Hair Loss Prevention - AnabolicMinds.com - Page 8

Hair Loss Prevention

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  1. Elite Member
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    Well guys - thanks to Shock133's post piquing my interest in LLLT and travbedaman's link, I am going to go ahead and build my own 'laser brush' unit. Im pretty handy with a soldering iron, so it should be a fun project...

    Ill keep this thread updated with progress pics, etc. Most of the reviews Ive read concerning laser therapy are surprisingly positive - looking forward to trying it out.

    BV

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    I have started using Xandrox 5, a laser comb and Nano shampoo/conditioner about 2 weeks ago and have seen great improvements.
    I did a search and Nano hasn't been mentioned until now. Has anyone else used it? (Or Nisim?) Thanks.
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    Good luck with your project BigVrunga!!
    Sounds fun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrgg
    I did a search and Nano hasn't been mentioned until now. Has anyone else used it? (Or Nisim?) Thanks.
    Just me I guess. I read some research on different shampoos and Nano was the only one that had regrown hair. I have used Nioxin and that stuff is awesome too. I'm not sure about regrowth from it but it definitely makes your hair healthy and quite a bit thicker.
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    Shock where are you getting your Nano?
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    Shock where are you getting your Nano?
    I purchased the Nano shampoo and conditioner from www.drproctor.com

    I don't know if that's the only site selling it or if it's the cheapest but that's where I purchased it.
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    ive read that Azelaic acid is the best dht inhibitor with no side effects penetrating into the skin. I dont know how true this is but it looks promising.

    im doing my first superdol cycle real soon. I am wondering if Azelaic acid should be effective in blocking dht , stop sheddign if it is a cuprit because at first research superdrol didnt cause thing, but now i see a couple people who say theyve done a superdrol cycle that could have caused some thinning. Im not leaving this one up the chance boys.

    Bv, Shock and others please comment
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    smeton - AFIK, hairloss from superdrol could come from DHT or another androgenic metabolite...its such a new compound I dont think anyone really knows for sure.

    With this in mind, your best bet is a combination of AA and an general androgen blocker like Spiro or Fluridil.

    You also might want to give the laser comb a try...I didnt believe it myself at first but after reading numerous reports of positive user feedback I have to try this for myself! The link above is where Shock133 got his 'laser brush' - you can get one fully assembled for ~$100 or buy the kit and build it yourself for about $80. Ill be ordering most of the components today for mine - looks like you can build one yourself if you shop around for the most inexpensive components for around $40.

    The Nano shampoo that Shock mentioned also looks very promising as well.

    If you're already thinning or know for sure your genetically prone to MBP - best to attack the issue of prevention from every conceivable angle.

    BV
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    BTW - I had mentioned a few posts above that I experienced thinning after using WHP.com's minoxidil/aa product. Its still to early to tell - but Im leaning toward it being an actual increasing in minoxidil dosage.

    I experienced some shedding for about 2-3 weeks after starting the WHP solution. Now, I can actually grab a fistful of hairs on my head and yank on them *hard* and I'll only lose like 2-3 hairs. More evidence that an increase in the amount if minox getting to my scalp could have caused temporary shedding.

    We'll see over the next few weeks...

    BV
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    Ok guys so I just purchaed 6 650nm, 5mW, 3VDC laser diodes off Ebay for $26.50, shipped. I have a universal AC/DC power adapter at home, and the remainder of the parts (wires, brush, connectors, etc) should cost about $10 or so from Radio Shack.

    Looks like you can build a 6-laser laser comb yourself for about $50, and that's if you have to buy a power adapter (3-12v Universal AC/DC adapters go for around $14.00 shipped on Ebay).

    The 6 diode comb on www.amazinglasercomb.com sells for $130. That's still a great price if you dont want to go through the hassle of building it, especially considering the HairMax laser comb sells for $700 new.

    Pics and schematics to follow...

    BV
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    Bv,

    does AA or Minoxidil cause shedding at first?

    let us know how well the haircomb works .


    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    BTW - I had mentioned a few posts above that I experienced thinning after using WHP.com's minoxidil/aa product. Its still to early to tell - but Im leaning toward it being an actual increasing in minoxidil dosage.

    I experienced some shedding for about 2-3 weeks after starting the WHP solution. Now, I can actually grab a fistful of hairs on my head and yank on them *hard* and I'll only lose like 2-3 hairs. More evidence that an increase in the amount if minox getting to my scalp could have caused temporary shedding.

    We'll see over the next few weeks...

    BV
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    Why do some of you think that azelaic acid (AA) inhibits 5 alpha-reductase (5aR) in the hair follicle? The only study showing any effect of AA on 5aR was the in vitro study by Samatiadis et al.[1], which was published in the British Dermatology in 1988. That was nearly twenty-years ago, and the results have never been repeated in vivo.

    Furthermore, AA has not been shown to reduce sebum production (a strong marker of local androgen activity), despite its extensive use in acne. I think it's very unlikely that AA is an effective inhibitor of 5aR in the hair follicle, but not in the sebaceous glands.

    1. Stamatiadis, D., M. C. Bulteau-Portois, et al. (1988). "Inhibition of 5 alpha-reductase activity in human skin by zinc and azelaic acid." British Journal of Dermatology 119(5): 627-32.
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    Why do some of you think that azelaic acid (AA) inhibits 5 alpha-reductase (5aR) in the hair follicle? The only study showing any effect of AA on 5aR was the in vitro study by Samatiadis et al.[1], which was published in the British Dermatology in 1988. That was nearly twenty-years ago, and the results have never been repeated in vivo.

    Furthermore, AA has not been shown to reduce sebum production (a strong marker of local androgen activity), despite its extensive use in acne. I think it's very unlikely that AA is an effective inhibitor of 5aR in the hair follicle, but not in the sebaceous glands.
    I dont know bro - seems to work pretty well for a lot of people.

    BV
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    Ok guys so I just purchaed 6 650nm, 5mW, 3VDC laser diodes off Ebay for $26.50, shipped. I have a universal AC/DC power adapter at home, and the remainder of the parts (wires, brush, connectors, etc) should cost about $10 or so from Radio Shack.

    Looks like you can build a 6-laser laser comb yourself for about $50, and that's if you have to buy a power adapter (3-12v Universal AC/DC adapters go for around $14.00 shipped on Ebay).

    The 6 diode comb on www.amazinglasercomb.com sells for $130. That's still a great price if you dont want to go through the hassle of building it, especially considering the HairMax laser comb sells for $700 new.

    Pics and schematics to follow...

    BV
    BV keep us updated on the comb. I was thinking about just buying some AA and spiro, but the comb sounds pretty intriguing. I'm definately interested.

    How often do you use the comb and for how long? I guess i should ask what is your regimen using the comb??
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigVrunga
    I dont know bro - seems to work pretty well for a lot of people.
    I'm not quite sure what you mean. There haven't been any controlled trials of azelaic acid in the treatment of androgenetic alopecia (AGA). I would strongly caution against assigning any value to anecdotal reports, especially when they concern a process such as AGA, which naturally progresses very slowly and unpredictably. Please don't make me list the problems with doing so.
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    smeton_yea:

    My experience shows that the AA is responsible for the shedding; I only experienced the shedding after applying AA. When I was ran out of AA on a couple occasions, just applying Minoxidil and/or shampooing with Nizoral (the other two weapons in my arsenal) did NOT result in shedding.
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    10-15 minutes 2x per week is what's suggested. When I first read about LLLT, I was very skeptical. However, Shock133's posts and general research got me started thinking otherwise.

    I plan on using the comb along with topical Minoxidil/AA/Retin-A/Regrowth Treatment Shampoo (Nizoral + Salycilic acid) and Nano shampoo. Im keeping Finasteride as an option, but dont want to use it unless I feel I have to.

    I have a heck of a lot more hair on my head than my Dad did at my age, but you can tell its thinner in some spots if you look close enough. My goal (and isnt everybody's) to have a thick head of hair with no signs whatsoever of MPB.

    BV
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    So, the Nano shampoo is like minox? Once you start using it you can't really stop right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grifter
    So, the Nano shampoo is like minox? Once you start using it you can't really stop right?
    It's America. You can stop anything if you choose. Now in Germany, in the late 30's and early 40's you may actually be required to use Nano for the rest of your life.
  20. Elite Member
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    I'm not quite sure what you mean. There haven't been any controlled trials of azelaic acid in the treatment of androgenetic alopecia (AGA). I would strongly caution against assigning any value to anecdotal reports, especially when they concern a process such as AGA, which naturally progresses very slowly and unpredictably. Please don't make me list the problems with doing so.
    I know that there arent any clinical trials proving the efficacy of AA in the treatment of AGA. I also know that since Ive been using AA/Minoxidil products Ive regrown a good bit of hair. Maybe this was due only to the effects Minoxidil. Perhaps everyone who has shown positive results with an azelaic acid/minoxidil combo is mistaken and is just wasting their money.

    Maybe, when someone is losing their hair they'll try anything that shows promise and has worked well for other people. And yes, I have relied on anecdotal evidence when it comes to trying to reverse my genetic AGA. As long as I keep seeing my hair get thicker, I will continue to do so.

    If you'd like to list the problems that accompany this less-than-scientific approach please, feel free. Meanwhile, I will keep researching any and all affordable solutions that show promise when it comes to slowing down/halting/reversing this piece of **** genetic affliction that 50% of the male population has to deal with at some point in their lives.

    So, the Nano shampoo is like minox? Once you start using it you can't really stop right?
    I don't know, I hadn't heard of it until Shock mentioned it in his post. AFIK, Nano 'may' help to regrow hair. Might be worth trying, its not very expensive.

    BV
    Last edited by BigVrunga; 09-09-2005 at 01:34 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grifter
    So, the Nano shampoo is like minox? Once you start using it you can't really stop right?
    which products are recommended to continue using after you start?

    is AA

    is minox

    is spiro

    is nizoral

    ...i mean could one just use AA and minox for a cycle of Superdrol and then discontinue use after the person thinks/feels its necessary.
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    Yeah, you can stop. You can stop minox, too. But your loss is going to start back up again.

    (Well, technically, minox just encourages growth. It really doesn't do much to halt the process of hairloss.)
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    which products are recommended to continue using after you start?

    is AA

    is minox

    is spiro

    is nizoral
    Minox is the only one that you should stay on, or you'll use the hair that it encouraged to regrow. Spiro,Nizoral, AA are all DHT and/or androgen blockers. They dont encourage regrowth. Theoretically, they would inhibit androgen at the scalp and thus prevent shedding or possibly allowing your hair to regrow naturally if you started early enough, or got real lucky

    BV
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    I know people shed normally and regrow it, what is considered normal amount of shedding per day? I recall noticing a few strands of hair after rinsing through my head in the shower before it got bad, I guess that is normal right?

    Last year I tried prohormones for the first time and after the cycle noticed myself shedding a lot to the point that when I didn't wear something covering my shoulders I could feel the hair drop down on it all day, that and a hell of a lot of hair in my hand when showering. That I know is not normal. I used spiro 5% from customs on my hairlines and crown, along with Nizoral 2% EOD. After a month it stopped and went back to normal. I was very happy and continued for another month or so. Then I stopped using it and I didn't notice shedding so all was good until well 5-6 months later. It started up again out of nowhere, haven't touched prohormones/supplements or even worked out since then. (Hair loss, fat gain, and other stuff kind of derailed me from lifting for a short period) Anyways it was when I started to come back to working out again that I noticed it, so I started to use the spiro and nizoral again. It hasn't stopped my hair shedding, but I am only losing like 5 or so a day from what I can count when applying the spiro and showers. I think its back to normal. What do you guys think?
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    I know people shed normally and regrow it, what is considered normal amount of shedding per day? I recall noticing a few strands of hair after rinsing through my head in the shower before it got bad, I guess that is normal right?
    Some studies say 100 - 150 hairs a day is normal, others as low as 35-40. I'd venture to guess it will be different for everyone, and that generally 35-75 hairs a day would be a safe 'normal' range. 100+ does seem a bit high.

    When you shampooing your hair its perfectly normal to notice a few strands of hair in your hands. If your hair is in a 'shedding' phase you'd see a little more, other times a little less or none at all. The hair on your head is in a constant cycle of shedding and regrowing. Its when those shedding cycles become longer and the regrowth cycles become shorter and eventually cease that your start noticing your hair thinning out.

    If you grab about 100 hairs between your fingers and give them a firm tug, 3-7 hairs coming loose is considered 'normal'. A handful of hair is most definitely cause for concern.

    Then I stopped using it and I didn't notice shedding so all was good until well 5-6 months later.
    The hormones in your body can take months to completely normalize after a cycle of anabolic drugs. You are obviously prone to MPB genetically, hair starting to shed 5-6 months later could just be the natural progression of your genetic hair loss. Unfortunately, this could have been accellerated by your PH cycle - there's really no hard evidence for that though.

    At 20 years old if you are starting to notice your hair thinning, I would start on a Minoxidil/Azelaic/Nizoral acid regimen immediately and continue indefinitely if you want to keep the hair on your head. You *will* go bald eventually unless you jump on the problem asap. You still might lose your hair, but the treatments people have discussed in this thread have shown a lot of promise for reversing/slowing the natural progression of AGA.

    However...

    I am only losing like 5 or so a day from what I can count when applying the spiro and showers. I think its back to normal. What do you guys think?
    5 hairs a day is nothing to worry about. As I mentioned above, unless you can really see your hair thinning in the back/front and your hair line receeding - I wouldnt worry about it.

    BV
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    BTW the laser diodes came in today! Should have the plans up for the laser comb in a week or two...
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    Thanks for the quick reply, I am going to continue using the nizoral and spiro for 2 more months and then see how things go. I don't want to start using minox yet. No one notices the hair lost except me, so it could be more of a mind thing atm.
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    Thanks for the quick reply, I am going to continue using the nizoral and spiro for 2 more months and then see how things go. I don't want to start using minox yet. No one notices the hair lost except me, so it could be more of a mind thing atm.
    Yeah you have to be aware of that and try to look at things objectively. I had a friend with a full, thick head of hair that had convinced himself he was going bald. Yet, he had barely any traces of AGA save for a slight receeding at the temples. I almost had to slap some sense into him
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    Hey guys, just a quick update here on my minox/aa use. Been using for close to 4 months now and ALL my hair is back...cept a tiny bit right in the front...but it's not noticeable much if at all...my temples are fully grown back in. I just got back from a haircut...got it cut really short on top and a bald fade on the sides...now I can really tell that it's all grown in... as George Castanza would say from Seinfield...I'M BACK IN BUSINESS BABAAAAAY!!!
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    CNW's site is down! Anyone know somewhere else to get AA 5%? I did a Google search but most places seem to sell it very weak, like 1%, or they just mention a formula that it is in and they don't specify the amount.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lifted
    Hey guys, just a quick update here on my minox/aa use. Been using for close to 4 months now and ALL my hair is back...cept a tiny bit right in the front...but it's not noticeable much if at all...my temples are fully grown back in. I just got back from a haircut...got it cut really short on top and a bald fade on the sides...now I can really tell that it's all grown in... as George Castanza would say from Seinfield...I'M BACK IN BUSINESS BABAAAAAY!!!
    congrats, that sounds like great progress
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    thx risend...

    Methusaleh...check out wholesalehairproducts.com or minoxidil.com
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    lifted - Are you planning to continue the minox? If not, I'd be interested to know if you see hairloss resume. thx
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrgg
    lifted - Are you planning to continue the minox? If not, I'd be interested to know if you see hairloss resume. thx
    Actually, that is a good question and one that I've also been pondering.

    To tell you the truth, I haven't even been using it twice/day as suggested, due to a low budget since I'm back in school at the moment. So I had to cut costs a bit.

    What I've been doing, basically, is this:

    3 days out of the week: 2 applications/day
    2 days out of the week: 1 application/day
    2 days out of the week: no application/day

    So as you can see, I pretty much got lucky with my dosing protocol and since I still saw good results this way, I'm going to take it down a notch for "maintenance" and apply once EOD....and then I'll see how I fare and possibly discontinue altogether.

    Although, if I decide to do more AAS cycles, I may reconsider and dose more often again...so that's pretty much up in the air. I've been off of androgens for 4+ months now, and am really starting to consider quitting using altogether now....but you know how that goes...lol.
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    always excellent info here
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    BigVrunga-- If you try the laser comb, I'd be interested to know what you think of it in a few months.

    Same for anyone who is trying NANO -- Shock133.

    Thanks!!!
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    BigVrunga-- If you try the laser comb, I'd be interested to know what you think of it in a few months.

    Same for anyone who is trying NANO -- Shock133.

    Thanks!!!
    Ive got all the parts I need now, stay tuned for an update...
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    Ive got all the parts I need now, stay tuned for an update...
    This reminds me of that time machine in Napolean Dynamite. Good luck!
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    Quote Originally Posted by rrgg
    This reminds me of that time machine in Napolean Dynamite. Good luck!
    I did try the laser comb between my legs like the time machine but all I got was an electric shock and increased ball hair growth....go figure
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    Considering adding spiro...

    I love the water-regulating effects I keep reading about, but does that occur with topical dosage or do I need to use it orally and/or pinning?
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