Thinking of running Havoc/Var

[ATH3386]

I was wondering if running Havoc/Var would product decent gains. I know theyre both mild, fairly potent in higher doses, and easy to come back from(HPTA-wise).

I dont know a ton about dosing var.. unfortunally. I have use Epi before.. but since Ive read bad stuff.. Havoc it is.

I wanted to do something like this.

Weeks 1/2- Havoc @ 30mg
Weeks 3/4- Havoc @ 30mg, Var @ 40mg
Weeks 5/6- Var @ 50mg
Weeks 7-10 Nolva 40/40/20/20, natty test booster, anti-cort, etc
Cycle support throughout the whole cycle @ 2 scoops/day for liver/BP

Goals: Add 12-15 lbs of LBM but more importantly, add 30-60 lbs to lifts.

 

[Trauma1]

I was wondering if running Havoc/Var would product decent gains. I know theyre both mild, fairly potent in higher doses, and easy to come back from(HPTA-wise).

I dont know a ton about dosing var.. unfortunally. I have use Epi before.. but since Ive read bad stuff.. Havoc it is.

I wanted to do something like this.

Weeks 1/2- Havoc @ 30mg
Weeks 3/4- Havoc @ 30mg, Var @ 40mg
Weeks 5/6- Var @ 50mg
Weeks 7-10 Nolva 40/40/20/20, natty test booster, anti-cort, etc
Cycle support throughout the whole cycle @ 2 scoops/day for liver/BP

Goals: Add 12-15 lbs of LBM but more importantly, add 30-60 lbs to lifts.

Havoc is a great choice indeed that will produce solid lean bodymass/strength gains. I found havoc at 30-40mg to be the sweet spot for myself. I don't have any experience with var, so maybe someone can chime in on the dosing.

 

[The G Train]

Var needs to be run alot longer than 4 weeks. I'd also add the Havoc at the end of the cycle, not the beginning. Hopefully you'll get more knowledgeable people than I to respond. Also, with these compounds your diet is what will make the gains, because these are not mass gainers.

 

[UnrealMachine]

You want 30-60 pounds on your lifts? No offense bro but I think a little orals only cycle shouldn't give you 60 pounds on any lift unless you're coming off a big cut, a big injury, a big period of inactivity, or you are just a noob.

So whats your stats?

 

[MkUltra]

havoc/var is going to be soooo dry. ouch

I did 80mg ED Var solo for 10 weeks over summer and I wish I had taken test a long with it. I gained about 5 pounds after PCT and lost bf but I was shutdown much more then I expected

 

[ATH3386]

Ill post stats in a little bit.

 

[Trauma1]

Just out of curiosity what made you choose a havoc/var cycle? I agree it's going to be very dry. I have some x-mass laying around and i'm planning on running that with havoc soon. I've had some friends have great results running havoc with a wet non-methyl like x-mass. It balances it out very nicely with some impressive gains.

 

[ATH3386]

Well.. I started reading about var and it sounded amazing. Lean gains, hardening, strength due to atp synthesis. I know somewhere I can get var for a decent price.. so thats not a big deal. Havoc.. I ran Epi solo.. and due to the "problems" Ill stick to the original one.

But.. epi gave me great gains... and var seemed like it would be good to take too.. seeing as theyre both orals, low supression, low sides, hardening, great in strength, etc etc

I dunno.. I just dont want to go to the needle yet. My personal call..



What exactly is x-Mass?

What if I ran Var(I could use the leaning and hardening) with something like Andriol(or is this a joke), or some PH/DS like BOLD, 11-oxo, or something..



As for stats: 6'2 224 @ 15%
Bench 305
Squat 395
Dead- havent maxed
Looking to play college ball after a few years off the field.

 

[Trauma1]

Well.. I started reading about var and it sounded amazing. Lean gains, hardening, strength due to atp synthesis. I know somewhere I can get var for a decent price.. so thats not a big deal. Havoc.. I ran Epi solo.. and due to the "problems" Ill stick to the original one.

But.. epi gave me great gains... and var seemed like it would be good to take too.. seeing as theyre both orals, low supression, low sides, hardening, great in strength, etc etc

I dunno.. I just dont want to go to the needle yet. My personal call..



What exactly is x-Mass?

What if I ran Var(I could use the leaning and hardening) with something like Andriol(or is this a joke), or some PH/DS like BOLD, 11-oxo, or something..



As for stats: 6'2 224 @ 15%
Bench 305
Squat 395
Dead- havent maxed
Looking to play college ball after a few years off the field.

X-MASS is a clone of Alri's Max-Lmg. It's a progestin. It's a fairly wet non-methyl compound which makes it a great stacker with havoc imho. It's tough to find because it has been discontinued though.

I personally have never run var but have had friends that did. Great recomper with lean mass gains indeed.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Well.. I started reading about var and it sounded amazing. Lean gains, hardening, strength due to atp synthesis. I know somewhere I can get var for a decent price.. so thats not a big deal. Havoc.. I ran Epi solo.. and due to the "problems" Ill stick to the original one.

But.. epi gave me great gains... and var seemed like it would be good to take too.. seeing as theyre both orals, low supression, low sides, hardening, great in strength, etc etc

I dunno.. I just dont want to go to the needle yet. My personal call..



What exactly is x-Mass?

What if I ran Var(I could use the leaning and hardening) with something like Andriol(or is this a joke), or some PH/DS like BOLD, 11-oxo, or something..



As for stats: 6'2 224 @ 15%
Bench 305
Squat 395
Dead- havent maxed
Looking to play college ball after a few years off the field.

X-Mass is an Ergomax-LMG clone right? If I recall correct, an unmethylated form of Phera-Plex, but a different isomer? (correct me if im wrong)

They aromatize and thats exactly what you want because "dry" orals that don't aromatize will leave you with a greater test:estrogen ratio than usual and the low estrogen is great for losing waterweight, but it's hard on your joints, and so harder to make big strength gains.

Don't get caught up too much in the science behind it, steroids work but var is far from the most effective thing out there, but good for strength gains yes. I say if you're going to use it, stack it with something else, or run a bridge, or pulse.
PP bridge to Var
Var stacked with PP low dose, or Max-LMG higher dose
Var, pulse the Epi?
Some ideas of what to play with. Stats look good, you 21?

If you can get var, then if you can get Test-E reconsider that. The aversion to needles is understandable, but if you're looking to get serious about this, test is a far better option than stacking orals.

 

[Trauma1]

X-Mass is an Ergomax-LMG clone right? If I recall correct, an unmethylated form of Phera-Plex, but a different isomer? (correct me if im wrong)

You're thinking of their Phera-Max, however it was methylated. If I recall correctly it was indeed found to be more similar to ergomax rather than pheraplex due to its isomer profile.

 

[ATH3386]

Wow great responses. I get the dry idea. This will sound stupid.. I can get var but not X-Mass. I could get test but for a rediculous price(120 per 10ml 250mg/ml). I know that price shouldnt come into the idea of the stack.. because only the BEST should be used but.. Im a 21 year old college athlete. I can't get a job due to my prepping for football.


Heres a story for yall. I got cut freshman year from the college ball team. I took a year off and tried to get back into it. I still didnt make it. I kept getting **** on and screwed over. I know that steroids arn't the "right way" to exceed the others.. but seriously.. Half of the team is juicing anyways. Its been my dream to play ball at this school. Ive been reading tons and I think I have a decent base knowledge of what does what. I just dont know what goes with what.

Plus.. It would be REALLY awkward to have to explain needles to my roommates.. or even worse.. parents.

But.. How would

Weeks 1-6 Var 40-50mg/day
Weeks 3-5 PP 15mg low does
Week 6- PP 30mg

Cycle support preload and 2 scoops all the way till 1 week AFTER PCT.. PCT with Nolva, Natty Test booster, Anti-Cort, and some other goodeis.

I figure this wont be too suppressive. Im afraid of losing my natty test production but Im sure I can get it back.

HCG isnt necessary, I dont believe. Ill just use Diesel Test Hardcore or Activate xtreme.

 

[MkUltra]

keep the PP dose up that last week or you will feel there is no reason to be taking it. Start at 30mg 1st week then bump it up to 45mg. You may want to take the PP for 4 weeks instead of 3, it really didn't take on its full effects with me until day 20 at 30mg

 

[ATH3386]

keep the PP dose up that last week or you will feel there is no reason to be taking it. Start at 30mg 1st week then bump it up to 45mg. You may want to take the PP for 4 weeks instead of 3, it really didn't take on its full effects with me until day 20 at 30mg

... weeks 3-6= four weeks
Im not running 45mg of PP with anavar.. that doesnt seem like a great idea.