Does transdermal 4-ad build any muscle?

[itsmeman]

What would the diff between gain wise(not including added water weight),
10g 1-test, 5g 4-ad or
10g,4-ad, 5g 1-test or
15g 4-ad or
15g 1-test.
Most ppl seem to use 4-ad to combat the lethargy of 1-test it seems, making me think it's useless for muscle building??..

[Kitchen Chemist]

I think 4ad is great for building muscle, won't be as clean as straight 1-test but it's supposed to be 90% as anabolic as test (don't really believe that). If you really want to know, make a brew of 12-15 grams 4-ad and run it for 4 weed and see how much weight you pack on.

[Sean]

Straight 1-test alone is a bitch. Unless you have a ****load of ECA lying around, stacking it with 4-ad is probably the best idea. I was doing about 330mg a day and I would literally be falling asleep standing up. The joint aches were pretty bad, too.

[LakeMountD]

yeah i have a 2:1 1-test:4-ad ratio and i was even falling asleep standing..

[ironviking]

the best thing about 4-ad is: you get hard when the wind blows

I was walking around with a flagpole for awhile. But yea straight 1-test is hard on energy factor and libido factor.

[itsmeman]

Originally posted by ironviking
the best thing about 4-ad is: you get hard when the wind blows

I was walking around with a flagpole for awhile. But yea straight 1-test is hard on energy factor and libido factor.

So if i don't care about erections for 4 week, 4-ad is useless for gaining muscle?

[windwords7]

Originally posted by itsmeman

So if i don't care about erections for 4 week, 4-ad is useless for gaining muscle?

You have obviosly not studied even a little or you would not be asking such an ignorant question. Sorry, not trying to be too mean but give me a break. Yes, it builds muscle. Now go read and then come back and ask a real question.

[itsmeman]

I've read 16pages of threads when doing a search for 4-ad tried to find someone who did a 4-ad cycle only or with a bit of 1-test and nothing...

[ironviking]

4ad has been around for quite some time, there are plenty of people who have done a 4ad only cycle but probably not recently. 4ad does build muscle, just look at some of the injectable experiments, but anyway 4ad is great for bulking and keeping libido up. If youre looking for more lean gains I would say go with more 1-t, if mass is your goal up the 4ad. Either way I would keep the two stacked, hope this helps some.

[SCORPIO]

Yes, 4ad is good for building muscle.....being that your diet, training and rest are in order. That being said, I have done a 4ad only cycle, infact, that was my first cycle (oral). Don't remember exactly, but I think I gained 12lbs in 4.5 weeks. I got some bloat.....fat/water....gains were not to lean (but gained muscle, none the less).....I used nothing to combat the bloat, didn't know of anything back then when I was still learning. Now you can use things such as Viratease, liquidex...ect to keep bloat down on 4ad only cycle, especially on high doses. Transdermal would be your best bet, especially with the current Homebrew recipie. Wardog did a cutting cycle with 4ad only...he stacked it with viratease @ 1200mg a day if I'm not mistaken. He said he got some awsome pumps and I beleive him. I also will attach some 4ad info below, courtesy of Big Cat:
4-diol or 4AD (4-androsten-3,17-diol)

Target Hormone: Testosterone
Molecular name of target hormone: 4-androstene-3-one,17ß-ol
Target conversion: High (15.76 %)
Conversion enzyme: 3-ß-hydroxysteroid dehydrogenase (3HSD)
DHT conversion: low, only from target hormone
Estrogenic effects: no aromatisation from compound, some from target hormone

According to many, this is the very best prohormones have to offer, but I beg to differ. Nonetheless my second choice. Because it's a diol it has no aromatisation prior to conversion, significantly lessening the risk of excessive estrogenic formation. It also doesn't make a direct conversion to DHT. Its structurally incapable of doing so. DHT is still a risk, because of the higher amount of testosterine produced and the fact that testosterine (through 5-alpha-reducates) can be converted to DHT in the Sertoli cells. This makes this a definite winner. If it doesn't give you results due to bad conversion, it also won't give you the side effects, because basically if it doesn't convert it can't make estrogens or DHT. That only makes the risk increase with the gains, and makes 4AD one of the safer prohormones.

4-diol is also by far the most anabolic of the three testosterone prohormones, offering almost three times as much conversion as andro and over 20 times higher than DHEA or 5-diol. In the real world that translates to 310% greater increase in testosterone and 256% greater increase in free testosterone (available) than andro (based on results compared to a control group) and 129% more anabolic than 5-diol¹

For testosterone conversion and pure legal anabolic, androgenic action, nothing beats 4-diol at this point. Especially once you pass 30 and your test levels begin to taper, the effects of 4-diol will exert a major effect on both gains and strength. 4-diol, after all, also seems to have a strong pre-workout energizing effect and a positive influence on libido.

¹ Ristovic L.J., Cobanovic M., Kem Ind, 24(7), 389-92

[windwords7]

Target Hormone: Testosterone

That says it all. Test only cycles are done all the time with great results. 4AD cycles are scaled down versions of the same thing.