds, that's what really matters most!!
    THE PAIN YOU ENDURE TODAY WILL PRODUCE THE POWER YOU ENJOY TOMORROW!!

    "Ye are gods, and all of you are children of the most High."
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