4-ad Injectable

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  1. Originally posted by BrKonman
    Heh, man I started a thread and missed out on talking in it for 26 replies :P That's what I get for posting and running...

    To Curt2go: Transdermal vs Inject of 4-ad is like taking two different anabolics, essentially.

    About being a pin-cushion: This is my only complaint, however I've read good posts regarding 4-ad-ec, which is esterfied and therefore might just prevent that twice daily stabbing.

    I'm hoping BDC will post on this soon, and possibly explain dosing schedules that don't involve multiple injects per day.
    The ONLY diff between pinning and transdermal is the amount that gets into the blood.... pinning 100%, transdermal 40-45%...

    The 4-ad-ec is esterfied for oral absorption. Not to sure if it would help with pinning. It just help to make sure the 4-ad makes it through the stomach into the intestines and out to the bloodstream.... Talk to ya...


  2. Dosent the suspension in oil allow for it to dissipate over the span of 2 days or so?

    If this were so, then eod injects could be possible.

    I know that this is the way that TNE from synovex is used by many people, but I could be wrong when it comes to 4AD.
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  3. Brock,

    I think you are on the right track. An ester and its length should extend the time for total breakdown. It should help 4AD with an ester injectable.

    But with orals, it is still pretty quick but not as quick as regular 4AD, I would think.

    I am sure BDC can help us.

  4. Originally posted by Brock Landers
    Dosent the suspension in oil allow for it to dissipate over the span of 2 days or so?
    It will be fine for EOD injects IF it were dissolved in the oil. Suspensions tend to leach pretty quickly even if it is an oil "suspension". I'm doing trials now to determine the best ingredients and ratios for the 4-AD inject. I plan on making a 10 20, 30 , etc. mg/mL preparation and see which is stable (and least painful). I am doing this for different ratios of medium/solvent/co-solvent systems. I will post the recipes and results within the next week or two (sorry, still just a bit behind and busy).

    Chemo

  5. Originally posted by curt2go


    Androsol ONLY used ISo as well....

    You guys are crazy. This is where the transdermals come in... Just rub on 1000mg/day. I garantee you will grow..... GARANTEED

    If you are going to pin something just do test. Just my opinion.. Talk to ya

    Thats not my stuff I cut and pasted from biotest web site to show Phil where people got the 95% from.

    I would gladly pin test right now or any other gear for that matter but I cant becuase I have been busted. If I was not I would not even think about using prohormones.
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  6. Originally posted by Big Daddy Chemo


    It will be fine for EOD injects IF it were dissolved in the oil. Suspensions tend to leach pretty quickly even if it is an oil "suspension". I'm doing trials now to determine the best ingredients and ratios for the 4-AD inject. I plan on making a 10 20, 30 , etc. mg/mL preparation and see which is stable (and least painful). I am doing this for different ratios of medium/solvent/co-solvent systems. I will post the recipes and results within the next week or two (sorry, still just a bit behind and busy).

    Chemo
    Just a lil' ol' BUMP for the Big guy. You've got curious people and it's been more than 2 weeks
  7. buuuuuummmmmpppp


    bump again for the big guy, cause i for one am eagerly awaiting.....soooooooo

     

    GET TO POSTING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  8. hey guys, i suppose this is slightly off-topic, but there are ways of getting around the whole injection idea, while still getting a very high percentage into ur bloodstream. intranasals, and sub-linguals for example. from what ive read, the absorption rate of a intranasal using the method described in dazed's article (mindandmuscle.com, issue 9) is between 90%-95%. its pretty easy to turn a steroid or prohormone into a cyclodextrin so that it is usable in a sub-lingual or intranasal. so basically, considering that 4-ad is about 95% as anabolic as test, and u would be getting between 90%-95% of what ur using, u would be able to get between 85%-91% of what test would give u, anabolicly speaking. so hypothetically, lets say u have been using 560 mg a week of test (im not too familiar with steroid dosages, so if this is way off from a normal dose, go ahead and correct me), well if u were to use about 640 mg of 4-ad intranasaly, or sub-lingually, u should be right in the neighborhood of the affects of the test, without a single injection. this is all theoretical of course, so dont hold me to any of this, but this should, in theory work just fine. sorry for rambling on, i just thought this might be of use to u guys.

  9. Originally posted by drfly
    hey guys, i suppose this is slightly off-topic, but there are ways of getting around the whole injection idea, while still getting a very high percentage into ur bloodstream. intranasals, and sub-linguals for example. from what ive read, the absorption rate of a intranasal using the method described in dazed's article (mindandmuscle.com, issue 9) is between 90%-95%. its pretty easy to turn a steroid or prohormone into a cyclodextrin so that it is usable in a sub-lingual or intranasal. so basically, considering that 4-ad is about 95% as anabolic as test, and u would be getting between 90%-95% of what ur using, u would be able to get between 85%-91% of what test would give u, anabolicly speaking. so hypothetically, lets say u have been using 560 mg a week of test (im not too familiar with steroid dosages, so if this is way off from a normal dose, go ahead and correct me), well if u were to use about 640 mg of 4-ad intranasaly, or sub-lingually, u should be right in the neighborhood of the affects of the test, without a single injection. this is all theoretical of course, so dont hold me to any of this, but this should, in theory work just fine. sorry for rambling on, i just thought this might be of use to u guys.
    There are a few things that you aren't taking into consideration:

    • Intranasal is GREAT for absorption but has a 25 mg per dose limit.  Refigure a weekly dose schedule and you get a whole lot of PH applications to your cavities.  For this reason, it is my recommendation to limit the use to pre-workout and not as a cycle base.
    • I firmly believe the notion that 4-AD has anabolic activity in its UNCONVERTED form.  It's hard to really estimate percent activity accurately but reports have it anywhere from 50-90%  I tend to go with the higher end of that scale...
    • The post by Dazed was GREAT!  It opened my eyes to the fact that I may have used a hard to complex cycledextrin and this the reason for my low yield.  The fact still remains that the method is untried...it would be better to verify we can actually perform the complexation before we start to plan the application.
    • If a workable recipe for a 4-AD can be established then 100% becomes the figure of reference.  In relation to intranasal application this is a leap from the rough guestimate of 90-95%.  For some, me included, the knowledge of EXACT doseages goes a long way for recording results and coorelations.


    Getting back to the recipe...

    I still haven't had time to work on the recipe.  I know I'm late on the ball but December is a big month for me and preparations began weeks ago.  I will slowly work on it a time is allowed but don't see any progress for at least another few weeks.  Sorry bros...

    Chemo

  10. Bump anything yet bro?

  11. I noticed kilosports now sells 4ad with an ester in powder form. This would probably be best used for anyone who wants to inject.

    Secondly, as far as the 15% conversion factor - I've seen this number thrown around by Bigcat and some others but, in the study, what transport method was used. If you're getting 100% absorbtion of the product, I would assume you would get a higher conversion rate since there would be more of it in your system, no?

    Or would the enzymes be saturated?

  12. DO you know where there are some good directions on how to convert it into an injectable?

  13. ok here ya go

    http://www.triedia.com/board/showthr...thread****21872

    checkout mr t's site as he now says he has a solvent for getting even winny in oil

  14. Wojo that was VERY helpful thanks.

  15. Originally posted by Chemo

    [*]I firmly believe the notion that 4-AD has anabolic activity in its UNCONVERTED form.  It's hard to really estimate percent activity accurately but reports have it anywhere from 50-90%  I tend to go with the higher end of that scale.
    Then 4-AD also has androgenic properties in its inconverted form, doesn't it? If so, it means that it's a very androgenic compound and you cannot use finasteride in order to stop that androgenity, am I right?

    Could you post some research which demonstrates that 4-AD similar potency to testosterone stems from INTRINSIC anabolic abilities and not from higher conversion enzymes in skeletal muscle?

  16. If I remember correctly the Vida data puts it at 120% as androgenic. The 15%-16% conversion was in vitro in human blood. I know PA has stated he believes total conversion is around 90% but if that is true it would mean 4-ad has intrinsic androgenic activity with next to zero intrinsic anabolic activity. I believe it has intrinsic anabolic activity.

  17. well it definetly works better as an injectable then it does with transdermal or oral. most ofthe guys who used mine gained on an average of about 7lean lbs in 2-3weeks while losing some fat. And now that I have my blend (Pro-Sust) done its much easier to get to the correct dose per week for max gains..
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