just finished my havoc cycle

[flw]

I just finished up 31 days of havoc, gains were good, about 14 lbs, sides were almost non existant, no shedding, no extra acne, no agression, only a lower sex drive which I thought was strange.
I will try and take measurments tonight and report back.
A quick question, should I continue to take cycle support now that I'm off if I'm taking pcs? I've also just recently read a few posts stating that dhea and trib are bad with nolva, what's the latest on this? I'm also taking rebound reloaded, fenugreek, and will start lx in a week or two. Any last minute changes i should make?

[Red Dog]

I just finished up 31 days of havoc, gains were good, about 14 lbs, sides were almost non existant, no shedding, no extra acne, no agression, only a lower sex drive which I thought was strange.
I will try and take measurments tonight and report back.
A quick question, should I continue to take cycle support now that I'm off if I'm taking pcs? I've also just recently read a few posts stating that dhea and trib are bad with nolva, what's the latest on this? I'm also taking rebound reloaded, fenugreek, and will start lx in a week or two. Any last minute changes i should make?

Great gains man -- sounds like you had a really nice cycle!

If you still have some Cycle Support left then I would definitely use it -- the toxicity from Nolva lends additional warrant to continue the use of a liver support supp so I yeah -- keep that up!

I am not real familiar with DHEA & Trib interactions with Nolva, but I would just check the thread based around the discussion in the other forum. IMO, I would drop the Trib (just in case) as I feel trib-based products take a seat so far behind your SERM that, unless the argument is discredited, I would just not even bother with it.

The fenugreek should help with your sex drive, and I agree with your LX timeframe -- I would start it at the beginning of your 3rd week of PCT.. Good luck!

[CryingEmo]

I've heard that havoc mimics DHT. So if you didn't shed, you are a lucky mofo and probably are not prone to MPB.


You gotta hate these guys that don't shed, and can bulk every cycle without gaining any fat... eating anything they want without gaining fat... blah blah

[flw]

Year, I always thought i Might bald later in life as I have slightly thinner hair on the top of my head, I guess not though, I did use nozoral shampoo and toco 8. I'm not the type of guy who can eat anything, I gain fat very easy. I ate clean and pretty lean keeping my calories at 3000, 60 or less grams of healthy fats and 250 grams of good solid protein and felt that my waist line and love handles were shrinking till about wk 3 when my pants started to tighten up, and mylove handles looked a little more prominent. I dropped my total calories down about 3 to 500 the last week. I don't think I put on any fat I just think the muscle pushed the fat outwards a bit if that makes any sense.

I've heard that havoc mimics DHT. So if you didn't shed, you are a lucky mofo and probably are not prone to MPB.


You gotta hate these guys that don't shed, and can bulk every cycle without gaining any fat... eating anything they want without gaining fat... blah blah

[flw]

thanks man, I will definately keep going with the cs.

Great gains man -- sounds like you had a really nice cycle!

If you still have some Cycle Support left then I would definitely use it -- the toxicity from Nolva lends additional warrant to continue the use of a liver support supp so I yeah -- keep that up!

I am not real familiar with DHEA & Trib interactions with Nolva, but I would just check the thread based around the discussion in the other forum. IMO, I would drop the Trib (just in case) as I feel trib-based products take a seat so far behind your SERM that, unless the argument is discredited, I would just not even bother with it.

The fenugreek should help with your sex drive, and I agree with your LX timeframe -- I would start it at the beginning of your 3rd week of PCT.. Good luck!

[Trauma1]

I've heard that havoc mimics DHT. So if you didn't shed, you are a lucky mofo and probably are not prone to MPB.


You gotta hate these guys that don't shed, and can bulk every cycle without gaining any fat... eating anything they want without gaining fat... blah blah

Where did you hear this?

[Trauma1]

I just finished up 31 days of havoc, gains were good, about 14 lbs, sides were almost non existant, no shedding, no extra acne, no agression, only a lower sex drive which I thought was strange.
I will try and take measurments tonight and report back.
A quick question, should I continue to take cycle support now that I'm off if I'm taking pcs? I've also just recently read a few posts stating that dhea and trib are bad with nolva, what's the latest on this? I'm also taking rebound reloaded, fenugreek, and will start lx in a week or two. Any last minute changes i should make?

The libido issue is most likely due to estrogen suppression while on havoc. Some users have added in some DHEA on cycle to combat this adverse effect with success. Nice work on your results!!

[flw]

it was not that bad, just low, no issues getting it ip luckely. Are You knowledgable with how dhea interacts with nolva?

The libido issue is most likely due to estrogen suppression while on havoc. Some users have added in some DHEA on cycle to combat this adverse effect with success. Nice work on your results!!

[Trauma1]

it was not that bad, just low, no issues getting it ip luckely. Are You knowledgable with how dhea interacts with nolva?

I can't say that i am to be honest. I know that dinoii had some good insight on this subject though.

[flw]

Yea, that's who's posts I was reading.

I can't say that i am to be honest. I know that dinoii had some good insight on this subject though.

[foland]

get your measurements man.

[flw]

Sorry, I've not been home for more than a few minutes, I will get them as soon as I can.

get your measurements man.

[flw]

Ok, here are the gains I made on my measurments!
Neck + .75
Arms + .75
Chest + 1
Waist + 0
Hips + 1
Thighs + 1.75
calfs + .5

some of the things that can't be measured I feel improved as well, the back of my shoulders and neck, really fill out my shirts better, as well as the top of my chest. I had a knee surgery a while back and I feel that the uniformity of my legs is better now aswell.

[Indiana Jones]

Year, I always thought i Might bald later in life as I have slightly thinner hair on the top of my head, I guess not though, I did use nozoral shampoo and toco 8. I'm not the type of guy who can eat anything, I gain fat very easy. I ate clean and pretty lean keeping my calories at 3000, 60 or less grams of healthy fats and 250 grams of good solid protein and felt that my waist line and love handles were shrinking till about wk 3 when my pants started to tighten up, and mylove handles looked a little more prominent. I dropped my total calories down about 3 to 500 the last week. I don't think I put on any fat I just think the muscle pushed the fat outwards a bit if that makes any sense.

So you ate just a little bit over maintenance and you gained 14lbs in 4 weeks. That should be the norm when you're on something like Havoc. So I wish people would shut up and stop telling me to eat more when I'm hardly gaining anything off of M-drol/P-plex when I'm eating 1000 calories over maintenance.


great gains btw

[MuscleMadness]

Great Gains flw... Havoc is a great supp. Question, did you have any gyno related issues. I know that Havoc is supposed to suppress estrogen while on cycle and you should have no estrogen related sides or conversion but I have read a few forums on other sites where ppl claimed that they got gyno 2-3 weeks into their cycle... This to me just didn't make sense. It could have just been dumb kids thinking that they have gyno cause their nips got a little tender or whatev. Thanks

[Trauma1]

Great Gains flw... Havoc is a great supp. Question, did you have any gyno related issues. I know that Havoc is supposed to suppress estrogen while on cycle and you should have no estrogen related sides or conversion but I have read a few forums on other sites where ppl claimed that they got gyno 2-3 weeks into their cycle... This to me just didn't make sense. It could have just been dumb kids thinking that they have gyno cause their nips got a little tender or whatev. Thanks

Exactly. There is no way to tell what people are taking/doing outside what they post they are, or if they have any other pre-existing medical conditions that can obviously interfer with results.

I'm sure many people conveniently don't tell the whole story leaving an online posting with the possibility of MANY variables that aren't accounted for contributing to an altered outcome of events. In other words, take reviews like that for what they're worth.

[ezza]

So you ate just a little bit over maintenance and you gained 14lbs in 4 weeks. That should be the norm when you're on something like Havoc. So I wish people would shut up and stop telling me to eat more when I'm hardly gaining anything off of M-drol/P-plex when I'm eating 1000 calories over maintenance.


great gains btw

wah wah wah

[flw]

Yea, just a over maintenance, kept my fat intake up a bit too, around 65g of healthy and lean meat fats. When I noticed my waist getting a bit tight I lowered my calories about 300 to 500 in an effort to do a quick cut the last week. So far I'm still having good workouts even with the deficit of calories sense istarted pct, I hope they continue.

So you ate just a little bit over maintenance and you gained 14lbs in 4 weeks. That should be the norm when you're on something like Havoc. So I wish people would shut up and stop telling me to eat more when I'm hardly gaining anything off of M-drol/P-plex when I'm eating 1000 calories over maintenance.


great gains btw

[flw]

no signs of gyno here, only thing out of the norm has been bright urine but I think I've attributed that to the toco-8 and multi vitamins.

Great Gains flw... Havoc is a great supp. Question, did you have any gyno related issues. I know that Havoc is supposed to suppress estrogen while on cycle and you should have no estrogen related sides or conversion but I have read a few forums on other sites where ppl claimed that they got gyno 2-3 weeks into their cycle... This to me just didn't make sense. It could have just been dumb kids thinking that they have gyno cause their nips got a little tender or whatev. Thanks