PH/DS Without Test

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    PH/DS Without Test


    Hi guys,

    I am intrigued by the widely varying opinions on running an PH/DS cycle without the use of a "real" test base. It seems unanimously agreed upon that it is always better to run test with any cycle, if at all possible. For many though this is not an option so instead substitutes are used to combat low test on-cycle like DHT PH's, stuff like Dermacrine and people have even suggested running Ostarine as a sort of test base. I guess my main question would be, what is the best substitute for a cycle when test is not available? Also, what are the main issues when test is not used on cycle and how to combat them?

    I haven't seen a consolidated post in a while where this topic was discussed and I'd love to hear PA's opinion on this as well. Thanks guys and I look forward to learning stuff

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    i can tell you this, ostarine definitely is not a test replacement. i cant see how farhter away from the natural hormone u can get
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    Pat,

    Thanks for the response. Do you think there is any validity to claim that Ostarine helps with joint repair?
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackswift View Post
    Pat,Thanks for the response. Do you think there is any validity to claim that Ostarine helps with joint repair?
    all anabolics have that potential
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    I could be wrong but I think it's more so with the progesterone based hormones, I.e. Deca. I forgot the theory behind it though
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    Pat, do you think there is any legal compound nowadays that can effectively mimmick a test base?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madevilz View Post
    Pat, do you think there is any legal compound nowadays that can effectively mimmick a test base?

    what are the crtieria that you are looking for specifically
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    what are the crtieria that you are looking for specifically
    mostly to counter the negative effect on libido/lethargy
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    Things that are commonly recommended:

    Stano - pro-DHT.
    4-DHEA - 2 step conversion to test
    Dermacrine - As you mentioned, topical DHEA & rezveratrol

    Maybe Trestobol ? - Pat, what are your thoughts on this one in regard to the OP's concerns
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madevilz View Post
    mostly to counter the negative effect on libido/lethargy
    testosterone is not going to do a damn thing for the lethargy you get from the more powerful steroids

    i am not entirely sure what it is about testosterone that makes it best for libido. probably has something to do with targeted metabolism in areas of the brain. the only thing i can think of offhand that would share some of the same propensity for this metabolism would be methyltestosterone or any testosterone precursor
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    Quote Originally Posted by jerrysiii View Post
    Things that are commonly recommended:

    Stano - pro-DHT.
    4-DHEA - 2 step conversion to test
    Dermacrine - As you mentioned, topical DHEA & rezveratrol

    Maybe Trestobol ? - Pat, what are your thoughts on this one in regard to the OP's concerns
    is trestobol the 7alpha stuff?

    that would aromatize which might help libido. however it is also quite suppressive and i dunno if that is great for libido. frankly we dont know enough about the mechanisms behind aas and libido
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    testosterone is not going to do a damn thing for the lethargy you get from the more powerful steroids

    i am not entirely sure what it is about testosterone that makes it best for libido. probably has something to do with targeted metabolism in areas of the brain. the only thing i can think of offhand that would share some of the same propensity for this metabolism would be methyltestosterone or any testosterone precursor
    So, the only legal thing would be 4-DHEA. Unless Im unaware of another compound that converts to Testosterone.
    Thanks for chiming in Pat!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madevilz View Post
    So, the only legal thing would be 4-DHEA. Unless Im unaware of another compound that converts to Testosterone.
    Thanks for chiming in Pat!
    cholesterol

    ha!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Arnold View Post
    cholesterol

    ha!
    brb 12 egg yolks a day
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