Please, Some advice - Hair Related

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
Hi ... I'm hoping someone can give me honest advice ...
I used to do anabolics in my twenties. I never had any issues with my hair. I'm 38 now and decided to go to a doctor and go on a light test program. I'm using a test cream (testosterone 10% LIPO) I rub 1 ML on (inner thigh) in the morning another 1 ML at night. I also take three shots of chorionic gonandothropin which keeps my sperm production going. Before going on this plan I had seen some thinning in my frontal scalp but recently it seems like I've gotten thinner. I never see hairs on my pillow but I've noticed during the day on an average of 20 hairs and in the shower about anothe 30 to 40. I am convinced by now that the test may be speeding up the loss. I had told the doctor about this and he gave me a precription for Propecia but I've heard of the side effects and I'm hesitant. Particularly, that I will go through a shedding stage. I also heard that results are not seen until one year later. Has anyone used Propecia? Please comment ... I will truly appreciate any advice I could get.
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
bump. Just hoping someone will reply
i am on propecia now, yes u will see some shedding in the beginning but you will notice results within 3 months, its definitely worth it.. however im pretty sure it wont be able to help that much if u are on test, as i was on something as light as jungle warfare and i was still losing hair while on propeica.. the answer is this... if you care about your hair go off the test.. either way take the propecia in 3-4 months you will be glad you did. especially if you use propecia and rogaine together.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Topical Spironolactone is effective, as as a number of readily available compounds used topically.

As to what those are, you will just have to wait and see.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
speedpastu and dsade,

Thank you very much for your replies. I think I do care about my hair more. I got to tell you though, being on the test make me feel great and I hate to stop but as I said ... I'm going to have to.

A couple of more questions if you do not mind ...

If I did lose hair due to the test ... Do you think it's lost forever?

The treatment that I'm on is prescribed by a doctor ... Should I just stop or wait for him to give me something to cycle off?
Do you know of any natural or non-prescription stuff that I should take to cycle off?
BTW: The cream has 10% Testosterone and I apply 1 ML twice a day. I didn't think this amount would have affected me.

What do you think I could go on that (supplements,etc.) that is effective for building muscle and is not risky? (Best stuff out there.).

I've heard of spiro ... Is it realy alot of maintenace? Have you or do you know of someone who had success with it?

Although expensive ... I heard GH is safer ... Is this true?

Thanks ... I really appreciate your feedback.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
Topical Spironolactone is effective, as as a number of readily available compounds used topically.

QUOTE]

As to what those are, you will just have to wait and see.[/

Could you elaborate on this?
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
BTW: I've been on the treatment for two months.
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
BTW: I've been on the treatment for two months.
Topical spiro is the exact same thing as propecia.. a DHT blocker.. I just had this conversation with my doctor about 3 days ago. If you are already on propecia i reccomend staying on it and using rogaine (the foam is better) to grow some of the hair lost, back. The questions about it being lost forever is one that depends, some people grow it back, some don't given your age its most likely not going to come back..unless you use rogaine, which has minoxidill the only thing that has been proven to grow hair on the head. Do you want to grow muscle, get bigger, get stronger, or get more cut... answer these questions and I can give you some advice. Just PM me if you want. I would definitely ask your doctor as soon as possible about getting off the test, if it were me I would stop immediately tho.
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
um...you are mistaken. spiro is an anti-androgen, finasteride is a 5AR inhibitor. neither is a DHT blocker.
Propecia blocks a form of 5-alpha-reductase called type II 5-alpha-reductase from converting as much testosterone to DHT as would be the case without treatment. The result is lower levels of DHT in the blood. Continuous treatment is required to maintain the benefits, as 5-alpha-reductase will continue converting testosterone to DHT if treatment is discontinued.
Propecia is the only DHT inhibitor the FDA has approved for hair loss.

What I meant to say is there no point in taking propecia and topical spiro at the same time.
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Reducing DHT systemically is not a good idea, IMO. Spiro will block some of the negative effects of androgens locally (in scalp tissue), while not affecting DHT systemically.

My post was referring to a formula that I had worked out, and now modified to include 2 new items, that worked very well for me during alpha testing. It is an advanced formula that blocks hairloss, and contributes to health hair growth. The drawbacks back then were that the formula stained...but now I realize it is not as big of a deal as it was back then, compared to hairloss.

I am going to revive this formula, send it back into testing, and probably offer it as a beta soon.
 

same_old

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
Reducing DHT systemically is not a good idea, IMO. Spiro will block some of the negative effects of androgens locally (in scalp tissue), while not affecting DHT systemically.
yup. spiro works with ANY androgen, not just test (so few cycles are test only), and it isnt systemic (if done right), so it certainly has a place in a hairloss prevention regimen.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
Topical spiro is the exact same thing as propecia.. a DHT blocker.. I just had this conversation with my doctor about 3 days ago. If you are already on propecia i reccomend staying on it and using rogaine (the foam is better) to grow some of the hair lost, back. The questions about it being lost forever is one that depends, some people grow it back, some don't given your age its most likely not going to come back..unless you use rogaine, which has minoxidill the only thing that has been proven to grow hair on the head. Do you want to grow muscle, get bigger, get stronger, or get more cut... answer these questions and I can give you some advice. Just PM me if you want. I would definitely ask your doctor as soon as possible about getting off the test, if it were me I would stop immediately tho.
speedpastu,

I think I'm going to start the propecia. I stopped doing the test last Thursday and I already feel the lack of pump... which sucks but I need to recover my hair. You know I noticed as fas as 1 1/2 years ago that I was thinning but the test definitely affected it more. Luckly, I was only doing for two months. I did not like the idea of using a drug for at least 1 year to see results, possibly shed a lot, affect my sex life and probably need to continue using for a long time but... appearance is important in corporate America and that's my bread and butter. So far I've heard that the "sheds" is not a definite side-effect, I heard the sexual sides are temporary and that some people eventualy can phase out of it .... who know may be they'll come up with something else that is better. But I think I am early ... I've been thinng for only 2 years, I still have a full head of hair ... I've hopefully caught it in good time.

BTW: Do you think that now that I've stopped the test that I will shed even more? Like aren't most side effects elevated after stopping?

BTW: I will answer to your private message ... I would also like to extend some rep points for your help.

I will private message you soon ... a little busy this week.
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
speedpastu,

I think I'm going to start the propecia. I stopped doing the test last Thursday and I already feel the lack of pump... which sucks but I need to recover my hair. You know I noticed as fas as 1 1/2 years ago that I was thinning but the test definitely affected it more. Luckly, I was only doing for two months. I did not like the idea of using a drug for at least 1 year to see results, possibly shed a lot, affect my sex life and probably need to continue using for a long time but... appearance is important in corporate America and that's my bread and butter. So far I've heard that the "sheds" is not a definite side-effect, I heard the sexual sides are temporary and that some people eventualy can phase out of it .... who know may be they'll come up with something else that is better. But I think I am early ... I've been thinng for only 2 years, I still have a full head of hair ... I've hopefully caught it in good time.

BTW: Do you think that now that I've stopped the test that I will shed even more? Like aren't most side effects elevated after stopping?

BTW: I will answer to your private message ... I would also like to extend some rep points for your help.

I will private message you soon ... a little busy this week.
have you talked to your doctor about stopping the test, he is not prescribing you anything such as a post cycle for it is he? i do not think you will shed even more, you should be fine and be happy you stopped in time, hell u should of seen how much hair i lost just on jw/bam i was really gaining strength but decided the hair is more important, will prolly try some var soon, if i shed on that its over and i'm giving up and going back to creatine and massfx lol. keep my updated. thanks.
 

Rx Lift

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
Start taking the propecia immediately and stay on the test. Finasteride as explained above is a Type II 5-alpha reductase inhibitor, this will inhibit the conversion of testosterone to DHT. With the inhibition of of 5-AR, the amount of DHT binding will be reduced significantly and should stop the excess hairloss you are experiencing. Roughly after a month of use you will notice shedding again which is normal - this indicates a new growth cycle is occurring and your old hair is being pushed out. While this may be discouraging stay on the medication, as your results 3-4 months from now will be worth it. Spirinolactone is different from finasteride. Spirinolactone is a androgen antagonist, it will stop all androgens from binding in your scalp. Using this is unnecessary at this point and I think the finasteride should work just fine for you. As far as the sexual side effects, some people notice them, some do not. According on the research it is temporary for the most part. Good luck!
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
Start taking the propecia immediately and stay on the test. Finasteride as explained above is a Type II 5-alpha reductase inhibitor, this will inhibit the conversion of testosterone to DHT. With the inhibition of of 5-AR, the amount of DHT binding will be reduced significantly and should stop the excess hairloss you are experiencing.
this is most likely not the case... i have been on proepecia for over a year now, i just did a cycle of jw/bam which i think we can all agree that is no where near as strong as test itself and i lost a ton of hair, the propecia did not help this at all. especially if he hasn't been on the propecia and he just starts taking it as he is taking the test, he will lose a ton of hair as propecia is known to cause shedding before it starts working, as the effects of propecia are not seen for months after taking it.
 

same_old

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
this is most likely not the case... i have been on proepecia for over a year now, i just did a cycle of jw/bam which i think we can all agree that is no where near as strong as test itself and i lost a ton of hair, the propecia did not help this at all.
you dont believe the doc? LOL. he tells the truth. here's your logic error:

JW/BAM are androgens. they activate the AR (including the ones in the scalp, of course) entirely independently of testosterone/DHT/finasteride. taking one of those is akin to using any other steroid. now, i dont even know if JW or BAM are 5a-reduced, but it's essentially irrelevant, as their potential for hairloss has been made apparent. if a person wants to prevent hairloss from other androgens (with the exception of, say, OHT or 4OHT or M4OHT or MT or even 4OHA which all undergo 5AR to produce a more androgenic hormone. the vast majority of other androgens are not affected by 5AR), they will have to use an anti-androgen like spiro, applied topically (orally is possible too but completely retarded for BBers)
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
Let me just point out a couple of things because history helps.

1) I noticed thinning 2 years ago (I'm 38). So it was happening before.

2) During the two years I've thinned somewhat more (not a whole lot but noticible to me and wife only).

3) It appears to be thinning more these last two months that I've was applying a test cream that is 10% - one rub in the morning, the other at night.

4) Then I also take three shots a week of HCG (GONADOTROPIN) to keep my system working.

5) This is all prescribed by a doctor.

6) The doctor did give me Propecia because I mentioned the thinning ... he told me to take it every other day.

7) I didn't take it becuase I wanted to see what happened and I was also concerned with shedding.

8) I've been on hairloss forums and although many do shed on Propecia, some do not.

9) I saw a dermatologist for something else and she said I did not need it and again ... she said not all people shed that much.

If I could take the Propecia with the test and it helps ... that is good. I just wish I had some certainty.


I just wish I could have both ... Gains and strenght to help buils up and not loose my hair.

BTW: I still have a full head of hair. Under sunlight, vanity lights and when its wet is when it is most noticable. I also feel less density ... so I am most concerned of what's to come.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
you dont believe the doc? LOL. he tells the truth. here's your logic error:

JW/BAM are androgens. they activate the AR (including the ones in the scalp, of course) entirely independently of testosterone/DHT/finasteride. taking one of those is akin to using any other steroid. now, i dont even know if JW or BAM are 5a-reduced, but it's essentially irrelevant, as their potential for hairloss has been made apparent. if a person wants to prevent hairloss from other androgens (with the exception of, say, OHT or 4OHT or M4OHT or MT or even 4OHA which all undergo 5AR to produce a more androgenic hormone. the vast majority of other androgens are not affected by 5AR), they will have to use an anti-androgen like spiro, applied topically (orally is possible too but completely retarded for BBers)
BTW: What is JW/BAM?
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
have you talked to your doctor about stopping the test, he is not prescribing you anything such as a post cycle for it is he? i do not think you will shed even more, you should be fine and be happy you stopped in time, hell u should of seen how much hair i lost just on jw/bam i was really gaining strength but decided the hair is more important, will prolly try some var soon, if i shed on that its over and i'm giving up and going back to creatine and massfx lol. keep my updated. thanks.
I'm gonna call the doctor but this ******* is hard to reach ... he never answers calls back ... I have to get someone else.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
BTW:

Finally got a hold of my doctor and he did say that I should have started taking the propecia when I started ti treatment. He mentioned that he had me take it every day because I mentioned the sexual side effects. He told me I should take it every day and that not all people shed.

He also stated that the treatment I am on is light. The lightest he prescribes. He said anabolics would be worse but that considering how I'm reacting to the light test that who knows ... maybe something like Deca would not affect me like others ... In essence, everyone is different.

I may give it a shot and continue again with the test.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
bump. Just hope fellas that were helping me add to my last comments ... Please see my list and what the doctor told me last.


BYW: Is spiro difficult to apply and since I do have a full head of hair (just thinning) should I even consider it?
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
i don't understand why everyone is afraid of propecia and say its so harsh, its a 1mg pill and its very easy, i have been taking this little pill for the past year every morning and seen nothing but great results and no side effects, it doesn't effect me in any way except controlling my hair loss.
What is your doctor prescribing the test for in the first place? I would pass on the spiro and just start on the propecia in 3 months you'll be glad you did.
This is just me but if I were you I would be more concerned with hair loss than anything else..
I would discontinue the test, and start propecia, it seems to me that your hair is more important to you then getting stronger or bigger, not to mention there are other things out there that can get you stronger with a less likelihood of losing your hair.
 

rcarracedo

Member
Awards
0
i don't understand why everyone is afraid of propecia and say its so harsh, its a 1mg pill and its very easy, i have been taking this little pill for the past year every morning and seen nothing but great results and no side effects, it doesn't effect me in any way except controlling my hair loss.
What is your doctor prescribing the test for in the first place? I would pass on the spiro and just start on the propecia in 3 months you'll be glad you did.
This is just me but if I were you I would be more concerned with hair loss than anything else..
I would discontinue the test, and start propecia, it seems to me that your hair is more important to you then getting stronger or bigger, not to mention there are other things out there that can get you stronger with a less likelihood of losing your hair.
I wanted to do the test for muscle gain. I'm going to couple it with the propecia.
 

same_old

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
I wanted to do the test for muscle gain. I'm going to couple it with the propecia.
sounds like a plan. the finasteride will probably help. i for one dont get shedding when i start finasteride, but i have super-short hair so "shedding" isnt noticed.
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
I take ~1mg of finesteride every day, and have experience no side effects.

There are many other ways to alleviate your hair loss issues due to genetic MPB and the addition of extrogenous testosterone. 1mg Finesteride is a good place to start. You may also want to look into using Ketoconozole shampoo (Nizoral), and LLLT Therapy (Laser Hair Brush). Topical androgen blockers like Spiro may also be of benefit. You may also want to look into a product called Crinagen - a topical solution of natural DHT inhibitors that looks like it should work pretty well.

Dsade is right, inhibiting too much DHT systemically is a very bad idea...many people can handle the mild reduction in DHT that a low dose of finesteride provides, however.

The combination of the above 3 should go a long way toward alleviating your symptoms.

i just did a cycle of jw/bam which i think we can all agree that is no where near as strong as test itself and i lost a ton of hair,
If the compounds in JW and BAM are not using 5AR to convert into a DHT-based compound, then finesteride will not help you at all. If they're boosting natural test while at the same time inhibiting SHBG and aromatase, you're going to have a boatload of free test running around that your body is trying to stablize. You're inhibiting two of the mechanisms the body uses to normalize your test levels, so guess where its going to turn? 5-Alpha-Reductase.

The right method of action in this case would be to up your finesteride dose, staying within safe levels, and hit your scalp with topical androgen inhibitors, like ketoconozole, azelaic acid, spiro, etc.

BV
 
Jarconis

Jarconis

Board Supporter
Awards
1
  • Established
ah, reading this thread i saw that 4oht was mentioned, that was a hormone that never really made it, 4oht cyp rip. :(
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
ah, reading this thread i saw that 4oht was mentioned, that was a hormone that never really made it, 4oht cyp rip.
Formestane is still around...:)

BV
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
I take ~1mg of finesteride every day, and have experience no side effects.

There are many other ways to alleviate your hair loss issues due to genetic MPB and the addition of extrogenous testosterone. 1mg Finesteride is a good place to start. You may also want to look into using Ketoconozole shampoo (Nizoral), and LLLT Therapy (Laser Hair Brush). Topical androgen blockers like Spiro may also be of benefit. You may also want to look into a product called Crinagen - a topical solution of natural DHT inhibitors that looks like it should work pretty well.

Dsade is right, inhibiting too much DHT systemically is a very bad idea...many people can handle the mild reduction in DHT that a low dose of finesteride provides, however.

The combination of the above 3 should go a long way toward alleviating your symptoms.



If the compounds in JW and BAM are not using 5AR to convert into a DHT-based compound, then finesteride will not help you at all. If they're boosting natural test while at the same time inhibiting SHBG and aromatase, you're going to have a boatload of free test running around that your body is trying to stablize. You're inhibiting two of the mechanisms the body uses to normalize your test levels, so guess where its going to turn? 5-Alpha-Reductase.

The right method of action in this case would be to up your finesteride dose, staying within safe levels, and hit your scalp with topical androgen inhibitors, like ketoconozole, azelaic acid, spiro, etc.

BV
so big..based on your knowledge and everything you have seen what do u believe to be the easiest on the hairline while on propecia and nizoral and laser brush.. anavar? halodrol? i can't afford any more hair loss.
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Honestly bro? I think testosterone is going to be your best friend when it comes to an androgen that you use and still combat MPB. I know it sounds counter intuitive, because test converts happily to DHT...but...test is not only one of the most powerful and safest mass builders around, its your body's own 'steroid' so we know just how its being processed in vivo. You can control test's DHT related sides with propecia/dutasteride and the myriad of other topical anti-androgens available. Once you've got your ancillaries down to protect your hair, a modest dose of test is not only going to provide great gains but be relatively mild on your lipids and HPTA as well. Of course, if you dont respond to anti-hairloss treatments test will probably make your hair fall out in spades...but from what Ive read, many are very successful combating testosterone's side effects with finesteride and/or dutasteride.

For a hormone that's to be used without any hair protection compounds, I believe anavar and deca are said to be quite mild. Anything that's not a potent androgen, DHT related, or converts via 5AR to DHT should be relatively safe for your hairline.

BV
 

speedpastu

Member
Awards
0
Honestly bro? I think testosterone is going to be your best friend when it comes to an androgen that you use and still combat MPB. I know it sounds counter intuitive, because test converts happily to DHT...but...test is not only one of the most powerful and safest mass builders around, its your body's own 'steroid' so we know just how its being processed in vivo. You can control test's DHT related sides with propecia/dutasteride and the myriad of other topical anti-androgens available. Once you've got your ancillaries down to protect your hair, a modest dose of test is not only going to provide great gains but be relatively mild on your lipids and HPTA as well. Of course, if you dont respond to anti-hairloss treatments test will probably make your hair fall out in spades...but from what Ive read, many are very successful combating testosterone's side effects with finesteride and/or dutasteride.

For a hormone that's to be used without any hair protection compounds, I believe anavar and deca are said to be quite mild. Anything that's not a potent androgen, DHT related, or converts via 5AR to DHT should be relatively safe for your hairline.

BV
thanks for your help man.. i mean i shed a lot on jungle warfare and bad ass mass so i figured if that just "freed up" my natural test production then i would most definitely shed on test.. I want it to be oral no matter what anyways, I would be on liver support and everything, I would do it smart of course, I just can't deal with injections. So that being said would anavar be a good choice? Maybe halodrol clone? I have a bottle of epistane but have not started it yet because of scared of hair loss. Hair loss is definitely more of a concern the money here so I was looking into anavar, how would that fair with propecia.
 

same_old

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
For a hormone that's to be used without any hair protection compounds, I believe anavar and deca are said to be quite mild. Anything that's not a potent androgen, DHT related, or converts via 5AR to DHT should be relatively safe for your hairline.
BV
good advice BigV....but it doesnt have to convert to DHT to be rough on your hairline. i saw hairloss from a weak, light-androgenic, non-5AR steroid that doesnt convert to DHT: EQ. it converts to the beta-analog of 1-T, which has a lot of affinity for the AR.

i'm trying to decide which hormones actually fit into your category! Tbol is one, clostebol, M4OHN, 4OHT, M4OHT, and deca like you said.

anyway, i still havent seen very much evidence that superdrol causes hairloss. on paper it should tear your scalp to bits but for some unknown reason it just doesnt...at all. if a guy wants to stick with orals (and i simultaneously tisk-tisk him while looking down my nose at him...all the while shaking my head...i like to be thorough with my e-berating) then i would strongly recommend superdrol.
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
good advice BigV....but it doesnt have to convert to DHT to be rough on your hairline. i saw hairloss from a weak, light-androgenic, non-5AR steroid that doesnt convert to DHT: EQ. it converts to the beta-analog of 1-T, which has a lot of affinity for the AR.
Ah, you are right about boldenone, some people do experience shedding with that compound. The beta analog of1-test is synthesized from boldenone via 5AR, so using propecia *should* technically help in that regard. From what I understand, boldenone does have some action via 5AR but not a very strong affinity for it all - perhaps to varying degrees depending on the person which would account for the hairloss in some and not others.

1-test also converts 'back' to DHT via the infamous 'unknown pathway', in addition to being quite a potent androgen in its own right...interestingly enough I never lost any hair with transdermal 1-test. At the time I was only using 2% spiro, Minox/AA, and Nizoral.

BV
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
1-test also converts 'back' to DHT via the infamous 'unknown pathway', in addition to being quite a potent androgen in its own right...interestingly enough I never lost any hair with transdermal 1-test. At the time I was only using 2% spiro, Minox/AA, and Nizoral.

BV
Spiro absolutely helped while on the dreaded 1-test. The times I did not use it, my hairline took a beating worthy of a red-headed step child.
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
Spiro absolutely helped while on the dreaded 1-test. The times I did not use it, my hairline took a beating worthy of a red-headed step child.
Yeah I didnt even chance it - started the 2% spiro 2 weeks before starting the cycle.

bv
 

same_old

Banned
Awards
1
  • Established
The beta analog of1-test is synthesized from boldenone via 5AR, so using propecia *should* technically help in that regard. From what I understand, boldenone does have some action via 5AR but not a very strong affinity for it all - perhaps to varying degrees depending on the person which would account for the hairloss in some and not others.

1-test also converts 'back' to DHT via the infamous 'unknown pathway', in addition to being quite a potent androgen in its own right...interestingly enough I never lost any hair with transdermal 1-test. At the time I was only using 2% spiro, Minox/AA, and Nizoral.

BV
according to Lanky (a bright guy on another board), boldenone has virtually no affinity for 5AR. it DOES have affinity for 5BR, however, thus the beta-analog of 1-T i mentioned earlier. finasteride doesnt do anything for it...which i have backed up with experimental evidence, as i got scalp itchies on 600mg boldenone even while using dutasteride (ya, bummer)

and 1-ad was murder on my hair, personally. that compound let me know i have the MPB gene :)
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
according to Lanky (a bright guy on another board), boldenone has virtually no affinity for 5AR. it DOES have affinity for 5BR, however, thus the beta-analog of 1-T i mentioned earlier. finasteride doesnt do anything for it...which i have backed up with experimental evidence, as i got scalp itchies on 600mg boldenone even while using dutasteride (ya, bummer)

and 1-ad was murder on my hair, personally. that compound let me know i have the MPB gene
as always man, great info. 1test was always described as the 5 alpha reduced version of boldenone, I didnt think the 5-beta version was active... 5AR and 5BR both convert test to DHT, but the beta version of DHT is inactive. I was always under the impression that the beta metabolite of 1test was as well.

According to this thread:

Question for Bill L - Bodybuilding.com Forums

W Llewellyn, claims beta version of 1test is a inactive, but boldenone converts to small amounts of 1test via 5AR.

I wonder though - boldenone is often described as being easy on hair for most people, even guys with MPB. If 1AD/1test had a serious level of negative sides for you, it would make sense that a small amount of 1-alpha-testosterone converted from boldenone would have a negative effect.

But...you were using dutasteride, that's highly unlikely as it technically should have made it nearly impossible for boldenone to convert to a noticeable amount of 1-testosterone at all.

Makes me wonder about boldenone's actual method of action - WL is generally thought to know his stuff, but Lanky's theory makes much more sense, taking your account into consideration.

BV
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
If something is already 5-beta reduced, then how would 5AR react with it?

Would it not have to be oxidized somehow to something else, then 5alpha reduced?

(sorry, early morning here...might seem like a dumb question later.)
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
If something is already 5-beta reduced, then how would 5AR react with it?

Would it not have to be oxidized somehow to something else, then 5alpha reduced?

(sorry, early morning here...might seem like a dumb question later.)
right 1-test is already 5α reduced and cant react with with 5αR - same old was saying that boldenone was actually reacting with 5-beta-reductase to form the beta analob 1ß-testosterone. Theoretically, this was supposed to be inactive, like 5-beta-DHT is - but that doesnt seem to be the case.

BV
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
So if something is already 5a reduced, it can still be 5b reduced, withouth having to be oxidized first?
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
So if something is already 5a reduced, it can still be 5b reduced, withouth having to be oxidized first?
No I dont think so...but boldenone doesnt have much of an affinity for 5AR, but same old was saying it seems to have a greater attraction to 5BR, which would result in 1-beta-testosterone.

BV
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
W Llewellyn, claims beta version of 1test is a inactive, but it converts to small amounts of 1test via 5AR.

I guess this is the statement I am looking at. If we have 1-test beta....and it converts to 1-test via 5ar...how is this possible?
 
BigVrunga

BigVrunga

Well-known member
Awards
1
  • Established
oh sorry bro, thats a type-o, should read:

W Llewellyn, claims beta version of 1test is a inactive, but boldenone converts to small amounts of 1test via 5AR.
it was late:)

BV
 
dsade

dsade

NutraPlanet Fanatic
Awards
4
  • RockStar
  • Legend!
  • Established
  • First Up Vote
Thanks...that makes my brain hurt less trying to understand. :)
 

Similar threads


Top