Blood work post cycle with SD and test prop...
- 03-28-2005, 06:46 PM
Blood work post cycle with SD and test prop...
I had blood work taken a week after I came off of test prop (500 mg/week), and 20 mg SD ED --- bear in mind that I was ON Formastat at the time. I took rebound the following week and don't have any data. Any takers on what my test and estrogen totals were? Ready? So much for this **** not being suppressive:
testosterone total --- 97; normal ranges (262-1593)
Estrogen Total --- 141; normal ranges (130 or less)
I will have more blood work taken this week to see what I am at now, 2 months later.
All other data came back favorable however. I will not be using formastat any longer for PCT.
- 03-28-2005, 06:51 PM
It should also be noted that I am not knocking sd. Tis the best oral I have used to date. Its just that this info about it not being suppressive is hogwash.
03-28-2005, 06:52 PM
I don't see how the results are surprising, since you were also on test-prop. Superdrol might not be tremendously suppressive, but that much test-prop will quickly convince your body to turn off the taps.
Great to see you share the results though. Thanks. I look forward to seeing the results from your use of Rebound.
03-28-2005, 06:54 PM
Indeed, I agree. However, others had said tho, and so I had postulated, that test prop, in that amount of time, would not shut you down that hard. All I am saying is that sd stacked with any test, in that about of time, will certainly shut you down hard.
I was more concerned that the formastat was so weak actually --- its supposed to kill estrogen if anything.
03-28-2005, 07:01 PM
Bro, i think your missing the point here. Taking any type of test is going to shut you down very quickly. To what degree the sd contributed is impossible to tell. The only way for blood work on this compound to really be of any worth (as far as suppression is concerned) is to use it alone.
03-28-2005, 07:21 PM
Again, I am not saying that it was the SD alone --- did you not read my last post? All I am saying is that SD, when taken with a test product, even in a relatively short amount of time, is gonna shut you down hard. Now that I have re-stated this twice, I hope I am being clear.Originally Posted by Sticks
Again, the most concerning portion is the increased estrogen despite taking formastat.
03-28-2005, 07:42 PM
I still don't see how these results tell us anything? That's like saying i took 20mg of var ED but i also took prop and now my t levels are low.Originally Posted by Lakevillethor
Far as formastat, I've never heard anything good about that stuff. Why did you risk losing some of your gains on an OTC product when we all know clomid/nolva are the best in restoring T-levels and blocking E?
03-28-2005, 07:48 PM
Well, I have nolva but have been concerend about the liver toxicity/cancer thing since it has been brought up time and time again.
I really didn't risk a whole lot. Despite that drop in test levels, this was still my most successfull cycle to date as I have maintaind the majoirty of my gains. Additionally, I used rebound for the weeks after the test and had good results with it...
It tell us simply this, test prop + SD, even when used for 3 weeks, is gonna shut you down. While you may look and say "of course" after the fact, it has often been said that shorter cycles of some androgens may not shut you down hard --- this data begs to differ.
03-28-2005, 08:16 PM
Lake are you not reading what people are posting?
Test prop and koolaid will shut you down YES YES YES even in just 3 weeks.
Heck it will start shuting you down in a couple days, so your test results mean nothing.
I have NO idea if SD shuts you down or not and do not care, as I will not be using it, but once again your test results tell us nothing about SD.
03-28-2005, 09:20 PM
Originally Posted by CROWLER
Agreed. If you had come back and said, "Guys, my t-levels are 97 and all was taking was SD for 3 weeks." Then everbody would be saying SD is very surpressive. But taking it with Test prop totally negates your statement Lake.
03-28-2005, 10:34 PM
What statement?Originally Posted by LCSULLA
Maybe I am having trouble articulating myself. No wait --- let me re-read every post I have made thus far --- there it is ---quite clearly written for the 1st graders in the back.
For the last ****ing time (I'll just copy it this time):
Again, I am not saying that it was the SD alone --- did you not read my last post? All I am saying is that SD, when taken with a test product, even in a relatively short amount of time, is gonna shut you down hard.
I am not trying to be an ass here --- just trying to show that my last cycle was suppressive. THIS DATA DOES NOT REVEAL ANYTHING ABOUT SD REGARDING HOW MUCH HPTA SUPPRESSION OCCURS.
The main issue here is that many folks believe that shorter cycles are worth it as the suppression is less. The data suggests otherwise. The real question I am left with is this:
When pondering cycle length and HPTA suppression, what is more important to keep in mind --- the length of time ON, or the doses being used? For example, in everyone's opinion, will you have an easier time restoring HPTA after a 10 week cycle of an androgen or a 5 week cycle of an androgen (assuming same dose)? Or will the recovery time be the same?
Maybe I am just an ignorant fool but no one has ever came up witha good, scientific explanation about this. If it is so damn obvious, then why do I hear about all these dumb asses who still use 2 week cycles of known suppressive androgens. If it's gonna be suppressive, AND EVERYONE EXCEPT ME OBVIOUSLY KNOWS THIS --- a point that has been made quite clear by the responses thus far --- why would this ever be a good idea?
03-28-2005, 11:07 PM
I agree with you regarding short cycles being just as suppressive. Seems to work like that with everything. I mean, hell. Take Trimax for a month and 45 days later your T3 levels are back to normal. Take T3 for 20 years and maybe you have to wait 120 days.
I know guys who are on 5+ grams of Test for years on end and come off and still have kids....
I think the importnat thing is just coming off occassionally and allowing natural levels to restore themselves.
But, that's my .02.
Anyway, I think it was this quote that people are responding toIts just that this info about it not being suppressive is hogwash.
I know, I know....u said it's not from the SD alone. But, empirical evidence does suggest that SD "solo" is not very suppressive.
03-28-2005, 11:14 PM
Drop the attitude or find somewhere new. People are simply commenting based on what you wrote as quoted above. It seems to me that you are implying superdrol as the culprit.Originally Posted by Lakevillethor
Anyone who does not expect HPTA suppression is foolish. I think most people have finally come to the realization that HPTA suppression occurs and it happens fast.
03-28-2005, 11:21 PM
Originally Posted by Lakevillethor
OHhhhhhhhhhhh Ok NOW I understand. When SD is taken with a test product even in a relatively short amount of time, it is gonna shut you down hard.
Let's try and ease the tension here with ****ing and calling people 1st graders
I will go one better and say When protein powder is taken with a test product even in a relatively short amount of time, it is gonna shut you down.
So let's see what we can learn from this. even short cycles of test will shut you down no matter WHAT you take with it, except maybe HCG.
WOW the things you learn
03-28-2005, 11:23 PM
Uh-oh....I sense an e-fight coming up here
edit: I'm outta here...I've seen Lakevillthor's pressing numbers. LOL
03-28-2005, 11:25 PM
03-29-2005, 01:19 AM
I got edited becasue I was insulting someone that was attempting to try to help.. (edited my Matthew D)Originally Posted by CROWLER
03-29-2005, 01:21 AM
I am not trying to start **** here --- I just would like to know about the length of time cycles versus HPTA suppression. If anyone has any data on this, please feel free to respond --- this is the direction I was hoping to take this thread...Originally Posted by size
03-29-2005, 01:28 AM
Thor stop the ****, you have managed to insult 2 members I just read... and size told you and now I am telling you..
As for your question, I don't think anyone will have any hard data on it.. that is current...
03-29-2005, 01:41 AM
LOL! This thread is just great. Thanks for laugh.
Oh, and I just got some blood work back. I've been on a diet of tuna melts and test prop, and I'm totally shutdown. Goddamn tuna melts.
Seriously Thor, I hope you're on anti-E at this point and not just thinking about how to proceed. If I can take a wild stab at your question, I'd bet your test drops off quickly in the first few weeks of a cycle and then continues to taper down slowly after that, y=1/x. That would explain why some think short cycles can almost as suppressive as long ones.
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