Is it normal to get WEAK from PH's??
07-31-2007 09:59 AM
Is it normal to get WEAK from PH's??
I have done a few cycles of PH's in the past. I've done pretty good with a VPX 1-test/EQ stack. Also with Halodrol stand-alones. Superdrol usually makes me feel like recycled crap, so I try to avoid it.
Last week I started a stack that is a new one for me. I was very excited because I thought there would be some great synergies in this cycle for my upcoming powerlifting meet.
My goals are to gain 7-10lbs and to maximize strength in about 5 weeks, with as miminal sides as possible. I am 6'1" tall about 255 when I started, and I would guess about 16-18% bf.
This is the stack I started almost a week ago.
4AD Transdermal 400mg bid (am and pm)
4AD oral 300mg (once mid-day)
GL Mega-Trn 2 caps/day, upped to 3 caps day before yesterday.
Halodrol 50 (original Gasperi batch), 50mg/day, added 25mg GL Mega-H day before yesterday for total 75mg/day (after reading that it may be under dosed for my bw).
I have worked out twice since starting the stack. First was bench on Saturday. My best competition BP is 600lbs. I was having trouble with 585 to a 1-board for this workout. All my ancillaries seemed a little weaker too.
My second training session was yesterday doing back. I was down 10-20 lbs on nearly all my exercises with some of them even losing reps along with decreased weights from just a week or two ago. I seemed to fatigue prematurely in all exercises.
The funny thing is I can feel this stuff working. I am up a couple of pounds. My pumps are noticably better (including back pumps that I could do without, LOL), and I feel strong going into the gym. No noticable sides yet and feel generally good... But as soon as I pick up a barbell, it feels HEAVY.
I have continued my creatine while on cycle this first week. Using Kre-Alkalyn and Millennium Sports Kreaceps. Protein intake is good, though I could probably up my carbs, but If I eat too much I start to feel really bloated (which happens a lot when I'm cycling, for some reason).
I have noticed similar effects using 4AD before, and when it's happened I've just dropped the 4AD from my stack and continued my cycle without it. I am wondering, however, if this is just a normal process of starting a cycle with 4AD or these other compounds, and if I should just continue as I've started and I will see results?
I'm just at a loss right now about how to proceed, and time is ticking away for my meet. Any knowledgable answers or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
07-31-2007 11:18 AM
I'm hoping that's the case... I just haven't had this weakness issue when starting cycles with other compounds.
Originally Posted by Gixxer82
08-01-2007 10:59 AM
Any other thoughts on this?
Trained mid-week bench, tris and shoulders last night. Still felt my lifts were down a bit, but probably not as bad as Monday night.
Have others experienced an initial loss of strength when starting a cycle?
Does my cycle/doseages look like a good one for peaking strength for my meet Sep 1?
I've read mixed reviews about Mega-TRN, anyone have good strength gains from it they can tell me about?
Any input is appreciated.
08-01-2007 11:05 AM
Running with the Big Boys
My guess would be the nutrient repartitioning. I know that TRN causes a mean blood sugar crash if you have inadequate carbs. Try adding an extra 50g of carbs to your pre-WO meal.
08-01-2007 12:23 PM
yeah ya def gotta be eating significant carbs running all that stuff... how do you feel in the gym? if your burning out quick or feeling any type of dizziness or light headedness then your prob experiencing some hypogylcemia which will decrease lifts no matter what your taking
08-01-2007 12:29 PM
Rodja and Movin Weight are right. Something u may want to try is making a protein shake with some PB or olive oil, something with a good amount of fat in it and take it pre-workout. I was having issues with eating carbs 1-1.5 pre-workout and I got dizzy alot. I been doing this and haven't had any issues.
Originally Posted by Movin_weight
I guess what I am saying is eat a good amount during the day and skip on them pre-workout, I believe it was causing to much of a spike before then. I will get some info from a Dr. I know that helped me out with this.
08-01-2007 12:31 PM
id suggest hypoglycemia as well. androgens have quite the effect on blood sugar levels, some more than others.
i would suggest 1. getting more sleep 2. upping the carbs overall 3. drinking a bottle of gatorade or powerade through the beginning of your workout
08-01-2007 12:55 PM
Some great observations and suggestions. Maybe I am skimping too much on the carbs?
I normally have a mid-morning protein shake with whey/egg protein and some whole oat flour thrown in for a bit of carbs. Then I go to lunch about 1:30 or 2PM on weekdays, usually heavy on protein (usually chicken) and usually my most substantial meal of the day.
Then I'll lift at about 6-6:30 when I get home. I typically slam a protein drink with some maltodextrin immediately before I lift, and I often make enough to kinda sip on while I'm training. Maybe I'm not getting enough carbs far enough in advance of my workout?
On my big bench day (Saturday) I usually sleep in til about 9AM then get up and my breakfast is a blended whole food shake with
6 egg whites
1/2 cup 1% milk
15g whey protein
1tbs ground flax seed
1tbs wheat bran
1tbs psyllium fiber
2tbs cottage cheese
1tbs olive oil
1 cup (heaping) whole rolled oats
(This is the same thing I have for breakfast every day, BTW)
I then lift about 1 to 1.5 hours later at 10:30am.
I often do feel sluggish, winded... kinda laxidasical in the gym.
I do also usually have a cytomax energy drink that I sip on for some extra endergy, but doesn't seem to be working all that well.
I'm pretty sure I'm getting sugar and fats, since I'm a powerlifter and my diet is healthy but not super clean, by bodybuilding standards. Chinese food is on the menu at least 3 times per week, LOL!
Based on the above, does this kinda confirm the "under-carbed" diagnosis?
08-01-2007 01:54 PM
i notice that you're carbohydrate choices in your preworkout meal seem to be mostly very slow acting carbohydrates... why not throw in some dextrose or slam a gatorade or something like that before your workout to give you a pre w/o insulin spike. I always have far superior workouts when high GI are utilized beforehand.
08-01-2007 05:01 PM
A lot of my carbs probably fall into this category. But isn't the Cytomax Energy Drink fast acting carbs? I also frequently have a bannana or apple right before I train.
Originally Posted by HARDtotheCORE
08-03-2007 03:16 AM
I'd generally say that fructose is a poor carbohydrate choice for pre-workout situations. From what i've researched, as well as experienced, fructose (the sugar in fruits) doesnt seem to load the muscles with nearly the glycogen as a carbohydrate like dextrose or say vitargo would. With taht said, i'd say give yourself a different pre-workout carb boost and see if you feel the difference. A co-worker of mine has been raving about waxy-maize preworkout... give it a shot. its cheap enough and can do nothing but help. - httc
08-03-2007 10:12 AM
Thanks for the suggestion!! I'll check into that and see if it helps.
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