What did everyone use before 6-OXO came along?
- 04-02-2003, 07:01 PM
- 04-02-2003, 07:46 PM
I'm going to put a radical idea out there and challenge members to respond with reference citations.
Before there were viable OTC post cycle alternatives the best course of action would have been simply high caloric intake and a 20% protein diet (with an escalated volume workout regime).
Prove me wrong...
- 04-02-2003, 07:46 PM
I remember flax, vi4ex, trib, ZMA. I'm sure there were some others but I can't remember them right now. However 6oxo is that much more effective than previous post cycle remedies that if Nolva/Clomid were not an option 6oxo would almost be a must if you want to maximize recovery IMO.
04-02-2003, 07:48 PM
04-02-2003, 08:00 PM
There was always the Chrysin and Quercetin. But how effective they are is VERY debatable. Here are a few studies to chew on.
Relationship between estrogen receptor-binding and estrogenic activities of environmental estrogens and suppression by flavonoids.
Han DH, Denison MS, Tachibana H, Yamada K.
Department of Environmental Toxicology, University of California, Davis 95616-8588, USA. email@example.com
In this study, we investigated the estrogenic activity of environmental estrogens by a competition binding assay using a human recombinant estrogens receptor (hERbeta) and by a proliferation assay using MCF-7 cells and a sulforhodamine-B assay. In the binding assay, pharmaceuticals had a stronger binding activity to hERbeta than that of some phytoestrogens (coumestrol, daidzein, genistein, luteolin, chrysin, flavone, and naringenin) or industrial chemicals, but phytoestrogens such as coumestrol had a binding activity as strong as pharmaceuticals such as 17alpha-ethynylestradiol (EE), tamoxifen (Tam), and mestranol. In the proliferation assay, pharmaceuticals such as diethylstilbestrol, EE, Tam, and clomiphene, and industrial chemicals such as 4-nonylphenol, bisphenol A, and 4-dihydroxybiphenyl had a proliferation-stimulating activity as strong as 17beta-estradiol (ES). In addition, we found that phytoestrogens such as coumestrol, daidzein, luteolin, and quercetin exerted a proliferation stimulating activity as strong as ES. Furthermore, we examined the suppression of proliferation-stimulating activity, induced by environmental estrogen, by flavonoids, such as daidzein, genistein, quercetin, and luteolin, and found that these flavonoids suppressed the induction of the proliferation-stimulating activity of environmental estrogens. The suppressive effect of flavonoids suggests that these compounds have anti-estrogenic and anti-cancer activities.
Inhibition of aromatase activity by flavonoids.
Jeong HJ, Shin YG, Kim IH, Pezzuto JM.
Department of Medicinal Chemistry and Pharmacognosy, College of Pharmacy, University of Illinois at Chicago, 60612, USA. firstname.lastname@example.org
In searching for potent cancer chemopreventive agents from synthetic or natural products, 28 randomly selected flavonoids were screened for inhibitory effects against partially purified aromatase prepared from human placenta. Over 50% of the flavonoids significantly inhibited aromatase activity, with greatest activity being demonstrated with apigenin (IC50: 0.9 microg/mL), chrysin (IC50: 1.1 microg/mL), and hesperetin (IC50: 1.0 microg/mL).
PMID: 10403137 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
04-02-2003, 09:20 PM
04-02-2003, 09:28 PM
I mean just that...increased volume and maintenance weight or slightly decreased.Originally posted by Supa Freek 420
escalated, and not decreased?
Reason being that the period immediately post cycle will be entirely devoted to maintaining mass and not building.
04-05-2003, 11:30 AM
04-08-2003, 03:18 PM
In the future I will probably go with clomid. Last cycle of 1-Test/4-AD left meOriginally posted by Supa Freek 420
Nolva/Clomid were not an option 6oxo would almost be a must if you want to maximize recovery IMO.
with a lot of acne post cycle on my chest about 2-5 weeks after cycle and I used
6-OXO, ZMA etc.
Kept most of the gains but the sides were a little annoying.
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