1st real cycle

[CHA0S]

Hey guys, I'm new to anabolicminds and this is my first thread. I've been researching on this topic for a while now (and have even written a research paper about it for college, A+ ) and have also done a few PH cycles in the past, so I feel its time for me to step up to the big leagues.
My Stats
Height: 6'0" (I stopped growing when I was in 9th grade due to the fact that I had a slight curvature on my back that was nothing to worry about, according to the doctor)
Weight: 183lb
Bench: workout out 230 lb 6x
Squat: workout with 280 lb 8x
Pre cycle
Letro: .2mg/day 2 weeks before starting cycle to keep it in your blood stream
1. cycle dbol/test e
week 1: dbol 20mg week 2-4: dbol 30mg
week 1-12 Test-Enan: 400mg/week (2 days a week, Mon and Thurs)
week 8-post cycle therapy: Novaldex 10mg (20mg during PCT) (i'll explain more on my PCT later)
-or-
2. cycle dbol/deca/test e
I'm kinda skeptical on this one but i do have it planned out
week 1-10 deca: 200-300 mg/week
week 1-4 dbol: 20mg/week
week 1-12 test e: 400 mg/week
B6: 200 ED
Nolva: 10 mg ED or if can afford it Dostinex (would it be necessary for a small cycle like this)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated thanks.

 

[Travis]

Hey guys, I'm new to anabolicminds and this is my first thread. I've been researching on this topic for a while now (and have even written a research paper about it for college, A+ ) and have also done a few PH cycles in the past, so I feel its time for me to step up to the big leagues.
My Stats
Height: 6'0" (I stopped growing when I was in 9th grade due to the fact that I had a slight curvature on my back that was nothing to worry about, according to the doctor)
Weight: 183lb
Bench: workout out 230 lb 6x
Squat: workout with 280 lb 8x
Pre cycle
Letro: .2mg/day 2 weeks before starting cycle to keep it in your blood stream
1. cycle dbol/test e
week 1: dbol 20mg week 2-4: dbol 30mg
week 1-12 Test-Enan: 400mg/week (2 days a week, Mon and Thurs)
week 8-post cycle therapy: Novaldex 10mg (20mg during post cycle therapy) (i'll explain more on my PCT later)
-or-
2. cycle dbol/deca/test e
I'm kinda skeptical on this one but i do have it planned out
week 1-10 deca: 200-300 mg/week
week 1-4 dbol: 20mg/week
week 1-12 test e: 400 mg/week
B6: 200 ED
Nolva: 10 mg ED or if can afford it Dostinex (would it be necessary for a small cycle like this)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated thanks.

I think #1 would be best. Its not like you want to experience deca **** on your first inj cycle. For the most part that looks pretty good. People might tell you to up the dbol and test dosages but I think those are both good for a first cycle.

Look into HCG on cycle. Not sure the nolva is needed on cycle unless your having gyno issues. I would also use ralox over it anyways. Post your PCT, imo that is where most people need help.

Vets feel free to correct me if I missed anything...

 

[CHA0S]

Thanx bro, in fact I will go with the first one. So how does having ralox on hand just in case and using nolvadex in pct.
PCT
Nolva: 20mg ED
HCG: 300-500 iu mondays and thursdays
and maybe mayogenx to help increase natural test and it might also help in adding more gains.
vets any advice, I want to get this down as perfectly as i can before i start anything

 

[Travis]

Thanx bro, in fact I will go with the first one. So how does having ralox on hand just in case and using nolvadex in post cycle therapy.
PCT
Nolva: 20mg ED
HCG: 300-500 iu mondays and thursdays
and maybe mayogenx to help increase natural test and it might also help in adding more gains.
vets any advice, I want to get this down as perfectly as i can before i start anything

Use the ralox in PCT. Its a better SERM imho, and I wouldnt even mess with nolva unless I already had it. Also use the HCG on cycle, not during PCT. I believe Myogenx is just the herb Fadogia and couldnt hurt in PCT. I think resveratrol would be a better choice for PCT.

Just curious though why such a low dose of nolva? I am not saying thats wrong, in fact I think I agree with the lower doses but others pry wont.

 

[CHA0S]

Just curious though why such a low dose of nolva? I am not saying thats wrong, in fact I think I agree with the lower doses but others pry wont.

The reason I used nolva in such a low dose and later in my cycle is due to the fact that I'm going to take Letro before I start the actual cycle. Letro is already preventing the conversion of androgens to estrogen;therefore, nolva would only take away from the effectiveness of letro.

and what do you suggest i run the HCG at?

Thanx in Advance

 

[Travis]

and what do you suggest i run the HCG at?

Thanx in Advance

250IU's 2x/week

 

[CHA0S]

Ok, I'm not familiar with Raloxifene and can't find much about it on other forums. What should i take for the doses during PCT?
I also a little confused on what else I should take for PCT. Clomid? Toremifene? Both? or something else. thanx

 

[Travis]

Ok, I'm not familiar with Raloxifene and can't find much about it on other forums. What should i take for the doses during post cycle therapy?
I also a little confused on what else I should take for PCT. Clomid? Toremifene? Both? or something else. thanx

Check out the PCT forum. There is a ton of good info in there. Let us know if you dont find what you need...

 

[CHA0S]

Check out the post cycle therapy forum. There is a ton of good info in there. Let us know if you dont find what you need...

Thanx, will do. I'll check back if I need any other help.

 

[CROWLER]

Hey CHAOS,

Welcome!

I had to comment as we have a product by the name of chaos

To protect yourself from high blood pressure, high cholesterol etc I would recommend Cycle Support. It is available at www.NutraPlanet.com

You may also want to look into a new product we have coming out specifically for post cycle. The name funny enough is POST Cycle Support and will be at Nutra Planet within 10 days.

Good LUCK!


CROWLER

 

[sdmf45]

why are your starting post cycle therapy in week 8? or was that a typo? just wondering.

 

[Travis]

why are your starting post cycle therapy in week 8? or was that a typo? just wondering.

I think he is just planning to use 10mg's of nolva to maybe prevent gyno at that time? I wasnt quite sure on that either...

 

[CHA0S]

why are your starting post cycle therapy in week 8? or was that a typo? just wondering.

No it wasn't a typo. I've been looking on steroid.com on there sample cycles and they have people using 10mg Nolva throughout the cycle, but since I was taking the Letro I figured it probably wouldn't be necessary until later on in the cycle. But now I'm not even taking it. I have an idea what my PCT will look like now. I'll post it once I get the dosages and let everyone critique it.

 

[CHA0S]

BTW, that cycle support looks pretty interesting. Does anyone have any positive or negative reviews?

 

[Travis]

BTW, that cycle support looks pretty interesting. Does anyone have any positive or negative reviews?

There is lots of positive feedback on it. Look around the supplement board, it has been out for a while now. POST cycle support is new but imo it would be a great product during PCT.

 

[sdmf45]

BTW, that cycle support looks pretty interesting. Does anyone have any positive or negative reviews?

I always use cycle support you can't go wrong with it. i did a blood test mid cycle and i was using cycle support and the results came back perfect. the nurse said "whatever your doing keep it up cause everything is in perfect condition".

great product IMO! :thumbsup:

 

[CROWLER]

BTW, that cycle support looks pretty interesting. Does anyone have any positive or negative reviews?

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/steroids/64443-liver-support-poll.html

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/anabolic-innovations/53347-cycle-support-life.html

Here are 2 threads you may want to take a look at.


Best of luck!


CROWLER

 

[CHA0S]

NICE threads Crowler :thumbsup: I'm going to use it throughout. And thanks for the other comments about it guys. I'll post up what all I'm doing and the dosages tomorrow.

 

[CHA0S]

OK, this is what I'm doing thus far.

Pre Cycle​

.25 mg Letro (going to start this 2 wks. before cycle)

Cycle​

wk. 1-12 .2 mg Letro throughout cycle only
Wk. 1 Dbol 20mg Wk. 2-4 30mg
wk. 1-12 Test E 500 mg (2x/wk) Monday and Thursday
wk. 1-14 HCG 250 IU (2x/wk) Monday and Thursday
wk. 1-12 AI Cycle Support and various support supp.

PCT (start wk. 15​

wk. 15-18 Toremifene 180 mg/ 120 mg/ 60 mg/ 30mg
wk. 15-18 Retain 2 dosage is how its stated on product
(this is all have right now for this PCT, still reading to see if there is anything else I might want to add)
and I will continue to take support supp.

 

[Travis]

Start the HCG on day 15 (beginning of week 3). Other than that looks good...

 

[Travis]

Bump, cause I dont know the answer but is the letro really needed prior to cycle?

Or for that matter even needed unless gyno symptoms arise durng cycle? Cant say I have heard of the pre-loading thing?

 

[RisingAgainst]

Bump, cause I dont know the answer but is the letro really needed prior to cycle?

Or for that matter even needed unless gyno symptoms arise durng cycle? Cant say I have heard of the pre-loading thing?

No letro isnt needed precycle.. and yes I HIGHLY recommend using it on cycle.

 

[TripDog]

No it wasn't a typo. I've been looking on steroid.com on there sample cycles and they have people using 10mg Nolva throughout the cycle, but since I was taking the Letro I figured it probably wouldn't be necessary until later on in the cycle. But now I'm not even taking it. I have an idea what my post cycle therapy will look like now. I'll post it once I get the dosages and let everyone critique it.

i take nolva during my cycles(every 3rd day usually) to help with lipids,and prevent any gyno sides...i say be safe than sorry

 

[RisingAgainst]

i take nolva during my cycles(every 3rd day usually) to help with lipids,and prevent any gyno sides...i say be safe than sorry

I prefer AI's to SERMs while on cycle.. Letro pwns.. :squat:

 

[TripDog]

No letro isnt needed precycle.. and yes I HIGHLY recommend using it on cycle.

i was doing letro at the begining of this cycle and by the second week my hip joints were ungodly frickin painful from low estro.....i wouldn't take letro everyday ever again!! that was horrable!!! i couldn't even fukcin walk

 

[TripDog]

I prefer AI's to SERMs while on cycle.. Letro pwns.. :squat:

i started with letro,now i switched to a-dex.......and do the nolva every 3rd day

 

[RisingAgainst]

i was doing letro at the begining of this cycle and by the second week my hip joints were ungodly frickin painful from low estro.....i wouldn't take letro everyday ever again!! that was horrable!!! i couldn't even fukcin walk

I hear ya dude.. but it is great to use EOD on cycle.. lol

 

[Travis]

No letro isnt needed precycle.. and yes I HIGHLY recommend using it on cycle.

Letro can potentially have a rebound effect, so I'm curious why even use it unless needed. Wouldnt aromisin be better used on cycle unless severe symptoms arise?

 

[RisingAgainst]

Letro can potentially have a rebound effect, so I'm curious why even use it unless needed. Wouldnt aromisin be better used on cycle unless severe symptoms arise?

Same pathway bro.. letro can have a rebound effect if not used properly, as can adex

 

[Travis]

Same pathway bro.. letro can have a rebound effect if not used properly, as can adex

Huh? I said aromisin (exemestane) not letro/adex... Wtf am I missing here?

u vag :stick:

 

[TripDog]

the human body in general does not like drastic radical changes to occur.....meaning tapering and slowly increasing things is the much preferd method.....this is very true when dealing with hormones(mainly estro)..hence the whole rebound effect........it's like the butterfly effect but slightly different....

 

[RisingAgainst]

Huh? I said aromisin (exemestane) not letro/adex... Wtf am I missing here?

u vag :stick:

my bad dude I misread it.. you yeast infacted vag.. (it's either that or "ya gay bastard!"..) LOL

 

[RisingAgainst]

the human body in general does not like drastic radical changes to occur.....meaning tapering and slowly increasing things is the much preferd method.....this is very true when dealing with hormones(mainly estro)..hence the whole rebound effect........it's like the butterfly effect but slightly different....

No way? LOL

 

[Travis]

i take nolva during my cycles(every 3rd day usually) to help with lipids,and prevent any gyno sides...i say be safe than sorry

Ever use albuterol on cycle to improve lipids? Or does clen do that (I dont think it does?)?

 

[LilPsychotic]

OK, this is what I'm doing thus far.

Pre Cycle​

.25 mg Letro (going to start this 2 wks. before cycle)

Cycle​

wk. 1-12 .2 mg Letro throughout cycle only
Wk. 1 Dbol 20mg Wk. 2-4 30mg
wk. 1-12 Test E 500 mg (2x/wk) Monday and Thursday
wk. 1-14 HCG 250 IU (2x/wk) Monday and Thursday
wk. 1-12 AI Cycle Support and various support supp.

post cycle therapy (start wk. 15​

wk. 15-18 Toremifene 180 mg/ 120 mg/ 60 mg/ 30mg
wk. 15-18 Retain 2 dosage is how its stated on product
(this is all have right now for this PCT, still reading to see if there is anything else I might want to add)
and I will continue to take support supp.

You should preload cycle support 2 weeks before starting the anabolics, some of the ingredients take a few weeks to kick in-solid product though

 

[TripDog]

Ever use albuterol on cycle to improve lipids? Or does clen do that (I dont think it does?)?

i use clen often......not shure it helps lipids???? anyone know?

 

[Travis]

i use clen often......not shure it helps lipids???? anyone know?

In Anthony Roberts article on Clen vs Albuterol he says the below, but never really states that clen doesnt improve lipids. Although the way it sounds it pry doesnt, I dunno:

One of the things I really like about Albuterol is that it has the potential to actually be used on my cycle to make it safer by improving my lipid profile (cholesterol)…or during PCT - post cycle therapy - to help get my cholesterol levels back in check. This is because Albuterol shows significant benefits to cholesterol as it works to lower total cholesterol, specifically LDL (the bad stuff) while at the same time elevating HDL (the good stuff).(8)

 

[CHA0S]

Bump, cause I dont know the answer but is the letro really needed prior to cycle?

Or for that matter even needed unless gyno symptoms arise durng cycle? Cant say I have heard of the pre-loading thing?

Check out this link. This where I got every thing I need to know about letro. I know it kill libido, but as of now I don't have a girlfriend and if one hot blonde or brunette happens to hit on me, I'll be like :wtf:

Here's the link
http://www.alinboard.com/showthread.php?t=7325

 

[CHA0S]

and about the lipids, Torm is said to raise HDL and lower LDL.

 

[Travis]

Check out this link. This where I got every thing I need to know about letro. I know it kill libido, but as of now I don't have a girlfriend and if one hot blonde or brunette happens to hit on me, I'll be like :wtf:

Here's the link
http://www.alinboard.com/showthread.php?t=7325

JMO, but I wouldnt start letro until there are any signs of gyno. Even if you want to be preventive I am not sure you need to start 2 weeks pre cycle. This is the posters reasoning in that link:

You will want to start running the letro approximately 2 weeks before you begin your cycle to allow it to fully stabilize in your blood. I have often heard the argument that letro takes up to 60 days to stabilize, I don’t know if I buy into this for the reason that I have reversed gyno after using letro for only 1 week. Still to be safe I recommend starting it before your cycle as stated above.

Can anyone back this up? Cant say I have heard of this...

 

[TripDog]

dude do yourself a favor....DO NOT START LETRO 2 WEEKS AHEAD!!!!!!.......get something less abrasive!..armidex is the gold standard....i totally agree with travis,dont use letro unless you are developing a problem with gyno.....i learned my lesson...trust!

 

[CHA0S]

dude do yourself a favor....DO NOT START LETRO 2 WEEKS AHEAD!!!!!!.......get something less abrasive!..armidex is the gold standard....i totally agree with travis,dont use letro unless you are developing a problem with gyno.....i learned my lesson...trust!

Gotcha. Letro out.

 

[CHA0S]

Yea, now i've come to the realization that letro is way to hardcore for a simple cycle of dbol/test

 

[CHA0S]

additions
PCT: Aromasin 20-25 mg/day
Cycle: A-dex .25 EOD or ED

subtractions
Cycle: Letro

 

[CHA0S]

Well, whether anyones follow this thread or not, I am going to post my final decisions.

2 weeks before cycle
starting cycle support

Cycle
Dbol: wk1- 20mg wk 2-5 30mg maybe 40 on week 5?
Test E: wk 1-12 500 mg (2x/wk)
HCG: 250 iu (2x/wk) taking until one week before starting PCT and
starting on beginning of wk 3
A-Dex: .25 mg ED throughout cycle not PCT
Cycle Support: As directed
Support Supplements: (don't feel like naming them all)

PCT
Aromasin: 20-25 mg ED
Toremifene: 180/120/60/30
Support Supplements
Retain 2: 3-5 caps ED
Long r3 IGF-1: 50 mcg