First injectable cycle!

[BigMattTx]

Well Ive done a lot of research and this week I started my first injectable cycle! Today is day 3.

Here it is:
1-14 Test E 600mg
1-4 PP 20mg-30mg
1-14 Arimidex .5mg-1mg EOD
5-10 LR3 IGF-1 40mcg twice per week
5-14 HCG 250iu 2x/week
EDIT: was going to use it first 10 days of PCT but changed protocol

post cycle therapy
1-4 Nolva 20-30mg
1-4 Clomid 50mg
1-6 LR3 IGF-1 40mcg twice per week
Creatine
Powerfull

I also have some old liquid Mag 10 which is a combo of 4ad and A1-E. Im taking that the first 10 days with my PP.

So far I can already feel the effects. Pumps and workout intensity was good the first 2 days. I got a little bit of pain from the injection that didnt hit until I woke up the second day. I'm hoping that my body will get used to the shots and this will not persist.

 

[Rage (SoCal)]

Best of luck with this.

 

[Jaxxx]

Don't take HCG during post cycle therapy, take it on cycle 2x/week @ 250iu.

It suppresses natty test, not exactly ideal during PCT...

 

[BigMattTx]

Don't take HCG during post cycle therapy, take it on cycle 2x/week @ 250iu.

It suppresses natty test, not exactly ideal during post cycle therapy...

Ive heard mixed reviews on this. A lot of the guys that helped me out on another board say they have tried both and have better results with using it on PCT.

I do like the idea of avoiding shutdown while on cycle tho. The real reason I was tempted to run it PCT is because I'm gonna be on for 14 weeks and I can only get HCG in 5000iu increments.

Do you think running it at 250iu 2x/week for the last 10 weeks would be good?

 

[WhatsaRoid?]

Damn your going to be huge...how many pounds are you now? I would love to do a damn cycle but dont want to risk mail order...

 

[BigMattTx]

Starting at 190. Hoping to get close to 220.

Starting out eating at 4000 cals. Doing a push/pull split training 4X per week with 10-15 mins of low intensity cardio postworkout.

 

[idunk42]

Do you think running it at 250iu 2x/week for the last 10 weeks would be good?

yeah, i think you should be fine with that protocol. Ive done the same in the past and worked well for me.

 

[BigMattTx]

yeah, i think you should be fine with that protocol. Ive done the same in the past and worked well for me.

cool thanks alot.

 

[glenihan]

Starting at 190. Hoping to get close to 220.

Starting out eating at 4000 cals. Doing a push/pull split training 4X per week with 10-15 mins of low intensity cardio postworkout.

if you end up at 220 after this cycle at least 20lbs of that will be water and fat .. you simply CANNOT build that much muscle


also SWALE an HRT doctor has stated that 250-300iu 2x a week with HCG while on is best .. there have been studies posted about this .. HCG pct is old school and is much better used on cycle .. prevent the problem before it starts

 

[glenihan]

oh and don't use an AI until you see that its needed not only will it hinder your gains but it will crush your libido .. i never use AI's anymore

 

[pistonpump]

oh and don't use an AI until you see that its needed not only will it hinder your gains but it will crush your libido .. i never use AI's anymore

but id venture to say youre not gyno prone either...


nice cycle btw. The only thing that im kind of thinking you should do differently is maybe just maybe take the IGF out of the cycle and use it pct and beyond, carrying until you can cycle again. It will help you keep the gains.

How long does it take you to finish a workout? just wondering because push pull days seem to need to target so many muscle groups i dont know how people do it.

 

[BigMattTx]

oh and don't use an AI until you see that its needed not only will it hinder your gains but it will crush your libido .. i never use AI's anymore

I already started the AI but only at .5mg EOD (adex). I will try to phase it out and see if I need it or not.

if you end up at 220 after this cycle at least 20lbs of that will be water and fat .. you simply CANNOT build that much muscle


also SWALE an HRT doctor has stated that 250-300iu 2x a week with HCG while on is best .. there have been studies posted about this .. HCG post cycle therapy is old school and is much better used on cycle .. prevent the problem before it starts

I'm just gonna keep a clean diet and adjust it to how I want to gain. Whatever I get, I will be happy with. I surely dont expect to put on pure muscle so hopefully I can stay above 200 after PCT.

As for the HCG, I'm going to go ahead and use Swales/Dr. Johns advice. Ive just heard varying things but I'm going to go with 250iu 2x/week starting week 5. Its best to take HCG the day before you take your AAS right?

 

[Mulletsoldier]

I already started the AI but only at .5mg EOD (adex). I will try to phase it out and see if I need it or not.QUOTE]

Well, I wouldn't advise doing that. There are a couple of negative side effects that could come from that as in estrogen rebound. Stopping it to see if you need it or not, to maybe find out you do, is not to wise. Just keep that dose.

 

[BigMattTx]

but id venture to say youre not gyno prone either...


nice cycle btw. The only thing that im kind of thinking you should do differently is maybe just maybe take the IGF out of the cycle and use it post cycle therapy and beyond, carrying until you can cycle again. It will help you keep the gains.

How long does it take you to finish a workout? just wondering because push pull days seem to need to target so many muscle groups i dont know how people do it.

I've talked with Grunt about the IGF usage. People questioned using it on my first cycle but he said it would be a good idea. IGF creates hyperplasia and it takes time for the new muscle cells to grow. What better time to take it then towards the beginning of a steroid cycle? I figure the first run (weeks 5-10) will get some new cells then they can grow through the rest of the cycle and I'll hit it again in PCT to help retain gains and continue to gain. My dosage is very modest.

As for the workouts, I spend exactly an hour each day. I'm kind of a tweaker when I go into the gym...I cant just sit and wait on a machine. I do a lot of circuit training.

Normally on push day, I'll hit chest then hit a set of legs. Once I finish up about 5-6 sets on both chest/legs, I'll go and hit shoulders for about 5 sets. Once I'm done with that, I'll hit tris for 3-4 and get on the bike.
On pull day, I superset Upperback with calves/abs and then Traps with lower back and finish up with bis and then the bike.

 

[BigMattTx]

I already started the AI but only at .5mg EOD (adex). I will try to phase it out and see if I need it or not.QUOTE]

Well, I wouldn't advise doing that. There are a couple of negative side effects that could come from that as in estrogen rebound. Stopping it to see if you need it or not, to maybe find out you do, is not to wise. Just keep that dose.

alright good deal....will do

I really started to feel libido kick up today so I dont think the adex is hindering it too bad.

 

[pistonpump]

I've talked with Grunt about the IGF usage. People questioned using it on my first cycle but he said it would be a good idea. IGF creates hyperplasia and it takes time for the new muscle cells to grow. What better time to take it then towards the beginning of a steroid cycle? I figure the first run (weeks 5-10) will get some new cells then they can grow through the rest of the cycle and I'll hit it again in post cycle therapy to help retain gains and continue to gain. My dosage is very modest.

As for the workouts, I spend exactly an hour each day. I'm kind of a tweaker when I go into the gym...I cant just sit and wait on a machine. I do a lot of circuit training.

Normally on push day, I'll hit chest then hit a set of legs. Once I finish up about 5-6 sets on both chest/legs, I'll go and hit shoulders for about 5 sets. Once I'm done with that, I'll hit tris for 3-4 and get on the bike.
On pull day, I superset Upperback with calves/abs and then Traps with lower back and finish up with bis and then the bike.

okay thanks for the 411. I havent really looked to far into IGF yet anyway but it makes sense.

Why calves on pull day?

 

[BigMattTx]

okay thanks for the 411. I havent really looked to far into IGF yet anyway but it makes sense.

Why calves on pull day?

Just to equal out the workload. I find it easy to hit upper back then hit a set of calves and then abs then repeat. Technically calves isnt a pull but thats just how Ive been doing it. I may change that.

 

[glenihan]

I already started the AI but only at .5mg EOD (adex). I will try to phase it out and see if I need it or not.QUOTE]

Well, I wouldn't advise doing that. There are a couple of negative side effects that could come from that as in estrogen rebound. Stopping it to see if you need it or not, to maybe find out you do, is not to wise. Just keep that dose.

with all due respect i disagree with this ... the rebound should be entirely minimal .. i liked the idea of stopping until you need it

i just use HCG mon and thurs .. doesn't seem to matter when its used in relation to gear .. i would start on week 3 though instead of waiting until 5

 

[BigMattTx]

with all due respect i disagree with this ... the rebound should be entirely minimal .. i liked the idea of stopping until you need it

i just use HCG mon and thurs .. doesn't seem to matter when its used in relation to gear .. i would start on week 3 though instead of waiting until 5

So, weeks 3-12 would be better then 5-14?

By the way thanks for all the help.

 

[glenihan]

well i actually meant week 3 until 3 days before PCT

 

[BigMattTx]

well i actually meant week 3 until 3 days before post cycle therapy

Id like to run it for the entire cycle but my dilemma is that I can only get it in 5000iu increments. So thats 10 weeks worth.

 

[glenihan]

so get 2 vials HCG is really a blessing trust me when i say it makes not only the cycle itself easier but makes coming off a billion times easier

 

[pistonpump]

i cant wait to start my cycle too. I think im coming down with something tho thats why i havent. I think after i get my flu shot unless i have the flu now, then ill start.

did you pin yet? if so details...

 

[BigMattTx]

so get 2 vials HCG is really a blessing trust me when i say it makes not only the cycle itself easier but makes coming off a billion times easier

Id love to but theres 2 things stopping me:
1) Cost - I've already dropped ALOT of money into this cycle and just got done ordering IGF which aint cheap. I really cant afford it.

2) Supposively HCG should be used within 60 days of mixing it and I dont plan on using 10000ius.

Wouldnt weeks 5-14 be sufficient?

I mean this is just test with a jumpstart anyway. Most people told me I wouldnt even need HCG, although it obviously makes recovery easier.

 

[BigMattTx]

i cant wait to start my cycle too. I think im coming down with something tho thats why i havent. I think after i get my flu shot unless i have the flu now, then ill start.

did you pin yet? if so details...

Yea. Easy as pie. Very painless. I did a glute inject with a 23G 1.5" Everything went fine but the next day I woke up with a pain in my ass...literally. Today it is feeling a lot better. The muscles need to get used to taking oil. I'll be pinning my other glute tommorow.

 

[glenihan]

well in that case run it from whenever you can until 3 days before PCT

 

[BigMattTx]

well in that case run it from whenever you can until 3 days before post cycle therapy

alright thanks Glen.

I know im a pain in the ass

 

[Ubiquitous]

It's fine.. and I like that you're using IGF on and then for PCT.

 

[glenihan]

If Ubi says its fine than its fine .. he's been hired as my official spokesperson

 

[Ubiquitous]

it's fine after you went into more detail with the HCG sitchie.

 

[boti420]

i would run the test for 12 weeks as a 1st injectable cycle, and i would run the igf before the cycle or better yet during post cycle therapy, there seems to be good feedback on running the igf during post cycle therapy, i'm a fan of not doing too much for a first cycle.

 

[pistonpump]

i would run the test for 12 weeks as a 1st injectable cycle, and i would run the igf before the cycle or better yet during post cycle therapy, there seems to be good feedback on running the igf during post cycle therapy, i'm a fan of not doing too much for a first cycle.

he is using the igf for pct. How is the phera doing matt?

 

[BigMattTx]

he is using the igf for post cycle therapy. How is the phera doing matt?

Good good. I am on day 4. For some reason, hormonal stuff hits me quick. On day 1, I could tell a difference in water retention, pumps and a little increased acne. Now on day 4, I can tell my face is starting to dry back up. Acne really only hits me when the hormones are started or haulted but once my body levels out, its fine. I need to weigh in again but I'm sittin right around 190. Given, I am stacking this with Mag 10 but mag 10 will be gone in less than a week so then I will really be able to tell how PP is on its own.

 

[BigMattTx]

until 3 days before post cycle therapy

Just to clear this up...thats 3 days before i start my Nolva/Clomid/IGF, correct? This will actually be 11 days after my last test shot.

 

[Ubiquitous]

Just to clear this up...thats 3 days before i start my Nolva/Clomid/IGF, correct? This will actually be 11 days after my last test shot.

Yup, that should be fine.

 

[BigMattTx]

Yup, that should be fine.

thanks bro

 

[BigMattTx]

I got one last question:
I am going to be running HCG after my last inject up until 3 days before I start using SERMs. When should I cut out the Arimidex?

 

[gotripped]

GOOD LUCK BRO!!! I am at 200 pounds now. Working to 210. I probably won't hit 210, but 200 is a solid # for me.

 

[jomi822]

an aromtase inhibitor must be used while using hcg, the stuff boosts aromatase through the roof...its certainly not worth chancing that you might be resistant to gyno like glen

 

[BigMattTx]

GOOD LUCK BRO!!! I am at 200 pounds now. Working to 210. I probably won't hit 210, but 200 is a solid # for me.

Same here. I just hit 200...floating around 197-200 right now. 210 would be nice but 220 would be better

 

[pistonpump]

Same here. I just hit 200...floating around 197-200 right now. 210 would be nice but 220 would be better

just some advice dont rush to it because it will most likely be fat or turn into it if you get there quickly. Where are you pinning at now? what spots have you done?

 

[BigMattTx]

just some advice dont rush to it because it will most likely be fat or turn into it if you get there quickly. Where are you pinning at now? what spots have you done?

Yea I know. So far, I have actually decreased my bodyfat. I never go with the "eat everything in sight" type bulk because I put on fat easily. I like clean bulks. i also do low intensity cardio for 10-15 mins after each weight train session. It keeps the fat gain down...my definition has been steadily improving.

I pinned glutes for the first 3 weeks and then delts this week. i like delts alot. I'm scared to do quads because my test is high concentration (300mg/ml) and most people cant do them without losing the ability to walk for a few days. I think I will stick to alternating delts and glutes.

 

[glenihan]

try lats .. they will be sore for the first 2 injects or so but that's just because its a virgin muscle .. after that its painless and can hold a lot

 

[BigMattTx]

awesome!

i will try those within the next couple weeks.

Glen, should I run an AI up until I start my SERMs??