Guys that gain 25+ lbs per cycle
- 10-08-2006, 09:57 PM
Guys that gain 25+ lbs per cycle
Because of board rules I can't link the source.
Here’s some info for guys who want to gain 20-25lbs on a cycle.
Everyone wants to know how to gain high poundages on a cycle. We’ve all got a “friend” in a gym somewhere that gained 25lbs on his last cycle and we want to do the same. We ask ourselves…What is his secret? Is the juice he’s taking that good? Is it a good diet in conjunction with the test.. is that what is responsible? Well, here’s the answer.. NO, his particular anabolic compound of choice be it Sustanon, Winstrol, Dbol, Tren, etc… isn’t so great that whoever takes one of those compounds will grow.. nor is his diet so “on” that he will gain more than us.
Here’s the truth.. and some of you won’t like it.. Some of you may even get pissed off.. The reason these guys grow so much on their cycles is because they shouldn’t even be using steroids to begin with… And that’s the truth… That may sound a bit confusing.. yes? Well allow me to elaborate…
You take a 20 yr old male. He has been lifting on and off for six months or so… He’s about 6 foot tall maybe a little shorter.. 5’10” or so.. He weighs about 165lbs.. He’s got a little bit of definition.. nothing big.. when his shirt is off people can tell he’s been working out.. He decides one day that he wants to take steroids, He sees the really big guys in the gym and he wants to be like them right now.. he doesn’t want to wait any longer.. in his mind six months has been long enough.. So he gets on the internet.. he finds a message board similar to this one.. he reads a little .. finds a hook up.. and decides to run 250mg of test and 300mg of deca for two months and ends up weighing around 185 or 190.. All of his friends are amazed.. he’s amazed He’s put on some size.. he looks like a weight lifter.. he doesn’t look like someone who could compete.. but he looks like he’s finally arrived on the Body building scene… His closest friends are so impressed that they want to run the exact same cycle .. He tells them exactly what he did.. how he ate etc… Now, a few months go by.. all of a sudden the kid is back to around 165 maybe 170.. He thinks.. “Oh man.. I’ve got to get back on cycle.. I need those drugs to be big.. if I don’t.. I just can’t grow… Steroids require that I stay on all the time to maintain the kind of size that I want”… I guess that’s what he has to do; huh; stay on all the time?
Now, here’s the reason he gained 25lbs on his cycle.. He was so far from his genetic potential that once the anabolic compounds were introduced into his system he grew like a weed.. His body didn’t need to struggle to put on that mass, because it was quite capable of adding that much mass naturally.. The steroids just sped it up..
it is for lack of a better or more accurate word.. a short cut to get to where he could have gotten natural anyway. His inevitable weight loss after coming off his "super" cycle wasn’t from the lack of steroids.. it was from a lack of a proper foundation.. a Lack of proper training skills, and a lack of muscular maturation…
Here’s the deal.. guys who need steroids aren’t the guys who are growing 25+lbs per cycle.. they are gaining 10lbs and hopefully keeping 5-8.. They are struggling to even do that.. I’ll tell you from personal experience.. I am 30 yrs old 6’2” .. I am 284lbs currently.. I am 17% BF (I’m a power lifter/strongman.. so I keep a little extra fat on me)…If I wanted to keep the same body fat % I have now and weigh 300lbs.. I would have to run a very long cycle. or in all honesty it will take me two full cycles to get to 3 bills..
An average cycle for me is about 750mg Test, 450mg Deca, 300mg EQ and Some Dbol in the front and at the end… Those are some fairly heavy dosages...Why don’t I gain 25lbs per cycle?
Because No matter how much gear I take.. no matter how much I eat.. my body is so far beyond it’s genetic potential that I simply can’t add that kind of radical mass anymore..
My body does a fairly good job of maintaining mass when I’m not on cycle.. but I do drop weight regardless.. and in truth, the only reason my body maintains it’s size as well as it does is because of Muscle maturation.. My body is used to carrying around that muscle.. it’s not a shock to my body to carry it around.. And I built a solid mass foundation naturally years ago.. I reached my genetic potential before I started using juice.. Lifting was a habit and a lifestyle for me because I played football from Junior high through College.
I’ve worked out in gyms all over the country.. and I have been doing so for the better part of a decade.. and I'll tell you, I have seen a lot of little guys blow up for a couple of months from a cycle only to deflate a couple of months later. It's the truth.. Muscle Maturation plays a huge key in keeping mass... that and proper training skills.. (and no hitting bench 3 days a week and squatting once every few months doesn't count)
So in truth, when you hear about some guy who gained 25-30lbs off of a cycle.. Please keep in mind that he is probably some impatient tiny punk that could have easily gained the same amount of muscle had he just been a little more patient.. If he had just been focused on learning how to train.. focused on how to eat…
This is a lifestyle.. there are no short cuts if you want to be the real deal.... There will never be a fly by nighter even win the smallest amateur comp in booney freaking Iowa if he hasn't been serious for years...
It's important that you guys learn that Juice may seem like the best short cut in the beginning... but whenever you add that much mass that quickly from gear.. Your body isn’t going to be ready for it.. it will literally fight you to keep it.. the sudden size and strength will stress the ligaments, tendons, bones and central nervous system and Your body will do everything that it can to shed those rapid muscle gains.. Decent muscle mass is only kept through time and hard work (cough.. cough.. it's a cliché.. but it's still true).. and it's important that your gains aren't so fast that the body can't adjust healthfully to it’s new weight gain..
I've been on the boards for years.. and I'll tell you, 80% of the people on these boards are wannabes and posers.. they are guys who won’t even be working out six months from now.. They are impatient and are looking for the shortcut.. they may even get a few short term results.. but in the long run they will come out behind everyone else (and when I say long run.. i mean less than a year or two)
These kind of guys will never be anything more than a hobbyist.. and in truth...that is probably the case in every other aspect of their lives as well, not just weight lifting..
So in the end my advice is this.. if you are wanting to add some mass. and you’re stuck.. learn a different training method.. change your diet.. and if you’re a good size.. (that’s when everyone who is in the room with you knows you’re a weight lifter.. if you walk in a room, and everyone in there doesn’t know that you lift… you are not ready for steroids) then come and sit down.. and we’ll talk about steroids.. until then… Learn how to train.. learn how to eat.. and spend some time in the gym.. you’ll be so much better off in the end…
- 10-08-2006, 10:03 PM
10-08-2006, 10:03 PM
10-08-2006, 10:03 PM
10-08-2006, 10:08 PM
10-08-2006, 10:11 PM
10-08-2006, 10:21 PM
10-08-2006, 10:32 PM
10-08-2006, 10:42 PM
Good post B! Ive read that before and remember it but dont remember where i had read it at.
E-Pharm Rep... PM me with any questions or concerns
10-09-2006, 05:52 AM
10-09-2006, 07:04 AM
Good post and alot of truth in that post. Wish more guys would read this on more of the boards out there.
10-09-2006, 08:20 AM
10-09-2006, 12:04 PM
I do agree with this article but I've always just had a question.
The average age for US males to be done with puberty (sexual organs wise) is 17.5 years old. Most males quit growing any taller at the age of 20, not 21. So why not look at the other side of this arguement I always hear?
Steriods are perfectly safe for all users who are HEALTHY ADULT MALES and who have done the proper research/PCT. Are you not a HEALTHY ADULT MALE at 20 years of age? I mean who is drawing these lines of age? I could be 100% wrong but I've found no articles linking steriods being perfectly fine after 21, not 20.
I do agree younger kids should stay away, but I've never understood telling a 20 year old kid, not like the one in your article, who has a good foundation/training/and research skills to wait. I guess what I am trying to say is it all depends on the person who wants to use and the research/time they want to put into it.
a 20 year old w/ proper training/diet/etc will keep most of the weight he gains as someone over 21 would.
10-09-2006, 12:10 PM
I don't see how any individual would hit their genetic potential at the age of 20 or even 21. I felt pretty dumb after my Superdrol cycle but it definetely gave me a good wake-up and gave me a good basis to gain mass naturally.Originally Posted by ih8brokebacks
Thats why when someone asks, I just say that I'm going to wait for when it counts.
10-09-2006, 12:43 PM
Thats not what im arguing though. I agree 99% of people would not of hit their natural potential at 20/21 but to say that the ages aren't safe IMO is giving false advice to those who have done the proper research and just want a BOOST to get to their natural potential.Originally Posted by Rage (SoCal)
I am 21 and I am, I'm sure, far from my natural potential but I am going to do just 1 cycle of Halodrol after I have done a little more research and after that I am going to try to continue to gain naturally for the next couple of years. I mean I want to try and compete so I don't think I am doing any harm, also I was EXACTLY the same in terms of height and many other facts when I was 20 so I don't understand why people tell responsible individuals the age of 20 is outrageous... at 20 IMO you are a healthy adult male.
I mean with a small cycle such as I am going to do I should be back to my natural test/levels and such after the cycle is over plus I will have some solid strength which will help me achieve to put on more weight naturally after it is over. I mean is this wrong for me at 21? or even if I did it at 20? I don't think so but like I said I am not as knowlegable as some of the people here.
10-09-2006, 01:57 PM
I know at least 5 guys that are living examples of this.
Most of them are just on drugs and depressed now..
10-09-2006, 02:21 PM
Well, IMHO natural test levels are still high enough at the age of 20 or 21 to not really need anything. I think the age of 21 is just the standard that has been created through the support of studies, etc. Honestly, I can't see myself going over to the darkside for a few more years.Originally Posted by ih8brokebacks
10-09-2006, 03:19 PM
To me, this points to the idea of doing shorter cycles instead of the typical long cycle. Problem is the internet is full of misconceptions and lies about people gaining 20+ lbs cycle after cycle.
10-09-2006, 03:26 PM
Exactly. A lot of e-bbers will say that they maintained 20lbs of muscle from a 4 week cycle with 2lbs of fat gain. Take it all with a grain of salt and as always, know your source.Originally Posted by size
10-09-2006, 03:37 PM
I agree but I have seen the same happen with real juice (injectibles). I know several guys that only workout on cycle and lose their gains afterwards. One of my buddies lost 30 pounds after a Test/Dbol cycle and got on drugs and I think hes in rehab now. He was a personal trainer and had a nice car before that.
Another one has been doing Test and Test/EQ and even using HGH. He shrinks down to being an average skinny guy when he comes off the juice.
I know several other various guys who hardly look like they lift but have used juice. They only look decent when they are on the **** and now I never even see them in the gym. a lot of these guys have bad stretch marks on their upperback by their armpit from explosive gains.
Just goes to show that you need experience with diet/training/rest before you juice. If you dont continue with an awesome diet/training program during PCT and beyond, you can expect to lose the gains. Simple as that.
10-09-2006, 04:25 PM
I mean I have already justified this in my head, but I would to hear the input of more experienced members here.
I have damn good genetics from what I've been told, grow pretty well, but I have small bones/waist so I always look heavier then I am because my muscles look bigger due to the smaller bones and whenever I get close to 190lbs I cant ever seem to get above it w/o putting on more fat then I'd like (dont like to get out of the 8-12% range). Now I feel if I do just one cycle of Halodrol w/ the proper post cycle therapy it will kick start me and give me an easy 10lbs, after which I can continue to gain again until I reach my actual natural limit.
I mean is that wrong? After the cycle with the help of post cycle therapy I will be back to normal and my high Test levels will still be as high as they were before the cycle correct? I mean I see no harm in it.
My Diet is sound and my training is on point so I feel I should keep the gains plus I am a research FREAK so I will not rest/start until I know everything their is to know about doing the PCT perfectly.
I mean that is how I justified it, what do you guys think? I would love opinions.
Also Rage have you done a cycle? What age did you do it at? Did you feel it helped you at all to achieve your goals naturally afterwards?
10-09-2006, 04:52 PM
Yeah...you might be. Here is where I believe many many young inexperienced users are creating there own problem. These oral steroids are everyone problems. They are short cycles, produce dramatic gains, mess up your lipids and inhibit you natural test. The other isssue is they are rarely run with test, or even 4AD.Originally Posted by ih8brokebacks
There is absolutely now way that puting on 10-20lbs in 4-6 weeks is going to be long term retainable gains. Your metabolism, new caloric requirements and many other issues at the cellular level cannot maintain 10-20lbs put on so quickly.
if at your natural test levels you cannot grow muscle any more than you are how do you think you will retain a burst of LBM with inhibited test levels. How long do you think it takes to get your test levels back up to what they were before...if at all that high ever again. It can take months or more. Meanwhile those dramatic gains you received from a quick 4-6 weeks cycle will be gone for the most part.After the cycle with the help of post cycle therapy I will be back to normal and my high Test levels will still be as high as they were before the cycle correct? I mean I see no harm in it.
I speak somewhat from experience in this area. Short cycles produce quick, asthetically pleasing results that do not stay for very long and hinder long term results.
Non-oral 12-16-20 week cycles gaining slowly once or twice a year are the way to go. You put on LBM at a slow pace. Your body has acclimated to it over a much longer period of time. This potentiates your ability to retain those lbs of LBM during the length period of time it takes you to restore HPTA.
This is JMHO...but I have some experience (both negative and positive) to back it up.
10-09-2006, 07:37 PM
This is all I needed to hear, and I appreciate you taking your time to let me know from your experience. With that you said above I will admit I was wrong and you were right, and I am thankful you led me to this before I finished researching PCT because now I will not take this cycle of halodrol. Only downside is I spent $100+ on it so now I have to either some how sell it or just hang on to it.Originally Posted by B5150
I do appreciate what you said and I'm glad you said it because it showed me the situation from another perspective. Thanks!
10-09-2006, 07:43 PM
I think that most guys that say they put on 30lbs or so of muscle off of a cycle are talking total weight gain not just pure muscle. I've been guilty of this myself and lots of people do it, alot of the time not on purpose i'm sure we'd all love to believe that it's all muscle but the the total weight gained consists of fat/water/glycogen/muscle. So lets say you gained 30lbs off of a cycle, chances are you put on 10lbs of muscle, 10lbs water, 5lbs glycogen, 5lbs fat, now THAT is realistic.
10-09-2006, 08:47 PM
I'd hang on to the H-50 BrokeBack (man - if you hate brokebacks, you'll hate AM )
Or - don't "give" it to some 18/19 yr old retard. (I know they are out there - they ask me how to get this stuff at my gym....)
10-09-2006, 11:08 PM
I'll hang on to it then, just incase. It said its shelf life is till 10/07 so I still have over a year.Originally Posted by jmh80
About my name, it refers to people in my gym who don't squat and say its because of their back pains (even front squats). So I've called them brokebacks from HS so its like 4-5 years old. Does not refer to homosexuals so please take no offense to it!
10-10-2006, 06:21 AM
Good point Size...very true.Originally Posted by size
Good read B. Yeah, I remember reading it before a while back.
10-10-2006, 10:41 AM
I tend to disagree with you on this point. To me, a shorter cycle has much more appeal when compared to a longer cycle in regards to risk/reward analysis.Originally Posted by B5150
On a shorter cycle, the gains expected should be minor but in my mind easier to keep as restoration to a normal functioning body is easier and the changes are less dramatic. An additional appeal, potential side effects are reduced. However, my conceptual construction of a shorter cycle may be different than how most would construct one.
10-10-2006, 10:49 AM
Have you ever noticed how different a man looks from 21 to 26? It is only 5 years but the face looks different, more like that of a man. One of the reasons is that males often do not reach a hormonal balance or leveling off until the mid 20s. Odd to consider since the hormonal drop off starts soon after.Originally Posted by ih8brokebacks
One of the strongest reason(in my mind) for a young man not to use anabolic steroids is that they will soon be used as a crutch. I believe that many(young and old, experience and inexperienced) use AAS as a crutch once they have experienced the changes that AAS can bring for; as they believe they need AAS to make gains/changes. Consequently, early usage begins a slippery slope into misuage, overusage, and disappointment.
10-10-2006, 11:38 AM
No kidding! I have a buddy who is 30 and has been cycling for quite some years. He hasn't been able to gain naturally for years now, that's awful. I could only imagine a guy in his mid 20s not being able to gain without AAS. Must suck.Originally Posted by size
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