How to dose SERMs for Gyno Reduction

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    How to dose SERMs for Gyno Reduction


    Happy Thanksgiving! I'm giving thanks for AM for giving me the knowledge to share with all.

    Not for post cycle therapy
    This should not be used for post cycle therapy, but rather a standalone cycle coupled with non hormonal products, training and diet.

    The Philosophy
    The basic instruction is not the amount of SERMs you take but the length of time. As you can see from the studies The length of time your on a SERM determines your results, NOT the amount you dose.

    Department of Pediatrics, University of Ottawa, Ontario, Canada. slawrence@cheo.on.ca

    OBJECTIVES: To assess the efficacy of the anti-estrogens tamoxifen and raloxifen in the medical management of persistent pubertal gynecomastia. STUDY DESIGN: Retrospective chart review of 38 consecutive patients with persistent pubertal gynecomastia who presented to a pediatric endocrinology clinic. Patients received reassurance alone or a 3- to 9-month course of an estrogen receptor modifier (tamoxifen or raloxifene). RESULTS: Mean (superdrol) age of treated subjects was 14.6 (1.5) years with gynecomastia duration of 28.3 (16.4) months. Mean reduction in breast nodule diameter was 2.1 cm (95% CI 1.7, 2.7, P <.0001) after treatment with tamoxifen and 2.5 cm (95% CI 1.7, 3.3, P <.0001) with raloxifene. Some improvement was seen in 86% of patients receiving tamoxifen and in 91% receiving raloxifene, but a greater proportion had a significant decrease (>50%) with raloxifene (86%) than tamoxifen (41%). No side effects were seen in any patients. CONCLUSION: Inhibition of estrogen receptor action in the breast appears to be safe and effective in reducing persistent pubertal gynecomastia, with a better response to raloxifene than to tamoxifen. Further study is required to determine that this is truly a treatment effect.

    PMID: 15238910 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    As we can see, these patients who reduced their gyno went from 3-9 MONTHS before they saw results. I would say to dose everyday for at least 6 months to see results.

    The reason why people are not seeing results with SERMs reducing gyno is not because theyre SERM is bunk (which is a possibility), but they dont have the gusto to go for at least 6 months.

    10mg nolva for 6 months is far more likely to reduce your gyno then if you went for 4 weeks @ 60mg nolva

    Ralox or Nolvadex?
    Raloxifene is preferable because it is less hepatoxic and better on the lipids.

    Dosages
    Nolvadex: 10-20mg ED
    Raloxifene: 30-60mg ED

    Other Ideas to Stack With
    Topical Formestane (lowdose at the beginning)
    Topical ATD (lowdose at the beginning)
    Oral AIs (lowdose at the beginning)
    Grape Seed Extract (high dose throughout)
    Last edited by RenegadeRows; 11-23-2007 at 09:26 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DerekAdams1 View Post
    Good stuff man. So this should be used after post cycle therapy?

    -Derek
    It's possible, but the goal of PCT is to return to homeostasis as fast as possible. This protocol would turn into a long, drawn out PCT which is not advisible. I would advise you use this protocol after your body has returned to normal. Fo' real!

    RR
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    I like Ralox for on-cycle protection at 60 mgs. Some will go as high as 240mg of Ralox for aggressive eliminating gyno but I like the mentality of preventing it before it happens. I've had dreams where I was insanely ripped and big but had lactating b-cups !
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iron Warrior View Post
    I like Ralox for on-cycle protection at 60 mgs. Some will go as high as 240mg of Ralox for aggressive eliminating gyno but I like the mentality of preventing it before it happens. I've had dreams where I was insanely ripped and big but had lactating b-cups !
    What a nightmare that must've been, lol.

    Just to note: The reason people go as high as 240mg to STOP gyno from forming with Raloxifene is because RALOX takes a long time to build up in the blood stream, hence the high dosing.

    Once the gyno is formed (pubertal or pre steroid induced; like this post is intended for.) theres no reason to go higher than 60mg.

    RR

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