phera/superdrol bridge stack help
- 06-02-2008, 12:56 PM
phera/superdrol bridge stack help
hey guys im 22 years old 6'0 and 190 pounds im currently cutting for the next 4 weeks using clen, to get to 7-8% bodyfat for summer.. i am successfully using carb cycling to get there... now in july i will be doing a pp/sd stack for 6 weeks with furazadrol or a clone to hopefully gain 10 pounds of lean muscle.. i will watch diet very carefully and will probably eat more carbs during the pheraplex for 3 weeks then slowly go less with supedrol.. i know sd loves carbs but when i ran a cycle in the winter i gained some fat with it ....
my diet in the beginning will be about 350 grams of protein... 200 grams of carbs.. breakfast, pre post workout all of them.... and about 100-150 grams of fat....
cycle layout is like this
pp30/45 sd 10/20
i would hope to be at around 200 pounds with still 7-8% bodyfat and my diet will be great as always... any one please give me some input
- 06-02-2008, 01:00 PM
(1)What is your cycle experience? Have you run both phera and SD standalone already, if not dont bridge them IMO.
(2) SD/PP and furaz is too much.
(3) IMO the doses you have are way too high
(4) You need to eat way more carbs on SD (especially complex carbs)
(5) Post your PCT and cycle plan
- 06-02-2008, 01:13 PM
yes, i have ran them both seperately and i have also dont a bold epistane stack.. problem is when i did them i gained some fat along with the muscle and now im trying to make lean gains because i have finally got my bodyfat down low and want to maintain a low bodyfat year round instead of eating all the carbs/protein i see.. my body is carb sensative and last time i used SD i gained fat/water with muscle also.. this was probably due to my carb intake was 450 grams of carbs and now i would like to see lean gains
06-02-2008, 01:25 PM
06-02-2008, 01:29 PM
i am 22 not 28 i dont know why it says that ill change it... my pct is going to be nolva for 4 weeks at 40/40/20/20..... just a quick question though would this cycle be possible for me to go from 187 at 7-8% to 200 at 8% bodyfat tops... and yea i will have alot of complex carbs at breakfast pre workout and postworkout and thats it for carbs... i feel that timing the carbs is key to not gaining fat and those are the best times to eat my carbs... i guess i will bump the carb dosage up to 250 maybe 300... and see if its going to my waist... also in pct i will probably use clen also so i can continue to eat and keep my gains while not increasing my bodyfat... thanks let me know man..
06-02-2008, 01:35 PM
IMO you might wanna run a bit more for PCT, some might suggest otherwise so maybe wait for another response. If it were me i would run PCt like this:
And maybe an AI start in week 3 of PCT
or something like this.
Also I say save the clen for after PCT form what i have been told.
Your aim is ~13pounds LBM, on this cycle depending on how you respond I would say you could expect at least 10lbs LBM, but its user specific
06-02-2008, 01:39 PM
ok thanks alot i will look into pct... but have you run this cycle before and what were your results... also i know diet is key so do you think that with that micro breakdown that is going to be effective setup so most of my gains will be muscle...its hard to find logs in this becuase most people do all out bulks lol and end up gaining size but also have thier waist increase a couple inches
06-02-2008, 04:18 PM
clomid 100mg per day fore 3 weeks then 50mg a day for 1 week with aromasin 20mg per day week 3 4 5 of pct is a MUCH better PCT.
you can run all 3 compounds at the same time, but not optimal.
phera for 30mg through out 4 weeks with furazobol, then do super for 4 week at 30mg per day, unless you get the back pumps in which case 20 would be sufficent.
clen can be RAN DURING pct because you need to keep your calories high to hold onto you muscle.
but carbcycling with those PHs will be good. but on you low carb day dont go lower then 50g carbs.
nolvadex has been shown to work at 10mg per day , so 40 is overkill. and aromasin is shown to work at 10mg per day as well.
clomid is better then nolva because it doesnt lower IGF1 output from the liver.
06-02-2008, 04:19 PM
I agree, you're PCT will need some work! I would also consider a cort modulator as well.
what support supps are you planning to accompany your cycle?
06-02-2008, 04:27 PM
The PCT i wrote was a PCT suggested by Dr.D over at BB. If I remember right it was for sd pp bridge, runing nolva, clomid and rebound xt with dhea.
I didnt say clen couldnt be run during pct at all. Its debatable whether or not it is better to leave til after, from what i read there is more to support leaving it for after.
I didnt say he couldn't run sd/pp/fura i said IMO (in my opinion) he shouldn't, sd pp bridge is harsh enough as it is, and adding the furaz is just going add to the problem (especially blood pressure)
EDIT: Also I agree about the nolva dosing, but I read that 20 or 10mg is only ok for milder cycles.
just my $0.02
06-02-2008, 04:43 PM
yea i mean Dr D has his ways, and Pat arnold and Dave Palumbo has his,
If its shown to work at lower doses, why not use them, and save the trouble and the money,
but why only milder cycles it does the exact thing at a lower dose, why over kill it.
clomid at 150mg per day can lead to eye issues in most people. 100 is safer and effective. and alond with aromasin, your good to go.
and ifBP is a problem, ACE inhibitor/Water pill/ an AI while on could be of help.
and running clen throughout would be optimal, the on and off cycle of it is riducuilous. increaese dose by 20 mcg every 2 weeks and no higher then 120 mcg per day. then dose down. 16 weeks and hes set.
i wouldnt run DHEA during PCT anyway, its a waste.
06-02-2008, 04:46 PM
06-02-2008, 04:48 PM
from what I've seen, using clomid in general can lead to emotional issues...
06-02-2008, 04:48 PM
agree about the DHEA.
I think I asked PA about nolva for an epithio he said 20mg is enough, but only because its a mild compound. To each his own
For the clen, from research IMO the best way is taper up to max dose, run the max dose for 28 days then either stop use or taper down, again user specific. But I was not saying leave it because of cycling it. His aim is a lean bulk so IMO he should bulk, pct, then clen to get rid of the 1-2% he may gain on cycle.
06-02-2008, 04:51 PM
06-02-2008, 04:56 PM
yep, this is why I still have an unused bottle in the fridge...it's only for emergencies (don't want to use it unless I have no other choice).
and if you take clomid, erase your ex gf's number from your phone...you might call her crying
06-02-2008, 05:02 PM
sounds good thanks for all the advice does my gains seem realistic as my diet will be right on to hopefully gain all lean mass... and should i carb cycle though durning this cycle i am carb cycling now to get to 7-8% becuase im probably at 10% now.... With a cycle of phera/sd should i continue to carb cycle or should i just jump right into 200-300 grams of carbs a day... im scared that since ive been carb cycling i would gain some fat by jumping right into 200 grams consistantly again.. i will definitly use clen right into pct also so i can eat to keep alot of my gains.. although i am hoping most of gains are muscle not water so wouldn't it be easier to maintain after cycle..
06-02-2008, 05:08 PM
also for support along cycle i will be running cycle support... and also for help with gf and that situation i will run either AI's PCS along the bridge to SD, or Paravol.... to try to keep a sex drive decent..
06-02-2008, 06:58 PM
but 100mg perday 3 weeks then 50mg perday 1 week, will help also get you fertile again
and super can be run for 4 weeks, i have no idea why every1 says 3.
i wouldnt have ne problem running it for 6
06-02-2008, 07:26 PM
anyone run this cycle on a clean bulk with carbs just mourning, pre and post workout and gain 12-14 gains of lean muscle, with maybe 1 or 2 pounds of fat tops...??
06-02-2008, 07:26 PM
06-02-2008, 07:32 PM
check out some recent logs of this bridge:
I know brian put on nearly 20 pounds on his cycle and kept his BF about the same...(the second log)
06-02-2008, 08:33 PM
06-02-2008, 09:11 PM
06-02-2008, 10:20 PM
06-02-2008, 10:40 PM
nice yeah and what was ur carb intake ? just curious tryin to get some feedback probably 450 grams +
06-03-2008, 09:19 AM
and i worked out 4 days a week.
felt really good on cycle, then i used halp and EPI and kicked all my PRs ass. then did pct was gunna fun it for 3-4 weeks, and then i got my appendix out starting 16 days after start of PCT.
now since then its been 8.5 weeks, and im back in the gym this week will be my 3rd full week,
the first 4.5 weeks after i got out my appendix i lost 30 ****ing pounds, some muscle some fat, funning a keto diet because i didnt need carbs for anything,
now im back up 11 poiunds waiting on another 15 lol
06-03-2008, 09:25 AM
damn man i feel you on that lol that sucks but muscle memory is there haha wuts ur body fat at im tryin to maintain a lean physique when i bulk again because usually i eat all carbs/protein and end up gettin 15% bodyfat which look horrible lol
06-03-2008, 11:34 AM
felt good, i had the biggest jump after week 2 and 3 and then like 2 pounds week 4
week one i gaine like 2.5
week 2 gain 5
week 3 6
week 4 like 1.5
felt good lol
then i felt a lil fat so i cut my carbs, to bout 100-150 a day the last 4 weeks which was epimax, and halodrol 50 (oral turinadrol by JN) lost 12 and LOOKED SEXY haha.
great cycle though because i kept all my strength even when i dropped some weight and got stronger. and PCT went well for nolva and aromasin both 12.5 mg and 10mg per day respectivly,
PS to all of you, didnt run liver support, i was thinking bout it, (and i know whaty yall are gunna say) but i got blood work 4.5 weeks after PCT
ALL VALUES NORMAL including
hdl at 58
liver enzymes in the normal range.
test levels normal
GH ELEVATED! (maybe my age)
THYROID ELEVATED (maybe the clen although i was off of it for 4.5 weeks when i got the blood work!)
hmm LDL was under 100 which is good.
and if im forgetting any other lemmey know
oh yea LH and FSH were normal. free and total test were normal, BP 116/72
strength on leg press went up a total of
540 for 7 too 800 for 4
and thats all i gotta say bout that! yall make your decisions on what YOU WANT TO DO
i totaled 8 weeks ON and 2 weeks PCT
06-03-2008, 12:42 PM
nice man sowhat was your starting cycle and ending cycle results did you end at like 208 with probalbly like 12% bodyfat that halo part of your cycle is very interesting...
06-03-2008, 01:02 PM
06-03-2008, 02:03 PM
i ran the numbers thats like 12 pounds lean body gain bro nice wwhat other cycles u got comin up
06-03-2008, 03:08 PM
06-04-2008, 11:06 AM
so pretty much to review i can gain a good amount of mass from this cycle just by eating complex carbs pre post workout and the rest of my cals from fats and protein...
i would probabley do 50 grams brown rice pre workout
after i lift i would have my 80/40 c/p shake
then a 35 gram sweet potato and that would be it for my direct carb sources... i would up my calories in fat intake like more olive oil on my chicken and more almonds ..? thanks
06-04-2008, 03:18 PM
eat carbs the 4-5 meals surrounding your workout and have a carb cut off at 7. so no starchy carbs after 7 and insteaqd have veggies, protein and fat. and then before you goto bed protein and fat.
75g waxymaize post workout with 10g BCAAs 5g Leucine and 5g creating. then 30 min later 30g WHEY PROTEIN ISOLATE. then about 1.5 hours later. have a meal with protein carbs and fat, unless its after 7.
best way for me to put it.
fat sources 1/3 cup almonds, walnuts. peanuts.
tablespoon EVOO, macadamia nut oil, avacodo oil.
and only lean protein sources, and complex carbs, except post workout which is waxymaize.
you can have 30-50g carbs per meal depending how sensitive you are to them, but keep protein and fat constant.
06-04-2008, 05:33 PM
So, I’ve been considering running a cycle this for awhile and had some questions that lead to some ideas that lead to further questions. Without the addition of test, you’re not going to feel as good since the PP and SD won’t replace all of the positive effects of having test in your system. Being that orals are tough on the liver and cardiovascular system anyways, I’ve been hesitant to run anything too long – to salvage my lipids and liver as much as possible. It seems 3 weeks is solid, but going up to even 5 weeks seems okay for some poeple.
So, if you want to limit your cycle to the shortest effective length. For PP that seems to be four weeks and SD seems to be three. Now, most bridges work by combining the two orals for one week overlap. My understanding is that you don’t want to stress our liver too much.
Looking at PP it seems that:
15mg – low dosage
30mg – moderate dosage
45mg – high dosage
A typical recommended PP cycle looks like:
Week 1 – 15 mg
Week 2 – 30 mg
Week 3 – 45 mg
Week 4 - 45 mg
Looking at SD it seems that:
10mg – low dosage
20mg – moderate dosage
30mg – high dosage
A typical recommended SD cycle looks like:
Week 1 – 10 mg
Week 2 – 20 mg
Week 3 – 30 mg
So, what about this….
Week 1 – 15 mg PP (low PP)
Week 2 – 30 mg PP (moderate PP)
Week 3 – 30 mg PP, 10 mg SD (moderate PP + low SD = High Overall)
Week 4 – 30 mg PP, 10 mg SD (moderate PP + low SD = High Overall)
Week 5 – 20(30) mg SD (moderate to high SD)
So you basically bridge for two weeks rather than one week. You give each product the optimal amount of time to do it's thing, and you don't put horrible stress on the liver by making it a long cycle. I guess the real issue is whether or not the orals have cummulative effects together and whether or not time is irrelevant and perhaps total stress on the liver equals total substance ingested.
Or I could be overthinking it...
06-04-2008, 05:42 PM
06-04-2008, 05:47 PM
if I were running a bridge of these powerfull products then I wouldn't let them overlap for very long.
Also, when they are bridged most people take the low dosage of both.
example: 15mg of phera and 10mg of SD
06-04-2008, 05:48 PM
run em back to back. at 3 pills a day, PP 45 and SD 30 (unless back pumps are too bad)
my lipids went back to normal. 4.5 weeks. after PCT. (and i was on an 8 week cycle)
for me its easier, to take the dose spread throughout the day. and i dont take any pills (except vitamins after 6 or 7)
some people even pulse thes at doses MUCH higher. i just reccommend using it everyday.
i was thinking of running 12 week cycle, ending with halodrol or epithin E. but im probably not bc ill be bulking i want more wet compounds,
ill probably do
EQT 2 (70mg M14ADD and 40mg Halodrol)
then Hyperdrol X2,
but i plan on leaving phera out. or using it first.
i want to try and gain 30 pounds, obviosly not all muscle, some fat too. but i think it would be very doable on a cycle like that.
06-04-2008, 05:54 PM
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