making test susp.

[snakebyte05]

I finally found a place that sells some powders, mainly test base, Im just wondering how you go about making up a test suspension solution. I'm pretty sure it is a test base I need, since it acts so fast because there is not ester. So if anyone has some homebrewing methods for this, or if I'm going about this all wrong, feel free to chime in. Trying to figure out a cycle for later on this year.

Also if you have any advice on dosage per day and how to inject to avoid scar tissue (haven't had to inject everyday before), let me know what you do. Im also looking for something to stack with this, preferrably something with little estrogen, something that provides lean mass gains (been thinking of giving tren a try, just not sure about the hairline issues).

 

[Matthew D]

I would be using the test base in a transdermal if it were me...

 

[hethcliff]

test base is a pretty tricky thing to make well. doses from 60-100mg/day are common. beware that it will be painfull at even 100mg/ml

 

[size]

If you decide to make it, suspend it in oil and not water. It will need to be inejcted daily so you will need to be comfortable using various injection sites. To avoid scar tissue, use a 25gauge or smaller for injections and rotate sites often(glutes, quads, delts, traps, biceps, lats, pecs, tris, etc)

 

[snakebyte05]

What would you recommend? Suspension or transdermal? If I am getting the same amount in my blood it should not make a difference, test is test and either way there is not ester attached. Im just trying to figure out if I will be able to get enough on or what concentrate for dermal I should go. Also would it be best to use something like penatrate for the dermal, or should I make my own dsmo (or does penatrate use this, not sure)?

EDIT: the problem I am having with dermal is from the fact that it will be hard to get a high dose I want to have. I already did a test enan with dbol and had moderate gains, but not what I expected. Diet and training were good, but I believe it was from earlier this year when I had done a high dose of 1-test cyp/sledge test, might have got my really good cycle out from that. So I am planning on taking a good amount of time off.

 

[glenihan]

if you didn't really get what you were looking for out of your test dbol cycle and you're sure your training and diet were fine and that the gear was legit .. i would recommend running a test deca cycle and seeing if the additition of a strong anabolic helps .. sometimes people just seem not to respond all that well to test alone

 

[snakebyte05]

if you didn't really get what you were looking for out of your test dbol cycle and you're sure your training and diet were fine and that the gear was legit .. i would recommend running a test deca cycle and seeing if the additition of a strong anabolic helps .. sometimes people just seem not to respond all that well to test alone

Well I got my stuff from a guy that has been around for a while and checked out ok with some mods here. But what I got was his new line that he just came out with. So who knows, his new stuff could be underdosed or something. As for my cycle, it will have something else in it, not just test, which was something I was trying to figure out what else I should add in. Not sure about deca, I need some more research.

 

[jminis]

Well I got my stuff from a guy that has been around for a while and checked out ok with some mods here. But what I got was his new line that he just came out with. So who knows, his new stuff could be underdosed or something. As for my cycle, it will have something else in it, not just test, which was something I was trying to figure out what else I should add in. Not sure about deca, I need some more research.

I've ran a few test base dermals and they all went well. It's pretty easy to get 100mg absorbed a day with a dermal bro.

 

[snakebyte05]

I've ran a few test base dermals and they all went well. It's pretty easy to get 100mg absorbed a day with a dermal bro.

Yea. now that I think about it, it had been so long with a dermal I was thinking all wrong. I was thinking if I wanted 700mgs of test, I would need to do that every day to equal 700mg test cyp. Dunno what I was thinking, major brain fart.

Well if I get penatrate and get 15grams in it (assuming it actually holds that) and squirt 6mls on a day, 7 days a week that would be 787mgs a week absorbed (assuming 30% gets absorbed).

Anyone know how well penatrate works? Also what would be a good oral to add with this cycle? Superdrol? Just trying to find out what I have to work with. Something with low estrogen sides.

 

[snakebyte05]

Would a TB dermal be the same as any other dermal, as in I need to wait 3weeks for it to kick in? Or should a 7 week cycle of TB dermal be good for a short cycle? Not sure if it would be enough time on.

On a positive note, I was re-reading some TB dermal cycles and noticed in Jminis that 20g of TB should fit in the 8oz bottle of penetrate. Should make applying very easy. Only 4-5mls a day.


EDIT:Well I am trying to decide which dermal to use. Tgel or penetrate. I have heard tgel has better absorption then penetrate, just not sure if this is true. Also it says 12g in a 4oz bottle of tgel, im guessing that is the high end, and TB should probably get close to that? So which one do you think would be best?


Also, one thing I can't seem to figure is what would be a good oral to go along with this. Im looking at legal ones first, but there is limited choice, mainly SD which I would make my own solution again. If anyone else has some good suggestions for legal (or illegal) for lean mass gains, please give some input.

 

[snakebyte05]

bumpity bump

 

[size]

I am not experienced with the transdermals, but you should notice the effects very rapidly. Try dosing it at least 2x daily. Results should be quite good as test base has a low molecular weight so I would expect it to work well. Honestly, I would expect to feel effects in a matter of days.

 

[jminis]

I am not experienced with the transdermals, but you should notice the effects very rapidly. Try dosing it at least 2x daily. Results should be quite good as test base has a low molecular weight so I would expect it to work well. Honestly, I would expect to feel effects in a matter of days.

Size your right on man. It usually takes about 4-5days and my libido is through the roof. I've used both penetrate and tgel and tgel has a higher absorbtion for sure.

Penetrate is easier to work with and you can get a higher dosed solution while tgel has better absorbtion and is a lotion not liquid. It's up to you bro.

As for orals, take your pic, I'm on a cutter and running dbol and moving into var. I would say if you have SD just use that.

 

[snakebyte05]

Size your right on man. It usually takes about 4-5days and my libido is through the roof. I've used both penetrate and tgel and tgel has a higher absorbtion for sure.

Penetrate is easier to work with and you can get a higher dosed solution while tgel has better absorbtion and is a lotion not liquid. It's up to you bro.

As for orals, take your pic, I'm on a cutter and running dbol and moving into var. I would say if you have SD just use that.

Do you have a rough estimate at which tgel would absorb? Im looking for a low end estimate so I know how much tb I need to get and apply. It doesn't seem like you can get more into penetrate that tgel, tgel says 4oz can get 10-12grams. Many say tb is easy to get in most solutions, so im guessing 10g shouldn't be hard. Penetrate supposidly can get 20g tb, only difference is it is 8oz.

 

[jminis]

Do you have a rough estimate at which tgel would absorb? Im looking for a low end estimate so I know how much tb I need to get and apply. It doesn't seem like you can get more into penetrate that tgel, tgel says 4oz can get 10-12grams. Many say tb is easy to get in most solutions, so im guessing 10g shouldn't be hard. Penetrate supposidly can get 20g tb, only difference is it is 8oz.

Honestly I get 10g in Tgel and I don't think I could get much more without it getting grainy. Penetrate I bet I could get 15g in 4oz. I would say the absorbtion rate for tgel is probably around 40%. The DMFA is a great, far better then DMSO for many reasons. Remember the guy who made it (Chemo) the man knows his **** and does things for a reason. Long live BDC, lol

 

[exnihilo]

I've heard subjective reports on avant from some people who have used both phlojel ultra and tgel, and phlojel was deemed the winner. A little DMSO and d-limonene (supposedly 10 and 3% respectively) is supposed to improve the penetration a decent amount too.

I'd like to do a rat study using different transdermal matrices, lol. Shave the rats, apply transdermals with test base twice a day for a week, and then kill the rats and then seperate out the test from the blood and see what causes the greatest increase in test levels... Wonder if I could get funding for such an experiment :twisted:

 

[jminis]

I've heard subjective reports on avant from some people who have used both phlojel ultra and tgel, and phlojel was deemed the winner. A little DMSO and d-limonene (supposedly 10 and 3% respectively) is supposed to improve the penetration a decent amount too.

I'd like to do a rat study using different transdermal matrices, lol. Shave the rats, apply transdermals with test base twice a day for a week, and then kill the rats and then seperate out the test from the blood and see what causes the greatest increase in test levels... Wonder if I could get funding for such an experiment :twisted:

LOL Search pubmed I think they already did that. Seriously though it would be nice to get some solid numbers on absorbtion rate. I base mine on results I get when I run test enanth or prop cycles at certain dosages.

 

[snakebyte05]

So to get 10g in tgel I would have to add slowly and keep giving hot water baths while shaking the hell out of it? Would adding a bolt or ball bearing inside help it all get into solution? Also if I get 10g in 4oz do you think 6ml would be overkill? Im trying to underestimate the abosbtion by guessing 30% being absorbed. That would be 1g absorbed a week. Or should I go for 5ml and hope for 40% and get 1g at the very most on optimal absorbtion?

To bad I dont have something like 1-test prop, that would be great on this cycle. 1-test cyp was one of my best cycles ever. To bad I do not have enough for a good cycle based on that. I guess I will save it for a longer cycle I will do far off in the future and use it as a smaller dose. Just ahve to find out how much I have left.

 

[kwantam]

Wonder if I could get funding for such an experiment :twisted:

I'll pitch in $10

-kwantam

 

[jminis]

So to get 10g in tgel I would have to add slowly and keep giving hot water baths while shaking the hell out of it? Would adding a bolt or ball bearing inside help it all get into solution? Also if I get 10g in 4oz do you think 6ml would be overkill? Im trying to underestimate the abosbtion by guessing 30% being absorbed. That would be 1g absorbed a week. Or should I go for 5ml and hope for 40% and get 1g at the very most on optimal absorbtion?

To bad I dont have something like 1-test prop, that would be great on this cycle. 1-test cyp was one of my best cycles ever. To bad I do not have enough for a good cycle based on that. I guess I will save it for a longer cycle I will do far off in the future and use it as a smaller dose. Just ahve to find out how much I have left.

I would do everything you said, i would transfer to a glass beaker and add 3-4 grams at a time with a something like a ball bearing, bolt, whatever to help seperate and mix. Usually takes a little while but it will all disolve. I would honestly plan on 40%.

 

[DR.D]

Trans w/ 10% DMSO works great using test base, but lidocaine hcl does wonders for the pain factor if you go aqueous. If you take Size's advise and use oil, I'd go with chlorobutanol as a painkiller/anti-septic. I am officially agaist daily injects though, but test base is the **** if you've ever done it.

 

[kwantam]

I am officially agaist daily injects though

Even sub-q? So... many... sites...

-kwantam

 

[Nate Dawg]

DR.D is back!!! Good to see you DR.D, its been awhile. Are you mainly against the daily injects just due to scar tissue build-up?

Hey Snakebyte, are you going to keep a log with this here? I would be interested in following it if you do decide to keep one.

Jminis- Have you ran any more of ALR's cycles such as the 40 day cycle that you ran a couple times? Have you tried or do you have plans for trying any of his other cycles?

 

[snakebyte05]

DR.D is back!!! Good to see you DR.D, its been awhile. Are you mainly against the daily injects just due to scar tissue build-up?

Hey Snakebyte, are you going to keep a log with this here? I would be interested in following it if you do decide to keep one.

Jminis- Have you ran any more of ALR's cycles such as the 40 day cycle that you ran a couple times? Have you tried or do you have plans for trying any of his other cycles?

nate dawg - I will most likely do something like posting weekly updates. BUt this cycle isn't till july at the earliest, so its still a ways off.

Jminis - So I should mix everyting in a glass beaker instead? Is there something wrong with using the bottle it comes in, or do I need to heat it up a lot, which would melt the plastic? Not sure how hot I need to go. I was just thinking some steaming/boiling water. I think i'll estimate 35% to make it closer to what I hope to optimally get. That way if I am under I wont overdose to much.

 

[DR.D]

I'm back! Good to see i was missed I missed you guys too(in a very manly way of course)

sub-q is ok, I just mean that the statistical signifigance of something going wrong necessarily increases with every shot you take, not to mention the inevitable scar tissue build up, oh yes, I can tell you it does happen :frustrate but a good trans formula is just fine as a replacement for daily shots, too cheap to not to take advantage and more friendly long-term to the body

 

[exnihilo]

I am officially agaist daily injects though, but test base is the **** if you've ever done it.

I remember skye mentioning cyclo-hormones, which would be effective as a method of doing sub-q shots. That seemed quite interesting to me.

As for ED shots, all I can say is - never again. Huge pain to have to break out the rig and shoot every day, and the rotation issue was a big annoyance too. My next cycle is almost certainly going to be trans test base and tren e.

 

[size]

I am officially agaist daily injects though, but test base is the **** if you've ever done it.

Absolutely.

 

[jminis]

Jminis- Have you ran any more of ALR's cycles such as the 40 day cycle that you ran a couple times? Have you tried or do you have plans for trying any of his other cycles?

Yes I have although they weren't posted here, I ran one with test E and EQ and winny. Every cycle I put together that was based on his idea's went very smoothly with minimum loss of gains post cycle. Granted your not going to blow up 30lbs like if you ran 16week of Test and (add your choice of AAS) but you gain quality mass without the "crash" and the like.

 

[jminis]

Jminis - So I should mix everyting in a glass beaker instead? Is there something wrong with using the bottle it comes in, or do I need to heat it up a lot, which would melt the plastic? Not sure how hot I need to go. I was just thinking some steaming/boiling water. I think i'll estimate 35% to make it closer to what I hope to optimally get. That way if I am under I wont overdose to much.

Yes use a glass bottle or beaker. You need to heat the piss out of it and the plastic WILL deform. What I do is pour the gel into the glass breaker (unheated) if some doesn't come out it's no big deal as the gel is going right back into the container. Anyway I usually heat the gel (without powder added yet) for a few minutes. Then add 3-5g of powder then heat again. I am constantly removing the beaker to shake every few minutes.

Anyway continue this process until everything is good to go. To test it just dip your finger in the gel a little bit and see if it's still grainy at all. After I heat it I've noticed sometimes ingredients in the gel would seperate leaving it runny. To avoid this, after it's mixed well and ready to be taken off the stove pour it back into the Tgel bottle, shake it for a few minutes then stick it in the freezer for 10mins then fridge for 30mins. This helps

 

[pjsallday]

I am running a test base trans cycle right now and I'm up 5 lbs. in a week. I used phlojel to compound it. I felt it in about 4 days like jiminis said. If it is your first cycle then just use test base and you will grow. I am running 150 mg twice a day (300mg a day) topical. I am already planning my dbol test cycle after recovery from this is over with.

 

[snakebyte05]

I am running a test base trans cycle right now and I'm up 5 lbs. in a week. I used phlojel to compound it. I felt it in about 4 days like jiminis said. If it is your first cycle then just use test base and you will grow. I am running 150 mg twice a day (300mg a day) topical. I am already planning my dbol test cycle after recovery from this is over with.

MY first cycle of illegal aas was test e with dbol. Did not like the dbol. It did not give me the strength increase or size, but gave me really bad gyno even with 20mg nolva everyday while on it. Test e was the standard 500mg and I got growth, just not what I expected. I guess I was most likely expecting more than I should have, thinking all I did was legal stuff, this should work better than that. Wrong frame of mind, even though I knew it, I still thought. I think the reason I was not pleased was I had done a high dose cycle of 1-test cyp/ sledge test and good sized amounts and had a great cycle. 15lbs while leaning out.

So my thought is to do a higher dosed test cycle and give it one more shot to see if it was just that cycle, or if my test e was underdosed, or If I just don't react that great to test. So I will run test base with superdrol, unless a different oral comes out that is good for lean mass gains while being legal and fine on the hairline. Only reason I do not want to go illegal, is that most seem to be hard on the hairline like winny or very expensive like var.

 

[snakebyte05]

Well I have some bad news for me, the guy I was going to get powder from has a minimum which I am not close too. So I need some help picking something else out to get along with it instead of just more test. I was thinking of something like 2grams of var and taking it at 50mgs/day. Try and get some strength and possibly lean out a bit. Also it is somewhat safer than other orals, so that is a benefit. Otherwise this is what I have for choices. Any suggestions on what you would get with my test out of these choices would help. (keep in mind I want lean gains and am mindful of my hair)

 

[DR.D]

Nothing beats SD on the sides VS effectiveness, but the dro looks good and A50 is always a good, dirty bulker. Depends on your real goal.

 

[exnihilo]

I wouldn't waste time with an oral since you're going transdermal (except dbol, I love dbol, but you said it didn't work for you right?). If your source could pony up some boldenone base I'd advise you go with that.

 

[snakebyte05]

the reason I am looking at other things is I need to spend about 100$ more or powders since he has a minimum for ordering. He is the only powder source I have found so far, so what I have to deal with is limited. Lucky for me his prices seem very decent. Im guessing SD would be the best choice, but I need to get the minimum order amount or no test for me, so i'm looking at what I can use out of that for lean gains and alright on the hair. I would love to do winny, but I have heard it can do wonders for losing hair. Not sure if using nizoral 2% or spiro 5% would be enough to stave away hair loss. I would love to have something to lean me out in this cycle, since it is going to be during the summer.

 

[exnihilo]

just as a heads up, if he charges more than $1.50/g for test base look elsewhere.

 

[snakebyte05]

just as a heads up, if he charges more than $1.50/g for test base look elsewhere.

Well I have found another place that charges $0.7 for each gram, the only problem is it is a remailer. You give him a service charge he places the order and it is sent directly from china to you. The prices are great and people have used him before, i'm just worried about customs. I don't want to lose my order or have someone knocking on my door. What do you guys think of using someone like that? Should I try it?

 

[kwantam]

Should I try it?

If you're not ordering a huge amount, you probably won't draw too much attention.

If you decide to do it, clean house first on the off-chance that you end up in a controlled delivery situation.

-kwantam

 

[snakebyte05]

If you're not ordering a huge amount, you probably won't draw too much attention.

If you decide to do it, clean house first on the off-chance that you end up in a controlled delivery situation.

-kwantam

What would be considered a large amount? If I ordered I would probably order around 100grams worth of stuff or more. NOt sure if that is large. Also get this, superdrol is now being sold else where. I saw they had it on the list for buying it in the grams. Not sure if it is legit, but I wouldn't know why it would not be. Just an interesting side not. They also have much more to choose form, I might post this list and get some feed back on what looks good to stack. Some of the stuff I have to look up to find out what the common name for it is, since I dont know all the scientific names.

 

[BigP0ppa3]

Not sure if it's ok to post that list, but I'd really like to take a look at it...

BP

 

[glenihan]

definitely not ok to post that list ....

snake i don't think 100g is a large order (its a tenth of a kilo) and if its packaged properly you should have nothing to worry about .. with that said make sure you have a clean house and if they make you sign for it refuse saying you have no idea who that person is and you don't even know anyone in china .. it must be a mistake

 

[snakebyte05]

definitely not ok to post that list ....

snake i don't think 100g is a large order (its a tenth of a kilo) and if its packaged properly you should have nothing to worry about .. with that said make sure you have a clean house and if they make you sign for it refuse saying you have no idea who that person is and you don't even know anyone in china .. it must be a mistake

Its not ok to post a list of compounds if there is no prices associated with them? How is that any different than just randomly posting a list and asking what you would suggest to use? I dont know what the problem would be as long as no names are mentioned/prices are mentioned. It is then purely me asking what compound you recomend? Its what most people do on here, they usually just post a few compounds and ask the difference.

As far as ordering. So clean the house, clear the computer. So I should not expect to need a signature? Not sure how it works since its from china? I would think since its that far signature would be required? But if you guys say it is not, then I will make sure I say it is not mine if they ask. So basically I should not worry to much over this, just clean everything and neve sign for anything. gotcha. The anavar on there is very cheap which is one reason I am thinking of doing it. Much cheaper than I have seen anywhere else. Also superdrol is VERY cheap, But I would feel bad not buying from DS since they did the work to get it, so that is most likely out of the question.

If I can post the list let me know and I will post only compound names. WEll I hope all goes well when I order in a month or so.

 

[exnihilo]

The whole point of a remailer is that they ship to you domestically...

70c a gram is a pretty good price, depending on the quality of the powder and the reputation of the supplier. I would definately pay a bit more for powders from someone I know is 100% legit like Jet Li or another people who's been around for a long time and has tons of positive feedback.

 

[glenihan]

ok i misunderstood .. when you said remailer i thought he would ship it domestically .. seems like this guy is just a middleman .. worthless... you should be able to get directly in touch with a supplier from china .. if its being sent internationally either way **** the middleman .. he's just charging you a fee for something you can do yourself .. a little more looking and i'm SURE you'll find a guy directly in china

as for the sig .. i don't know how they send it .. i don't order internationally

as for the list .. i just think its a good idea to keep the board clean of all that stuff in general .. it only brings trouble IMO

 

[size]

This thread is walking the line.

 

[snakebyte05]

This thread is walking the line.

I'll make sure not to go past it. :thumbsup:

Ok so I guess having him as the middle man is pointless, good prices, but like you guys said, I could probably find myself a house in china anyways. Back to searching for cheaper domestic powders. I gotta find more areas that have some people that offer these services. I want to make sure my rats get a good deal for them. They don't like over paying for their experiments.

 

[snakebyte05]

Well my brain is starting to hurt with all the searching for cheap domestic. All I can find is international people. I only know of one place that allows for those types of posts since all the other boards stopped doing it. My brain is starting to hurt. You really need to know the right people to be able to find new places, unless you want to be getting ripped off.

I found another international that will reship if seizure happens, which is a plus. They also do not take a charge for doing the transaction, just a flat rate shipping and then pay for your order (pretty cheap, not the cheapest, but cheaper than the one domestic). Well back to trying to search.

Anyone know if vipbb still is up? It says coming soon. Also how do you get in if you do not know anyone specific from there? If anyone here is a member there would you let me use you as a reference?

 

[glenihan]

bear in mind that price isn't the only factor you need to consider .. quality and safety are much more important

 

[snakebyte05]

this is very true. I have been thinking of going with the original guy a found. More expensive, but has lots of backing.

One thing I have been looking at is proviron at 75mg/day. Since I am taking a good size dosage of test, I was thinking this would be a good idea to stack with it since it helps free test levels go up by attaching to SHBG. I'm just not sure how proviron affects the hair. It is 1-methyl dht so I'm thinking it could take my hair away fast. I just do not see many reports of that happening. So would you guys think this would be a good idea to stack with the test to help raise free test and also gain some strength, while being alright on the hair? I would use nizoral 2% regardless 3 days a week. Thanks for any advice.

 

[exnihilo]

*shrug* you probably don't want to hear this but nothing beats tren. If you lose hair on gear and it doesn't grow back you would have lost it soon anyhow. Besides tren, I'd go with more test, maybe some EQ or nandrolone. Any of those will work, with tren being the most likely to cause hair loss and nandrolone being the least.