Originally Posted by BigVrunga

Every Day
----PM----

• Emu Oil
  • Applied to affected areas of the scalp - a few drops on finger tips and massage into skin.
  • Alleviated inflammation from androgen activity in the scalp
  • Excellent skin conditioner
  • May help suppress DHT
  • Enhances absorption of other transdermal products
  • Emu oil hair loss and frontal regrowth
• Retonic Acid .025%
  • Applied with dabber bottle
  • Increased effectiveness of minoxidil
  • Retinol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  • HTML outline generator - Google Search
• 1mL 15% Xandrox Solution
  • Applied with an eye dropper to the entire scalp.
  • Most potent liquid minoxidil solution available
  • In my experience, a fantastic potentiator for hair regrowth
  • Contains 5% Azelaic Acid, a topical inhibitor of DHT
  • Minoxidil.com Xandrox Page
• 2% Spironolactone
  • Applied with a dabber bottle to hairline only.
  • Very potent anti-androgen - use with care and be weary of potential side effect.
  • Never allow pregnant women to come in contact with this compound - potential for birth defects in male children.
  • A valuable ally against non 5AR converting anabolics like Tren, 1-test, etc
  • For normal use, I apply to hairline only. If cycling a non 5-AR converting compound that caused hair loss, I would use 1x per day at night before the application of any of the above products.
  • Spironolactone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
• .5mg Finasteride
  • Systemic inhibitor of 5AR enzyme - inhibits 65% of TypeII 5AR (TypeII is the 5AR in skin and prostate tissue)
  • FDA Approved to treat hair loss
  • Never allow pregnant women to come in contact with this compound - potential for birth defects in male children.
  • Generally, side effect free for most men. However, use caution and be weary of potential side effects.
  • I am currently experimenting with EOD dosage - seems to be working well. Finasteride has a half life of 5-7 days, but after long term use the blocked 5AR enzyme takes up to 30 days to turn over. I'm trying to use as little of this stuff, and thus block as little DHT as possible, to achieve the intended effects.
  • Finasteride - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  • Google Answers: Stopping finasteride

Every Day
----AM----

• 1mL 5% Minoxidil Solution
  • Currently using non-AA Minoxidil, considering adding Azelaic Acid and/or Crinagen in the future.
  • Applied with an eye dropper to entire scalp
  • Lightly dry hair-only (try not to touch scalp) with a damp towel after application.

Every Other Day
----PM----

• Laser Hair Brush (LLLT Therapy)
  • ~10 Minutes all over the scalp at night before bed. Holding brush in place for ~4 seconds.
  • FDA Approved to treat hair loss
  • No side effects - positive results for most users.
  • Has a photochemical action in the cells that are treated, increases blood flow to the scalp, and reduces inflammation.
  • Photobiomodulation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  • Low Laser Light Therapy for Hair Loss - NHI
• 2% Pyrithione Zinc Shampoo
  • Apply 1st thing in the shower, rinse last. (~10 minutes)
  • Blocks DHT in the scalp
  • Head and shoulders for hair loss?

Every Other Day
----AM----

• 2% Regrowth Treatment Shampoo - (Nizoral)
  • Apply 1st thing in the shower, rinse last. (~10 minutes)
  • Contains 2% Ketoconozole (Nizoral) w/3%Salicylic Acid
  • Increases effectiveness of Minoxidil
  • Ketoconozole is a general androgen blocker - probably a good thing to use ED while on cycle.
  • Also reduces inflammation.
  • Ketoconazole shampoo as a treatment for pattern hair loss
  • Regrowth

This combination of compounds has provided the best results by far, of any treatment protocol I have ever used. My hair is the thickest its been in years, and I rarely lose more than 2-4 hairs in the shower or when I do the 'tug test', often none at all. I suggest reading the supplied links for more indepth info - the general idea is that you want to try and attack the problem from every possible angle. Blocking androgens, stimulating regrowth, reducing inflammation, and providing an optimal environment for healthy hair and scalp. Many are also working to potentiate eachother, resulting in an anti-MPB combo that is greater than the sum of its parts.

It should go without saying that proper nutrition, adequate rest, and being absolutely religious about applying your treatments is essential if you are to see any degree of success.

Remember it can take up to 12 months to start seeing results from any hair-loss treatment. Generally, I think most can tell after 4-6 if a product is working for them.

There are other brands and other types of products out there that are also effective, but this is what I currently use. If you've read about a new treatment, or are using something that we havent mentioned, please chime in!!! To a degree, MPB can be treated effectively and while one day genetics may take over and Ill lose the battle - I'm not going down without a fight!!

Hope that helps -
BV

Thanks alot bro, reply is much appreciated.


I think I'll start with the minox, azelaic acid, spiro, and fina. I'm hoping that has some positive effect.

How exactly did you go about building yourself a laser brush?

How exactly did you go about building yourself a laser brush?

I put up some instructions back in the thread somewhere...its basically 6 650nm, 5mW,3v Laser Diodes that you can get on Ebay for cheap (~$25) from a company called Aixiz Lasers. The brush is a high quality boar's head brush that ran me about $10, and a universal power supply that can put out 3V DC, another $15. Just wire all the +'s together and all the -'s togeher. Cover the bare wire with heat shrink tubing or electrical tape, and then connect to the power supply (make sure its 3V DC!!) and you're set.

BV

I just got my order of 10grams of RU 58841. Anyone here try this as part of their regime? I split one order before and used it mixed with penetrate during both a halo and an epi cycle. no hair loss or scalp irritation during halo cycle, but my scalp was bothering me during my epi cycle even with the RU. Hopefully this will help me regrow anything lost during my rune epi run. I make a 5% solution and apply it twice a day. 10g should last about 6 months.

Wow, RU58841 is a rare one! Was it really expensive?

Ive read about it, but I havent used it, and I dont think anyone in this thread has either. Have you had good results when using it off-cycle?

From what I've read of it, its a specific blocker of DHT, which may make it ineffective for a compound like Epistane. I believe Epi's hair loss issues may be from the Epistane molecule, or a metabolite, binding to androgen receptors in the scalp. Maybe Spiro , Ketoconozole, and Emu oil would help there.

BV

I am pretty sure it should be able to block any androgen, I think epi is just hell on the hair. Was using 5% spiro, keto shampoo as well.

It came to about $400 total for what will last between 6-10 months. I have never used it off cycle before, and am just hoping to add this to my regime in order to get some regrowth. Last time I split an order so only got 5 grams. I pretty much used this up over three 30 day cycles. The first two with h-drol I had no hair problems, but with epi I did.

I am pretty sure it should be able to block any androgen, I think epi is just hell on the hair. Was using 5% spiro, keto shampoo as well.

It came to about $400 total for what will last between 6-10 months. I have never used it off cycle before, and am just hoping to add this to my regime in order to get some regrowth. Last time I split an order so only got 5 grams. I pretty much used this up over three 30 day cycles. The first two with h-drol I had no hair problems, but with epi I did.

Were you 'pulsing' Epistane or running a full cycle?

Originally Posted by BigVrunga

Were you 'pulsing' Epistane or running a full cycle?

I did a full cycle of epi. Was also running furaguno at the same time, but I doubt that was the culprit.

It shouldnt be, but remember Furaguno is a relatively unknown and unstudied compound...it's hard to say if the shedding you experienced on that cycle was due to the epi, the furaguno, or both.

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/article...teroids-02.htm

BV

Hey guys, about to start using minox/aa combo from WHP again, along with nizoral 2%.

Will it be a problem after application of aa/minox if I am going to be sweating most of the day?
I'll be applying it in the am and pm. Reason I ask is because before I used to use spiro 5% and when I sweat it used to give me sides (thinking from systemic absorption taking place).

I work part-time in an office and part time as a CDL driver and will be loading/unloading and working outside. Just worried about both possible systemic effects and/or lack of results from sweating. Any help here would be apprec. GREATLY, thx.

Also, sorry if said before, but should I be using the niz shampoo once ED or EOD? Thx

Hey Lifted,

Ive never had any sides from sweating with a 5% Minox/AA solution. I have experienced some wierd sides from applying 2% Spiro directly after a hot shower - so I know what you're talking about there.

You should be fine with the Minox.

I use Nizoral EOD. I dont think it will hurt to use it ED (I would if you're cycling any hair-unfriendly hormones), it'll dry your scalp out though, so watch for that and take the proper precautions.

BV

Thx BV, I'm on test at 600mg/week atm so I'll 1st see how it treats me doing it EOD and then gauge it and maybe I can get away w/ using it ED if the drying isn't too bad... apprec. the quick response.

Thx BV, I'm on test at 600mg/week atm so I'll 1st see how it treats me doing it EOD and then gauge it and maybe I can get away w/ using it ED if the drying isn't too bad... apprec. the quick response.

Np brutha - Ive found the best ways to alleviate scalp irritation is to use a good hair thickening shampoo and conditioner right after the Nizoral. If it persists, rub skin lotion right into your scalp at night. It will make your hair greasy as hell but who cares, you'll wash it out in the AM and your scalp will feel great.

BV

Originally Posted by BigVrunga

Np brutha - Ive found the best ways to alleviate scalp irritation is to use a good hair thickening shampoo and conditioner right after the Nizoral. If it persists, rub skin lotion right into your scalp at night. It will make your hair greasy as hell but who cares, you'll wash it out in the AM and your scalp will feel great.

BV

Great, any particular hair thickening shampoos and conditioners you recommend?

My problem is weird. At first, a few years back, I noticed that my hair line was starting to recede in the temples and a tad in the front, but not much at all...basically my temples concerned me the most. So I was easy on the sauce for awhile and used the mino/aa combo and it actually grew hair back in the temple region and eventhough I quit using the mino/aa for like 1.5 years or so, to this day, I STILL have tiny new hairs growing back in the temples.

As you can see in my avy, I recently shaved my head (usually fade myself up pretty descent if I'm just too busy to go to the barber, but this time I cut it, I messed up, lol).
Now, eventhough like I said above my temples are still as good as ever, I noticed a SHlTLOAD of thinning in the upper front (vortex?) and on the very back crown, where that swirl is. I was shocked! Like you BV, I also have black thick Italian blooded hair type. And eventhough the actual HAIRS are thicker than most peoples, the problem lies in the number of hairs on the scalp, and this is why I just really noticed, not until I shaved it bald and it grew back a little.

I also noticed that my hair has a strip in the middle of my head (going ear to ear, not forehead to back) that has a lot more hair than the front and back.

Also, after getting done shaving my head, I noticed I had a fungus on it (can't remember the name atm) and had these tiny scabs and redness and irritation all over it. Went to the docs and he gave me some topical called Loprox gel. Said it was from sweating all day and then itching my head throughout the day?? Used that for a few days and it seemed to clear it up a bit and now my scalp is just peeling from the dryness of washing it more and the gel. (stopped the gel due to sweating at work and it getting in my eyes)

So I think w/ the combo of the fungus, MAD STRESS this past year, and AAS, and a lot of dairy, my hair is just getting it's azz kicked, so I decided to try the mino/aa and niz to help somewhat alleviate the problem. What do you (BV) and other guys think, any more suggestions, comments?

Sorry for the long post, but I thought some might have some of the same problems as me and we can all learn by learning from each other.

I also noticed that my hair has a strip in the middle of my head (going ear to ear, not forehead to back) that has a lot more hair than the front and back.

We have a very similar hair loss pattern bro...mine is the same. Thinning in the front and back, very thick on the sides and in the middle, with some receeding at the temples.

While I'm sure the scalp irritation and stress played a part, that is the classic pattern for Male Pattern Baldness, so definitely treat it accordingly.

That stack I listed a few posts back is working well for me, Ill put some progress pics up later...I'd say my hair is a good 15-20% thicker that it was 6-8 months ago in the thinning areas.

BV

Originally Posted by BigVrunga

We have a very similar hair loss pattern bro...mine is the same. Thinning in the front and back, very thick on the sides and in the middle, with some receeding at the temples.

While I'm sure the scalp irritation and stress played a part, that is the classic pattern for Male Pattern Baldness, so definitely treat it accordingly.

That stack I listed a few posts back is working well for me, Ill put some progress pics up later...I'd say my hair is a good 15-20% thicker that it was 6-8 months ago in the thinning areas.

BV

Thx, I'm going to try the minox/aa and nizoral for awhile and hopefully that will stop the hair loss and help regrow a little back. If not then the hell w/ it, I'll just keep the dome shaved. I can't afford all the other products unfortunately.

Do you think I'll be able to tell within a few months if the products are causing any regrowth and stopping of the situation? If I let my hair grow back It will be hard to tell if it is or not. My hair is AFRO thick, crazy... I might just keep it short for the next few months in order to get a better determination.

Thx, I'm going to try the minox/aa and nizoral for awhile and hopefully that will stop the hair loss and help regrow a little back. If not then the hell w/ it, I'll just keep the dome shaved. I can't afford all the other products unfortunately.

Do you think I'll be able to tell within a few months if the products are causing any regrowth and stopping of the situation? If I let my hair grow back It will be hard to tell if it is or not. My hair is AFRO thick, crazy... I might just keep it short for the next few months in order to get a better determination

You should be able to tell in 4-6 months if the stuff is working. You might not see any improvement, but the situation hasnt gotten worse either - this could also be a sign that the product are working to keep the MPB at bay, but just arent enough to regrow hair for you. Everyone is different when it comes to how they respond to MPB treatments. I'd highly recommend adding Emu oil and LLLT to your stack - they're both cheap. The laser brush is a one time expense, and the Emu oil might cost you ~$20 every 3 months or so.

I hear you on just keeping the head shaved - Ive thought about it many times. At this point, its more of a challenge now to see how long I can suppress the genetic expression of my bald gene.

BV

Fina + 2% niz alone seems to be working on cycle. Fina @ 1 mg a day, and niz 2% once a day. Hair loss seems to be reduced to about 20-30% of what it was. I wonder what else I should implement? I'm also using head and shoulders, and I have some Alzeic Acid, the spray bottle I think, but I'm not sure how to use that. My scalp gets itchy sometimes, but when I pull hair in the itchy area, most of the time, nothing comes out. Also I wonder how much hair would naturally fall out anyways. 50 follicles a day maybe? If so, I'm losing roughly the average amount.

I think I'm going to be running some SD this fall and I wanted to get some input from you guys on hairloss measures to take.

I'm currently using Nizoral 2% eod and laser brush daily. What should I add while I'm on to maintain the status quo?

I'm currently using Nizoral 2% eod and laser brush daily. What should I add while I'm on to maintain the status quo?

Might want to try some 2% Spiro with the superdrol, but only if you need it. Emu oil may help as well.

BV

Fina + 2% niz alone seems to be working on cycle. Fina @ 1 mg a day, and niz 2% once a day. Hair loss seems to be reduced to about 20-30% of what it was. I wonder what else I should implement? I'm also using head and shoulders, and I have some Alzeic Acid, the spray bottle I think, but I'm not sure how to use that. My scalp gets itchy sometimes, but when I pull hair in the itchy area, most of the time, nothing comes out. Also I wonder how much hair would naturally fall out anyways. 50 follicles a day maybe? If so, I'm losing roughly the average amount.

50-100 follicles a day is average bro. Problem is, when you have MPB, they grow back in thinner every time, and eventually nothing...what are you using for your cycle?

Originally Posted by BigVrunga

50-100 follicles a day is average bro. Problem is, when you have MPB, they grow back in thinner every time, and eventually nothing...what are you using for your cycle?

Weeks 1-4: 500 mg test prop EW
Weeks 1-16: 500 mg test-e EW
Weeks 1-16: 500 mg boldendone (undeclynate ester) EW
Maybe weeks 14-16 Anavar, 50 mg ED

This is a cool thread. I have been delaying even reading it b/c of I am totally just in denial. Roommate totally commented that I am looking bald as **** on the top of my head tonight....going to have to do somethin about that now.

Time for update:

1) I started doing the laser comb 6 out of 7 days of the week. I came across this thread from another site where the OP gives credit to you, BV:

http://www.gaining-mass.com/hair-reg...rugs-t2127.htm

According to this guy, with the four laser, you are to use it every day for 6-7 days a week for 20 minutes for the first two weeks. Then slowly taper down. So the problem may very well could have been a result of not doing it enough. Given the high success rate, it is odd that I have yet to see any.

For the past week, I've been following that. I do it 10 minutes in the morning and 10 minutes before I go to bed. I'll post up new results in a month.

2) Increased temple growth. The temple hairs have moved past "peach fuzz" and into "light but noticeable hairs." It will probably take a month to see it grow in even thicker.

3) The Thinning Hair Solution is ok. The biggest problem is that is has a rough texture and almost seems like you need half the bottle to get it to cover your whole scalp. No results yet but it says to wait at least 3-6 so I'm still using it. If I don't see good results by the end of my fourth bottle (should be at least 6 months time), I won't get it again. So final review coming in the next couple months.

4) The Emu Oil is improving the overall quality of my hair. Thanks for the recommendation. I'll probably always have it in the rotation for now.

5) Ceasing Spiro 2% use until 9/1. Not sure how great continuous use is so I decided to hold off for a few weeks and then start it up again.

hey guys, great thread.
im thinking about doing my first cycle now, but the only thing thats been stopping me is hairloss.
i have been on minoxidil 5% for about 1 year and 7 months. i was on finasteride for the whole time but 2 months ago dropped that and started dutasteride. i have done laser treatments but i am getting the lasercomb next week.the main problem is the front of the head.
anyway, the question; is what would be extremely safe on the hairline even if it sacrifices a bit of the gains, i was thinking of maybe 500 mg of sus 250 or 500 mg of test enanthate/stacked with primobolan or boldenone for 9 weeks, and dont have a clue for post cycle. i will continue with 1 mg dutasteride, minoxidil, and laser and nizoral, i will also add spiro 5% during the cycle, if anyone knows that this cycle will increase hairloss or there is a safer bulking stack please let me know......by the way i am 6'4 and 227lbs.
thanks guys....

Originally Posted by IZY

hey guys, great thread.
im thinking about doing my first cycle now, but the only thing thats been stopping me is hairloss.
i have been on minoxidil 5% for about 1 year and 7 months. i was on finasteride for the whole time but 2 months ago dropped that and started dutasteride. i have done laser treatments but i am getting the lasercomb next week.the main problem is the front of the head.
anyway, the question; is what would be extremely safe on the hairline even if it sacrifices a bit of the gains, i was thinking of maybe 500 mg of sus 250 or 500 mg of test enanthate/stacked with primobolan or boldenone for 9 weeks, and dont have a clue for post cycle. i will continue with 1 mg dutasteride, minoxidil, and laser and nizoral, i will also add spiro 5% during the cycle, if anyone knows that this cycle will increase hairloss or there is a safer bulking stack please let me know......by the way i am 6'4 and 227lbs.
thanks guys....

Speaking from experience...

If you are fighting hair loss then forget about juice period, it is a battle you will lose everytime.

Sure, there are some things that are easier on the hairline but regardless of what roids are taken you will most likely end up losing more hair... regardless of what precautions you take.

I personally would not take anyones advise in regards to personal "I took (insert name of any steroid here) and even regrew hair, wow wee!" stories either. What most people don't seem to grasp is depending what phase your hair is in, it can be months after a cycle until the falling out process begins, which just gives you a false sense of hair security...not to mention it's friggin mentally draining to boot.

I used to do a couple cycles a year and while I miss cycling alot, I would miss my hair much more.

Originally Posted by travbedaman

What most people don't seem to grasp is depending what phase your hair is in, it can be months after a cycle until the falling out process begins, which just gives you a false sense of hair security...not to mention it's friggin mentally draining to boot.

Amen to that, it's like sneak attack hairloss. Just when you think you're in the clear....wham! molting season.

Originally Posted by The Experiment

5) Ceasing Spiro 2% use until 9/1. Not sure how great continuous use is so I decided to hold off for a few weeks and then start it up again.

What's the concern here? I think I might know, but I want to hear it from someone who's done the field tests.

anyone else stop using their spiro or crinagen because of the smell?

Originally Posted by Tom 185

anyone else stop using their spiro or crinagen because of the smell?

Almost.

Its Especially bad if it mixes with minoxidil, there's a chemical reaction that smells like a stinkbomb and if you sweat, then it really gets bad.