dbol/sus250/deca

james c

james c

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im planning a cycle off the above on the near future
dbol for 4 weeks at 30mg
deca for 7 weeks at 200mg
sus250 at 250mg for 8 or 10 weeks

nothin 2 strong for my first one.just tryin 2 get as much info as possible the now.i have clomid nolvadex and hcg.
should i take nolvadex during it plus at wot dose.
should i mix 200mg off deca with 250 mg off sus and inject it all at once.reapted once a week thanks for any info
 
UnrealMachine

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Maybe a little higher sus:deca ratio, or just more sus really, 250mg nothing wrong with that dose but a bit more and you'll get more effects, 250 is the minimum, shuts you down but low effects

Dbol 1-4 30mg ED
Sus 1-10 125mg EOD (assuming you have 250mg/ml? this is probably best way to run it)
Deca 1-8 200mg EW

Sus needs to be shot more frequently than deca so forget same barrel

Should wait around 2 weeks after last sus injection b4 starting nolva protocol 40/40/20/20

HCG useful but not needed for 10 weeker

Some arimidex might be more useful
 
tnick7

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im planning a cycle off the above on the near future
dbol for 4 weeks at 30mg
deca for 7 weeks at 200mg
sus250 at 250mg for 8 or 10 weeks

nothin 2 strong for my first one.just tryin 2 get as much info as possible the now.i have clomid nolvadex and hcg.
should i take nolvadex during it plus at wot dose.
should i mix 200mg off deca with 250 mg off sus and inject it all at once.reapted once a week thanks for any info

This is your first cycle? If so thats way too much IMO.

Go for Test E/C or Sus @ 500mg/week for 10 weeks with nolva for PCT. If you have any experience with OTC orals (maybe SD, PP, Havoc) you could use that Week 1-4 as a jump, but thats plenty.
 
james c

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This is your first cycle? If so thats way too much IMO.

Go for Test E/C or Sus @ 500mg/week for 10 weeks with nolva for PCT. If you have any experience with OTC orals (maybe SD, PP, Havoc) you could use that Week 1-4 as a jump, but thats plenty.
thanks alot guys for the info.will asks yous for more info nearer the time.not planning in doing it for another few months.is it hard 2 keep gains from only test cycle.i have got deca/sus/dbol ready but maybe just keep the deca for another time
 
tnick7

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thanks alot guys for the info.will asks yous for more info nearer the time.not planning in doing it for another few months.is it hard 2 keep gains from only test cycle.i have got deca/sus/dbol ready but maybe just keep the deca for another time
No a test only cycle 10-12 weeks (sus is fine IMO) will produce the most maintainable gains. Throw in the dbol week 1-4 @ 30mg if you must, but IMO test is enough. Definitely keep the deca for another time IMO. You may want to run a low dose AI on cycle to reduce bloat, and a nolva or clomid only PCT is fine and you dont need HCG
 
sportsbro21

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No a test only cycle 10-12 weeks (sus is fine IMO) will produce the most maintainable gains. Throw in the dbol week 1-4 @ 30mg if you must, but IMO test is enough. Definitely keep the deca for another time IMO. You may want to run a low dose AI on cycle to reduce bloat, and a nolva or clomid only PCT is fine and you dont need HCG
i concur, if this is your first cycle you need to use test(or sus) by itself so you know how your body reacts to it. if you use 3 compounds in your first cycle and you have good results or you get alot of bad sides, you won't know witch compound did the most good or caused the sides. plus, trust me you will be very happy with your results from a test (sus) only cycle. and like tnick7 said, test(sus) will give you the most maintainable gains.

keep the dbol and deca for another cycle down the road, i know its burning a whole in your pocket just sitting there but dont worry it wont go bad haha

10-12 week sus only cycle will not need HCG, and sense sus has alot of fast acting test esters in it you will proli not have much bloat at all, so i wouldn't worry about an AI while ON cycle.
but make sure you have your nolva BFORE you start your cycle just incase your body doesn't react well to the test.

o ya and good luck bro have fun :head:
 
slow-mun

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i concur, if this is your first cycle you need to use test(or sus) by itself so you know how your body reacts to it. if you use 3 compounds in your first cycle and you have good results or you get alot of bad sides, you won't know witch compound did the most good or caused the sides. plus, trust me you will be very happy with your results from a test (sus) only cycle. and like tnick7 said, test(sus) will give you the most maintainable gains.

keep the dbol and deca for another cycle down the road, i know its burning a whole in your pocket just sitting there but dont worry it wont go bad haha

10-12 week sus only cycle will not need HCG, and sense sus has alot of fast acting test esters in it you will proli not have much bloat at all, so i wouldn't worry about an AI while ON cycle.
but make sure you have your nolva BFORE you start your cycle just incase your body doesn't react well to the test.

o ya and good luck bro have fun :head:
Actually, Sustanon tends to be more estrogenic than other straight esters of testosterone and Omnidren is even worse.....You will bloat like a blowfish on these and be prepared to have to resort to using Nolva on cycle. These are the easiest to get and the most erratic to control. There are good reasons that these are also the cheapest that can be found.
 
sportsbro21

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"unlike other testosterone compounds such as testosterone cypionate and testosterone enanthate, the use of Sustanon leads to less water retention and estrogenic side effects. This characteristic is extremely beneficial to bodybuilders who suffer from gynecomastia yet still seek the powerful anabolic effect of an injectable testosterone. The decreased water retention also makes Sustanon a desirable steroid for bodybuilders and athletes interested in cutting up or building a solid foundation of quality mass. "
article on sustanon from meso-rx.

i have personal experience with test enan, test prop, and sustanon.
from my personal experience the only one that ever caused me to hold water or bloat was test enanthate. sustanon was by far my favorite because i DID NOT bloat at all had the best strength and lean mass gains, and i recovered faster from it.

sorry slo-mun, i think you have it backwards
 
slow-mun

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"unlike other testosterone compounds such as testosterone cypionate and testosterone enanthate, the use of Sustanon leads to less water retention and estrogenic side effects. This characteristic is extremely beneficial to bodybuilders who suffer from gynecomastia yet still seek the powerful anabolic effect of an injectable testosterone. The decreased water retention also makes Sustanon a desirable steroid for bodybuilders and athletes interested in cutting up or building a solid foundation of quality mass. "
article on sustanon from meso-rx.

i have personal experience with test enan, test prop, and sustanon.
from my personal experience the only one that ever caused me to hold water or bloat was test enanthate. sustanon was by far my favorite because i DID NOT bloat at all had the best strength and lean mass gains, and i recovered faster from it.

sorry slo-mun, i think you have it backwards
I'm not going to try and argue with you on this. I have personally run Test enanthate, Omnidren, and Sustanon. Many would also agree with me on this.
 
james c

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i concur, if this is your first cycle you need to use test(or sus) by itself so you know how your body reacts to it. if you use 3 compounds in your first cycle and you have good results or you get alot of bad sides, you won't know witch compound did the most good or caused the sides. plus, trust me you will be very happy with your results from a test (sus) only cycle. and like tnick7 said, test(sus) will give you the most maintainable gains.

keep the dbol and deca for another cycle down the road, i know its burning a whole in your pocket just sitting there but dont worry it wont go bad haha

10-12 week sus only cycle will not need HCG, and sense sus has alot of fast acting test esters in it you will proli not have much bloat at all, so i wouldn't worry about an AI while ON cycle.
but make sure you have your nolva BFORE you start your cycle just incase your body doesn't react well to the test.

o ya and good luck bro have fun :head:
thanks for the info ive decided 2 go with sus only.just maybe use 20 mg off dbol the first 4 weeks.ive done a dbol only cycle before and kept half off it because i eat like a mad man in pct lol was happy with that.so 500mg off sus a week split in 2 doses.
 
sportsbro21

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I'm not going to try and argue with you on this. I have personally run Test enanthate, Omnidren, and Sustanon. Many would also agree with me on this.
haha, im not going to argue either. i would just like to see some type of credible article to back up your little bit backward theorie
 
slow-mun

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haha, im not going to argue either. i would just like to see some type of credible article to back up your little bit backward theory
You pasted an unauthored, editorial about sustanon from a site that sells bogus products that have steroid names. Here's an actually article that backs up my argument that sustanon is a poor choice VS. enanthate.
Sustanon 250 is a unique blend of 4 different esters of testosterone. The principle purpose of attaching an ester to a steroid is to make it more lipophillic, so that when injected intra-muscularly it can remain in the adipose tissue longer...

In Depth Sustanon 250 Profile!

By: Big Cat

Sustanon 250

NOTICE: This information is for entertainment purposes ONLY!

Full profiles on each individual steroid are here.

Pharmaceutical Name: Testosterone (as 30 mg propionate, 60 mg isocaproate, 60 mg as phenylpropionate, 100 mg decanoate)
Chemical structure: 4-androstene-3-one,17beta-ol
Molecular weight of base: 288.429
Molecular weight of ester: 74.0792 (propionic acid, 3 carbons)
Molecular weight of ester: 116.1596 (isocaproic acid, 6 carbons)
Molecular weight of ester: 150.1768 (Propionic acid phenyl ester, 9 carbons)
Molecular weight of ester: 172.2668


Effective dose: 250-1000 mg/week
Average Street-price: $10-30 per ml
Available Doses: 250 mg/ml

Brands & Products:

Organon Sostenon 250 (Mexico, ES, GB, NL, FI, India, Russia, TK, CZ, BG) 250 mg/ml
Sustenon 250 (PT) 250 mg/ml
Sustanon'250' (Thailand) 250 mg/ml
Durateston 250 (BZ) 250 mg/ml
Durandron (o.c.) (ES) 250 mg/ml
Ravasini Veterinary: Deposterone (Mexico) 250 mg/ml
Ttokkyo Labs Testono'n 250 mg/ml

Characteristics:

Testosterone is the prime male androgen in the body, and as such still the best possible mass builder in the world. It has a high risk of side-effects because it readily converts to a more androgenic form (DHT) in androgen responsive tissues and forms estrogen quite easily. But these characteristics also provide it with its extreme anabolic tendencies. On the one hand estrogen increases growth hormone output, glucose utilization, improves immunity and upgrades the androgen receptor, while on the other hand a testosterone/DHT combination is extremely potent at activating the androgen receptor and eliciting major strength and size gains. While not always the most visually appealing result, there is no steroid on earth that packs on mass like testosterone does.

Sustanon 250 is a unique blend of 4 different esters of testosterone. The principle purpose of attaching an ester to a steroid is to make it more lipophillic, so that when injected intra-muscularly it can remain in the adipose tissue longer and is released in the blood-stream over time. The longer an ester, the more lipophillic it is. Sustanon 250 contain 1 short, 1 long and 2 medium length esters that are all delivered over time, which gives a quick release, but a durable one as well. You may think that this is a positive thing, and to patients requiring testosterone therapy this probably is, but to a steroid user its really not.

A steroid user will use a long-acting testosterone and inject it once a week. The end of a week is usually the time when a long-acting (7 or 8 carbon) ester has tapered down to its original level and threatens to drop below that level, giving sub-par amounts of testosterone beyond that point (eventhough the compound stays somewhat active for 3-4 weeks). With sustanon, that equal amount is divided much differently. Imagine a hypothetical situation where one take either 270 mg of a an ester that lasts 6 days, or 270 mg of a blend of different esters, 90 mg each, that release over respectively 2, 4 and 6 days, analog to sustanon. With the first one, an even amount of testosterone is released on each day. With the second one the entire first ester, half the second ester and 1/3rd of the last ester is released within the first two days. The result here is clear : the first two days one gets 165 mg, the next two one gets 75 mg and the last 2 days one gets a mere 30 mg. The levels peak much sooner, and drop off sooner, leaving you with less than adequate androgen levels as the week draws to a close.

So for use as one would use another long-acting testosterone, I find sustanon to be poor value. The price is roughly the same so I really don't see the affinity people seem to have for it. Respectively cypionate and enanthate are much better choices. I can understand the need for a fast-acting component to front-load and kick-start gains, but even then, testoviron (200 mg testosterone enanthate and 50 mg testosterone propionate) is a much better choice. Speaking of front-loading, for this express purpose sustanon may be very suited. One could probably obtain results faster If one were to use 500 mg of sustanon on day 1, then again 5 days later on day 6 and start a cycle of enanthate/cypionate at 500 mg/week on day 11. That avoids the major crash at the end of the week and makes maximum use of the fast acting esters to saturate the system.

As with all testosterones the rate of side-effects is quite high. Risks of androgenic side-effects (hair loss, prostate hypertrophy, deepening of voice) as well as estrogenic side-effects (gyno, water retention, fat gain) are real, and the use of ancillary drugs such as anti-estrogens will most likely be needed. This is something that I urge all users to take into account. Never start any cycle with testosterone without having at least a lot of Nolvadex and a few amps of HCG on hand. Testosterone is not in any way toxic, and should not give a user any problems apart from a high rate of occurrence of standard steroid side-effects.

Stacking and Use:

Because of its long-acting components, sustanon is mostly used as a form of long-acting testosterone. Much like testoviron, testosterone enanthate and testosterone cypionate. I don't find it to be the best choice for this purpose, but obviously I don't determine the trends among bodybuilders. In such use doses of 500 to 1000 mg per week are used in a single injection, with decent results nonetheless. Perhaps because 3 of its esters are notably shorter than enanthate or cypionate, so more of it is actual testosterone and less ester, eventhough the distribution is uneven. Its best use in my opinion is to start off a cycle with, by injecting twice with 5 days space, and then give it another 5 days before starting an 8-10 week cycle of testoviron, enanthate or cypionate. This should allow for more testosterone to build up and results to come much faster.

Again, because of the two medium-length and the long ester, the compound is not very controllable. So when problems occur, simply discontinuing the product is not an option. One needs to be familiar with anti-estrogenic compounds for one. When signs of gyno appear using 20-40 mg/day of the estrogen antagonist Nolvadex or 100-150 mg/day of its weaker counterpart clomid until a few days after symptoms disappear is advised. The best way to avoid such problems is running proviron or arimidex, aromatase blockers, alongside the product. In most instances I give preference to arimidex, but when concerning the use of testosterone Proviron at 50-100 mg per day may be wiser since it frees up more testosterone.

Of course the simultaneous use of an aromatase blocker will compromise your gains since it literally stops estrogen from being made. Androgenic problems can be reduced to some extent by the use of finasteride, which will stop the conversion of testosterone to its more androgenic component DHT. This may alleviate aggravated hair loss and prostate problems somewhat. Again, the blocking of such a conversion may decrease the gains made and will in any case heighten the risk for estrogenic side-effects, since DHT acts as an anti-estrogen. Proviron is also a form of DHT, so people worried about androgenic side-effects should then naturally opt for arimidex over proviron when they choose an aromatase blocker as well.

Sustanon stacks well with any compound. Usually testosterone is always the stronger compound in the stack, so whenever you stack something alongside its usually because the drug has certain characteristics. Usually this means it will be a milder drug that will allow the user a milder cycle with lower occurrence of side-effects than simply using more testosterone, without having to give up all of the potential gains. Deca-Durabolin, Equipoise and Primobolan are some of the more fitting compounds for this purpose. But naturally the king of all mass-builders stacks well with almost anything.
I hate that I have to quote Big Cat, but at least I can quote a real person.
 
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sportsbro21

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please point out where it said sus is more estrogenic and caused more bloat and water retention than enan or cyp? ... i am dyslexic and i might have missed it but i didnt see it say any thing like that.

meso-rx sells books and dvds and thats it, no supplements at all.
i personally know several people who write for websites like meso-rx and steroid dot com and they never post the name of the author for privacy and safety reasons.

please dont argue when you really dont know that you are talking about. not trying to start anything, i just hate seeing people post garbage like that. and then post an article that doesn't even back up what you were claiming....?


sorry bout all that .... that looks good james c
keep us posted on your progress
 
slow-mun

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please point out where it said sus is more estrogenic and caused more bloat and water retention than enan or cyp? ... i am dyslexic and i might have missed it but i didnt see it say any thing like that.

meso-rx sells books and dvds and thats it, no supplements at all.
i personally know several people who write for websites like meso-rx and steroid dot com and they never post the name of the author for privacy and safety reasons.

please dont argue when you really dont know that you are talking about. not trying to start anything, i just hate seeing people post garbage like that. and then post an article that doesn't even back up what you were claiming....?


sorry bout all that .... that looks good james c
keep us posted on your progress
I know what I have experienced myself. I also know that sustanon for

me is more estrogenic than a straight ester of testosterone and is erratic

to control because of the esters becoming active whenever they feel like

it. When your testosterone levels fluctuate like this it sets off a hormonal

imbalance which leads to estrogen production that correlates to those

imbalances. Most people who have used different types of products will

always go back to a straight ester, b/c of the generally moodiness(from

the severe ups and down caused by the esters peaking at erratic times)

and bloat(from the estrogen that production correlates with testosterone

levels that are constantly fluctuating)that accompanies a multi-ester

cycle. The only way to compensate for this is to do eod injections to

make the "on" feeling consistent. This leads to the longer acting esters

building up, resulting in more estrogenic sides and a heavier shutdown.

Don't think because I don't post in the straight steroid threads as often

as I do the PH/PS's that I don't know WTF I am talking about. I usually

keep what I choose to do to myself, but I occassionally speak up when I

hear bad information being spouted of as gospel because somebody read

a write up on meso-rx.

*Don't tell me about author privacy when Anthony Roberts basically dimed out sources publicly on those sites. They aren't protecting anyone there.
 

ThePlague

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Hey guys ,

Right to the point I have not worked out in about 8 years. I am currently 176lb 5'8. I am curious on any thought of starting with a cycle or workout for a while then cycle ? I know this is a newbie question but I wanted some thoughts weather I would be wasting my gear or will it provide good results? I am looking to bulk up. I currently have enanthate, DBOL , Sostonol and Deca. Can someone please provide feedback what would be best cycle to start or would the gear be a waste of time just starting out?
 

siren05

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I am going to have too agree with SportsBro.I have ran Cyp,Eth and Sust, and in my own experience Cyp Bloats me worse than any Sust. Also everything that I have read suggests Sustanon to be the least likely too cause bloat. but you have to run EOD.
 

musclewise

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hey i needa reply asap. how much wud it cost to cyle deca, sus250 and dbols for 1 month, any answer appreciated.
 

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