Methyl-Drol/4-AD: Personal Log

[BHERTZ]

Alright guys, it's 2006, which means I am finally ready to unleash this.

Daily supplements which remain constant throughout the entire pre, on, and post cycle:
R-ALA, Garlic, Hawthorn, MHP Activite (multi), MHP weight gainer, protein, BCAA, fish oil, in addition to:
shitloads of clean food
1+ gallon of water
8-10 hrs of sleep

Week 0: Daily heavy herbal pre-cycle, completed!! Consisted of: RYR, CoQ10, Hawthorn, Garlic, Milk Thistle, ALA

Week 1: (Jan. 2nd: Cycle start date)
10mg MD, 200mg 4AD

Week 2:
20mg MD, 300mg 4AD

Week 3:
20mg MD, 400mg 4AD

Week 4: PCT begins!
Scifit, 'ES3 stack' (similar to RXT)
SAN, 'Attitude' (ATD product)
SNS, 'Reduce' (cortisol control)
AX, 'Perfect Cycle' (liver)
3g CEE

Week 5:
ramped down week 4

Week 6:
ramped down week 5

Week 7:
ramped down week 6

As you can tell the PCT is still a little goofy, only because the products I am using have more than 1 active ingredient, which I am still reading up on. I may also use DHEA and some tribulus which I have on-hand.

I know some of your are gagging in your mouths because of the absence of any SERM product. Right now I have good intentions of obtaining some liquid Nolva...but I only want to do this if gyno flare-up is physically noticed (I feel I am not predisposed to this based on past cycles - see below).

Some further notes:
1) ON cycle, there will be no milk thistle, and only light herbal usage (see week 0). I am purposely allowing the liver to lose some of it's defense in order to utilize the MD/4AD better. The dosing will be spread throughout the day to keep blood levels as constant as possible, etc.

2) PCT consists of CEE which seems common on these boards. Hopefully it will help keep gains steady or at least maintaining. Still looking for input regarding DHEA (unless Reduce will suffice) regarding cortisol in the post cycle!

Pre cycle stats: ~190 lbs, 6'2, ecto, estimated 8% bf, bench: 275x6 bench

Post cycle goal: 205-210 lbs., 315x6 bench

Training schedule: 5-day split
Sun - REST
Mon - Chest/Tri
Tues - Back/Bi
Wed - Shoulders/Legs
Thurs - REST
Fri - Chest/Bi
Sat - Legs/Abs

This is an increase from my normal 4-day protocol. Training generally consists of 4 exercises @ 4 sets each consisting of 'power' reps (6-8 range) for each body part listed.

Past experience: M1T stand-alone, M1T/4AD stack, PP stand-alone

On a personal note, I hope for this to be the most rewarding and safest cycle due to the vast amounts of knowledge and information contained within these forums! Props to you guys!

So with that, I am off to bed, and let the log begin!!:woohoo:

 

[motiv8er]

Good looking cycle. Try posting it in the Cycle section. :study:

 

[BHERTZ]

What's the easiest way to move the entire thread rather than copy and paste? If a MOD sees this, feel free to move it as well, no offense taken....

it's Jan. 2nd - official cycle start date! I'll be keeping logs of body weight, and some personal records when lifting rather than a detailed here is every single set I did, because that just takes up too much time and space in these threads...wish me luck

 

[BHERTZ]

Alright well anyway, back to the log...

Day 1 is complete. Chest and tri workout was great, no complaints. I got a good pump going for most of the duration of the chest workout. Tri's were typical...

Only thing that really matters at this point is my baseline (post new years!) bodyweight. I weighed in pre-workout at 191.5 lbs.

Only comments from here on out is that the 200lb barrier isnt looking so far away afterall...I am shooting for 205, maybe even sniffing 210 :twisted:

Three final things...
~275x6 on bench is the baseline weight for todays exercised group
~Pre workout meal consisted of 1/2 gallon of water, oatmeal, banana
~4AD was poorly dosed (too close together due to traveling constraints). Tomorrow will be properly spaced.

 

[BHERTZ]

My lab rat has been reading anabolicminds.com lately and told me that he was worried about delayed gyno.

So I went ahead and ordered some research grade tamoxifen citrate. Is 1 bottle enough? (Assume the rat is the same size as me and is doing the same cycle...) :icon_lol:


On a serious note though...This is like my 5th oral cycle and I have never gotten gyno OR used Nolva for pct...does anyone think I should worry about it now that I am using the infamous methyldrol (superdrol twin)this cycle? I feel as is I am not "predisposed", if thats even a valid excuse...?

 

[BHERTZ]

Well even though no one is replying I guess I'll continue talking to myself for the sake of someone who will read this in the future...

Anyway, weight today was down to 191 (-.5 lbs from yesterday). It may be too early to tell, but I think this is due to water shed. My abs are looking more like road blocks rather than speed bumps. It's really nice actually, so no complaints there.

Furthermore, strength is ALREADY through the roof. Today was Back/Bi day and I can definitely say I was feeling the strength gains. My wide grip pulls up were so easy. I got 3 sets of 10 no problem. Normally I get gassed out half way through and I only get 8/6 on set 2/3 respectively.

MD has one downside so far and only one. I got a bloody nose out of nowhere today when I woke up. This is fairly lame, considering I am all hopped up on hawthorn. Anything else I can take to control this?

Either way, Nolva has been shipped already...I think PCT is as robust as it can possibly be. Probably going to do some sort of 40/20/10/10 in combo with my ATD.

Feel free to comment. :blink:

 

[Moyer]

Celery Seed Extract has gotten some good reviews here for lowering blood pressure, which I assume is what caused your bloody nose. Might try a search, but I think the recommended dose is 150-300mg/day.

 

[BHERTZ]

thanks moyer, i'll look into the celery seed.

todays workout was pretty typical. shoulders started out sorta boring, then picked up nicely. so far no more nosebleeds...vascularity is really starting to show. i am getting nice pumps just tying my shoes!!

anyway...i feel like 10mg on the MD might be a little low. I think rather than waiting a calender week, I might just kick the dosage up to 20mg a couple days earlier. I think Jan 6th I might do this - unless I should ride out the gains on 10mg?

Something I have also been pleased with is the lack of acne flare up. Sometimes on M1T, etc i would look very red, and flare-ups were problematic to treat. So far a couple localized zits have been dealt with easily. The Proactiv I have on-hand does wonders. Nolva should be here in a couple days as well...

Tomorrow is OFF day, so I will continue stuffing my face. OHH best of all - up to 192.0 lb today. I think my upper body is really starting to "spread" out. I noticed it most when doing shoulder raises today. One thing that I think is helping me is the gallon of water I've been getting everyday.

alright, thats all for now....

 

[jonny21]

Nolva always good to have around. My friend had issue with bloody nose during SD but was not BP related. BP was wnl during cycle but he experienced occasional nosebleeds, most likely from dryness in his opinion.

 

[BHERTZ]

jonny, that very well could be it. i am actually very prone to nosebleeds (i used to get them ALLLL the time growing up) but i hadn't gotten one in a long time so i attributed this to the MD when i woke up with one the very next day after starting the cycle...it was either real ironic timing for a random one, possibly the winter dryness, or that MD dries noses out instantly.

so far it was an isolated case, so i guess it really doesnt matter too much. other than that, no sides to speak of at all...no back pumps at all (i've been eating 2 bananas a day)...plus its only 10mg MD/200mg 4AD right now, which is real conservative for almost anyone. hopefully i can say the same in 10 days from now...:blink:

 

[MadMas]

First of all I would add Taurine.

And you drink 1/2 gallon pre workout? Seems like that would fill you up too much. It would for me.

 

[jonny21]

What's the easiest way to move the entire thread rather than copy and paste? If a MOD sees this, feel free to move it as well, no offense taken....

Check the thread tools tab, should be able to move it from there.

~Pre workout meal consisted of 1/2 gallon of water, oatmeal, banana

Hopefully your pre-workout weights come before you drink 4lbs of water. If not try to be consistent so we get a good idea.

First of all I would add Taurine

I guess I am a Taurine non-responder because I get pumps regardless of taurine or potassium supplementation. I think it is blood flow thing but that's just my opinion.

 

[BHERTZ]

ahhh damn it, i meant to say 1/2 liter!! (~16 oz) sorry dudes....

the gallon of water is over the course of 24 hrs. again, sorry for the confusion, my bad

as far as the potassium supplementation, its still up in the air. i bet if i stopped, maybe i'd notice more of a pump/pain, who knows...?

on a side note, i feel as if i am a particularly interesting responder to a lot of these designer orals. i never really pack on a ton of weight, but my strength skyrockets, and i get veins everywhere (even those pyscho ones across the lower abs and shoulders). Furthermore, i have never had gyno or lethargy problems either. as of right now, there is no joint pain to report, but this very well could change as the dosing changes.

for now, i will strongly look into the taurine situation. thanks for everyones input so far!

alright guys, tomorrow is rest, although i look at it as growing day.:food: if anyone has any specific rest-day routines or habits they would like to share, i am all ears.

i forgot to mention, todays workout included legs, but i left out hams. i am going to save them for saturday's leg routine, where i will be doing deadlifts.

 

[BHERTZ]

SIDE EFFECT: Well everyone, today i unfortunately had to deal with probably the harshest side so far...my buddy who hasnt seen me in a couple weeks said "wow, your arms look huge!" haha

now thats what i like to hear. this was a totally unprovoked comment. aka i wasnt fishing this compliment whatsoever. it was a really rewarding feeling knowing that the diet and training (and lack of social life) are paying off! :thumbsup:

 

[roadsidejustice]

BHERTZ,

How long have you been doing that split? I know if that were me I would definitely be overtraining. If you have been doing it for a while consider going to one body part a day Mon-Fri. As your strength/weights increase your body will need the rest and hitting them twice a week IMO would be too much. Joint pain would definitely kick in on that split.

I have run three SD cycles. Two with 4DERM and the last one without. For whatever reason the last one was the best as far as putting weight on and having a better PCT.

The first two were straight 4wk at 20mg/ed followed by Nolva for 4wks. The last cycle I did 20/30/30/20/10 for the SD and did Nolva at 60/60/40/40/20 along with 300mg of DHEA split up 3x's throughout the day.

It was the best cycle so far although I didn't really enjoy the weeks on 30mg of SD. I may only do the 3rd week at 30 this time but I am definitely going with the 5th week again.

I held onto way more of my strength gains and ended up leaning out a bit despite having the stomach flu for 5 days during PCT. I am 34, 5-10, 215lbs with 33" waist.

 

[BHERTZ]

Roadside, thanks for the input...well as of now I am just about to start my second chest workout today so I'll find out how I feel after the weekend. I can tell I am already recovered. Nothing is sore, in fact my chest almost wants another workout. I am only 21 so perhaps it's not as taxing on me (in the short term). Also right now I am doing something which is every lifters dream...I am doing NOTHING but lifting and eating throughout the day.

I am only able to do this because I am on winter break from school. I have 1 more semester left before graduation, so I figured I'd come back to school for the winter break and dedicate it to my cycle. So I don't have work or anything to deal with, which is why my recovery time might be so high. I have 0 stress in my life right now. (Perhaps because my girlfriend is in Europe right now haha) It worked out perfectly that my cycle ends when the semester starts.

If I begin to notice overtraining I definitely will back off. I used to lift naturally 6x a week, and only experienced overtraining in the long run. I switched to 3x a week last year and got big gains, but then I started to slow down considerably, so I think it might be ok if I kick in high gear for just the next 3 weeks.

I am interested to weigh in today. 200 here I come!

 

[BHERTZ]

sooo....yeah, its about that time, personal record! 193.5 lbs weigh-in!! this is uncharted territory...

so yeah chest routine was not really up all that much, except on incline.

1 more good before the bad....

i got another comment today, "damn dude you are really throwing around some weight!" this was after a heavy set of preacher curls...115x6 as last set.

now for the bad...
i went bowling last night with a couple friends, just for something to do...well turns out one of them just got over some sort of flu...ANDDD as luck would have it, i think i may have picked it up. i feel pretty strongly that had i not gone on MD, i may have avoided this. well, so is life...murphys law, whatever you want to call it.

so i am gonna get to be bed real early (its 830pm here) and hopefully wake up feeling a lot better. the chick said it was just a 24 hr thing for her, but who knows what it spawned into...:rant: hopefully no appreciable mass is lost from the lack of eating tonight, blahhh

 

[BodyWizard]

MD has one downside so far and only one. I got a bloody nose out of nowhere today when I woke up. This is fairly lame, considering I am all hopped up on hawthorn. Anything else I can take to control this?

a humidifier?

I get bloody snot every winter, due to the sinus membranes drying out & cracking. Other than humidifying your environment (only works if you never go outside), my best recommendation would be to carry a spray bottle of saline solution with you & give each nostril a squirt periodically.

Don't assume it's BP unless you're getting other signs of BP elevation.

 

[BHERTZ]

BodyWiz, you are totally right. Its soo cold here in PA right now, and I know the low humidity levels are drying me out. My lips are getting overly chapped as well. What I do for the nose is take a Q-tip and dab some vaseline on it and coat my nostril. My doctor told me to do that many many years ago, and it seems to work.

Furthermore, I just woke up...I feel achy and sorta gross, however I think the flu is gone, because my head doesnt really hurt, etc....13 hrs of sleep must have done something for me then haha

 

[MadMas]

6'2 190 and youre benching 335? Whats your bf%?

Don't assume it's BP unless you're getting other signs of BP elevation.

Dont ASSUME it, but keep one hell of an eye out for it, dont take stupid risks.

 

[BHERTZ]

I love that question. Well I honestly can't answer you. Several years ago I was 6%. :blink: If I had to guess, I'd say ~8% right now.

I think my metabolism is so incredibly robust that I can maintain such a lean build without even trying. Trust me, its not as glamarous as it sounds. Sure it's nice to look cut up all the time, but honestly, I'd rather be 6'2 and 240 at the expense of bf increase.

HOWEVER - I can't complain I put on several lbs so far with MD and I have been running it at only 10mg so far. I think my flu bug is gone now (its 11pm on sat)...
I might just take off tomorrow, fully recoop, and hit the gym HARD on monday as usual. 20mg/300mg will begin then as well, so these gains should keep coming!

As far as the bench, yeah those #'s are true, no BS. I get some funny looks sometimes when I am sitting on a bench that's triple-plated.

 

[BHERTZ]

So it's sunday, normally an off day, but I figured since I missed saturday, I will try and make up for it today, but keep the workout real basic. It sucks when you are sick, the bed and a tv look more enticing than chalk and plates.

as expected, i lost a couple lbs being that my diet was severely undermined. i tried to make up for it and went out for steak and eggs this morning.

exercises today included deadlifts, walking lunges, back extensions and lots of abs. nothing impressive. tomorrow is a new day. :woohoo:

 

[BHERTZ]

Alright everyone its been a little while, so I better post now before I forget. So far so good. It's starting to feel "natural" to be ON. The sides are really non existent and I am consistent at 20mg now. It almost makes me want to try 30mg since I am not getting the all-out burst of mass and strength I want. I will ride out 20mg for probably another few days or a week.

Some things I have noticed....

-Bloody noses are a serious problem during winter. MD possibly made it worse. This is the only fair thing to conclude.
-Acne actually cleared up. I have nothing on my back (which is rare!) and nothing serious on my face.
-Joint problems seem to be going away without any special supplementation.
-Strength is DEFINITELY up. 115x6 for sets today as standing curls. Seated curls with 50s and T-bar row with 4.5 plates as a final set. Wide grip pull ups are a breeze.
-Feeling very vascular and starting to fill out my shirts better.
-No longer shredded abs, starting to retain some mass even in the midsection which is nice.
-Sex drive is fairly pathetic, however when it does act up, it's pretty intense. This is not really attributed to anything and could be the fact that I havent had any sex for a couple weeks now until my g/f gets back home.
-Stacking with 4AD seems to be great idea. No MD-solo comparison can be made, but for the sake of the 4AD addition I think it was a great choice.
-Absolutely no gyno flare up or hair loss at all.
-My urine smells like awful. If I am not chugging water consistently my piss let's me know it. It gets dark yellow occasionally in the morning. This was closer to when I was sick however. Lately it's been light-yellow/clear.
-Slight insomnia which I was experiencing has pretty much dissapeared. My remedy was to use an extra pillow under my head. For some odd reason I can fall asleep quicker and stay asleep if I was raised even higher. It sounds weird but it works. The insomnia might just be because I am so care free right now. My training is exhausting, but I have nothing to do otherwise so collectively by body never is really run down. This might account for the sides being so minimal. Even back pumps are hard to detect. After a heavy set of rows sometimes I will feel it even more than normal, but nothing unbearable.

So as far as PCT goes - I am having serious thoughts about saving the ATD for much later on, and use only Nolva and some sort of strong tribulus product and some cortisol control. I will strongly avoid DHEA as well from what I have been reading.

Now...for todays weight. With boots on I was 196.3 lbs. I am growing!!! :woohoo:

The posts that I have been reading about the slow and steady gains that "stick" are really true. These gains are ever so slow, but at a lb every couple days, there are no complaints (not to mention this isnt all that slow haha). Let's just hope because they came on slow, they will be here to stay as well!!

Little more to comment about sexually related things.
1) My balls showed their first signs of noticeable shrinkage about a day or so ago.
2) My balls are hugging me even tighter now, which is sorta weird. Since I don't plan on having a kid anytime soon, I am not concerned in the least.
3) Ejaculate volume is way down. Not blanks, just noticeably less. A lot less. This again is nothing that really worries me though.

Honestly, there is not much else to say, other than this is the real deal. It would be nice if the gains were a little more explosive, but I really can't complain. I am heavily considering 30mg for the last week as sides are minimal. However if the gains keep going smoothly at 20mg, there might not be a need to change anything.

That's it, bedtime meal, and then, well, off to bed!!

 

[BHERTZ]

Today is off day. Yesterday weighed in around 196 again. Like I said the ultimate goal is 205 or so.

As of right now some serious changes in my body are taking place. My lats are finally getting that winged look as opposed to just a V look. This is awesome. Arms are feeling noticably stronger. Super vascular all the time. However these other posts about "pumps just from tying shoes" are bogus. I just got done washing and high-speed buffing my car and didn't get pumped to the point where I had to stop what I was doing.

My neck seems to be cramped a bit more than normal, however this could just be from sleep.

Back pumps are starting to be a little more prolonged than usual. However they arent super severe.

I am in the process of redoing the whole PCT scheme and will post it when done. It's going to exclude ATD altogether.

Yesterday's PR: 80x7 for military dumbbell press as my 4th set in the pyramid. :twisted: My legs are really starting to feel the effects as well. Was doing seriously deep leg presses with 525 yesterday and felt great. So far so good.

 

[BHERTZ]

Back pumps are starting to linger longer each day, but don't really occur while lifting.
This week I will up the dosage to 400mg 4AD but stay at 20mg MD. I toyed with the idea of 30mg, but just not worth it.

Today's weigh in: 196.5 lbs!! PR
Bench press: 275x8!! PR

So far everything is smooth sailing.
-------------
New PCT:
-Nolva: 40/20/20/10
-Tribulus: 1500/750/750
-Reduce: ?? follow servings on bottle..

I am going to save the ATD for a later date. I might finish my ES3 from Sci-Fit for the first week or so. Not really sure if I should abandon the ATD altogether or not...?? Any ideas?

 

[bigpaul99]

BHERTZ,

How long have you been doing that split? I know if that were me I would definitely be overtraining. If you have been doing it for a while consider going to one body part a day Mon-Fri. As your strength/weights increase your body will need the rest and hitting them twice a week IMO would be too much. Joint pain would definitely kick in on that split.

I have run three SD cycles. Two with 4DERM and the last one without. For whatever reason the last one was the best as far as putting weight on and having a better PCT.

The first two were straight 4wk at 20mg/ed followed by Nolva for 4wks. The last cycle I did 20/30/30/20/10 for the SD and did Nolva at 60/60/40/40/20 along with 300mg of DHEA split up 3x's throughout the day.

It was the best cycle so far although I didn't really enjoy the weeks on 30mg of SD. I may only do the 3rd week at 30 this time but I am definitely going with the 5th week again.

I held onto way more of my strength gains and ended up leaning out a bit despite having the stomach flu for 5 days during PCT. I am 34, 5-10, 215lbs with 33" waist.

BHERTZ,

hey man i noticed that you seemed to not like the 30 mg's of superdrol a day the most. I kind of feel that way too. i started my cycle at 20 mg's though and bumped to 30 for my second and third week. tomorrow will be my third week and im wondering if i should go back down to 20 mg's or if i should stay at 30's. Now it seems like I have adapted to the 30's and am getting some insane work outs but the first day or so i didnt really feel the significance of the addition of the 30 mg's. another thing, should i continue the cycle for an additional week or should i just start my pct after the third week?

 

[roadsidejustice]

I'm not sure if you have done weeks 2 and 3 at 30mg because you later go on to say you will be starting week three. Whatever week you are in I would taper down to 20mg in week four and don't be afraid to add a 5th week at 10mg. Like I said, it was my best PCT yet doing it that way.

 

[bigpaul99]

I'm not sure if you have done weeks 2 and 3 at 30mg because you later go on to say you will be starting week three. Whatever week you are in I would taper down to 20mg in week four and don't be afraid to add a 5th week at 10mg. Like I said, it was my best PCT yet doing it that way.

what i meant was that i originally planned to do my second and third week at 30 mg's. but yesterday was the first day of my third week (im still on the cycle). so you are saying i should continue at 30 mg's for the rest of this week (the third week) then taper off the next two weeks?

 

[BHERTZ]

bigpaul, yeah he is suggesting a pyramid basically. up to 30 then back down.

i have been away for the last couple days so i havent had time to add anything to the log.

as of right now back pumps are getting bad. i think i need to spread out the dosages more to keep the peak MD levels lower in my body at any given time.

HOWEVER...before i left i weighed in at 199 lbs!!!! this is awesome for me being that i am an ecto. i have a feeling i am back down to 196 or so since i didnt get to eat like i normally do while i was on the road.

as for the MD i kept it to 20mg, and i think i will just keep it like that. the weights have been consistently going up, but i can honestly say strength gains were better on phera plex at 20mg. i think my next cycle might be a stand alone methylplex but do 20/20/30/30. this wont be for quite some time because i believe in taking at least 4 months off in between cycles even if they are only 3 weeker's.

revised PCT:
Nolva: 40/20/20/10
Lean Extreme: suggested servings
Tribulus: suggested servings

i ordered the sns reduce xt but was backordered, so the dude called me up and said he would sub in lean extreme for free!! i think i am going to stay on cycle till the 23, maybe stretch it to the 25th or so depending on how the workout falls into that schedule.

thats about all for now, hopefully i can break the 200lb barrier but i am going to have to eat my face off. :burger: :burger:

 

[bigpaul99]

right on i think thats what I'll do.

Bhertz, sorry for using your thread as mine, hope you're cycle turns at well. Let us know how the end results turn out

 

[roadsidejustice]

Big Paul,

How many times have you done SD or things like it and how much do you weigh. The only reason I went up to 30mg in the first place is because it was my third cycle and I was 210 on my way to 230lbs. If you haven't cycled that many times and are roughly the same weight I would actually get back down to 20mg for the 3rd and 4th week and add 1 wk at 10mg.

I am on my 4th SD cycle and I think my receptors are not back where they should be because I am getting nowhere on this cycle and I am coming up on finishing my second week. I did notice that the bottle I started on has smaller capsules than the newer bottle I just opened so I am hoping maybe I got a bad batch or something but I have not heard anything about that happening.

I guess my point is don't take more if you don't need to.

 

[BHERTZ]

Yeah generally 200 lb seems to be the prereq for 30mg to even be considered. However, based on some other posts 30mg might not be as bad as some people think.

Things that I did NOT experience in my 18 days so far are as follows:
gyno, acne, hair loss, major joint pain

So far my only sides that i DID experience at 20mg are:
loss of labido (really bad actually) and back pumps (also really bad but not until day 12 or so). 30mg I feel would not give me any more sides just maybe make the current ones more severe. Then again I don't want to find out the hard way. BigPaul these are things to consider when cycling, etc.

As far as new gains...I am going down to the gym now after 2 rest days. Trying to get 275x8 again or better on flat bench. 10 reps would be mind blowing!! :twisted:

 

[BHERTZ]

good news - weighed in at 199.0 again. so i didnt lose anything over the rest days even though i only ate 4x a day.

275x8 again, so no new pr's to report, but i'll take it. back pumps were non existent today. i was heavy on the carbs this morning, and spaced my 4AD much better as well.

with IBE on serious backorder with their nolva, i basically will extend the cycle until i receive the product or else my pct will be junk, and maybe even ruin the cycle altogether. pct is where gains are kept. sooo...we'll see how this pans out.

if anyone else has had this problem (they told me on the phone about 300 other people are waiting for shipment) that monday will be the new proposed ship date.

current goal: get to use the 200 notch on the scale.

another thing i wanted to point out is that my waistline has definitely grown about 3/4" or so. this doesnt worry me at all but may worry others on bulking cycles who want to avoid this. my girlfriend (who hasnt seen me in 3 weeks) said last night:

-your arms look scary
-your midsection looks thicker (in a good way)

soo take it for what its worth, but as the cycle comes to an end i can definitely say this is one of the most effective bulking cycles i have ever had. i got good strength gains so far but nothing explosive. the gains are slow and steady which is actually more rewarding than seeing all 10lbs or so in the first couple days. like i've said since day 1, hopefully the slower the gains come on, the longer it will take for them to come off. i have high hopes for this pct as it's my first use with a serm.

i'll give a final writeup when everythings all over.

 

[bigpaul99]

damn man today my work out consisted of walking lunges, squats, powerclean, and a few light sets on bench just to keep my chest tight.

but god oh mighty my back hurt like a motherfucker.
i have never experienced such back pumps, it was to the point where i was thinking of ending my cycle... i dont know. ive experienced the pumps before but nothing like they were today. is there anything i can take for them? i feel like the only thing thatd make me feel better is a handful of OC.

 

[BHERTZ]

my last couple of workouts have been awful...supposedly bananas help. i also have been sticking to about a gallon a day of water. this seems to help a little.

today i lifted at another gym with an old friend. its sorta fun to see a different crowd of people.

anyway, i couldnt find a friggin scale in the whole place so i am unsure of todays weigh-in. however the strength is totally there and seems to still be growing. dumbbell rows for back with the 100's were the highlight of today. i am hoping when i weigh-in tomorrow, i am over the 200 lb barrier.

another side note - labido is pathetic. i had more sex drive at 10mg of M1T than i do at 20mg of MD. i was drilling the ol' lady the other night and was honestly having trouble staying totally up. the drive just wasnt there. noticeable testicle shrinkage as of lately. i guess i might be starting to see some signs of significant supressesion. of course this sucks, but hey the cycle is almost over soo i guess things could be worse.

lastly i forgot to mention i have leftover AX Perfect Cycle which will also be thrown into my PCT. This is super heavy in NAC/milk this/r-ala.

alright i'm out for a late night grocery run.

 

[roadsidejustice]

Taurine is supposed to help the back pumps.

 

[BHERTZ]

WOW, alright it's been a long time, I apologize for anyone who has been awaiting the conclusion of this cycle.

So I am gonna go ahead and say right now that this will probably be fairly long, as to recap the past week or so.

Basically my whole cycle changed. It ended up looking like 10/20/20/10 with some anti-e (ES3 from SciFit) on week 4 to sort of kickstart the PCT.

As of today all products are finally in. This includes Lean Extreme, and my liquid Nolva came in yesterday as well. Just for the record Nolva has a horrid taste, but is better than growing a set of C-cups.

At first I thought my PCT would be Nolva/trib/LX only. After reading Dr. D's awesome posts, I figured ramping up an ATD product (such as the SAN Attitude) I have on hand would be a killer combo to destroy estrogen and maintain gains.

Gains? Let's talk about them. I finally broke 200, but only for 1 day. I sort of felt like near the end of Week 3 that I wasn't even "on" anymore. Back pumps were still there of course and at times were debilitating. Most people would react with 30mg dosing, but I wanted to avoid this. At any rate, no symptons of gyno flared up, and I feel using week 4 as a transition made for a smoother off cycle.

So today is technically day 1 of my full on PCT, but will be my second day of Nolva/ATD combo.

I'll recap the whole cycle:

Pre-Cycle:
Week 0: Herbal front load

On-Cycle:
Week 1: 10mg/200mg (MD/4AD)
Week 2: 20mg/300mg
Week 3: 20mg/400mg
Week 4: 10mg/200mg + ES3 (1 pill)

PCT: (Nolva / SAN / LX)
Week 5: 60mg/60mg/150mg
Week 6: 40mg/60mg/100mg
Week 7: 20mg/120mg/50mg
Week 8: 20mg/120mg/50mg

So far I have added NO-Xplode and some CEE to the mix. I am still dosing herbs and fish oil super heavy.

While ON I also tried out MHP's Up Your Mass. So did everything work together? I'd have to say so. This seemed to be one of the best cycles I have done to date relative to mass gains, and body recomp. My lats are flared out, bi's are noticably fuller, and legs are more dense. People have complimented namely on my arms looking bigger, and my back being wider. As of right now I am holding gains to the tune of 197-199 lbs.

That means the biggest gains I had seen were technically 13 lbs in 3 weeks. (Week 4 was done out of neccessity because of backordered PCT products, and didn't offer much to the cycle.) Right now I feel as if I am leveling out around 197 or so. This is right around +10lbs. I'll take that anyday. These gains are not fleeting like M1T used to give me. I feel like I will be able to maintain the size. The moderate strength increase I encountered has been sticking around as well. I noticed my back already feels to not be as strong, however chest, arms, and legs are holding fairly constant. I feel it is a bit too early to really comment on these things.

So it's been 4 days without any MD/4AD and I was still able to put up 335 on bench. Oddly enough my bench max didnt really go up all that much, but I can stick 275x8 rather easily now. Curling 115 for 4 sets of 6 seems to be common now.

Some bads of being on PCT above and beyond not building muscle at an exponential rate.....
1) Joint pain came on right away. I feel this can be attributed to several things. ATD tends to dry people out. Joints get tight, etc. Also, damage being done while on cycle and pushing big weight tends to be masked and not realized till off cycle
2) Acne flare up. Noticable back-ne and some more facial blemishes. The ones on my back are 2 pockets and are fairly contained. 1 on each of my delts.
3) Sex drive came back right away, however noticeable teste shrinkage is still there.
4) Fatigue. The jury is still out on this one. I figured NO-xplode would give me a nice kick, but even so, I am still in need of afternoon naps all of a sudden. My last semester at college began, and I think just being up later and out with people all the time may be wearing me down.
5) Mild cold symptons. Again, with more people being back at school, this could be attributed to a host of different things. I think now that my LX is in, this may combat any cortisol induced immune function problems. Additionally, killing off estrogen will lead to these problems b/c if I am correct, estrogen and white blood cell production are related. And to anyone who is wondering, MILD means super MILD. I have not been coughing or sore throat, I just noticed more than average congestion, and excessive mucus when I wake up.
6) Nosebleeds have subsided rather nicely. In fact even Week 4 they went away. It seems like going to 20mg took its toll on my BP.

Other than that, things seem to be going fairly well. If anyone has any suggestions whatsoever, please comment. Including any future cycle possibilities. I have a lot of methylplex, shitload of M1T, some methyldrol (no more 4AD though!) left over. I am wondering if playing around with H50 or P25 would be worth my time or money.

Thanks to everyone in this board who helped put together this cycle and commented along the way. I hope this can serve as a reference for future people who want to try out a similar stack.

 

[BHERTZ]

Alright guys, I want to add to this...

LX is an AWESOME addition to PCT. My belly size shrunk instantly, totally leaned out. Nolva tastes like **** but shrank my nips. On a scale of 1-10 for puffiness I would have origianlly said maybe a 3, but after using Nolva for just a few days at 60mg they were so tight against my body that the puffiness was more severe than I had thought. So in hindsight, I would have ranked myself closer to a 6, with 10 being "hey someone milk me".

I weighed in around 195/196 the past couple days, so I mean I only really have lost a couple lbs. I am working a lot more, plus school is in session, so my diet is not nearly as solid as it was while ON. But this is still awesome considering I started closer to the 188 range. So it would appear that after 1 week of PCT I am holding 8 lbs of good gains.

And for what it's worth everyone at school thinks I am juicing. They make jokes about needles and stuff because when they came back to school my body was so noticeably bigger, plus I was literally throwing around 275 on bench.

I am thinking of a H-50 or Mega-TRN (see generic labz for this one) in a few months. If anyone has any questions, comments, or whatever, let me know!!!