Why do so many use an AI like ATD for PCT nowadays?
- 09-07-2005, 10:10 PM
Why do so many use an AI like ATD for PCT nowadays?
Why is the use of an aromatase inhibitor so popular all of a sudden to use for PCT?
I almost don't hear about steroid users using for example an AI like arimidex post cycle...they use SERMS like nolva, clomid.
Is all this ATD use because of legality issues concerning obtaining nolva and clomid..? Just wondering.
- 09-07-2005, 11:40 PM
- 09-08-2005, 01:39 AM
Reem, as i learned from this forum and others that clomid and nolva are the best orals to use as PCT due to their strong ability to fix the natural Test production in a Man, in other words they work on the HPTA and make body produce more LH (letuinizing hormon, spelling) and make the testes gain their natural size and charac.and at the same time inhibit estrogen so loss of muscles will be prevented.
this is my 2 cents
Last edited by Mess; 09-08-2005 at 01:42 AM. Reason: fix
09-08-2005, 02:14 AM
If im not mistaken... ATD is a Anti-Estrogen... not an Aromatase Inhibitor (Such as 6-OXO). ATD actually crushes the estrogen in your body, so low that it stimulates test production with a quickness. I read around here that ATD is a Steroidial AE.. but I forgot what that interprets as. For me ATD brings me back quicker than the SERMS.Originally Posted by Reem
Hopefully the good Doc or whatnot can chime in.
09-08-2005, 02:21 AM
ATD is an AI, but there is question as to its true properties in the body besides its capacity as a strong steroidal AI. It is not a SERM (clomid, nolva), which are still recommended for PCT over any AI.Originally Posted by DAdams91982
09-08-2005, 02:25 AM
ATD works very well, i like it better than nolva
09-08-2005, 02:33 AM
I echo this... it also keeps me from becoming a whiney little bitch during PCT.Originally Posted by Kristopher
09-08-2005, 06:31 AM
It's popular because it works and it's legal and easily accessible. If it didn't work, it wouldn't have sored this fast in popularity.
09-08-2005, 07:04 AM
To the comment above in posts, if I remember correctly ATD is a more active metabolite of 6-0x0, but I could be wrong and it could be OHAT, the other ingredient that was in Novedex XT so forgive me if I am wrong.
09-08-2005, 01:25 PM
I'm not sure that people are using ATD as a standalone for PCT following longer cycles...
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09-08-2005, 03:32 PM
it was 3-OHATOriginally Posted by MaNiaK1027
09-08-2005, 04:12 PM
I think it brought me back faster then Nolva by far, not sure why though.Originally Posted by Kristopher
09-08-2005, 04:17 PM
feelings are only useful to a certain extent. If i gave you injectable test as PCT, and could somehow convince people it was a SERM or an AI, I am sure many people would be praising its benefits in restoring the HPTA (because libidio, mood, etc, remained high). this was an extreme analogy, but the point is that the integrity of the HPTA can only be known via blood tests.Originally Posted by muscles4life
09-08-2005, 04:33 PM
I agree here. I "feel" like Ultra Hotter and Rebound did one HELL of a good job bringing me back, but I can't tell for sure. I'll know after I do my bloodwork on monday though.
09-09-2005, 12:58 PM
there has been bloodwork done with ATD. if I remember right they all seemed good. one guy was recovered after 2 wks of pct. he start taking ATD the last 2 wks of the cycle and 2 wks pct he was recovered. only negative thing I seen was some estrogen levels seemed a little high.
09-09-2005, 01:26 PM
ATD&metabolites cross react with T, making those #s invalid. Furthermore, there is more to recovery than normal T levels.Originally Posted by wastedwhiteboy2
09-09-2005, 02:37 PM
I have heard this might be true. where did you get the info about the invalid #s
09-09-2005, 04:01 PM
I scanned the article and posted it over at avant. Any test level taken while on ATD by RIA (the most common technique) is entirely unreliable.Originally Posted by wastedwhiteboy2
09-09-2005, 04:21 PM
so we need a new test to really assess the value. thanks velik...
09-24-2005, 09:04 AM
I was not aware that the test was so general as to react with an ATD metabolite. Do you have a ref I can read?Originally Posted by SilentScream27
09-24-2005, 10:54 PM
Originally Posted by DR.D
Steroids. 1980 Dec;36(6):717-21.
Immunological interference of the synthetic aromatase inhibitor 1,4,6-androstatriene-3,17-dione (ATD) and its metabolite(s) in the radioimmunoassay for testosterone.
Donaldson MD, Forest MG.
Radioimmunoassay (RIA) for testosterone (T) in unchromatographed plasma extracts from ATD-treated rats gave spuriously high values for T. Cross-reaction and chromatographic studies subsequently showed that ATD and, to a much greater extent, its metabolite(s) were responsible for this overestimation. Celite column chromatography proved to be an effective way of separating T from ATD and its product(s) of metabolism.
09-24-2005, 11:14 PM
So, how do we get accurate T values in out of a test? Anybody able to performa celite column chromatography for us?
09-25-2005, 01:16 AM
I don't do clinical anymore, but if the assay is just an enzymatic colorimetric determination, it could be an issue indeed. Retention times on chromo are the way to go here.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
Kwyckemynd00, send me a gallon of your finest pee collected over an even 24hr period and dope it with small sponge containing 1% thymol. Add 100ml dichloromethane too so it can be pre-extracting on it's way here.
Or maybe people should just request an LC test method when they get it done. It will have to be outsourced I'm sure and that gets expensive. I wish a clinical guy would chime in here and verify that they still use this old method. That reference was from 1980! SS, where are you bro?
09-25-2005, 01:21 AM
Hmmm....not sounding too promising
Oh well...as long as my balls work and I'm getting stronger, i can't complain
09-25-2005, 09:06 AM
So I guess this could be responsible for Dio's incredibly high test levels after 2 weeks of KS attack?Originally Posted by SilentScream27
09-25-2005, 09:12 AM
09-25-2005, 09:26 AM
Yeah! I got gold last wk at some point. Not really sure how though, nobody has taken credit.Originally Posted by SJA
09-25-2005, 09:28 AM
pssst look in bobos forum in the "if you donate" threadOriginally Posted by DR.D
09-25-2005, 11:43 AM
Thanks for the clueOriginally Posted by Pioneer
09-25-2005, 12:08 PM
A little birdy told me it was "ghosting"Originally Posted by DR.D
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