Preventing lethargicy

[hockeytown88]

About 2 months ago I started the spawn stack from Olympus labs. The one with epistane, tren, and stanobol. I had to stop within 2 weeks because I was too lathargic between working and school and the gym. I do want to run a cycle, currently cutting. I think I read somewhere on here that stanodrol can be used as a test base to help with this... Do you think if I did Epi and stanodrol it would minimize the effect. Other than the lathargicy I was liking that spawn stack. Strength went up immeditely, muscls got harder and started putting on mass within the first week. Ideas anyone? Thanks

 

[mixedup]

Do their tren and a stano of your choice very nice cutter I've used multiple times I don't know your experience level but something like 60trn/600 stano or if more experienced 90/800 can treat you very nice

 

[booneman77]

You need a test base to help prevent the lethargy you're experiencing. Stano as suggest will work. Trest is another option. Obviously real test. Dermacrine can work for a light cycle (prob not enough for the stack you have).

 

[dbrock504]

Did you experience any issues with the nipples? I'm about to run epi and tren

 

[Misfit28]

You need a test base to help prevent the lethargy you're experiencing. Stano as suggest will work. Trest is another option. Obviously real test. Dermacrine can work for a light cycle (prob not enough for the stack you have).

These are all good suggestions.

 

[booneman77]

Did you experience any issues with the nipples? I'm about to run epi and tren

People more commonly experience rebound issues with epi rather then on-cycle. Tren can cause prolactin related issues but with a normal dose ph these are less common. Something like inhibit-p or prolactrone should be plenty to cover you. If you want to have ultimate peace of mind, get prami.

For the epi, just make sure to have a suicidal ai in your pct. arimistane or formestane will suffice, aromasin if you feel worried.

 

[Misfit28]

People more commonly experience rebound issues with epi rather then on-cycle. Tren can cause prolactin related issues but with a normal dose ph these are less common. Something like inhibit-p or prolactrone should be plenty to cover you. If you want to have ultimate peace of mind, get prami.

For the epi, just make sure to have a suicidal ai in your pct. arimistane or formestane will suffice, aromasin if you feel worried.

The upcoming Elimistane will be an awesome AI addition

 

[booneman77]

The upcoming Elimistane will be an awesome AI addition

the cortisol control would be a nice addition as well. solid looking formula.

 

[Abe Lincoln]

Dermacrine + stano IMO would be the best, but trest alone or legit test would be better at combating lethargy.

 

[dbrock504]

People more commonly experience rebound issues with epi rather then on-cycle. Tren can cause prolactin related issues but with a normal dose ph these are less common. Something like inhibit-p or prolactrone should be plenty to cover you. If you want to have ultimate peace of mind, get prami. For the epi, just make sure to have a suicidal ai in your pct. arimistane or formestane will suffice, aromasin if you feel worried.

Thanks for the response. That's what I've been seeing. I have the Inhibit-P and the AI I have is Formabolic. So I shouldn't get Stano and run that next to the epi?

 

[booneman77]

Thanks for the response. That's what I've been seeing. I have the Inhibit-P and the AI I have is Formabolic. So I shouldn't get Stano and run that next to the epi?

I personally would suggest trest and epi. It's basically a perfect complimentary cycle as trest will cover the test base, and epi will help with the aromatization of the trest. You'll be strong, hard, and lean as all hell. Just be VERY careful of rebound estro and make sure you have a solid ai to run maybe lightly on cycle and definitely in pct.

 

[dbrock504]

I personally would suggest trest and epi. It's basically a perfect complimentary cycle as trest will cover the test base, and epi will help with the aromatization of the trest. You'll be strong, hard, and lean as all hell. Just be VERY careful of rebound estro and make sure you have a solid ai to run maybe lightly on cycle and definitely in pct.

Ok great thanks for the tips. And yes I am very cautious on my pct for the rebound. I might run my nolva for a couple weeks extra just incase...

 

[booneman77]

Ok great thanks for the tips. And yes I am very cautious on my pct for the rebound. I might run my nolva for a couple weeks extra just incase...

Don't count on Nolva. It's not an ai. It does work on the estro receptors but it doesn't effect aromatization. Get an actual ai.

 

[hockeytown88]

Do their tren and a stano of your choice very nice cutter I've used multiple times I don't know your experience level but something like 60trn/600 stano or if more experienced 90/800 can treat you very nice

I've ran tren and epi stack before, I hurt my arm and never finished it. Do you think tren epi and santo would be good, or would epi be overkill?

 

[booneman77]

I've ran tren and epi stack before, I hurt my arm and never finished it. Do you think tren epi and santo would be good, or would epi be overkill?

I'd do tren or epi. They'll have similar effects as far as strength and body comp but tren should give you somewhat better gains assuming diet/training is correct. If this is your first full cycle, I'd pick one or the other and a test base. Otherwise you'll never know what caused sides or what gave the best effects. Start small and build up as you learn from each cycle.

 

[specmike]

A light dose of drug store ephedrine helps with the lethargy also.

 

[booneman77]

A light dose of drug store ephedrine helps with the lethargy also.

I feel like this would be a very short term (a couple hrs at most) solution tho. And one that you'd have to repeat almost around the clock

 

[hockeytown88]

Thanks, I think I'm gonna go with tren + stano. Ever use LGI Stano-200?

 

[specmike]

I feel like this would be a very short term (a couple hrs at most) solution tho. And one that you'd have to repeat almost around the clock

True, it's a small bump but it definitely helps knock the edge off for me, especially during work hours. I'd do this as opposed to stopping or never even starting a cycle.

 

[booneman77]

True, it's a small bump but it definitely helps knock the edge off for me, especially during work hours. I'd do this as opposed to stopping or never even starting a cycle.

I feel like this could potentially be very dangerous for bp reasons tho while on cycle.

 

[specmike]

Never heard of it causing any issues but monitoring BP is a good idea. It's not going to have any greater effect on BP than your average pre-workout product.

 

[booneman77]

Never heard of it causing any issues but monitoring BP is a good idea. It's not going to have any greater effect on BP than your average pre-workout product.

It def will. Ephedrine is much stronger then most common stims. I'd be very cautious with this especially if you already have higher then normal bp from your cycle

 

[specmike]

That's why I said drug store ephedrine. You can tailor your dose easily as the products (Bronkaid et al) come in 12.5mg and 25mg doses. They are easily broken to 1/2s or 1/3s. Add aspirin if desired.

 

[booneman77]

That's why I said drug store ephedrine. You can tailor your dose easily as the products (Bronkaid et al) come in 12.5mg and 25mg doses. They are easily broken to 1/2s or 1/3s. Add aspirin if desired.

I still can't think this is a better alternative then just a test base. More gains, less sides, more other healthy functions (libido, etc)... Seems like a no brainer to me

 

[specmike]

I still can't think this is a better alternative then just a test base. More gains, less sides, more other healthy functions (libido, etc)... Seems like a no brainer to me

I definitely do NOT think it's a better option. The test base is essential regardless of lethargy issues.

But, I've seen users complaining in the past about having a good test base and still having lethargy issues that said mild stims helped them out. I've had it myself and it was at its worst, during the daytime, after lunch. The morning coffee and as little as 1/2 of a 12.5mg Bronkaid did wonders. BP most times for me was at or about 130/80. But, I do tolerate stimulants very well.

 

[booneman77]

I definitely do NOT think it's a better option. The test base is essential regardless of lethargy issues. But, I've seen users complaining in the past about having a good test base and still having lethargy issues that said mild stims helped them out. I've had it myself and it was at its worst, during the daytime, after lunch. The morning coffee and as little as 1/2 of a 12.5mg Bronkaid did wonders. BP most times for me was at or about 130/80. But, I do tolerate stimulants very well.

Well said. Were on the same page.

 

[hockeytown88]

I guess it just depends on the individual. Better to be safe than sorry, but if you monitor your BP and keep it in a safe range, then id say go for it. Me personally, even when on cycle, i drank energy drinks, pre workouts. Most of it doesn't effect me, my body adapts to all that stuff very quickly. Even fat burners, Ill feel the effect for one maybe two days, then i don't feel them do anything for me. Just be safe guys.

 

[booneman77]

I guess it just depends on the individual. Better to be safe than sorry, but if you monitor your BP and keep it in a safe range, then id say go for it. Me personally, even when on cycle, i drank energy drinks, pre workouts. Most of it doesn't effect me, my body adapts to all that stuff very quickly. Even fat burners, Ill feel the effect for one maybe two days, then i don't feel them do anything for me. Just be safe guys.

You can't go by just feel tho. High bp can feel totally normal and be nearly fatal levels.

I agree that there's def plenty of times and people who can deal with compounds ands stims with no issues at all but other people could have a huge bp spike and not know until it's too late. You should be checking bp almost daily while on anyways but especially if you're using stims too.

 

[hockeytown88]

You can't go by just feel tho. High bp can feel totally normal and be nearly fatal levels
I agree that there's def plenty of times and people who can deal with compounds ands stims with no issues at all but other people could have a huge bp spike and not know until it's too late. You should be checking bp almost daily while on anyways but especially if you're using stims too.

Very true

 

[dbrock504]

Don't count on Nolva. It's not an ai. It does work on the estro receptors but it doesn't effect aromatization. Get an actual ai.

I said I have Formabolic bud. It's a Formestane made by IronFlex. I realize nolva isn't an AI. It's a SERM.

 

[booneman77]

I said I have Formabolic bud. It's a Formestane made by IronFlex. I realize nolva isn't an AI. It's a SERM.

Sorry thats not how I meant it. I thought from your post that your reason for running Nolva longer was to help with the rebound. Just making sure you weren't confusing the two. It's been pretty common around here lately that people seem to think Nolva will prevent any estro issues. Just trying to save some bros from growing boobies

 

[dbrock504]

Sorry thats not how I meant it. I thought from your post that your reason for running Nolva longer was to help with the rebound. Just making sure you weren't confusing the two. It's been pretty common around here lately that people seem to think Nolva will prevent any estro issues. Just trying to save some bros from growing boobies

Lol I totally hear you my man. Thanks for the advice. Don't want the boobies. Well, I do, but on my wife only! Haha

 

[Loneyboy]

Trest is great, but definitely get Inhibit P. Running Transform right now, but my nips have been flaring real hard despite it.

 

[reps4jesus]

Trest is great, but definitely get Inhibit P. Running Transform right now, but my nips have been flaring real hard despite it.

Inhibit p is great for prolactin control

 

[Loneyboy]

Inhibit p is great for prolactin control

definitely picking some up if i run trest again. isn't former on supposed to be very effective at controlling gyno as well, though? i was just surprised at how aggressive the flare ups were after reading everything I had.

 

[booneman77]

Trest is great, but definitely get Inhibit P. Running Transform right now, but my nips have been flaring real hard despite it.

why would you want/need inhibit-p while running trest?

 

[Loneyboy]

why would you want/need inhibit-p while running trest?

To control prolactin, one of the main hormones causing gyno.

 

[Blergs]

About 2 months ago I started the spawn stack from Olympus labs. The one with epistane, tren, and stanobol. I had to stop within 2 weeks because I was too lathargic between working and school and the gym. I do want to run a cycle, currently cutting. I think I read somewhere on here that stanodrol can be used as a test base to help with this... Do you think if I did Epi and stanodrol it would minimize the effect. Other than the lathargicy I was liking that spawn stack. Strength went up immeditely, muscls got harder and started putting on mass within the first week. Ideas anyone? Thanks

simple dont run oral only cycles and never without a testosterone base....

 

[srblan]

Dermacrine + stano IMO would be the best, but trest alone or legit test would be better at combating lethargy.

I have had much less lethargy with trest than I did with dermacrine and stano, but I suppose YMMV.

 

[srblan]

A light dose of drug store ephedrine helps with the lethargy also.

Your heart will HATE you for that. Blood pressure is hard to control on cycle and ephedrine will make that worse. With tren, you are going to be sweating like a madman

 

[srblan]

I feel like this could potentially be very dangerous for bp reasons tho while on cycle.

Bingo

 

[Abe Lincoln]

I have had much less lethargy with trest than I did with dermacrine and stano, but I suppose YMMV.

Trest is a stronger compound, but like I said if you aren't looking to deal with AI and such, stano and dermacrine

 

[srblan]

To control prolactin, one of the main hormones causing gyno.

Control estrogen and you will control most of the prolactin issues. I haven't really had a need for inhibit-p with trest, personally. I rotate between topical formestane and erase/arimistane (my joints don't like too much erase).

 

[specmike]

Your heart will HATE you for that. Blood pressure is hard to control on cycle and ephedrine will make that worse. With tren, you are going to be sweating like a madman

I don't see it being nearly as harsh as people who use clen on cycle. We're talking about a very small daily dose, not a kilo ;-)

 

[booneman77]

To control prolactin, one of the main hormones causing gyno.

Prolactin can potentially cause a form of gyno but it's fairly rare. And trest doesn't cause prolactin related issues so I can't see this really being necessary at all. Estro is the main cause of gyno and that's the issue with trest. You need and ai not prolactin control.

 

[Loneyboy]

Control estrogen and you will control most of the prolactin issues. I haven't really had a need for inhibit-p with trest, personally. I rotate between topical formestane and erase/arimistane (my joints don't like too much erase).

I have found the opposite. I dosed transform throughout my last cycle and it didn't protect me from gyno. I have pea-sized lumps under both nips now. better to be safe than sorry. next time i run trest i will be running inhibit-p alongside.

 

[booneman77]

I have found the opposite. I dosed transform throughout my last cycle and it didn't protect me from gyno. I have pea-sized lumps under both nips now. better to be safe than sorry. next time i run trest i will be running inhibit-p alongside.

It's probably more that form wasn't strong enough. The chances and ability to develop gyno from prolactin related issues especially on a compound that doesn't have any is near impossible.

 

[Loneyboy]

It's probably more that form wasn't strong enough. The chances and ability to develop gyno from prolactin related issues especially on a compound that doesn't have any is near impossible.

ran up to 250mg a day. near impossible or not, it happened. it was DMZ and Trest, if that makes a difference.

 

[specmike]

. it was DMZ and Trest, if that makes a difference.

Wow, that sounds liver lethal. I hope you protected yourself well.

 

[booneman77]

ran up to 250mg a day. near impossible or not, it happened. it was DMZ and Trest, if that makes a difference.

I don't think form is nearly sstrong enough for that cycle... it def sounds like you had estro issues that just werent contained by form alone.

Gyno is estro related 99% of the time and even the 1% of prolactin related can usually be controlled by keeping estro in check.